View source for Wiki143:WikiProject Countering systemic bias/Religion task force

{{WikiProject status|taskforce=yes|inactive|parent=Countering systemic bias|project-type=topic|topic=religion|sister=Religion}}
The '''religion task force''' of '''[[Wikipedia:WikiProject|WikiProject]] Countering [[systemic bias]]''' exists in order to ensure [[WP:NPOV|neutrality]] in Wikipedia articles that have to do with [[religion]] and [[spirituality]]. 

Any Wikipedia user is invited to join. The sole requirement of membership is dedication to ensuring a [[WP:NPOV|neutral point of view]] in all Wikipedia articles. 

If you would like to help, please inquire on the [[{{TALKPAGENAME}}|talk page]] and see the [[Wikipedia:to-do list|to-do list]] there.

==Participants==
# [[User:Goethean|Goethean]]
# [[User:Zappaz|ZappaZ]] [[Image:Yin_yang.svg|12px]]
# [[User:Aquillion|Aquillion]]
# [[User:Irmgard|Irmgard]]
# [[User:Jossifresco|&asymp; jossi &asymp;]]
# [[User:Freestylefrappe|Freestylefrappe]]
# [[User:Solar|Solar]]
# [[User:Jfdwolff|JFW]]&nbsp;|&nbsp;[[User_talk:Jfdwolff|<small>T@lk</small>]]
# [[User:Richard|Richard<sub>RDF</sub>]]<sup>[[User_talk:Richard|talk]]</sup>
# [[User:Ed Poor|Uncle Ed]]
# [[User:Smithfarm|Smithfarm]]
# [[User:Igni|igni]]
# [[User:RockOfVictory|J. J.]] 15:06, 9 June 2006 (UTC). Evangelical Christian, but sensitive to bias in interfaith dialogue. Biblical studies emphasis.
# [[User:Itsmejudith|Itsmejudith]]
# [[User:Lbmixpro|LBMixPro]] [[User talk:Lbmixpro|<sup>&lt;Sp</sup>]][[Wikipedia:Esperanza|<span style="color:#0c0;"><sup>e</sup></span>]][[User talk:Lbmixpro|<sup>ak|</sup>]][[WP:CCD|<span style="color:#0cc;"><sup>o</sup></span>]][[User talk:Lbmixpro|<sup>n|it!&gt;</sup>]]
# [[User:Baristarim|Baristarim]] 11:17, 16 October 2006 (UTC)
# [[User:Elvenscout742|elvenscout742]] 22:16, 31 October 2006 (UTC)
#[[User:Sir james paul|Sir james paul]]
#[[User:Badbilltucker|Badbilltucker]]
#[[User:Justanother|Justanother]] Scientologist. Sensitive to most belief systems that do not include human sacrifice or having sex with children (though I am not a big fan of [[Santeria|animal sacrifice]] either but "if it works for you", I guess it is at least as valid a reason to kill an animal as a [[Big Mac]]).
#[[User:johnalexwood|johnalexwood]] - Scientologist in the UK
#[[User:Vassyana|Vassyana]] 10:02, 1 February 2007 (UTC)
# [[User:Misou|Misou]] 18:09, 9 February 2007 (UTC)
# <span style="background-color: #FFFF80; color: #800000">''[[User:Rursus|Rursus]]''</span> 09:55, 23 February 2007 (UTC) - very-very ordinary Christian anti-Creationist.
# [[User:Demmeis|Demmeis]] 02:06, 5 March 2007 (UTC) Evangelical Anglican Christian concerned about Islamophobia.  Also a creationist concerned about anti-evolution bias and lack of NPOV in articles related to favorite creationist topics.
# [[User:jackturner3|jackturner3]] 29 March 2007 - adjunct professor of Religious Studies
#[[User:Astuishin|- thank you  Astuishin]] 19:13, 29 April 2007 (UTC)
# [[User:KnightMove|KnightMove]] - currently busy to stop massive Bahá'í POV establishment activities. If there were none, I would not have any problem with this religion.
# [[User:Unless you|unless]] 21:38, 9 September 2007 (UTC) - Very agnostic.
#[[User:Ganesh J. Acharya|Ganesh J. Acharya]] I am a Hindu, trying to understand what life is all about. 
#[[User:Zoeblackmore|<span style="color:green; font-family:Arial;">''Zoebuggie☺''</span>]] -interested but feeling my way around Wikipedia
#[[User:Rwenonah|Rwenonah]] ([[User talk:Rwenonah|talk]]) 19:38, 17 June 2014 (UTC)
#[[User:Jaredscribe|Jaredscribe]] I've noticed a persistent bias toward the post-christian secular, sharing many basic assumptions of the graeco-roman christian worldview
#[[User:VenusFeuerFalle]]
All members should feel free to add {{tl|User WikiProject Csbir}} to their userpages.<!--

