Talk:Malay language

Speaker numbers

L1 numbers are listed at 83 million, but in the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_languages_by_total_number_of_speakers article, Indonesian is listed as 44 million, and on ethnologue (https://www.ethnologue.com/insights/ethnologue200/) Malay L1+L2 is listed as 19.2m, so are the extra 19 million coming from 'Baba Malay' and 'Baba Indonesian'?

It would be helpful if someone could post the L2 figures from Ethnologue so at least things would be consistent in the infobox. 90.167.94.143 (talk) 00:36, 23 May 2024 (UTC)

Broken link

The link to Brunei in the opening paragraph is not functioning properly. Clicking on it takes you to the Malaysia article. Brunei does have its own article in Wikipedia, and the link should be fixed accordingly. Geraldpriddle (talk) 23:48, 25 October 2024 (UTC)

Geraldpriddle: Well spotted – I've fixed it. — ClaudineChionh (she/her · talk · contribs · email) 01:43, 26 October 2024 (UTC)

Bahasa Melayu (Malay language) / Bahasa Melayu Klasik (Classical Malay)

Malay language/Classical Malay has long been used during the Malacca Sultanate. Also spread by the Malacca Sultanate in the Nusantara (according to the Malay definition) such as Malay Peninsular, Thai-Siam (Southern Thai), Champa -(Burma, Cambodia, Viet, Laos), Sri Lanka, Sumatra, Java, Borneo, Sulawesi, Timor, Maluku, Southwest Papua, Cocos Island and Christmas Island.

Malay language is also used by three countries as an official language such as Malaysia, Singapore and Brunei.

The Malay language also developed and gave birth to other Malay languages such as Bahasa Malaysia and Bahasa Indonesia.

Malaysia uses two Malay languages, Bahasa Melayu and Bahasa Malaysia. Ahmad Shazlan (talk) 09:41, 12 December 2024 (UTC)

since when are there two languages? Malaysian language is a political term. while the Malay language is correct. So Bahasa Melayu and Bahasa Malaysia are the differences? 183.171.249.217 (talk) 03:26, 23 December 2024 (UTC)

Nope, Malay has been spread around before the Malacca Sultanate. Xbypass (talk) 05:14, 28 January 2025 (UTC)

Regarding the Misrepresentation of Bahasa Indonesia Spoken in Thailand

The recent revert was made to address an inaccuracy in the text regarding the Malay language spoken by the Malays in Thailand, a region with a population of 1.5 million of Malay descent.

The version from January 13, 2023 (revision ID: 1269265311, by @Sayurasem) suggested that the Malay-speaking population in Thailand uses Bahasa Indonesia, which does not accurately reflect the linguistic situation. This revision seeks to clarify the matter and ensure that the information presented is both clear and factually accurate.

Distinct Dialects in Southern Thailand: The ethnic Malay population in southern Thailand, particularly in the provinces of Yala, Patani, Narathiwat and Satun, speaks distinct regional Malay dialects such as Kedahan/Satun Malay and Patani-Kelantanese Malay. These dialects are part of the broader Malay language family but are not equivalent to Bahasa Indonesia. Bahasa Indonesia is a standardized, formalized version of Malay that was developed in Indonesia, with specific lexical, phonological, and grammatical features unique to Indonesian usage. There is a clear linguistic divergence between the dialects spoken in Thailand and the standardized Bahasa Indonesia, and it is crucial to maintain this distinction. The two are not mutually intelligible in the same way that different varieties of a language might be, and conflating them misrepresents the linguistic reality of southern Thailand.

Linguistic and Historical Accuracy: The original phrasing inaccurately conflated the language spoken by Malays in Thailand with Bahasa Indonesia, obscuring important historical and linguistic developments. While both languages share a common Austronesian root, their paths diverged over centuries, with Bahasa Indonesia undergoing significant standardization, modernization, and incorporation of local Indonesian languages, whereas the Malay dialects in Thailand remained regionally distinct. Recognizing this divergence is essential for understanding the historical evolution of the Malay language across Southeast Asia and ensuring that the text adheres to accepted linguistic principles.

