Talk:Phthalates

C&EN cover story

The C&EN cover story on phthalates in the June 2015 issue may be used for additions or updates to this article:

• Regulators And Retailers Raise Pressure On Phthalates
• Plasticizer Makers Want A Piece Of The Phthalates Pie
• Phthalates’ Structural Truths

--Leyo 01:59, 30 December 2015 (UTC)

Prenatal and maternal exposures additions

Madhaba51 added several paragraphs to the section with verbiage and tone that says exposure to phthalates causes several maladies. This is not the case. After decades of study, absolutely no causal relationships between phthalate exposure and actual human maladies has been proven. In fact, quite the opposite considering that phthalate exposures began 60+ years ago. It is true that several toxicological studies in rodents, especially rats, have shown strong relationships between exposure and reproductive and developmental toxicity. However, it's also true that the main mechanism for this observed toxicity is specific to rodent physiology and humans do not share this physiology. I propose that several of the statements made by Madhaba51 should be clarified by the addition of "in rodents", while others can be clarified by pointing out the limitations of the studies quoted and the methodologies employed to reach their conclusions. In the exuberant efforts to pin bad outcomes on phthalate exposure, some questionable methods have been employed. Repeating the conclusions of those repeatedly, in the media and in Wikipedia, does not make them true. --Scoob5555 (talk) 12:40, 9 May 2016 (UTC)— Preceding unsigned comment added by Scoob5555 (talk • contribs) 12:35, 9 May 2016 (UTC)

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References for possible expansion of section – Detection in food products

• Testing Finds Industrial Chemical Phthalates in Cheese
• July 12, 2017, The Chemicals in Your Mac and Cheese, New York Times
• July 14, 2017, Don’t panic over the chemicals in your mac and cheese, Slate
• July 15, 2017, Macaroni and cheese: Are there phthalates are in there?, CNN

RE: Detection in food products references

While this "study" received a lot of press earlier this year, the facts around it haven't been well-explored or discussed except in the Slate article. What the extremely biased study doesn't say is that the level of phthalates found in the Mac n Cheese and other cheese products was 1000x lower than most scientific studies. They were reporting parts per billion, whereas most studies - and all regulations on phthalates - are in parts per million. This was a case of using the latest technology to find a substance at lower levels than was even possible only a decade ago. And then using that to fundraise on Kraft's back, hoping that no one would ask questions. So while detection of phthalates in foods is a legitimate section to add to the Phthalates article, this study should only be mentioned as a cautionary tale of how NGOs can present biased data to garner a lot of negative press.

Scoob5555 (talk) 17:08, 27 November 2017 (UTC)

Edits of Dec 3, 2017

Ranked in decreasing urgency:

• This statement makes it sound like DEHP occurs in these foods, but I am guessing that these fatty foods extract the DEHP from packaging? "Diet is believed to be the main source of di(2-ethylhexyl) phthalate (DEHP) and other phthalates in the general population.<ref name=":3" /> Fatty foods such as milk, butter, and meats are a major source.<ref>{{Cite journal|last=Serrano|first=Samantha E.|last2=Braun|first2=Joseph|last3=Trasande|first3=Leonardo|last4=Dills|first4=Russell|last5=Sathyanarayana|first5=Sheela|date=2014-06-02|year=|title=Phthalates and diet: a review of the food monitoring and epidemiology data|journal=Environmental Health: A Global Access Science Source|volume=13|issue=1|pages=43|doi=10.1186/1476-069X-13-43|issn=1476-069X|pmc=4050989|pmid=24894065|via=}}</ref>
• I changed 'consumed' (eaten?) to 'produced': "Approximately 8.4 million tonnes of plasticizers are consumed globally every year, of which European consumed accounts for approximately 1.5 million metric ..."
• This sources seems a little narrow for some of the big claims in this article:
• Just too vague: "Phthalate exposure may occur through leaching and general environmental contamination."