==Structure==

Discuss the format for each article based on the WikiProject. Include various categories applicable to the topic.-->

==Goals==

This Wikiproject exists in order to facilitate the following:

# Discussion of exactly what a neutral point of view means with regard to religion
# To alert members to articles that are biased or that exhibit prejudice for or against religion or spirituality
# To cooperatively ensure neutrality in all articles that have to do with religion
# To discuss whether there is [[systemic bias]] in Wikipedia in regard to religion and spirituality and what can be done to counter this bias

==Projects==
===Neutralize vocabulary ===
# I suggest a project to "neutralize" the vocabulary of religious articles which contributes a lot to POV. Many words in that context, e.g. heresy, apostate, cult, etc. are used mainly by a specific POV. They can be used within NPOV when attributed "Irenaeus thought Gnosticism a heresy" but they should not be used unattributed. Other words are frequently used in a generalizing way which usually also contains a POV (e.g. calling all conservative Christians fundamentalists). --[[User:Irmgard|Irmgard]] 13:35, 27 August 2005 (UTC)
::I noticed that Hindus have myths and sects, but other religions have stories denominations. [[User:Andries|Andries]] 20:59, 23 February 2006 (UTC) 
:::I found out that the word [[sect]] has a different meaning in an Indian context. See [[sect]]. [[User:Andries|Andries]] 16:56, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

Such a clean-up would consist of
#* collecting not-NPOV words - best in subproject-article explaining why for each word
#* linking this article to other articles regarding NPOV so it is accessible to the community
#* cleaning up - article by article during article cleanup or word by word using word searches

<!--This section is for organizing group projects-->
===[[Wikipedia:WikiProject Countering systemic bias in religion/Assessment|Assessment]]===
The department to assess articles with which this project deals, and, if required, draw attention to articles which are in need of attention.

==Tasks==
# I propose renaming of [[Separation of church and state]] to [[Relations between religions and states]], and [[Separation of church and state in the US]] to [[Secularism in the US]] or [[Relation between religions and state in the US]].. Have a look at the relevant talk pages.. I am proposing the renames to counter the systemic bias and to make these articles have a more global approach.. [[User:Baristarim|Baristarim]] 11:17, 16 October 2006 (UTC)

:This makes sense to me. Also, within the article currently entitled [[Separation of church and state]] it would be better to list the countries in alphabetical order and not try and classify them into those which have or do not have separation. There are just too many complex cases. The detail is in the text relating to each country, for those who are interested. [[User:Itsmejudith|Itsmejudith]] 17:01, 16 October 2006 (UTC)

::I'm not sure about this; the term Separation of Church and State is used so frequently that it practically is a proper name; it's also qualitatively/conceptually distinctint from 'relations between religions and states' as it implies a certain kind of relationship betweeen religion and states.  It's a philosophical concept found in the works of numerous political philosophers as well as in the writings of the 'founding fathers' of the United States.  --[[User:The Way|The Way]] 06:39, 23 October 2006 (UTC)

:::The phrase is a widely-used term of art that is quoted in practically every legal decision which involves the relationship of government and religion (in the US).  Putting it in quotes, perhaps, but PC'izing the phrase is unnecessary.  [[User:Izaakb|Izaakb]] 00:44, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

<!--For anything smaller or more specific than projects and anything that individuals can work on. Usually this is a list of individual articles. See [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Melbourne#Open tasks]] for one example of how this section can be used.-->

==Asian Lunisolar calendars and holiday cycles==
===[[New moon]]===
{{atop|status=Massive waste of time|result=This is a massive waste of time. Advice: either bring [[WP:BESTSOURCES|sources]] which support your proposed changes and their [[WP:RSUW|prominence]] in the academic literature, or don't propose them. If you cannot find sources which meet Wikipedia's [[WP:ECREE|high standards for exceptional claims]], then the content does not belong on Wikipedia. E.g. "{{tq|post-christian academic scientism}}" is not terminology supported in high quality academic literature.—&nbsp;[[User:Shibbolethink|<span style="color: black">Shibboleth</span><span style="color: maroon">ink</span>]] <sup>([[User talk:Shibbolethink|♔]]</sup> <sup>[[Special:Contributions/Shibbolethink|♕]])</sup> 16:31, 4 April 2023 (UTC)}}

;+1 Gender balance, +1 Global perspective, +1 Asian religions and philosophies, +1 natural philosophy
:Trying to make +1 for addressing systemic bias in academia: {{slink|Talk:New_moon#Separating_sections:_Lunisolar_Calendar_and_Lunar_Calendar}}
Today is the second new moon of spring.  We don't know this, because they refuse to feature this kind of content on the main page, accusing people like me of POV promoting a lunar religion, and suggesting that I'm [[WP:NOTHERE]].  We need to find points of intersection in this struggle.  Lets get the new moon on the main page next month.[[User:Jaredscribe|Jaredscribe]] ([[User talk:Jaredscribe|talk]]) 06:47, 14 April 2021 (UTC)