Avoiding Oversimplification and Misleading Information: The statement that the Malays in Thailand speak Bahasa Indonesia oversimplifies and misrepresents the linguistic diversity of the region. This simplification risks causing confusion among readers regarding the complex relationship between the various Malay dialects spoken across Southeast Asia. The assertion could also perpetuate misunderstandings about the nature of Malay language varieties, particularly the relationship between the dialects spoken in Thailand and the standardized Bahasa Indonesia. The revert was necessary to ensure that the text provides a nuanced and accurate portrayal of the linguistic landscape, consistent with established research and academic discourse on the Malay language.

Conclusion: The revert was essential to preserve the academic integrity and factual accuracy of the Wikipedia article. It corrects the original error, clarifying that the Malay ethnic group in southern Thailand speaks distinct regional dialects, not Bahasa Indonesia. This correction ensures that the article accurately reflects the linguistic reality in Southeast Asia and prevents the dissemination of misleading or oversimplified information. The revised version aligns with both linguistic scholarship and the broader understanding of the Malay language family, providing readers with a more precise and informed description of the language's diversity and historical development. Native99girl (talk) 05:30, 15 January 2025 (UTC)

Template:Ping Please don't use AI tools in talk pages. The machine behind it doesn't now the facts and WP policies, it only apes existing text. And it tends to produce overblown blather.

User:Xbypass's version is actually quite ok, but ambiguous in parts (I don't think they deliberately wanted to say that Indonesian is spoken in Thailand, but the pronoun "it" had an unclear antecedent):

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Let's fix it to:

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Thoughts? –Austronesier (talk) 06:23, 15 January 2025 (UTC)

Thank you for the input, I agree with the Xbypass version of the article. Native99girl (talk) 06:39, 15 January 2025 (UTC)

I'm confused now. @Xbypass's version is exactly the one that you have objected to (@Sayurasem merely reverted an IP edit back to @Xbypass's version). –Austronesier (talk) 06:49, 15 January 2025 (UTC)

My apologies for the confusion @Austronesier. I agree with the fixed version you suggested. Native99girl (talk) 06:54, 15 January 2025 (UTC)

Ok, I will update it. Sayurasem (talk) 07:25, 15 January 2025 (UTC)

Thank you for the update Sayurasem. However I noticed you put a new update on the article, I am confused when did Xbypass entered and agreed with the alignment. The user only updated new edit a few minutes after your update but didnt signalled any agreement.

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However, I think it is better to removed that symbol on the article.--Native99girl (talk) 10:45, 15 January 2025 (UTC)

Bahasa Melayu is a Johor-Riau language.

Bahasa Melayu is actually Bahasa Melayu klasik/classical Malay and Bahasa Johor-Riau, which is a premodern language. This language was created during the Sultanate of Malacca to the Sultanate of Johor-Riau, this language is a standard or old standard language because it is used as a matter of correspondence. Bahasa Melayu is still used today. Bahasa has produced new standards such as Riau (not a dialect), Bahasa Brunei (not a dialect), Bahasa Singapura (not a dialect), Bahasa Indonesia and also Bahasa Malaysia. Ahmad Shazlan (talk) 02:45, 27 May 2025 (UTC)

Bahasa Melayu, Bahasa Malaysia and Bahasa Indonesia.

Bahasa Malaysia is the Malay language that has been Anglicized, whereas Bahasa Indonesia is the Malay language that has been Dutchized.

For examples: 1. English : Majority. 2. Bahasa Melayu (Standard Malay) : Sebilangan/kelompok terbesar. 3. Bahasa Malaysia (Standard Malaysia) : Majoriti. 4. Bahasa Indonesia (Standard Indonesia) : Mayoritas.

Some deny that Bahasa Malaysia and Bahasa Indonesia are the same as the Malay language. Some agree that Bahasa Malaysia and Bahasa Indonesia are the same as the Malay language. They say don't politicize the language! The fact is that the Malay language created a new Malay language, namely Bahasa Malaysia and Bahasa Indonesia.

However, in Malaysia, two standard Malay languages are used, Bahasa Melayu and Bahasa Malaysia. Ahmad Shazlan (talk) 17:00, 2 June 2025 (UTC)