View source for Wiki143:Categories for discussion/User/Archive/February 2008

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===February 28===
====Category:Chilean-American Wikipedians====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''double upmerge'''. [[User:Wizardman|<span style="color:#060">'''''Wizardman'''''</span>]] 15:54, 14 March 2008 (UTC)
:{{Lc|Chilean-American Wikipedians}}<br />
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' Seems to be a redundant category, as both [[:Category:Wikipedians in Chile]] and [[:Category:American_Wikipedians]] already cover this.  [[User:Vivio Testarossa|<span style="color:green;">Vivio<span style="color:red;"> Testa<span style="color:blue;">rossa</span></span></span>]]<sup>[[User_talk:Vivio Testarossa|Talk]] [[User:VivioFateFan|Who]]</sup> 06:42, 28 February 2008 (UTC)
* <small>Moved from [[WP:CFD]]. Procedural relisting at correct forum. [[User:Bencherlite|Bencherlite]][[User talk:Bencherlite|<i><sup>Talk</sup></i>]] 22:36, 28 February 2008 (UTC)</small>
* '''Double upmerge''' to [[:Category:Chilean Wikipedians]] and [[:Category:American Wikipedians]]. The scope of the category is too narrow and, more generally, I don't believe it facilitates encyclopedic collaboration. I don't think one can assume that Chilean Americans possess an above-average ability or desire to collaborate on articles about Chilean American people, organisations, culture, and the like. Some likely will, but others will not. In general, I don't think we can judge about editors' interests and abilities solely on the basis of their identities (e.g. I edit articles related mostly to Africa, yet have no personal connection to the contintent). A similar case can be found at [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/December 2007#Category:Arab Canadian Wikipedians]]. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 06:57, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Double upmerge''' per above. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 06:05, 3 March 2008 (UTC)
----
:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

====Category:Wikipedians in the Interior====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:'' '''Upmerge to [[:Category:Wikipedians in Alaska]]''' [[User:WODUP|WODUP]] ([[User talk:WODUP|talk]]) 21:07, 7 March 2008 (UTC)
:{{lc|Wikipedians in the Interior}}
"This page is for Wikipedians from Fairbanks, the Tanana Valley, and elsewhere in the Interior region of Alaska." - Needs a rename to clarify what the category is for at minimum.  However, this is a single user category, so my first choice would be to upmerge to [[:Category:Wikipedians in Alaska]]. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 04:05, 28 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Upmerge''' as nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 04:05, 28 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Upmerge''' per nom. --[[User:Metropolitan90|Metropolitan90]] [[User talk:Metropolitan90|(talk)]] 08:31, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Upmerge''' as per nom. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 20:50, 3 March 2008 (UTC)
----
:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians interested in the Sims ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Delete''' - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 02:53, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

:{{lc|Wikipedians interested in the Sims}}
While the Sims probably has enough articles to collaborate on, this category is populated by a lone userbox page with no actual users.  Additionally, the userbox text is "This user enjoys playing the Sims", so any users adding the userbox would be miscategorized. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 04:05, 28 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as nom, without prejudice of recreation. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 04:05, 28 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom - miscategorisation: "enjoys playing the Sims" != interested in improving articles related to the Sims. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 08:46, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians interested in wild food ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Delete''' - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 02:53, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

:{{lc|Wikipedians interested in wild food}}
[[Wild food]] has been deleted, so this category can not facilitate collaboration.  Single-user category that has existed over a year. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 04:05, 28 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 04:05, 28 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom - serves no purpose. --[[User:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;">'''The'''</span>]] [[User_talk:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:black;"> '''Helpful'''</span>]] [[Special:Contributions/Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;"> '''One'''</span>]] <sup>[[User:Thehelpfulone/Review|(Review)]]</sup> 16:47, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as per nom. No article=no cat. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 20:50, 3 March 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians invited to the LA Meetup ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Delete''' - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 02:53, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

:{{lc|Wikipedians invited to the LA Meetup}}
Single user category despite existing for nearly 3 years, does not help the encyclopedia to categorize those who are invited to particular wiki-meetups. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 04:05, 28 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 04:05, 28 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom - even if this category was useful at some point in the past, it is not useful anymore. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 07:02, 3 March 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as per nom and Black Falcon. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 12:24, 4 March 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians interested in Antiquity ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''UpMerge''' [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in Antiquity]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in ancient history]] - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 02:31, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

:'''Rename''' [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in Antiquity]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in classical antiquity]]
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' [[Antiquity]] is a disambiguation page, and the term may refer to [[classical antiquity]] or [[ancient history]] in general. Judging from the page description and userbox, the category ''seems'' to be oriented toward the former meaning. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 08:08, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''UpMerge''' to [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in ancient history]] - At best, (and only if renamed per nom) this should be a parent cat divided by the subsections of [[Classical antiquity]]. ([[:Category:Wikipedians interested in the Roman empire]], for example.) - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 20:39, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
:*There are "interest" categories for ancient [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in ancient Carthage|Carthage]], [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in ancient Egypt|Egypt]], [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in ancient Greece|Greece]], [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in ancient Persia|Persia]] and [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in ancient Rome|Rome]], but all are currently subcats of [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in ancient history]] and [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in a region]]. I suppose it boils down to the question of whether an intermediary layer of categorisation for "classical antiquity" is needed... All in all, I can't say that I oppose upmerging. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 22:46, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''', does not help users write an encyclopedia. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 16:45, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
<hr style="width:50%;"/>
:<span style="color:Chocolate;">'''Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so that consensus may be reached.'''</span><br/><small>Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 04:05, 28 February 2008 (UTC)</small><!-- from Template:Relist -->
*'''Upmerge''' per Jc37. to [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in ancient history]] , but keep as a real category for the broadly interested, not just a parent. '''[[User:DGG|DGG]]''' ([[User talk:DGG|talk]]) 06:54, 5 March 2008 (UTC)
----
:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

=== February 24 ===
==== Category:Kosovo independence supporters ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Delete''' - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 00:18, 3 March 2008 (UTC)

:'''Convert to article''' [[:Category:Kosovo independence supporters]] to article [[Wikipedians who support Kosovo's independence]]
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' Category meant for userboxes improperly named. [[User:Hemlock Martinis|Hemlock Martinis]] ([[User talk:Hemlock Martinis|talk]]) 20:53, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Move to [[WP:UCFD]]''' [[User:Otto4711|Otto4711]] ([[User talk:Otto4711|talk]]) 22:01, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Moved to UCFD from CFD by me.''' [[User:Carlossuarez46|Carlossuarez46]] ([[User talk:Carlossuarez46|talk]]) 00:18, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as support/oppose category. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 00:54, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per VegaDark.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 19:41, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as per VegaDark and precedent. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 19:52, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per [[WP:NOT]] as a political issue support/oppose category. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 08:43, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
----
:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:User nds-NL ====
==== Category:User nds-NL-1 ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''delete'''. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 00:25, 7 March 2008 (UTC)

:[[:Category:User nds-NL]]
:[[:Category:User nds-NL-1]]
:single user cat. It seems that the user has created this cat on several language Wikipedias (with it having been apparently deleted on one of them), though still being a single user cat in those places as well. If no consensus to delete, upmerge -1 to the parent. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 21:52, 24 February 2008 (UTC)

*'''Delete both''' as nom. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 21:52, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete both''', as useless as all the Babel categories. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 22:05, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
:*'''comment'' on previous deletion rationale. My own experience of babel categories is that they are by far the most useful. Just to give an example: a question of notability about an Egyptian TV presenter might better be answered by someone with Arabic who is not on a TV-project, than by anybody particularly involved in TV projects. --[[User:Paularblaster|Paularblaster]] ([[User talk:Paularblaster|talk]]) 14:05, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' - If a Wikipedia doesn't exist and is unlikely to ever exist in a particular language/dialect, IMO we should delete the category for it. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 22:12, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per VegaDark.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 19:42, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' or up-merge. I'm not sure what the problem here is, nor am I aware of the "needs a local Wiki" requirement. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 04:28, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' <s>Upmerge to [[:Category:User nds]] and [[:Category:User nds-1]].</s> I think that "regional dialect" categories (see [[WP:UCFD/I#Wikipedians by non-ISO regional dialect|here]] for past discussions) do not facilitate encyclopedic collaboration. The primary usefulness of the Babel categories lies in their relationship to translation, yet regional dialects generally differ from the main language in terms of speech rather than writing, and it is the latter that is relevant to collaborative translation efforts. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 07:03, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete both''' - Useless categories that are lonely, with only one user each. --[[User:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;">'''The'''</span>]] [[User_talk:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:black;"> '''Helpful'''</span>]] [[Special:Contributions/Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;"> '''One'''</span>]] <sup>[[User:Thehelpfulone/Review|(Review)]]</sup> 16:48, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete'''. This is not anything other than a dialect of Dutch, and doesn't need a cat, and especially doesn't need Babelization for a single user. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 20:52, 3 March 2008 (UTC)
----
:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:User Torlak ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''delete'''. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 07:08, 3 March 2008 (UTC)