The [[Chinese Calendar]], [[Hindu calendar]], and the [[Hebrew calendar]] are all [[Lunisolar calendars]], as was the ancient [[Babylonian calendar]].  
Civic and Religious holidays in all these Asiatic traditions are based on different days than the ones we use.
Trying to more adquately represent Asian cultures in wikipedia. [[User:Jaredscribe|Jaredscribe]] ([[User talk:Jaredscribe|talk]]) 03:59, 3 April 2023 (UTC)

:{{tq|Non-solarian religions}} and {{tq|lunisolar religions}} are [[WP:1DAY]]. [[User:tgeorgescu|tgeorgescu]] ([[User talk:tgeorgescu|talk]])  13:11, 3 April 2023 (UTC)
::I would never use such a coinage as {{tq|non-Solarian religion}} or its opposite in mainspace. This is for discussion, and feedback, not for publication.  If you had a legitimate grievance against my description of your own bias as {{tq|Solarian religion}} due to your use of the Egyptian and later imperial Roman calendar system and astrology, you could have suggested alternative names here, per [[WP:DISCUSS]] to which I would have been amenable in the spirit of scholarly discourse.  What I am describing is perfectly clear if you bother to examine the context.
::I'm responding to meta-wiki edit-war you've declared, against "lunatic charlatans" on your own User page, @[[User:Tgeorgescu|Tgeorgescu]], and have been prosecuting through [[WP:CHOPSY]] in an overly broad manner, and have [[WP:Hound]]ing my for the last two years over my contributions here.  I wasn't aware that you were taking this so personally or I would have upgraded the diction earlier.
::[[User:Jaredscribe|Jaredscribe]] ([[User talk:Jaredscribe|talk]]) 17:08, 3 April 2023 (UTC)
::I've also now complied with your earlier demands to remove the charge of {{tq|solarian religion}} from from my user page, which I had predicated of western christianity and post-christian academic scientism.
::I am not without right to make the the same <!-- Template:Unsigned --><small class="autosigned">—&nbsp;Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:Jaredscribe|Jaredscribe]] ([[User talk:Jaredscribe#top|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Jaredscribe|contribs]]) </small>
{{abot}}

==='''DEMANDS''' of ACADEMIC-bias POV-pushers at WP:CHOPSY===
{{atop|status=[[WP:SOAPBOX]] and [[WP:RGW]]|result=This is a massive sideshow, that distracts from the goals of writing an encyclopedia and is, additionally, the [[WP:WRONGVENUE]]. [[WP:DFTT]].—&nbsp;[[User:Shibbolethink|<span style="color: black">Shibboleth</span><span style="color: maroon">ink</span>]] <sup>([[User talk:Shibbolethink|♔]]</sup> <sup>[[Special:Contributions/Shibbolethink|♕]])</sup> 16:26, 4 April 2023 (UTC)}}
c/o @[[User:tgeorgescu]] et al
::1. Take the equally unwarranted, vulgur, unscientific and unsourced pejorative of 
::{{tq|lunatic charlatan}}  off your user page.  
::2. Deprecate the userbox that you and your colleagues use to signal their membership in your systemically-biased "CHOPSY-cabal", and please locate in your vocabulary a different pejorative to refer to the pseudo-scientists whom you are your actual targets, not us.  
::3. And stop allow @[[User:AndyTheGrump|AndyTheGrump]] to declare "bullsh--" on your [[WP:Academic bias]] page - he makes you look like a useful idiot by association.  [[appeal to ridicule]] is not acceptable in academia, and neither is verbal abuse.  Please teach him that lessson, since he refuses to learn from my corrections.  Your essay and your other editorial work are likely to improve considerably after these unreliable absurdities or expunged.  
::4. If you will not do this, you will have to give reliable sources, and explain and demonstrate some serious matters to all of us who inquire from Asia, Africa, the middle east and beyond.
::[[User:Jaredscribe|Jaredscribe]] ([[User talk:Jaredscribe|talk]]) 17:41, 3 April 2023 (UTC)
:::About {{tq|lunatic charlatan}}: tell that to Jimmy Wales, "lunatic charlatans" is the message he has broadcast to the public and was dully noted in mainstream media. [[User:tgeorgescu|tgeorgescu]] ([[User talk:tgeorgescu|talk]])  18:20, 3 April 2023 (UTC)
::::''Dully''? Or ''duly''? Or both? [[User:EEng#s|<b style="color:red;">E</b>]][[User talk:EEng#s|<b style="color:blue;">Eng</b>]] 04:55, 4 April 2023 (UTC)
:::::Duelly but undue. [[User:Levivich|Levivich]] ([[User talk:Levivich|talk]]) 11:27, 4 April 2023 (UTC)
{{abot}}

