Talk:Nestor Makhno

Châtelain film

Hélène Châtelain's 1996 documentary Nestor Makhno, un paysan d'Ukraine might have some answers to the Makhno FAC image copyright discussion. Here's a quote from an interview:

CP: How did you find these archives where we see Makhno and his companions on a station platform?
Hélène Chatelain: It's a stroke of luck. I had heard that Makhno had been filmed alive, but I did not know where. I came across a film made by a director from Saint Petersburg, which showed a reel which came from Romania, a scoop, and suddenly I saw this scene. And thanks to friends from Moscow who know the archives well, I was able to find the footage that had been repatriated from Romania. It was the first alliance between Bolsheviks and insurgent peasants and the front camera was there. ... There are also the market plans because the cameramen like to take pictures. It is also interesting to see how we frame and what is done. And this film with Makhno, the first time we saw it, we went for a coffee because it was overwhelming. And we realize that many photos are actually prints of this film. There are archives everywhere. ...
— Machine English translation of Chroniques Rebelles

If it's possible to find some detail on this published film, I imagine many of the Makhno images will clearly be proven as public domain. The source of this St. Petersburg film wasn't clear from the film's credits sequence. czar 19:07, 8 November 2023 (UTC)

This article () by Châtelain is freely available but doesn't appear to mention the footage. Might want to double check. (It would, however, serve as a good source on cultural depictions of Makhno over the years, apart from her own.) czar 19:20, 8 November 2023 (UTC)

@Czar: Having seen the documentary, I actually already know which photo this is talking about. This is the still from the film. I imagine that means that this photograph may also be from the film (or taken at the same time), judging from all the people in the shot, how they're dressed and positioned. --Grnrchst (talk) 19:22, 8 November 2023 (UTC)

Any ideas on who the St. Petersburg director might be? czar 19:54, 8 November 2023 (UTC)

"Director from Saint Petersburg" isn't much to go off tbh. We're still trying to find a needle in a haystack, that haystack is just slightly smaller now. --Grnrchst (talk) 20:03, 8 November 2023 (UTC)

Noting for posterity that it looks like File:1919. Повстанцы и батька Махно. Юг Украины. Кинохроника гражданской войны..ogv is a portion of the Romanian reel in question. czar 15:13, 6 January 2024 (UTC)

I've found a high-quality version, unlisted on the YouTube account of Seance Magazine. The clip bears the watermark of the Russian State Film and Photo Archive, and the high-quality scan was posted in 2017, so it's probably still in there somewhere. I've tried to trace it back through their online resources (which unfortunately do not provide complete transfers for everything), but my knowledge of Russian is perhaps not good enough for this task. 144.82.8.11 (talk) 19:51, 27 February 2024 (UTC)

Brief update: located it. Archival material No. 30501, 'Selected Scenes from a Soviet Newsreel' (Отдельные сюжеты советской кинохроники). The archive listing says it's from a film institute in Hungary, with intertitles in Hungarian. Makhno appears at the end of the listing: "Southern Ukraine, spring 1919. Leader of the insurgent movement in southern Russia Nestor Makhno, one of the leading commanders of Makhno's army Semyon Karetnik, and other leaders of the insurgent movement standing by a train carriage, walking on the railway tracks." There's no other information on the archive's website on who took the footage or where it came from. 144.82.8.11 (talk) 20:28, 27 February 2024 (UTC)

Nicely done. Thank you! czar 00:35, 28 February 2024 (UTC)

Thank you so much for looking into this! --Grnrchst (talk) 12:25, 1 March 2024 (UTC)

Toruń

The following month he and his family moved to Toruń Did Makhno move to Toruń or was he forceably relocated there, per Ukrainians in Toruń#Anarchists? This other article also mentions assassination attempts, which would seem noteworthy to mention here. Template:Cp czar 18:20, 29 December 2024 (UTC)

@Czar: According to Colin Darch (p. 137), Makhno and Kuzmenko were issued residency permits to stay in Toruń after they were released from prison on 3 December 1923. Darch here is citing the 2012 book Nestor Machno w Polsce by Michał Przyborowski and Darius Wierzchoś. I think "enforced relocation" might refer to the conditions of his exile, more so than why he was in Toruń specifically. And "ordered to settle in Toruń" could be considered true, as that was the residency permit he was given without much of a choice on location. Either way, I'm not sure its a substantial difference. As for the attempts, Darch doesn't make mention of any assassination attempts against him, only his suicide attempt. I'm not sure what Karpus 1993 says on the matter, but that these were unsuccessful attempts by "unknown assailants" seems rather vague. --Grnrchst (talk) 19:10, 29 December 2024 (UTC)

Thanks for that check. Let me grab a copy of Karpus 1993 to check that too. czar 03:46, 30 December 2024 (UTC)

Here. How good is your Polish?

DeepL + OCR p. 107 into 108; 108 rest of paragraph czar 15:54, 6 January 2025 (UTC)

My grasp on Polish is very weak, but thankfully I know a Polish pal that can help with translation should I need it. Going by the DeepL translation, Karpus doesn't give any information at all about the assassination attempt, other than it happened in May 1924. Just going off what's here, I don't think there's anything so notable as to demand inclusion in this article. Without any other details on the apparent assassination attempt, introducing it would raise more questions than it answers. The rest of the paragraph just aligns with what is already in the article. --Grnrchst (talk) 16:15, 6 January 2025 (UTC)

"Makhnovism" listed at Redirects for discussion

File:Information.svg The redirect Makhnovism has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Template:Section link until a consensus is reached. 1234qwer1234qwer4 17:40, 13 March 2025 (UTC)