:[[:Category:User Torlak]] - single user category, and one of a regional dialect. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 21:46, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per several precedents, as nominator. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 21:46, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''', as useless as all other user-by-language categories. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 22:05, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' - If a Wikipedia doesn't exist and is unlikely to ever exist in a particular language/dialect, IMO we should delete the category for it. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 22:12, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per VegaDark (I'm seeing a pattern here...)  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 19:43, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
----
:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians interested in books as objects ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''no consensus'''. Although being a single-user category is a common reason for deletion (or merging), the fact that the category was created relatively recently <u>and</u> was created for a specifically collaborative purpose suggests that it may be appropriate to "give it time to grow". (I will not address the issue of how much value is inherent in a user category for a topic that is already covered by an active WikiProject, as there does not seem to be clear consensus on the issue -- similar questions have been raised in prior discussions, and my perception is based as much on the content of prior discussions as it is on this one.) Since the category's creator and sole member has expressed support for deletion if the category does not attract new members within a month of its creation, it might be best to revisit the issue in a few weeks, assuming no new arguments or ideas for renaming/reorganising are developed before then. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 18:03, 13 March 2008 (UTC)

:'''Rename''' [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in books as objects]] to [[:Category:Wikipedian bibliophiles]] (See [[bibliophile]])
:or
:'''Rename''' [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in books as objects]] to [[:category:Wikipedians interested in book history]]  (See [[History of the book]])
:or
:'''Delete''' - single member category.
:See also comments at [[:Category talk:Wikipedians interested in books as objects]] - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 19:52, 24 February 2008 (UTC)

*'''Comment''' - Unsure as yet, waiting for more discussion. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 19:52, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''', do not help users contribute to writing an encyclopedia. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 22:06, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' - the two rename proposals would result in single-article categories, which is not helpful for the encyclopedia. Collaboration can occur on the talk pages of [[bibliophile]] and [[History of the book]], a category is not necessary for this. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 22:12, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
:That assumes that everybody who is willing to share their expertise will be going out of their way to contribute to talkpages. -[[User:Paularblaster|Paularblaster]] ([[User talk:Paularblaster|talk]]) 13:58, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' to give it time to grow, I know from the first discussion on the depopulating of Wikipedians interested in books that there may be people out there that are interested in books themselves, not the contents. This could be the a category of people who would improve articles on such things as book binding, book publishing methods, book media, history of books, etc. Since Wikipedians interested in books was depopulated such a short time ago, and this category created in response to that, give it time to grow. I suggest that it be revisited in a few months. - [[User:Lady Aleena|LA]] @ 08:28, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
*:People who would improve articles on book binding, publishing methods, etc., etc., can and should be listed at [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Books#Participants]]. There's no need for a category. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 08:48, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
:::My understanding of wikiprojects is that they bring together those interested in systematically contributing to wikipedia in a particular field. I am already a member of two; more would rather overload me. Categories, in contrast, are a way of finding people with expertise in a particular field even if it is not the main area of their activity on wikipedia (at least, that's how I use them). --[[User:Paularblaster|Paularblaster]] ([[User talk:Paularblaster|talk]]) 13:58, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
::::As Paularblaster says, WikiProjects are just one of many ways we collaborate, and a full-on project is not always required. In fact, [[WP:PROJECT]]'s guidelines even recommend topical collaboration outside of a WikiProject when that's all that is needed. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 04:32, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
::::: But in this case, there is an existing WikiProject. And even collaboration outside WikiProjects doesn't require categories. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 05:05, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
::::::Nothing ''requires'' anything, but it helps. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 05:21, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''creator's comment'''. I recently created this category, with this name, to replace the now defunct "bibliophile" category which seems to have become an overpopulated catch-all for people interested in books in a variety of senses (also, incidentally, a problem with Wikiproject Books, which is more about literature than it is about books). The category is not intended exclusively for book historians, but also for those interested in book design, layout, bindings, etc. Hence neither "bibliophile" (which people take simply to mean "likes books") nor "book history" seemed entirely appropriate. The purpose is to provide a category for those willing to provide expertise in these areas even if their main contributions to wikipedia fall outside this field. I am myself an academic specializing in 16th and 17th-century print culture, but wikipedia is a hobby: my contributions are in areas that interest me more incidentally (and in any case it would be hard not to fall into OR, on top of which wikipedia is not a form of publication that looks good on an academic CV); nevertheless, I am perfectly happy to make my expertise available for anyone asking for it. This, I would have thought, is the reason for having categories as well as projects. If, in a month's time, nobody else has added themselves to the category then I would certainly be in favour of deletion. I should say, as the creator of this category, it would have been nice to receive notification of this discussion rather than stumble upon it - but CfD and AfD seem to have rather different etiquette. --[[User:Paularblaster|Paularblaster]] ([[User talk:Paularblaster|talk]]) 13:58, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' per my above comment. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 04:32, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
----
:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

===February 23===
==== Category:Wikipedians interested in books ====
<div class="boilerplate vfd" style="background:#bff9fc; margin:0 auto; padding:0 10px 0 10px; border:1px solid #AAAAAA;">
:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''No action, though a good discussion'''. This "nom" turned into an educational discussion and then a brainstorming discussion. Nothing wrong with that, imho. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 02:26, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