==Related articles==

:''See also NPOV items, etc., on {{tl|Spirituality tasks}}

===NPOV===
*[[List of purported cults]]
*[[Rajneesh]]
*[[Psychic detective]] - This article has been an ongoing target for attack by those who do not accept [[NPOV]] policy, as you can see at [[Talk:Psychic detective]]. If there is anyone here who has a good knowledge of this area, please help out the article needs a lot of work. - [[User:Solar|Solar]] 11:29, 6 February 2006 (UTC)
*[[Guru]] - unlike other articles on concepts in religion, this article contains a large section of "criticism" by Western scholars, some little-known. Talk page discussion has been polarized for many months. One editor claims he "has a problem to distinguish between good and bad gurus". Other editors (including myself) claim that this is [[WP:OR|original research]]. &mdash; [[User:Goethean|goethean]] [[User_talk:Goethean|&#2384;]] 17:03, 9 June 2006 (UTC)
*[[Cult apologist]] - Currently a cleanup is underway. Please feel free to add your input. --[[User:Justanother|Justanother]] 14:37, 1 February 2007 (UTC)
*[[Cessationism]] could use some serious attention from any interested editors and/or experts. It is currently heavily biased with a huge Charismatic/Pentecostal focused bibliography and similar POV. Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. [[User:Vassyana|Vassyana]] 06:50, 19 February 2007 (UTC)
* [[The Promised Land (sculpture)]] The article for a statue in Portland Oregon.  The statue itself expresses a POV: [[Supersessionism]], implicitly asserting that Oregon is the [[Promised Land]] and that the white American Christians depicted therefore have a divine right to possess it and dispossess its indigenous inhabitants.  The article assumes this as a false neutral, and tenant editors have refused to allow acknowledgement of it into the article. I've begun to challenge this on talk [[Talk:The_Promised_Land_(sculpture)#Meaning_and_interpretation_of_the_statue]] but have been accused of harrassment in a related dispute over the inscription (which I deny), and must now back off to avoid a block.[[User:Jaredscribe|Jaredscribe]] ([[User talk:Jaredscribe|talk]]) 07:20, 9 February 2021 (UTC)

===Merge===
*[[Brainwashing]] 

===Other, no tags===
*[[Apostasy]]
*[[Cult]]
**[[Cults and governments]]
**[[Destructive cult]]
**[[Opposition to cults and new religious movements]]
*[[Divine Light Mission]]
*[[Human]] - currently, [[Humanity]] and [[Homo Sapiens]] redirects to [[Human]], where human beings and humanity are treated as primates. Some editors (including myself) believe that the article implies that human beings are ''nothing more than'' primates. Discussion page has been polarized for years. Along with others, the conflict has resulted in an Arbcom case against one religious editor, [[User:Sam Spade]] &mdash; [[User:Goethean|goethean]] [[User_talk:Goethean|&#2384;]] 17:09, 9 June 2006 (UTC)
** The same dispute occured 2400 years ago, and was resolved when Plato and Aristotle defined human as a "rational animal".  The definition as "bipedal" was considered by them and rejected by them as a nonessential differentia, along with "hairless", and "having opposable thumbs".  This article makes the error of treating bipedal, hairless, opposable thumbs MORE ESSENTIAL than intelligence.  Another ignorant and retarded prejudice of mainstream "scientism", enforced here as [[WP:ABIAS|Academic bias]] according to the [[WP:CHOPSY]] test.  Thanks {{u|Goethean}} for bringing this to our attention. You can cite Aristotle [[Mortimer Adler]] on this.  I'm going to <del>attack</del> address points in that article in the coming months. [[WP:ENC]] [[User:Jaredscribe|Jaredscribe]] ([[User talk:Jaredscribe|talk]]) 07:05, 14 April 2021 (UTC)
*** So, what solution do you advocate for:
*** State that humans are body, soul and spirit, according to the [[New Testament]] [https://bible.org/seriespage/2-man-trinity-spirit-soul-body];
*** State that humans have seven bodies, according to [[Omraam Mikhaël Aïvanhov]];
*** State that humans have nine bodies, according to [[Rudolf Steiner]];
*** State that humans have an immortal soul, according to mainstream [[Christianity]];
*** State that humans don't have an immortal soul, since between death and resurrection their soul ceases to exist, according to [[Seventh-day Adventist Church]] and [[Jehovah's Witnesses]];
*** State that the soul of humans is simply the result of having a biological body of a human and being able to breathe oxygen, and if one is no longer able to breathe the soul ceases to exist, according to [[Seventh-day Adventist Church]];
*** State that humans don't have souls, selves or atmans at all, according to [[Buddhism]];
*** State that humans ''may'' become God after death, according to [[The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints]];
*** State that humans will resurrect in flesh on [[Earth]];
*** State that humans will resurrect as spiritual beings in heavens;
*** State that humans will become angels after death;
*** State that humans will reincarnate till they vanish forever;
*** State that humans will reincarnate till they become part of the chosen people, and only then they ''may'' get to heavens? [[User:Tgeorgescu|Tgeorgescu]] ([[User talk:Tgeorgescu|talk]]) 00:02, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
**** I advocate for exactly what I stated: Man is a  RATIONAL ANIMAL, according to Plato, Aristotle, and at least one notable philosopher from U. of Chicago who happened to be general editor of the Encyclopedia Britannica.  [[WP:VERECUNDIAM]].  I made no predications about the afterlife of the rational soul, and that is not what this dispute is about.  This editor should stop projecting his religious caricatures.  [[Straw men]] abound in the "arguments" given by defenders of the status quo, and ridicule is not an argument. [[User:Jaredscribe|Jaredscribe]] ([[User talk:Jaredscribe|talk]]) 01:18, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
***** Except {{tq|rational animal}} is not what they said. They said {{tq|speaking animal}}. {{tq|Rational animal}} is the specific Roman interpretation of those Greek statements. [[User:Tgeorgescu|Tgeorgescu]] ([[User talk:Tgeorgescu|talk]]) 19:19, 15 April 2021 (UTC)
***** To spell out the problem: [[science]] reached a consensus about what humans are, while all [[non-science]] academic fields either didn't reach any consensus thereupon, or rubber-stamp the consensus from science. [[User:tgeorgescu|tgeorgescu]] ([[User talk:tgeorgescu|talk]])  10:14, 14 June 2023 (UTC)
***** I took two courses on ethics, and therein {{tq|rational animal}} wasn't mentioned even once. Nor was mentioned any holy book, not even for criticizing it. Such definition is pedantic, and rarely used. [[User:tgeorgescu|tgeorgescu]] ([[User talk:tgeorgescu|talk]])  11:29, 16 August 2023 (UTC)
*[[Intelligent Design]]
*[[List of new religious movements]]
*[[Prem Rawat]]
**[[Criticism of Prem Rawat]]
*[[Sant Mat]] 
*[[Sathya Sai Baba]]
**[[Beliefs and practices in the Sathya Sai Organisation]]

