Talk:Durak

judging from early revisions, this appears to have been taken from another wiki (due to use of CamelHump). Is this article OK copyright wise? A quick Google search of some text didn't yield anything. --Eean

I originally posted it here; then I came across the unreified link on wikipedia's Card_Games. ToothyWiki copyright policy is here; I stripped other contributors' text from the material posted on wikipedia and claim no particular rights over mine. - MoonShadow

ok, cool. -- Eean

Vote for re-writing

I would like to replace this article with a translation of the russian-language one, because that one is better organized, and this one has a number of structure and factual peculiarities that I think would look better if they weren't there. Any objections? eae 23:01, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

Are you kidding? The Russain article is nearly useless for those who don't already know the game. But of course, you may rehash/update the current one. mikka (t) 23:12, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

The article has been already rewritten with five patches by Lnick13. 26 August 2011 Lnick13 (talk) 14:18, 26 August 2011 (UTC)

Two-handed Durak

Durak for 2 players is played a little differently than Durak for 3 to 6. Should there be a subsection for it? Morganfitzp 01:34, 17 January 2007 (UTC)

Yes, there definitely should be more information on two-player Durak, as my wife and I just tried playing it with the standard rules...and it totally doesn't work. My parents used to play this game with our neighbours (the wife from next door was born in the USSR), and I recall it being very enjoyable. But this evening's attempt to play it again was a total disaster. KevinOKeeffe (talk) 02:11, 19 December 2009 (UTC)

Most common variant

"The most common variant[citation needed] is called "transferrable durak" (perevodnoj durak, «переводной дурак»), which permits passing on cards on attacks in certain instances." This is not the most common variant, the most common is regular durak without any quirks. transfer durak is often criticized as the newbie and unskilled version because of its randomness. Even if you keep track of the deck within your head you may still be defeated by lesser skilled opponents, especially within a 3+ people game. NyaR 07:45, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

Most common is podkidnoy durak. Rikis (talk) 05:43, 2 April 2008 (UTC)

The first attacker

As far as I've always been playing, after the first attacker, starting from the second game, is the person to the RIGHT of the fool, i.e. the first defender is the FOOL. Any comments on this? 195.246.248.3 12:03, 18 September 2007 (UTC)

Everyone I know has always started from under the fool (iz pod duraka) i.e. like the article describes Maxim K 22:40, 11 October 2007 (UTC)

In fact there are two variants it can be a person to the right of the fool (in this case they say "to teach the fool"(дурака учат)) or to the left of the fool (from under the fool (из под дурака)) ) So both ways are possible, it rather depends on who you're playing with :) 77.52.242.78 (talk) 21:48, 7 June 2010 (UTC)

The citation is not needed

In the header there is a "citation needed" about a variant of the game. Event if only one man (in this case two) is playin the variant so it's a variant even if nobody knows about it! —Preceding unsigned comment added by Danimes (talk • contribs) 12:22, 12 February 2008 (UTC)

Without commenting on the specific example, sometimes a citation is asked for because of if the variant is notable enough to be included and not original research. Tetron76 (talk) 17:57, 1 March 2011 (UTC)

Blacklisted Links Found on the Main Page

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2 to 5 Removal

When you've been left of the basic phenomenal numbers in today's Engg. World 2..5, you pretended to be, how you could make out the fiery WIN; the survival; tendency to win in the bet. Now I am realizing the-what - Russians Trend in "understanding of beyond" w.r.t to European Sir.Newton's write-up(s).

My Interpretation of Newton's — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ansathas (talk • contribs) 23:08, 9 January 2015 (UTC)

french page

hi, french link is fr:Dourak no Durak but i can't change

Cpartiot (talk) 17:11, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

I think there's a redirect or disambiguation page you can set up? 23.115.35.219 (talk) 17:16, 15 May 2025 (UTC)

Who is the first attacker?

The rules say, the first attacker is the player with the lowest trump card. How is that determined, having all cards hidden from one another? Should be made clear in the article. Gil_mo (talk) 23:03, 4 December 2018 (UTC)

Usually it goes like this: Who has the six? Who has the seven? Etc. Eventually, someone says "me", and shows just that card to everybody else. Selerian (talk) 03:36, 18 November 2019 (UTC)

Possibly wrong end of turn description?

"Players who have played their last card leave the game and do not draw new cards from the deck." - In all versions of Durak I know, cards must be replenished as long as there is a deck and players can only be eliminated in the endgame.

Something doesn't make sense

The text says one can play with 6 players, but with a 36 card deck and 6 card hands, how could you then turn over a card to determine trump? You would have eliminated all the cards. Unless you play one of the variants, it seems in straight Durak you could not play 6 players with a 36 card deck. Unless there is some rule omitted, which would be quite helpful to know. 2606:69C0:5120:5402:0:0:2:2 (talk) 19:27, 14 October 2022 (UTC)

durak fool in russian and polish languages, bus station turkish Тагунов в Орле (talk) 18:37, 7 June 2023 (UTC)

The trump is still defined by the last card in the deck. It is opened before being dealt to the player.