:{{lc|Wikipedians interested in books}}
I would like to reopen the discussion on the emptying of this category and making it a parent category. I was unaware of the original discussion until the category was "removed" from my user page. Emptying of this category does not seem to be a good idea, and [[User:Lady Aleena/Books|this is why]]. If you look at that page, I put all possible categories that I would belong to on that page. (I haven't created them yet, since I am the only member.) That is a lot of categories which would get created in the place of this one. There will be others who are far more read that I am, so their pages could have even more categories than that. Do we really want that many new user categories springing up, or do we want to keep it nice and simple? - [[User:Lady Aleena|LA]] @ 21:35, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
:'''Addendum:''' If that does not suit, would there be any problem with me creating a sign up page in the Wikipedia name space called [[Wikipedia:Wikipedians interested in books sign up]] so that categories could be created if there is enough interest in a genre, author, or series. - [[User:Lady Aleena|LA]] @ 21:45, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
:*In looking over [[User:Lady Aleena/Books|the list of cats you made]], a couple things: most of the author ones would be valid categories, presuming that enough Wikipedians would be interested in being included. The individual books, not so much. Unless it's a book series, or in some way can help with collaborating on more than a couple articles, it's likely to be nominated for deletion. And several of the TV series novella tie-in cats would likely be nominated for merging to "Wikipedians interested in x TV series". (Wikipedians interested in Star Trek, for example). - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 20:12, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
*The reason the category was depopulated was because it was far too broad for effective collaboration. I have an interest in books by [[Jonathan Kellerman]], [[Stuart Woods]] and [[Dale Brown]]; my friend is enormously fond of the novels of [[Benito Pérez Galdós]] and [[Edith Wharton]]. Are you able and willing to collaborate on their works? (Galdós, in particular, needs some attention; very few of his works have articles in the English Wikipedia.) Additionally, some of the "categories" in your list are far too narrow for collaboration, or are duplicative; we don't need separate categories for [[Xanth]] '''and''' [[Piers Anthony]], or for all of the varieties of the D&D and Star Trek universes; consolidating them and others like them will reduce your list by about half. Note that [[:Category:Wikipedians who read science fiction]] already exists; it is a useful category.  The "books" category is not useful as a collaborative tool in and of itself, but it is useful as an organizational category, with users sorted into smaller subcategories. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 01:11, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
**You are right that I wouldn't be able to collaborate on articles by those authors. The categories on my list however all have plenty of articles that can go with them. [[Piers Anthony]] does not equal [[Xanth]]. I have several of his series listed on that page; the [[Apprentice Adept]] series, the [[Bio of a Space Tyrant]] series, the [[Incarnations of Immortality]] series, and the [[Mode series]]. Also, there are hundreds of Star Trek books out there based on the various series (I think there are over a hundred for the original series alone), and then the technical manuals through the years. There are also probably hundreds of TSR RPG and White Wolf RPG based novels out there. The narrowing is needed. I saw that the scifi category was created, but a lot of genres are still missing. - [[User:Lady Aleena|LA]] @ 09:37, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
*Keep for organization purposes--and if some people do think they fit in it best in a very general way. Nothing wrong with that, either. They may either have very broad tastes, or be very unsophisticated. '''[[User:DGG|DGG]]''' ([[User talk:DGG|talk]]) 04:21, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
**They could be also very well read, so well read that they would have a worse list of categories than I would if all of those every get created. - [[User:Lady Aleena|LA]] @ 09:37, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep as a parent category, keep depopulated of individual users''' per last discussion.  If you wish to create a bunch of "books by series/genre" categories, that is your prerogative, but I would recommend you make sure the scope of the categories are not too narrow, and also that more people besides you will join the categories within a few days of creation (as we often delete single-user categories). [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 06:25, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
*:A couple of other notes: If this were AfD, this would be speedy closed.  Debates should not be re-opened like this so soon after closing (unless no consensus was reached, and even if that were the case this would be a bit soon), and therefore I support a '''speedy close'''.  If you disagree with the last close you should go to [[WP:DRV]].  Additionally, I would support deleting all current "who read" categories, as "who read" certainly doesn't translate to "interested in collaborating on".  I've read tons of books I have no interest in collaborating on, and like the nominator mentions, they have a category prepared for "all possible categories" that they could belong to.  This isn't helpful to Wikipedia in the least unless you plan on actually collaborating through all those categories.  I would support an "Interested in" naming convention by author (and perhaps by series, depending on the number of books in the series that such a category could support collaboration on), but "who read" includes too many people ''unlikely'' to collaborate that it makes it not useful (for instance, people who hated a book could theoretically add themselves to the category, simply because it applies to them, but obviously wouldn't want to collaborate on such articles).  Some books are practically manditory reading in middle school/high school, so many such "who read" categories could be close to all-inclusive ([[:Category:Wikipedians who read Shakespeare]], for instance, which thankfully currently doesn't exist). [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in Shakespeare]], though?  I'd definitely support such a category. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 07:00, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
*:::The convention of "Wikipedians who read..." was established some time ago, and that convention is noted on the category page for [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in books]]; while "Wikipedians interested in..." more clearly conveys the collaborative potential for the category, it would require a great deal of work to rename the currently named categories, and additionally runs the risk of miscategorizing editors who enjoyed a book but have no intention of contributing to its article. Changing the currently named categories is likely to anger many editors for very little practical gain, as the difference between "who have read" and "interested in" is not very broad. There is a [[Wikipedia talk:User categories for discussion/Archive 4#A radical proposal|potential solution]] to the problem, but that proposal didn't meet with anywhere near enough support to push it any farther. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 13:19, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
*::I didn't know about the next step of the process, since I had never used it before. The last time I put a user category up for discussion, there wasn't a separate section especially for user categories. I didn't know if there was a next step process in this area. If this discussion could be moved there without loss, I would do it. My question is, when were user categories so constricted that they are only for collaboration purposes? Are you saying that there are categories deleted just because they couldn't lead to collaboration, that there is a push to get rid of all community building categories? That is just plain sad to see. I like editing Wikipedia and seeing what a group of people can do to make the world a much more informed place, but I would also like to get to know those with whom I am editing. Sometimes the only way to do that is through little boxes and the categories they can create. - [[User:Lady Aleena|LA]] @ 09:37, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
*:::I don't know if you recall (since it was some time ago), but I also was involved in the userbox (re-)organisation efforts. I strongly support community building, and feel that that can be a good, though indirect, way to help contribute and promote collaboration among Wikipedians. That said, in general, category space just shouldn't be used for that. After months (years) of discussions, it's clear that the category system (all categories, not just Wikipedian cats) should not be used as "bottom-of-the-page" notices. (Categories being navigational tools.) If there is something noteworthy to place in the article, ''place it in the article''! If one wants to place a notice on their userpage, add some text, or a userbox, but don't use the ''category'' system for it. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 20:04, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' this and all its subcategories, as none of them helps users write an encyclopedia. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 17:02, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
:*Wow, that's obviously not true. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 04:34, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
::*Wow, yes it is. A category of users interested in books doesn't do anything to help the encyclopedia. WikiProject Books is the place for book-related collaboration. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 05:11, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Strongly support keeping depopulated as a parent category''' - Individual subcats are more useful for navigation in this case. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 19:54, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' DGG's comment sums up my own view pretty well. I have no problem with this being only a parent category, but at the same time I don't see what's going on ''now'' as a problem. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 04:36, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
**Nobody is discussing deleting the category, Ned. This was brought up because of an editor objecting to being removed from the cat when it was depopulated as an organizational cat. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 04:40, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
***Um, except for [[User:Angr|Angr]]. He did advocate deletion. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 04:41, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
***(to Horologium) Then replace "keep" with "supporting X" or whatever, it's still pretty obvious what I'm saying. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 04:49, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
=====The addendum=====
Would you support my suggestion in the addendum above? No one has mentioned it, so I feel the necessity to mention that it is there, but perhaps unread. - [[User:Lady Aleena|LA]] @ 08:24, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
:Actually, I don't support that, at least not in project space. For specific series or genres, a note dropped in the talk page for the main page of the series or genre about the possibility of forming a user category should be sufficient to identify if there is enough interest. I'm not strongly opposed, though, and might be convinced to support your proposal, although I think it needs a different name that what you have proposed. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 13:26, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
::It is basically the reverse of what Wikipedia:User categories for discussion is usually used for which is the deletion of categories. The "sign up" page would be for discussing creating user categories for authors, genres, or series. As I said earlier in regard to the red linked categories on [[User:Lady Aleena/Books|my books page]], I am not going to create them until I know there are enough people to make them worth creating. I could add this categorization to the current book template with a cautionary note to suggest the creation of new categories on the "sign up" page. I could put it at [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Wikipedians who read books subcategory suggestions]] or similar.
::Here is what I would put on the top of the suggested page...
<div style="border:1px solid #000;">This project is for the incrimental creation of user categories that would fall under the [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in books|Wikipedians interested in books]] parent category. It will help find categories which are in need of renaming or categorization under that category, and identify pan-media franchise categories which should be included here. Please discuss category name disputes on the talk page.<br/>
Do not hesitate to add your user page to a category which has yet to be created, which will cause a red link. That is acceptable until there are enough users who are in the category for it to be created. Please place your signature (<nowiki>~~~~</nowiki>) under each category which fits you.</div>
::Does that suit? - [[User:Lady Aleena|LA]] @ 14:33, 25 February 2008 (UTC)

*'''Comment''' Your addendum sounds like the sort of thing that might be handled as a subpage of [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Books]], with such a page perhaps serving as a useful means of organizing specific [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Council/Guide|task force|task forces]], like the existing [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Discworld]]. It could be a very good idea to have such a sign-up, I would think, if it would attract interested editors into collaborating on articles, even if they don't form specialized task forces. I don't know if user categories are the best way of organizing such collaborations or not. The problem inherent in ''any'' Wikipedia sign-up procedure, of course, is that people don't ''un''sign on becoming inactive and that many active editors who might participate never know the possibility exists. ''That'' difficulty is way beyond the scope of ''this'' discussion. :) --[[User:Moonriddengirl|Moonriddengirl]] <sup>[[User talk:Moonriddengirl|(talk)]]</sup> 14:46, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
**Moonriddengirl, I can name at least 20 different WikiProjects and task forces that deal with books in one way or another. The sane and organized creation of these subcategories is pan-project. Believe me, it needs to be on its own. - [[User:Lady Aleena|LA]] @ 10:42, 26 February 2008 (UTC)

::*I was going to suggest [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Council/Proposals]] as a place where you might get more focused feedback, but from your contribution page it seems you don't need me to point that out. :) I'll note that I was evidently slowly composing the above comment as you placed your note @14:33, because my comment was in reply to your note of 13:26. I will never understand how edit conflicts work...and don't. --[[User:Moonriddengirl|Moonriddengirl]] <sup>[[User talk:Moonriddengirl|(talk)]]</sup> 13:14, 26 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Usernames editors have expressed concern over ====
<div class="boilerplate vfd" style="background:#bff9fc; margin:0 auto; padding:0 10px 0 10px; border:1px solid #AAAAAA;">
:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Keep''' - That said, I'm going to list this on the /working page as a speedy rename to add the word "Wikipedian", per long convention. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 00:14, 3 March 2008 (UTC)