===Articles on Freedom of religion===

* [[Freedom of religion]]

====Votes for deletion====
<!--To see one example of keeping track of various deletion votes, look at [[Wikipedia:LGBT notice board]]-->

*'''[[WP:VFD|Votes for deletion]]''' (Article deletion):
*'''[[WP:VFU|Votes for undelete]]''' (Article undeletion}:
*'''[[WP:TFD|Templates for deletion]]''':
*'''[[WP:CFD|Categories for deletion]]''':
*'''[[WP:IFD|Images for deletion]]''':
*'''[[WP:RFD|Redirects for deletion]]''':

==Requests==
===2006-12-04===
; [[Buddhism in modern India|Indian Buddhist Revival]] and [[Kherlanji Massacre]]
:As much as I'd love to do battle with Hkelkar and his fellow editors, I have a job and have to work.
:This is the way the article Indian Buddhist Revival (now redirected, with no request for input, to a page called Dalit Buddhist Movement)looks today:[[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dalit_Buddhist_movement]]. The page history (briefly interrupted by an editor who futily tries to protest named Pkulkani)is here:[[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Dalit_Buddhist_movement&action=history]].
:The Kherlanji Massacre (which, believe me, is truly horrific by ''any'' human standard) looks like this [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kherlanji_Massacre]]. This is it's page history:[[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Kherlanji_Massacre&action=history]].
:Hkelkar is working in concert with an Editor named Ambroodey, who was apparently called out of retirement by an editor named Dangerous Boy (or D-Boy). It appears I have a new "friend".
[[User:NinaEliza|NinaEliza]] 02:54, 5 December 2006 (UTC)
::I can't BEGIN to enumerate the various flaws in both these articles, but here's just one example. The ''repeated'' rapes of these women is not "alleged", it's a fact. The murders (''followed by the public parade of their bodies'') are not an "alleged" crime. 
::By all accounts India is a Country brimming full with excellent examples of culture, architecture, botany, art, religious icons, as well as a phenomenally rich history. Furthermore, I assert that it's a Country fair to bursting with incredibly smart and compassionate people. But unless something happened that I'm not aware of recently, The great Nation of India still considers ''rapes and murders'' to be ''crimes''.
::You've simply let this go on to long. I appreciate that everyone is busy doing other things, or perhaps you sincerely did not know.  But you must, must, start dealing with this. I'm copying the Hinduism project and the Indian Caste System project as well. I'm also copying my own projects. I know there's wonderful editors here, and wonderful people. I'm showing my hand, and asking for help.
[[User:NinaEliza|NinaEliza]] 04:22, 5 December 2006 (UTC)
::Yes, I know that these articles weren't part of WikiProject India, and I know that Hkelkar was never a member.  I apologize for sounding so shrill, and for bringing up a painful subject. But now that you're aware of what's going on, I would dearly appreciate it if you take these articles into your care. Thank you.
[[User:NinaEliza|NinaEliza]] 04:33, 5 December 2006 (UTC)
:::Okay, there's a lot of background, but basically the Indian Buddhist Movement(which isn't the best title) concerns Indians of Hindu descent classified as "dalits" converting to an extremely new form of Buddhism in an attempt to escape their caste, among other things.  The Kherlanji massacre doesn't exactly fall into the purview of this project - the family that was murdered were dalit. I'm not an Indian, and am in fact an American Nichiren Buddhist.  I would appreciate any and all assitance. If anything, just put them on your watchlist. 
:::Please don't doubt my desire to join your project. I joined a few nights ago, and never thought I would be asking for help so soon. If there is anything I can be of assitance with in your own Wiki-World, please let me know.
Sincerely, [[User:NinaEliza|NinaEliza]] 05:30, 5 December 2006 (UTC)
::There are so many wikipedia [[WP:NPOV]] violations in the post above that it truly boggles the mind. Look at the following NEWS SOURCE (remember that little annoyance, sources? Remember those little things called news sites? FYI, they're very reliable) that states the rapes as "alleged" (exact words)[http://www.ndtv.com/template/template.asp?template=dalitatrocities&id=97427&callid=1]:

<blockquote>
Two of them - Surekha and Priyanka were '''allegedly''' raped before they were killed.
</blockquote>

::See that? Allegedly. Ever hear of edits reflecting sources?Might want to read up on some wikipedia policies. Whether the Kherlanji crimes were atrocious, brutal or a Sunday afternoon barbecue is beside the point. We must adhere to NPOV. If articles on the [[holocaust]] (at least 6 million dead, and that's just us Jews) can be written in a neutral narrative why the hell not this? We are editors, not politicians. We should not use loaded words and distort the known facts unless we are certain that the sources reflect them. Memorize that please. [[User:Hkelkar|Hkelkar]] 06:50, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

*NDTV.COM (New Delhi Television Ltd)[[http://www.ndtv.com/template/template.asp?category=National&template=dalitatrocities&slug=Dalit+killing%3A+No+action+against+accused&id=95838&callid=1]]

*AsiaNewsItaly (For a more worldwide perspective) [[http://www.asianews.it/view.php?l=en&art=7673]] (actually not so much a news source as Christian Missionary Site - it's quite hidden)

*CNN-IBN News (it's the India division of CNN)[[http://www.ibnlive.com/news/dalit-oppression-a-dark-reality/26025-3.html]]

*Diligent Media Corporation [[http://www.dnaindia.com/report.asp?NewsID=1063562]]

Or, of course, you could do what you were going to do anyway and GOOGLE these events. You'll find neutral sources a plenty.  [[User:NinaEliza|NinaEliza]] 06:57, 5 December 2006 (UTC)
::Lady you need to check your refs a bit more carefully. My NDTV article is more recent than yours, listing the rapes as alleged. Your NDTV article dates Nov 4th. Mine dates December 4th. Now, I don't know how dates work in Shangri-La or wherever, but here on planet Earth December comes AFTER November. Since the most recent NDTV article says "alleged rape", the most recent source of information is that the rapes are NOT established facts as far as NDTV is concerned. Understand?
::Now, as far as that Bible-thumping rag "Asia News Italy" is concerned. Well, their partisanship is obvious.
::And guess what. The CNN article, is an op/ed by Asim Khan, also dated prior to December 4th, and it doesn;t even mention the alleged Kherlanji rapes, only the murders briefly in ONE sentence (the murders, of course are not alleged but fact, there are dead bodies to prove that). Please learn to do some research before making transparent attempts to reduce wikipedia to the level of a political soap opera. [[User:Hkelkar|Hkelkar]] 07:08, 5 December 2006 (UTC)
:::Hkelkar, I humbly apolgize for the terribly things I wrote above. It was offensive, irresponsible, and awful thing to bring up.
:::To all who read this request, please disregard it.  I posted this request without discussing it with the editors in question, which is the worst form of bad faith. My hurtful and incredibly stupid remarks were aimed at the very faiths I said I would help, which is simply unforgivable.