Playing durak with 6 players is not so common as 2-4 players games, at least from my experience. Vonopr (talk) 18:51, 21 January 2024 (UTC)

AFAIK (being Russian and having played this many times), if there are 2-4 players, they may OPT to remove rank 2/3/4/5 cards, but they don't have to. It just changes the duration of the round. If there are 5-6 players, the low cards are generally NOT removed, precisely because a 36-card deck would be exhausted before the start, leading to a very short and imbalanced game, without hope of drawing better cards from the talon.

Conversely, with more players or if a longer game is desired, more than 1 deck may be mixed in, optionally removing the low cards or not.

It's a very flexible game, from 2 to (in theory) 12 players, from 36 to 208 cards. 23.115.35.219 (talk) 16:54, 15 May 2025 (UTC)

How does multiple decking handle exact-duplicate cards (i.e. 7 hearts vs 7 hearts)? Simple - players agree beforehand if the duplicate is not allowed (i.e. it's worthless (except for transfers), or conversely if it can be used to beat an identical card (because the probability is rare enough that it's cool/fun if that happens). 23.115.35.219 (talk) 17:19, 15 May 2025 (UTC)

Should origin be “Russian” or “Soviet Union”?

I think “Russian” isn’t a good origin as even Preferans has the origin as Russia. Since it’s a Soviet game, should the origin be “Russia” or “Soviet Union”? ThatOneEpicDude (talk) 13:23, 7 July 2024 (UTC)

Main variants: regular, podkidnoy (add-in or "social"), perevodnoy ("transfer")

Basically, there are 3 main rulesets:

1.) The "regular" game, it's 1 versus 1, attacker and defender. No one else may add in, and the defender cannot transfer - they have to either successfully defend each attack, or "eat" the whole lineup. Due to this, in the early part of the game, some players may opt to "eat" the first attack and lose their turn, but reduce the possibility of additional attacks.

Example defense:

Attacker: 5 of diamonds --- Defender: 7 of diamonds Attacker: 7 of spades --- Defender: 10 of spades [end of attack, successful defense, defender maintains turn]

Example concession:

5 of diamonds --- Defender: "I'll take it" [end of attack, defender loses turn]

Exception to this: if the attacker has another card of the same rank, even if they didn't play it at the same time, once the defender declares they're "eating it", the attacker may "follow up" with the same-rank card. Usually with a quip along the lines of "you thought it was over? It's not over".

Attacker: 5 of diamonds --- Defender: "I'll take it" Attacker: "you'll take these too" --- 5 of hearts + 5 of spades [defender loses turn]

Also note that, since this gives the (failed) defender multiple cards of the same rank, visible to everyone and not discarded, the next player now knows to expect a triple-card attack the next time around.

2.) Podkidnoy (literally, "thrown in") = add-in / social.

After the attacker is finished, other players may add in their own attacks, using the rank of any card on the "battlefield".

It's generally agreed beforehand if the other players must wait for the attacker to state that they're done attacking, before adding in their own attacks; or if the attacker should open with every card they want (i.e. if they have 3x 7s, they should put them all down at once), and the other players can add their own attacks as soon as the defender's card hits the table. "Gentleman rules" versus "Fastest rules".

Example:

Attacker: 5 of diamonds --- Defender: 7 of diamonds Attacker: 7 of spades --- Defender: 10 of spades Defender: "I'm done" Player 3: 7 of hearts + 10 of hearts Player 4: 5 of clubs Player 5: 10 of clubs

Now the defender has to beat 4 additional cards, or eat all 6.

In podkidnoy durak, the choice to eat the first attack becomes even more important, as it denies the opportunity for others to make the problem even worse.

3.) Perevodnoy - transfer / bypass.

If the defender has a card of the same rank, they simply announce "transfer", put down the card, and serve both of them to the next player down the line.

Example:

Attacker: 5 of diamonds - Defender: "transfer" Defender: 5 of clubs Defender: *passes both* Player 3: "really, guys?"

It's even more hilarious if Defender has multiple cards of the same rank. Because (if agreed upon beforehand) they can take a 1-card attack and turn it into a 3- or 4-card attack on the next guy.

4.) Podkidnoy + Perevodnoy Combination - transfer with add-in.

Not a very common practice, but also fun. Once the Defender announces their intent to transfer, other players may add in other cards of the same rank.

---

In all 3 variants, the maximum # of attack cards is 6 - regardless of how many cards the defending player is holding. 23.115.35.219 (talk) 17:14, 15 May 2025 (UTC)