:{{lc|Usernames editors have expressed concern over}}
At minimum, this category needs a rename, since it is not categorizing user ''names'', it is categorizing the users themselves.  Additionally, however, I'm not entirely sure this category is useful at all.  Users are automatically added to this category when [[Template:uw-username]] is added to their page.  There is no indication what the requirements are for a user to legitimately "express concern" over a username, nor any indication that the category is actually ever used to find users to username block. The [[Wikipedia:Username#Dealing with inappropriate usernames|policy]] on usernames says to bring concerning usernames to [[Wikipedia:Usernames for administrator attention]], which I think is a much better solution than adding them to this category.  Additionally, the category has become large and unwieldy due to users in the category who actually are blocked not being removed, so using the category to find people to block is a shot in the dark. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 22:46, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as nom, or rename to [[:Category:Wikipedians with usernames editors have expressed concern over]] if no consensus to delete, as nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 22:46, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom.  I agree that [[WP:UAA]] is a more practical solution for reasons put forth above.   --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 14:56, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep but reform'''. Nominator seems to have misunderstood the purpose of this category. It is not for users that are to be blocked. Instead, the {{tlx|uw-username}} template is used for usernames that are ''not blatant enough'' to be reported to [[WP:UAA]], but where discussion is needed. The purpose of this category is to keep track of usernames where discussion has started, and after a reasonable period of time, either mark the concern as relieved or report the user to [[WP:RFCN]]. However, this category is not working because, as VegaDark says, blocked users and users where concern is relieved are not removed from the category. But this is not a problem with the category itself, but the way it is used. I therefore propose that the category be kept, and a note be posted to [[WT:U]] reminding people to remove blocked names (probably a bot can be set up to do this). [[User:Is he back?|Is he back?]] ([[User talk:Is he back?|talk]]) 21:06, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
**'''Comment''' It appears that [[User:DusterBot]] is supposed to remove blocked users from this category, but it stopped working in October. I will notify the bot owner. [[User:Is he back?|Is he back?]] ([[User talk:Is he back?|talk]]) 21:09, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
::*If all the "dealt with" users were out of the category, so only those who have had the template on their page for less than 5 days were listed, then it could indeed make the category managable and possibly useful.  It would still need a rename, however.  Do you oppose renaming? [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 20:38, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
:::*I'm not firmly opposed to a rename, but I don't really see the need either. Note that there are several bots that use this category, including DusterBot (see above) and the HBC AIV helperbots who identify users in this category that are reported to UAA, in order to inform admins that discussion has been attempted. If consensus is that a rename is required, this should be checked with the bot owners to make sure that the rename does not break any bots. But then again, it seems that the rename is only for semantic reasons and I don't think it is really necessary. [[User:Is he back?|Is he back?]] ([[User talk:Is he back?|talk]]) 23:28, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' per [[User:Is he back?]]. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 05:48, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
<hr style="width:50%;"/>
:<span style="color:Chocolate;">'''Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so that consensus may be reached.'''</span><br/><small>Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 01:50, 23 February 2008 (UTC)</small><!-- from Template:Relist -->
*'''Keep''' for entertainment value.  Funny names.--[[User:The Fat Man Who Never Came Back|The Fat Man Who Never Came Back]] ([[User talk:The Fat Man Who Never Came Back|talk]]) 03:20, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' useful category. If DusterBot doesen't come back up soon, I'd be willing to look at creating a replacement. [[User:SQL|<span style="font-size:7pt;color: #fff;background:#900;border:2px solid #999">SQL</span>]][[User talk:SQL|<sup style="font-size: 5pt;color:#999">Query me!</sup>]] 15:19, 28 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' - UAA can only really be used for blatantly inappropriate or promotional usernames. Granted there's a few accounts on that list that could probably go right to UAA straight away, but there are many on there who aren't. If anything, it's useful for keeping an eye on potential joke names. [[User:SMC|SMC]] ([[User talk:SMC|talk]]) 06:01, 1 March 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' - it's very useful for keeping an eye on usernames which aren't quite inappropriate enough for reporting to WP:UAA. [[User:EJF|EJF]] ([[User talk:EJF|talk]]) 12:27, 1 March 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

===February 22===
==== Category:Wikipedians interested in radio ====
<div class="boilerplate vfd" style="background:#bff9fc; margin:0 auto; padding:0 10px 0 10px; border:1px solid #AAAAAA;">
:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''delete'''. [[User:Wizardman|<span style="color:#060">'''''Wizardman'''''</span>]] 19:49, 22 March 2008 (UTC)
:{{Lc|Wikipedians interested in radio}}
:<small>'''Note:''' This is a group nomination of [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in radio]] and its subcategories. Detailed nomination rationales for the subcategories are offered below.</small>
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' This category is too vague to be useful for encyclopedic collaboration – indeed, it is too vague to be useful as anything other than a parent category. "Radio" can refer to the "[[radio|medium of wireless communication]]" in general, specific radio technologies, the activity of [[radio broadcasting]], specific [[radio programming|radio broadcasts]], [[radio frequency|radio frequencies]], the [[receiver (radio)|electronic device]], and a host of other things. Since there is no reason to expect that an interest in one implies an interest the others, the category effectively fails to tell us anything specific about the users it contains.
*If all subcategories are deleted, then '''delete'''; if all subcategories are not deleted, then '''depopulate''' of user pages. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 22:53, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Support''' the above. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 11:28, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Oppose''' and let people choose how specific they wish to be. '''[[User:DGG|DGG]]''' ([[User talk:DGG|talk]]) 04:22, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Depopulate, keep as a parent category''' if any of the subcategories remain.  If not, delete as empty, but allow recreation as a parent category if suitable subcategories are ever created (currently I would support deleting all subcategories, but I could support keeping some subcategories if they had an "interested in" naming convention). [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 06:25, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' parent category and all subcategories. None of them helps users write an encyclopedia. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 17:00, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
:*Are you new here? That's obviously not true. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 04:38, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
::*I've been here about a year longer than you have, and it obviously is true. User categories do nothing to assist encyclopedia-building. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 05:13, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
:::*Then you're just blind. This isn't something "in theory", it's something that actually happens on a daily bases. I've contacted other editors via such categories, and I've been contacted via similar categories. '''''Facts''''' would suggest that your generalization that all user cats are useless is wrong. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 05:24, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
::::*Thanks for the personal attack. Arguing with people is so much easier when they undermine themselves. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 05:26, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per Angr.  I'm interested in lots of things, watch many tv shows and listen to different radio shows, none of which I have an interest in writing about. --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 19:48, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' either as a parent category, or as a non-detailed interest category per DGG. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 04:38, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''20 days later...''' I don't whether this discussion is a difficult one to close or whether it's just escaped notice for such a long time. In any case, in the hope of restarting the process (or the conversation), I'm posting a brief recap of the discussion (if I inaccurately or inadequately represent one or more arguments, please modify my comments as necessary and feel free to hurl a [[WP:TROUT|fish or two]] in my direction -- I prefer [[salmon]], by the way.)
*:Of 7 participants, 2 support straightforward deletion, 3 support deletion contingent on deletion of the subcats (see the nominations below), and 2 oppose deletion. The arguments offered include:
*:''For deleting''
*::does not facilitate encyclopedic collaboration or help users to write an encyclopedia - reasons vary but include:
*:::"too vague to be useful ... fails to tell us anything specific about the users it contains"
*:::"user categories do nothing to assist encyclopedia-building"
*:::interest in something, watching a TV programme, or listening to a radio show does not translate into an interesting in writing about these subjects
*:''For keeping''
*::editors should be allowed to "choose how specific they wish to be"
*:'''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 17:26, 13 March 2008 (UTC)
*::Well, some of the subcategories are now on deletion review, so I don't know if this can be closed until that is over.  If that closes as endorse, this looks like a pretty clear delete.  If it closes as overturn and relist, then this will likely have to wait even longer to be closed until after the relisted categories get closed. *yawn* [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 19:25, 13 March 2008 (UTC)
*:::If the DRV results in "relist", I suggest they be subcats of [[:Category:Wikipedians by radio series]] (which I just created). [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in radio]] should be a parent cat, if kept at all. That said, I think a parent of a different name may be in order. (See: [[Serial (radio and television)]] for more information.) So either way, I support depopulation (and possibly deletion) of [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in radio]]. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 17:09, 14 March 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div> 