:::It's also the worst way to introduce myself. Again, I am very sorry. I have posted unique apologies to both the [[WP:INB]] and [[WP:HINDU]] pages should you want to know in detail why what I did was so very wrong. I only hope to be able to regain the good faith that I have lost in time.
Sincerely,
[[User:NinaEliza|NinaEliza]] 07:48, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

===2007-02-13===
; Baha'i Faith
: I would appreciate some views on an old dispute I had regarding the article [[Institution of the Counsellors]] - detailed on the talk page - as to whether the names of members were suitabel for inclusion under the [[WP:N]] and [[WP:RS]] policies. Thanks [[User:AndrewRT|AndrewRT]]([[User talk:AndrewRT|Talk]]) 19:13, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

== Lot of distorted and bogus information ==
This article [[Vishwakarma_(caste)]] does not consider views and opinions from any of books written by the 18 crore Vishwakarma members and is purely relying on Non-Vishwakarma members? All the sources chosen are either from Christians writers or from Non-Vishwakarmas members? This is like editing articles on Christianity but choosing the views and opinions of Muslims and Non-Christian writers? Hopelessly written according to me. Request to check the same. On continuously trying to explain I get threats of getting blocked. I belong to this community Vishwakarma so I know the information here does not follow my belief systems. When I try to question I am being shown wiki guidelines like [[Wikipedia:NPOV]] etc. While will a non community member know more about a community? Will a article on Physics be better justified by editors who do not come from physics background? [[User:Ganesh J. Acharya|Ganesh J. Acharya]] ([[User talk:Ganesh J. Acharya|talk]]) 06:31, 22 September 2013 (UTC)
:The reason to point this out is also to make readers and editors realize that [[Vishwakarma_(caste)]] has an entirely different customs and practices when compared to other Hindu communities. There are differences with regards to initiation of the yagnopaveetham and its practice there after, practice of the Vedas, marriage ceremony, ... the list goes on ..., and finally the death rituals. [[User:Ganesh J. Acharya|Ganesh J. Acharya]] ([[User talk:Ganesh J. Acharya|talk]]) 03:13, 28 September 2013 (UTC)

== Category:Vice and [[Lust]] ==

I've marked both of these pages for NPOV review because of blatant religious bias, but unfortunately no one has made any positive contributions yet and I am not knowledgeable enough in either subject to make positive edits on my own.  Could someone with a bit more background take a crack at them? [[User:Unless you|unless]] 13:12, 17 April 2007 (UTC)

==File:Philbar 2.png==
'''Only contains Western philosophers'''<br />
[[File:Philbar 2.png]]
I was around checking for more bias. I notice only pictures of Western philosophers. Philosophy has both [[Western philosophy|Western]] and [[Eastern philosophy|Eastern]] contributors. [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=File:Philbar.png&oldid=571017064] The current pictures are of [[Plato]], [[Kant]], [[Nietzsche]]. All three are Western philosophers. 
Currently the entire Wikipedia is almost leaned towards the western world. [[User:Ganesh J. Acharya|Ganesh J. Acharya]] ([[User talk:Ganesh J. Acharya|talk]]) 03:57, 26 October 2013 (UTC)
This bias is a persistent problem in university studies as well.  I suggest Solomon, Patanjali, Lao Tzu, Maimonides. [[User:Jaredscribe|Jaredscribe]] ([[User talk:Jaredscribe|talk]]) 07:06, 9 February 2021 (UTC)

==[[Jehovah%27s_Witnesses_beliefs]]==

{{archive top|This is a defunct WikiProject page. Moved discussion to [[Talk:Jehovah's_Witnesses_beliefs#Accusation of bias]]}}

I can't believe that after all this time there is bias in these articles and twisting of the facts and truth.
I start reading and right in the second paragraph some one has added a note about some dissemination of some news.
This isn't some news that no one else is talking about that can be glossed over like that.
There are bible translations out there that use the very phrase "[[Good News (Christianity) | The Good News]]" because it refers to [[The Gospel]],
that every Christian denomination refers to. 
So I changed it to what it should be and even added and internal link to the article for "The Gospel" which says in the first line, also referred to as "The Good News." These are the [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Jehovah%27s_Witnesses_beliefs&type=revision&diff=1011679065&oldid=1006507552 diffs.] And I am worried that this twisting of the facts by omission is shows a glaring bias. And I request that it be observed for a period, placed on a watch list, or whatever is official done at this project. Thank you. [[Special:Contributions/24.78.228.96|24.78.228.96]] ([[User talk:24.78.228.96|talk]]) 06:50, 12 March 2021 (UTC)

:It seems as though you may be over-reacting. You added a wikilink to the article, which was uncontested. It is not clear how the previous absence of that one wikilink indicates any 'twisting of facts', nor is it clear what other 'glaring bias' you're alluding to. You have not attempted to engage anyone at the article's Talk page regarding your concerns.--[[User:Jeffro77|<span style='color:#365F91'>'''Jeffro'''</span><span style='color:#FFC000'>''77''</span>]] ([[User talk:Jeffro77|talk]]) 09:34, 12 March 2021 (UTC)
::There he is, the man himself. I would want a second opinion on absolutely anything you have to say. As I wrote, I expect an attempt to be made to wipe away the internal link I added. The fact that I had to make that edit to the wording after all this time is a real concern. I'm glad you're here to minimize that point, which also vindicates my concern. [[Special:Contributions/24.78.228.96|24.78.228.96]] ([[User talk:24.78.228.96|talk]]) 16:46, 12 March 2021 (UTC)