--Smokefoot (talk) 02:00, 4 December 2017 (UTC)

Wiki Education assignment: Toxicology

— Assignment last updated by Nc1018! (talk) 17:23, 19 September 2022 (UTC)

This might be a tough assignment for a student. There are a lot of phthalates and toxicology varies across the class. Even at a high level, there are nearly 90 systematic reviews to get through. --Project Osprey (talk) 09:04, 21 September 2022 (UTC)

Wiki Education assignment: Comparative Developmental Biology

— Assignment last updated by Iscucchi (talk) 05:15, 27 February 2023 (UTC)

The alternatives section appears to be missing the compound DINCH. I am adding this as an alternative from my sandbox. Iscucchi (talk) 03:24, 6 March 2023 (UTC)

Section added to "Alternatives" from sandbox User:Iscucchi/Phthalate Iscucchi (talk) 04:01, 6 March 2023 (UTC)

Added information regarding disparities among minorities to close the equity gap seen in the article. I also added information regarding obesity under the "other effects" category as there is an error currently on the page. Iscucchi (talk) 01:40, 12 April 2023 (UTC)

Phthalates need not be esters

The first sentence of the article implies that all phthalates are esters. This is not so. Phthalic acid is an organic acid and as such it can form salts with most lyes/bases. E.g., disodium-phthalate is the sodium salt of the phthalic acid (so obviously not an ester): https://pubchem.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/compound/Disodium-phthalate --Felix Tritschler (talk) 19:24, 22 November 2024 (UTC)

Good points, but 99.9% of readers don't give a hoot about the sodium phthalate. So the trick is to not obscure sought-for-info ("I am wondering about 'phthalates', what are they?") with pesky facts to satisfy us nerds. Have a go at editing. --Smokefoot (talk) 19:31, 22 November 2024 (UTC)

But phthalic acid is not a phthalate. At least not by most sources (e.g.,). Pubchem has a lot of synonymns, including the one you mention, so an argument exists that at least in some specific scientific contexts phthalic acid can be named a "phthalate". My vote is to leave the article unchanged for now. Unless we can build a stronger case for more universal common usage of 'phthalate' to encompass non-esters. Note that PubChem needs to have every conceivable synonym (including misspellings) because it is used by software to harmonize diverse datasets, including those that may have human curation errors. Jaredroach (talk) 22:55, 22 November 2024 (UTC)

References

Biodegradation info doesn't match source

Don't quite have time to make a full edit -- also am new here, so sorry if there's somewhere else I should be saying this instead -- but the biodegradation section is not supported by the article it uses as a source. Phthalates absolutely persist and are very slow to degrade abiotically; the article states this under "Abiotic and biotic degradation of PA esters." Biotic degradation is faster, but requires the correct microbe species/microbial communities, so microbial degradation of phthalates is a useful tool for bioremediation rather than a common natural occurrence that stops them from persisting in the environment 74.213.237.145 (talk) 03:25, 4 April 2025 (UTC)

Your source appears to be a weak or possibly a junk journal. Check the editorial board. Regarding the biodegradation, It seems likely that esters are hydrolyzed to with no microbial assistance. Some particularly lipophilic esters are less soluble in the aqueous medium and might be slower to hydrolyze. --Smokefoot (talk) 14:56, 4 April 2025 (UTC)

I am using the reference that was cited in the biodegradation section (number 56). I can't say anything about its quality and so should not have spoken with such confidence, but that review is cited in the article as the source of the rapid degradation claim, which it can't be, because it contradicts it directly 104.39.216.207 (talk) 17:00, 4 April 2025 (UTC)

To add to article

Shouldn't we add this information to this article: that exposure to phthalates has been found to cause more than 350,000 deaths worldwide per year?

Sources:

• https://www.washingtonpost.com/climate-environment/2025/04/29/plastic-chemicals-phthalates-deaths-heart-disease/
• https://www.thelancet.com/journals/ebiom/article/PIIS2352-3964(25)00174-4/fulltext

98.123.38.211 (talk) 15:30, 11 May 2025 (UTC)

On that theme but in reverse, I was wondering if we could look for references about the millions and millions of lives saved or improved thanks to plasticizers. Much or most sewage plumbing is PVC, which requires phthalates to be useable. --Smokefoot (talk) 16:27, 11 May 2025 (UTC)

Your claim would clearly need a reliable reference, as e.g. this website says pretty much the opposite. --Leyo 21:20, 11 May 2025 (UTC)