=====Wikipedians by radio talk shows=====
<div class="boilerplate vfd" style="background:#bff9fc; margin:0 auto; padding:0 10px 0 10px; border:1px solid #AAAAAA;">
:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''d<span style="color:red;">e</span>lete'''. [[user:east718|<small style="background:#fff;border:#191970 1px solid;color:#000;padding:0px 3px 1px 4px;white-space:nowrap">'''east<big style="color:#090">.</big>718''' ''at 04:19, March 1, 2008''</small>]]
:[[:Category:Wikipedians who listen to Car Talk]] - zero-user, single-article ([[Car Talk]]) category
:[[:Category:Wikipedians who listen to Howard Stern]] - ([[The Howard Stern Show]])
:[[:Category:Wikipedians who listen to Le Show]] - single-user, single-article ([[Le Show]]) category
:[[:Category:Wikipedians who listen to Mike and the Mad Dog]] - single-article category ([[Mike and the Mad Dog]])
:[[:Category:Wikipedians who listen to Mike and Mike in the Morning]] - single-article category ([[Mike and Mike in the Morning]])
:[[:Category:Wikipedians who listen to Nobody Likes Onions]] - single-user, single-article ([[Nobody Likes Onions]]) category
:[[:Category:Wikipedians who listen to Opie and Anthony]] - single-article category ([[Opie and Anthony]])
:[[:Category:Wikipedians who listen to Rush Limbaugh]] - ([[The Rush Limbaugh Show]])
:[[:Category:Wikipedians who listen to The Ed Schultz Show]] - single-user, single-article ([[The Ed Schultz Show]]) category
:[[:Category:Wikipedians who listen to The Herd]] - single-article category ([[The Herd with Colin Cowherd]])
:[[:Category:Wikipedians who listen to The Iain Lee Show]] - single-user category, lacks a corresponding article ([[The Iain Lee Show]], [[Iain Lee Show]]), the show is mentioned in the [[Iain Lee]] biographical article
:[[:Category:Wikipedians who listen to The Stephanie Miller Show]] - single-article category ([[The Stephanie Miller Show]])
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' The collaborative potential of these categories, if any, is in most cases limited to one article only. Moreover, it is questionable whether merely listening to a radio talk show implies any type of above-average ability or desire to improve articles about these shows. Knowledge of what was said on a talk show, which is the type of knowledge that is most likely to be gained from listening to the show, is not especially useful in an encyclopedic context, for two reasons. First, additions based on such knowledge are likely to be minor [[WP:TRIVIA|trivia]] -- although there will be exceptions. Second, per [[WP:UNDUE]], articles "should fairly represent all significant viewpoints that have been published by a reliable source, and should do so in proportion to the prominence of each". That is, that something was stated on a radio talk show should be mentioned in an article only if reliable sources deem it noteworthy, irrespective of how important, interesting, or controversial an individual user thinks it to be. In the end, the knowledge that matters is knowledge of and access to these reliable sources, not knowledge of the transcript of a talk show.
*'''Delete all''' as nominator. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 22:53, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete all''' - Not a whole lot I could add to that, so I'll just say "per nom" : ) - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 11:28, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete all''' These categories are not useful for collaboration in any way, unlike the network categories below. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 16:27, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete all''' per nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 06:25, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete all''' per nom, and my comments above. --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 19:49, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

=====Wikipedians by panelist game shows=====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''d<span style="color:red;">e</span>lete'''. [[user:east718|<small style="background:#fff;border:#ff8c00 1px solid;color:#000;padding:0px 3px 1px 4px;white-space:nowrap">'''east<big style="color:#090">.</big>718''' ''at 04:20, March 1, 2008''</small>]]
:[[:Category:Wikipedians who listen to I'm Sorry I Haven't a Clue]] - ([[I'm Sorry I Haven't a Clue]]}
:[[:Category:Wikipedians who listen to Just a Minute]] - ([[Just a Minute]])
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' Same as for "Wikipedians by radio talk shows".
*'''Delete both''' as nominator. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 22:53, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Weak Keep''' - I think that these are similar to those who watch game shows, noting though that the former is a parody, and both are comedic. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 11:28, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete both''' - Categorizing by "who listens" simply does not translate to "interested in collaborating on". Additionally, the scope seems too narrow for a category. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 06:25, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete both''' per above.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 19:50, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
----
:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

=====Wikipedians by radio series=====

<div class="boilerplate vfd" style="background:#bff9fc; margin:0 auto; padding:0 10px 0 10px; border:1px solid #AAAAAA;">
:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:'' '''Delete'''. -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO|talk]]) 23:43, 7 March 2008 (UTC)

:[[:Category:Wikipedians who listen to The Goon Show]] - ([[The Goon Show]])
:[[:Category:Wikipedians who listen to the Navy Lark]] - ([[The Navy Lark]])
:[[:Category:Wikipedians who listen to Round the Horne]] - ([[Round the Horne]])
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' Same as for "Wikipedians by radio talk shows".
*'''Delete all''' as nominator. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 22:53, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Strong Keep''' - If we keep TV series, then we should keep these. Same reasons, same rationales. We shouldn't discriminate by media type. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 11:28, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' - While I agree with jc37 that it ''might'' create a double standard to delete these but keep the TV series categories, I fully support deleting (or renaming) all the tv series categories, so I have no proplem with dealing with these first. Additionally the TV categories will have articles on individual episodes to collaborate on, which the radio shows will not have, so I'm not even entirely convinced that if we have those we should keep these. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 06:25, 24 February 2008 (UTC)

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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

====Category:Wikipedians who are critical of Christianity====
<div class="boilerplate vfd" style="background:#bff9fc; margin:0 auto; padding:0 10px 0 10px; border:1px solid #AAAAAA;">
:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''deleted''' by [[User:East718]]. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 22:12, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{lc|Wikipedians who are critical of Christianity}}
Potentially divisive, "not" category, lots of precedent to delete.  Listing in speedy for another admin to confirm. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 06:13, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Speedy delete''' as nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 06:13, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Comment''' - This seems to be more a "Support/Oppose" cat. Should probably be moved to main nomination section. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 18:42, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''': A nonsense category, per nom. <font color="#CC0000" size="-2">[[User:Seicer|<font color="#CC0000">seicer</font>]] | [[User talk:Seicer|<font color="#669900">talk</font>]] | [[Special:Contributions/Seicer|<font color="#669900">contribs</font>]]</font> 21:09, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Speedy Delete''' as per overwhelming precedent. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 21:38, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as divisive; this will not help build the encyclopedia.  [[User:6SJ7|6SJ7]] ([[User talk:6SJ7|talk]]) 21:46, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Speedy''' as per other similar catgs deleted. [[User:Jossi|≈ jossi ≈]] <small>[[User_talk:Jossi|(talk)]]</small> 01:22, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
----
:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians who are Xbox Ambassadors ====
<div class="boilerplate vfd" style="background:#bff9fc; margin:0 auto; padding:0 10px 0 10px; border:1px solid #AAAAAA;">
:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Delete''' - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 00:08, 3 March 2008 (UTC)