:::And if the hypothetical boogeyman you've invented shows up, you can discuss their objections on the article's Talk page. The absence of a single wikilink that was overlooked because the context was already clear is not the conspiracy you imagine it to be. Apart from your pointless rhetoric here, there is no problem at all with the change you made to the article.--[[User:Jeffro77|<span style='color:#365F91'>'''Jeffro'''</span><span style='color:#FFC000'>''77''</span>]] ([[User talk:Jeffro77|talk]]) 04:00, 13 March 2021 (UTC)

:::The term "good news", without a wikilink, was first introduced into the text of the original article [[Beliefs and practices of Jehovah's Witnesses]] by {{User|AuthorityTam}}, a pro-JW editor, on 2 April 2009[https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Beliefs_and_practices_of_Jehovah%27s_Witnesses&type=revision&diff=281102255&oldid=281060758]. Elements of the subject relating to ''beliefs'' were split to [[Beliefs of Jehovah's Witnesses]] on 14 August 2010, with the same wording retained, and the article was renamed [[Jehovah's Witnesses beliefs]] later the same day. The context of the statement apparently seemed obvious to the editor who added the phrase and subsequent editors. At no point was a wikilink added to the term in question and then subsequently removed due to any supposed 'bias'.

:::If you have any legitimate concerns of bias to discuss regarding the article, please start a section at the article's Talk page.--[[User:Jeffro77|<span style='color:#365F91'>'''Jeffro'''</span><span style='color:#FFC000'>''77''</span>]] ([[User talk:Jeffro77|talk]]) 04:42, 13 March 2021 (UTC)
:::I have reviewed every change made to the lead of the article in question. Apart from occasional section or page blanking by vandals (some being JW supporters trying to redirect traffic to the denomination's website[https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Jehovah%27s_Witnesses_beliefs&diff=prev&oldid=948428165][https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Jehovah%27s_Witnesses_beliefs&diff=prev&oldid=856401296][https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Jehovah%27s_Witnesses_beliefs&diff=prev&oldid=856401640][https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Jehovah%27s_Witnesses_beliefs&diff=prev&oldid=856401685][https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Jehovah%27s_Witnesses_beliefs&diff=prev&oldid=856401761][https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Jehovah%27s_Witnesses_beliefs&diff=prev&oldid=856401788][https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Jehovah%27s_Witnesses_beliefs&diff=prev&oldid=856401822]), the only change made to the term "good news" in the lead was one removal of the quotations marks around the term on 23 December 2014,[https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Jehovah%27s_Witnesses_beliefs&diff=prev&oldid=639252109] which was reverted the same day.[https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Jehovah%27s_Witnesses_beliefs&diff=next&oldid=639252109] But if the IP editor won't take my word for it, they are welcome to review the history of the article themselves and point out any instance where the absent wikilink was supposedly added and then removed due to some imagined 'bias'.--[[User:Jeffro77|<span style='color:#365F91'>'''Jeffro'''</span><span style='color:#FFC000'>''77''</span>]] ([[User talk:Jeffro77|talk]]) 05:47, 13 March 2021 (UTC)
::::As I've already said, when I came across the article, the term "The Good News" (as a reference to Gospel's purpose, of every Christian denomination) was NOT there. What was there was written as some [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Jehovah%27s_Witnesses_beliefs&diff=prev&oldid=1011678651 diminished less maybe local joke of a new], which is a smear and a slight on this religion. No proverbial wheelbarrel full of distraction you bring into this can change that. [[Special:Contributions/24.78.228.96|24.78.228.96]] ([[User talk:24.78.228.96|talk]]) 22:11, 13 March 2021 (UTC)
:::::More than happy to hear whether other contributors here, or at the article’s Talk page where you should have raised your objection, agree with your novel reasoning on this matter.—[[User:Jeffro77|<span style='color:#365F91'>'''Jeffro'''</span><span style='color:#FFC000'>''77''</span>]] ([[User talk:Jeffro77|talk]]) 23:03, 13 March 2021 (UTC)

:::::I would also add that Jehovah's Witnesses do not capitalise the term "good news" (even when referring to the gospel). Additionally, the original editor who added the term included an extended quotation (which is still present 12 years later) in the supporting citation showing the use of "good news" explicitly in the context of Christian "proselytizing" (and the cited source explicitly explains that no negative connotation of the term "proselytize" is meant). The wikilink that has been added (which the IP editor imagines will be attacked for some bizarre reason) is entirely appropriate, but its absence was by no stretch of the imagination any attempt at 'smearing Christianity'.--[[User:Jeffro77|<span style='color:#365F91'>'''Jeffro'''</span><span style='color:#FFC000'>''77''</span>]] ([[User talk:Jeffro77|talk]]) 01:14, 14 March 2021 (UTC)

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