:{{lc|Wikipedians who are Xbox Ambassadors}}
Not helpful to Wikipedia to categorize this. The userbox is sufficient to convey this information. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 06:13, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 06:13, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*<s>'''Keep''' - [[Xbox Ambassadors]] have shown themselves to be willing to assist other Xbox users with problems and having a category for those looking for assistance that may have to do with both Xbox and Wikipedia is worthwhile. the category has utility, moreso than many other user-affiliation categories. furthermore, nominator has not proved disutility. </s>[[User:Xenocidic|xenocidic]] ([[User talk:Xenocidic|talk]]) 14:03, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Don't care anymore'''. Whatever BlackFalcon decides. [[User:Xenocidic|xenocidic]] ([[User talk:Xenocidic|talk]]) 19:39, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''': Per nom. A userbox is sufficient for this. There's no need to clutter up WP with redundant or useless categories that are not wholly relevant to WP. <span style="color:#669900;font:Trebuchet MS;font-size:10px;">[[User:Seicer|Seicer]] ([[User talk:Seicer|t]] | [[Special:Contributions/Seicer|c]])</span> 16:31, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
:*The same argument could be made against {{lc|Rouge_editors}}. 'clutter' argument fails [[Wikipedia:PERFORMANCE]]. [[User:Xenocidic|xenocidic]] ([[User talk:Xenocidic|talk]]) 16:40, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
::*Please see [[WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS]] (incidentally, I intend to nominate that category shortly). As for [[WP:PERFORMANCE]], it makes an argument about server space and server performance only; however, clutter also impedes the ability of human editors to navigate through and make use of user categories. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 16:48, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
:::*Yes, I'm aware my argument was a logical fallacy. It was also an [[argumentum ad hominem]], but you missed the bonus points for that one. =) [[User:Xenocidic|xenocidic]] ([[User talk:Xenocidic|talk]]) 16:52, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
::::*Ah, I missed that. :) '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 17:11, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
:::*[[:Category:Rogue editors]] actually came about from a mess at ANI over <nowiki>Category:Rogue Administrators</nowiki>. <span style="color:#669900;font:Trebuchet MS;font-size:10px;">[[User:Seicer|Seicer]] ([[User talk:Seicer|t]] | [[Special:Contributions/Seicer|c]])</span> 17:03, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' <s>per nom. This is essentially a form of "[[WP:UCFD/I#Wikipedians by gaming website|Wikipedians by gaming website]]".</s> '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 16:50, 22 February 2008 (UTC) - rationale changed <small>'''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 07:14, 29 February 2008 (UTC)</small>
:*Not quite. Xbox Ambassadors are hand picked by Microsoft staff. [[User:Xenocidic|xenocidic]] ([[User talk:Xenocidic|talk]]) 16:52, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
::*My impression of [[Xbox Ambassador]]s, after having read the relevant section in the main article, is that they are the equivalents of Wikipedia [[Wikipedia:Administrators|administrators]]: "hand picked community members" who are supposed to be "helpful towards other ... members and are willing to assist new ... users". That is, their designation is more likely to reflect their experience, commitment, and personality than any subject-specific knowledge. Is that not (mostly) accurate? '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 17:11, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
:::*Mostly, but they do have working knowledge of Xbox 360, Xbox Live, and Microsoft support channels. [[User:Xenocidic|xenocidic]] ([[User talk:Xenocidic|talk]]) 17:14, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
::::*By "working knowledge", do you mean knowledge needed to operate a Xbox 360 and work in/with Xbox Live or knowledge that could be relevant to making non-[[WP:NOR|original research]] contributions to articles? Thanks, '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 17:50, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
:::::*Being Xbox Ambassadors they are much more in touch with the Xbox "scene" than run-of-the-mill Xbox users would be. Wikipedians who are also Xbox Ambassadors are very likely to contribute relevantly to articles, which is why I humbly maintain the category is worthwhile. [[User:Xenocidic|xenocidic]] ([[User talk:Xenocidic|talk]]) 18:07, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
::::::*Thanks for the clarification. I'll need a little time to think about this, and I will post back here. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 19:09, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
:::::::*Thank you for listening to my arguments. I respect whatever decision you make in this matter. [[User:Xenocidic|xenocidic]] ([[User talk:Xenocidic|talk]]) 19:28, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
::::::::*After reviewing [http://www.xbox.com/en-US/community/ambassadors/default.htm this] page, I still support deletion, although for a diffrent reason. While I can see how this type of categorisation ''could'' hypothetically be useful in some cases, I don't feel that this type of category is a good way of categorising users with the ability and/or desire to contribute to articles related to [[Xbox]]. It seems to me that "Wikipedians by alternate website status" are too prone to categorisation-for-identification as opposed to categorisation-for-collaboration, and would support independent creation of a more directly collaboration-oriented (e.g. interest) category for Xbox. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 07:14, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete:''' Per nom and Black Falcon. [[User:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;">'''The'''</span>]] [[User_talk:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:black;"> '''Helpful'''</span>]] [[Special:Contributions/Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;"> '''One'''</span>]] <sup>[[User:Thehelpfulone/Review|(Review)]]</sup> 17:51, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
:*I was under the impression that these are not supposed to be votes, but a venue for building consensus. If you have nothing at all to add to the discussion, why bother? [[User:Xenocidic|xenocidic]] ([[User talk:Xenocidic|talk]]) 18:43, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
::*'''Comment''' So you have to participate in the discussion to comment on deletion, when the points have already been made? --[[User:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;">'''The'''</span>]] [[User_talk:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:black;"> '''Helpful'''</span>]] [[Special:Contributions/Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;"> '''One'''</span>]] <sup>[[User:Thehelpfulone/Review|(Review)]]</sup> 19:19, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
:::*It's not a vote. If you have nothing to add, then there's no reason to comment. It's '''un'''helpful. [[User:Xenocidic|xenocidic]] ([[User talk:Xenocidic|talk]]) 19:22, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per everyone above. In addition to that there is a genuine problem here. Your arguments basically amount to "we were hand-picked by X organization or company hence we should have a user category to locate each other". That is fundamentally wrong. I don't have a problem with a category for users ''interested'' in Xbox but this isn't it. No one is stopping you from contributing to Wikipedia regardless of the category, you don't need it so we don't need to make an exception. [[User:EconomicsGuy II|EconomicsGuy]] ([[User talk:EconomicsGuy II|talk]]) 19:09, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
:*'''Comment''': Xbox Ambassadors are, by their very nature, interested in Xbox, otherwise they wouldn't have gone through the trouble of performing the actions required to be selected. on a related note, '''Interesting quote by nominator''' -  
{{cquote|User categories should exist for the purpose of finding others, not for the purpose of self identification.}}
:::[[User talk:Hyacinth/User categories#Proposal A: Collaborative statement requirement|''(source)'']]. By their own words, the nominator seems to support this category. [[User:Xenocidic|xenocidic]] ([[User talk:Xenocidic|talk]]) 19:28, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
::::Finding others ''for a Wikipedia-furthering purpose'', is what the implication was.  I don't believe this category does that (although I would support a category called "Wikipedians interested in Xbox" or something similar). [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 19:40, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
:::::Fair enough. Having read up on usercats, I am beginning to see the reason why this usercat might not qualify for the proposal and have changed my vote to "don't care anymore". It was a fun argument, while it lasted. No hard feelings. [[User:Xenocidic|xenocidic]] ([[User talk:Xenocidic|talk]]) 19:43, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
::*You are missing the point. This category serves one purpose only, to allow people hand-picked by Microsoft as ambassadors to find each other. Any other purpose can be achieved through a broader category. No thank you. [[User:EconomicsGuy II|EconomicsGuy]] ([[User talk:EconomicsGuy II|talk]]) 19:33, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''', does not help users write an encyclopedia. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 16:59, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' - Too myspace for a encyclopedia.--[[User:Playstationdude|Playstationdude]] ([[User talk:Playstationdude|talk]]) 20:27, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
:*'''Comment''' Dozens of myspacian listings, but you comment only on the Xbox 360-related ones? Thanks for your input "Playstation" dude. [[User:Xenocidic|xenocidic]] ([[User talk:Xenocidic|talk]]) 20:34, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians who like Xbox 360 ====
<div class="boilerplate vfd" style="background:#bff9fc; margin:0 auto; padding:0 10px 0 10px; border:1px solid #AAAAAA;">
:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Delete''' - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 00:09, 3 March 2008 (UTC)

:{{lc|Wikipedians who like Xbox 360}}
Most people "like" Xbox 360 i'd imagine.  Not helpful to categorize such users. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 06:13, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 06:13, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' is you wanna delete this you better delete all other "Wikipedians who like" categories. This is an outrage. --[[User:123Pie|123Pie]] ([[User talk:123Pie|talk]]) 09:49, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
:*That is not exactly true, although many ''have'' been deleted (see [[WP:UCFD/I#Wikipedians who like/dislike|here]]). It's all a matter of how much of a relationship there seems to be between a particular "like" and an interest in improving the encyclopedia. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 16:20, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
::*Wikipedian's who like Xbox 360 are very likely to improve Xbox 360 related articles. [[User:Xenocidic|xenocidic]] ([[User talk:Xenocidic|talk]]) 16:28, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
:::*That statement must assume either that any random like can translate into an encyclopedically-relevant interest or that there is something special about Xbox 360. I personally don't feel that either assumption is justified (e.g. I like luxury cars, yet I'm not at all likely to improve articles related to luxury cars). '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 16:57, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''', per drive-by nomination with dubious justification. [[User:Xenocidic|xenocidic]] ([[User talk:Xenocidic|talk]]) 14:29, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Comment''', If this get change from like to have, can it stay? --[[User:123Pie|Pie]][[User talk:123Pie|'s can talk]]! 15:22, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
:*That would introduce miscategorization problems (people who like the 360 might not own one). I don't see why this category needs deleted in the first place, let's let the CFD run its' course. [[User:Xenocidic|xenocidic]] ([[User talk:Xenocidic|talk]]) 15:29, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' - a grouping of users who like an admittedly nifty piece of electronic equipment [[WP:NOT#MYSPACE|does not facilitate encyclopedic collaboration]]. People like many objects, including Xbox 360s, luxury cars, gold watches, jewelry, expensive laptops, but it does not help to create groupings of users on the basis of these likes. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 16:20, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
:*Would the same argument not apply to [[Wikipedia:User_categories_for_discussion#Wikipedians_who_watch]] ? But in those, you only proposed renamed. [[User:Xenocidic|xenocidic]] ([[User talk:Xenocidic|talk]]) 16:24, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
::*[[WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS|Perhaps, perhaps not]]. More than anything, that was a procedural nomination, and it's possible that I'll later nominate one or more of those categories for deletion. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 16:57, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''': Wikipedia is not an extension of [[WP:NOT#MYSPACE|MySpace]]. What will we have next? Those who like the Nintendo Wii? Computers? Halo? A Butterfinger's candy bar? The list can go on, and we'd be stuck with hundreds of trivial categories that do not add value to Wikipedia, an encyclopedia. <span style="color:#669900;font:Trebuchet MS;font-size:10px;">[[User:Seicer|Seicer]] ([[User talk:Seicer|t]] | [[Special:Contributions/Seicer|c]])</span> 16:30, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Comment''', it was meant to be so Xbox users can find other Xbox users and ask for help, as wikipedians are serposed to help. --[[User:123Pie|Pie]][[User talk:123Pie|'s can talk]]! 18:17, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
:*For general help regarding questions unrelated to Wikipedia, there is the [[Wikipedia:Reference desk]]. However, in general, we don't (and shouldn't) maintain lists of users for reasons that are unrelated to building the encyclopedia. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 19:56, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete:''' Per <span style="color:#669900;font:Trebuchet MS;font-size:10px;">[[User:Seicer|Seicer]] ([[User talk:Seicer|t]] | [[Special:Contributions/Seicer|c]])</span>  and per nom. --[[User:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;">'''The'''</span>]] [[User_talk:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:black;"> '''Helpful'''</span>]] [[Special:Contributions/Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;"> '''One'''</span>]] <sup>[[User:Thehelpfulone/Review|(Review)]]</sup> 17:50, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''', does not help users write an encyclopedia. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 16:58, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''', gives me a list of people to track down and shoot their Xboxen with my Three Ring Ray of Doom. I'm kidding, of course, this isn't a useful category. Editors who need to discuss 360-related articles will naturally find each other via the talk pages. [[User:Sockatume|Sockatume]] ([[User talk:Sockatume|talk]]) 01:43, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''', Too myspace for a encyclopedia.--[[User:Playstationdude|Playstationdude]] ([[User talk:Playstationdude|talk]]) 20:28, 25 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

====Category:Wikipedians interested in Meher Baba====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''speedy delete''' per [[WP:CSD#C1|CSD C1]] (empty category) and [[WP:CSD#G7|CSD G7]] (author request). The category (and userbox) creator emptied the category and consented to deletion at [[Category talk:Wikipedians interested in Meher Baba|the category talk page]]. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 08:25, 29 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{lc|Wikipedians interested in Meher Baba}}
Per [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/Topical index#Wikipedians by individual]], categorizing by individual is too narrow for collaboration. Possibly redundant to [[:Category:Wikipedians who follow Meher Baba]]. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 06:13, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 06:13, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''', just because it's "one person" doesn't mean anything one way or another. {{tl|Meher Baba}} alone suggests that this is a perfectly good user category, and is not too narrow for collaboration. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 04:51, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''', does not help users write an encyclopedia. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 05:23, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

====Category:Wikipedians who have read the BIG HUGE FREAKING PURPLE BOX====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  ''see below''. There are three main issue at stake: purpose, scope and [[WP:POINT]].

I don't think that anyone disputes that this category does not (directly, at least) facilitate encyclopedic collaboration. In fact, it is marked as a humour category. Given that there is precedent for retaining some humour pages, the question then becomes whether this should be such a case. Without making any judgment on that point specifically, I do wish to note two points:
#When it comes to categories (as opposed to, say, user pages or pages in the Wikipedia namespace), there is fairly consistent precedent ''against'' humour categories (see various discussions linked [[WP:UCFD/I#Nonsense/joke/humour categories|here]]).
#A humour page is effective only if it is generally perceived to be humorous; such a page is not likely to be appropriate if it is a source of controversy, ill will, disruption, or anything else that hurts the encyclopedia or detracts from an atmosphere of collaboration. With this category, there is no consensus that it does not have any negative side-effects.

Various discussions (at UCFD and MFD) have produced a relatively consistent consensus that Wikipedia is not appropriate for random humour that is entirely unrelated to Wikipedia. It's safe to say that this catgory is Wikipedia-related, as it was created in response to a specific incident that took place on Wikipedia. This brings us to the third issue...

This category was created in response to a specific incident which involved a certain degree of controversy, hostility, and/or bitterness, and there is no question that it was created to make a point. Whether it is actively disruptive in the process of making this point can be disputed to some extent; however:
#The point made by the category targets (comments made by) a single user, and said user has expressed dissatisfaction with the existence of this category.
#In continuing to make a point, the category perpetuates the dispute/conflict/incident. This is most certainly unproductive.

Thus, considering all of these factors together, the result is '''delete'''. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 08:12, 29 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{lc|Wikipedians who have read the BIG HUGE FREAKING PURPLE BOX}}
Now that the rouge admins category is dealt with, I think this can safely be nominated.  WP:POINT creation during that discussion that serves no purpose towards encyclopedia building. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 06:13, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 06:13, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' for as long as there are editors or admins who haven't read the BIG HUGE FREAKING PURPLE BOX. Aids encyclopædia building by reminding people to read what is on the screen before leaping to judgement. [[User:DuncanHill|DuncanHill]] ([[User talk:DuncanHill|talk]]) 15:52, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete'''. Junk. &ndash; [[User:Steel359|Steel]] 16:08, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''': Nonsense. <span style="color:#669900;font:Trebuchet MS;font-size:10px;">[[User:Seicer|Seicer]] ([[User talk:Seicer|t]] | [[Special:Contributions/Seicer|c]])</span> 16:31, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as per nom. The category that resulted in the creation of this POINTy cat is gone now, and this should disappear as well. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 21:42, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as insulting nonsense and per [[WP:POINT]].  [[User:6SJ7|6SJ7]] ([[User talk:6SJ7|talk]]) 21:47, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*I must admit that I am wondering what disruption this category causes... -- [[User:Lucasbfr|<span style="color:#002BB8;">lucasbfr</span>]] <sup>[[User talk:Lucasbfr|<span style="color:#001F7F;">talk</span>]]</sup> 15:39, 26 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Rename''' to "...FREAKING BIG HUGE PURPLE BOX" (doesn't really flow presently). [[User:Xenocidic|xenocidic]] ([[User talk:Xenocidic|talk]]) 16:52, 26 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' You can't violate [[WP:POINT]] without making a disruption (making a point alone is fine). -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 04:40, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' per Ned. Making a point isn't the point of WP:POINT to prohibit :) Only a disruptive action, taken only to make a point, is what WP:POINT prohibits. The mere existence of a category doesn't disrupt anything, unless it's overtly offensive to a specific group or some similar problem, but this doesn't seem to have any such issue. <small style="font:bold 10px Arial;display:inline;border:#009 1px dashed;padding:1px 6px 2px 7px;white-space:nowrap">[[User:Equazcion|<font color="#000">Equazcion</font>]] [[User talk:equazcion|•''✗'']]/[[Special:Contributions/Equazcion|''C'' •]] ''07:22, 27 Feb 2008 (UTC)''</small>
*'''Keep'''. Mostly harmless. There are bigger fish to fry. -- [[User:Llywrch|llywrch]] ([[User talk:Llywrch|talk]]) 21:32, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' Is having this category causing a problem? [[WP:POINT]] is not violated because there is no disruption. [[User:Alexfusco5|<b style="color:blue;">Alex</b>]][[User talk:Alexfusco5|<b style="color:red;">fusco</b>]][[Special:Contributions/Alexfusco5|<sup style="color:green;">'''5'''</sup>]] 00:04, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' this childish nonsense; the encyclopedia is [[Main Page|that way]]. -_- '''[[User:Krimpet|<span style="color:#ff9900;">krimpet</span>]][[User talk:Krimpet|<span style="color:#ff6699;">✽</span>]]''' 03:13, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
**Ha. Best rationale ever. [[WP:SARCASM|I'm convinced]]. <small style="font:bold 10px Arial;display:inline;border:#009 1px dashed;padding:1px 6px 2px 7px;white-space:nowrap">[[User:Equazcion|<font color="#000">Equazcion</font>]] [[User talk:equazcion|•''✗'']]/[[Special:Contributions/Equazcion|''C'' •]] ''05:24, 29 Feb 2008 (UTC)''</small>
*'''Delete''', does not help users write an encyclopedia. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 05:21, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

====Category:Wikipedians who play Rövarspråket====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''d<span style="color:red;">e</span>lete'''. [[user:east718|<small style="background:#fff;border:#000 1px solid;color:#000;padding:0px 3px 1px 4px;white-space:nowrap">'''east<big style="color:#090">.</big>718''' ''at 04:22, March 1, 2008''</small>]]
:{{lc|Wikipedians who play Rövarspråket}}
Single article category, hence pointless to have a category for. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 06:13, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 06:13, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom - collaborative potential, if any, is limited to one article only: [[Rövarspråket]]. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 08:32, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

====Category:Wikipedians who try not to worry====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''d<span style="color:red;">e</span>lete'''. [[user:east718|<small style="background:#fff;border:#800080 1px solid;color:#000;padding:0px 3px 1px 4px;white-space:nowrap">'''east<big style="color:#090">.</big>718''' ''at 04:22, March 1, 2008''</small>]]
:{{Lc|Wikipedians who try not to worry}}
Useless, lots of past precedent to delete similar categories. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 06:13, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 06:13, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' - random, miscellaneous sentiment (see [[WP:UCFD/I#Miscellaneous sentiments|precedent]]). '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 06:39, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as nonsense.  [[User:6SJ7|6SJ7]] ([[User talk:6SJ7|talk]]) 21:48, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Speedy Delete''' as no content, no users are in the Category. --[[User:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;">'''The'''</span>]] [[User_talk:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:black;"> '''Helpful'''</span>]] [[Special:Contributions/Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;"> '''One'''</span>]] <sup>[[User:Thehelpfulone/Review|(Review)]]</sup> 17:57, 26 February 2008 (UTC)
*From the talk page of the category: ''"I created this page. However, I am okay with it being deleted. I already removed the destination from the user box that pointed to it. Thank you. Tommytocker (talk) 10:55, 22 February 2008 (UTC)"'', thus might qualify for [[WP:CSD#G7]]. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 04:44, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

=== February 21 ===
==== Category:Wikipedians who liked The Dukes of Hazzard ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''speedy rename'''. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 20:39, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

:'''Speedy Rename''' [[:Category:Wikipedians who liked The Dukes of Hazzard]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians who like The Dukes of Hazzard]] liked > like. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 02:08, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians who liked The Waltons ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Delete.''' [[User:WODUP|WODUP]] ([[User talk:WODUP|talk]]) 21:00, 7 March 2008 (UTC)
:'''Speedy Rename''' [[:Category:Wikipedians who liked The Waltons]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians who like The Waltons]] liked > like. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 02:10, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
*While I support the rename if the category is to remain, this is a single-user category whose scope is limited to two articles ([[The Waltons]] and [[List of The Waltons episodes]]) and thus could be deleted. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 03:01, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
:*Would you be willing to modify your comment to "Delete, without prejudice for recreation, should there be more collaborative material on the topic, or more Wikipedian interest in the catgeory"? - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 00:06, 3 March 2008 (UTC)
::*I'm perfectly OK with that. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 00:31, 3 March 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per above (the same logic could probably be used for many other tv show categories), rename per nom if no consensus to delete. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 06:44, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''': Trivial category. <span style="color:#669900;font:Trebuchet MS;font-size:10px;">[[User:Seicer|Seicer]] ([[User talk:Seicer|t]] | [[Special:Contributions/Seicer|c]])</span> 16:32, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Comment''' - Television series aren't limited to just the show and its episodes (or character pages/lists). And being a ''series'', means that there is more possible contribution material, than one may find for a stand alone show (or a "[[talk show]]" for that matter). Someone interested in the show may also be interested in contributing on the actors' articles. (Such as [[Richard Thomas]].) Also, there is the potential for expansion per other TV series articles. (One person's "cruft" is another person's article. The debate continues on...) Just looking over the main article, I see several places for exansion (the later movies, or the new series, for example). - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 18:42, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''', does not help users write an encyclopedia. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 16:57, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians who hate Television ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''delete'''.  Would have prefered not to close this as I participated, but it is unanimous and lack of administrators active here makes it necessary. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 20:25, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

:[[:Category:Wikipedians who hate Television]] - "not" category. Long precedent for deletion. See also [[WP:UBX#User categories]]. Populated by [[User:Blacklemon67/Notliketv]]. (Which is a prime candidate for MfD itself.) - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 01:40, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' - as nominator. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 01:40, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Speedy delete''' - Too much precedent for this to end up as anything but delete without deletion review overturning this precedent, which is doubtful. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 06:44, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''': Trivial category. <span style="color:#669900;font:Trebuchet MS;font-size:10px;">[[User:Seicer|Seicer]] ([[User talk:Seicer|t]] | [[Special:Contributions/Seicer|c]])</span> 16:33, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Speedy Delete''' as per overwhelming precedent. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 17:51, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''': I don't need it --[[User:Blacklemon67|BLACKLEMON-67 yay!]] ([[User talk:Blacklemon67|talk]]) 18:20, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Speedy delete:''' Unless I am mistaken, there are no users in this category. --[[User:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;">'''The'''</span>]] [[User_talk:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:black;"> '''Helpful'''</span>]] [[Special:Contributions/Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;"> '''One'''</span>]] <sup>[[User:Thehelpfulone/Review|(Review)]]</sup> 17:58, 26 February 2008 (UTC)

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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians who believe in Hetero marriage ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''speedy delete''' - was only seeded from a template that has been deleted. --[[User:Slakr|<span style="color:teal;font-weight:bold;">slakr</span>]]<small><sup>\&nbsp;[[User talk:Slakr|talk]]&nbsp;/</sup></small> 02:32, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
:[[:Category:Wikipedians who believe in Hetero marriage]] - "Support/Oppose issue" category, and at the same time, close to being a "Wikipedians by sexual preference", both of which have been repeatedly deleted in the past. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 01:23, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

*'''Delete''' - as nominator. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 01:23, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' - and this improves collaboration and isn't just a random category... how? [[User:David Fuchs|<span style="color:#cc6600;">David Fuchs</span>]]<sup> <nowiki>(</nowiki><small>[[User talk:David Fuchs|<span style="color:#993300;">talk</span>]]</small><nowiki>)</nowiki></sup> 01:28, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete'''. It's funny how everyone is avoiding the more serious issue, but it definitely should go. -[[User:Amarkov|Amarkov]] <small>[[User_talk:Amarkov|moo!]]</small> 01:32, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians on Erasmus ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:'' '''Delete'''. -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO|talk]]) 23:40, 7 March 2008 (UTC)

:[[:Category:Wikipedians on Erasmus]] - See [[ERASMUS programme]]:
:* ''"The aim of the ERASMUS Programme is to encourage and support [[academic mobility]] of [[higher education]] students and teachers within the [[European Union]], the [[European Economic Area]] countries of [[Iceland]], [[Liechtenstein]] and [[Norway]] as well as candidate countries such as [[Turkey]]."''
:* ''"The ERASMUS Programme, together with a number of other independent programmes, was incorporated into the [[Socrates programme]] when that programme was established in 1995. The Socrates programme ended on [[31 December]] [[1999]] and was replaced with the Socrates II programme on [[24 January]] [[2000]]. That, in turn, was replaced by the Lifelong Learning Programme 2007–2013 as from 1 January 2007."''

:So essentially, this single-article cat ''was'' an "all-inclusive" cat for any student of "higher learning" from the European Union.

:However, it's also now a defunct programme, that's been subsumed by several others. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 01:03, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

*'''Delete''' - as nominator. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 01:03, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 06:44, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''', Erasmus is still the name used for it - its brand as it were - and it is know by that name. It is not about higher learning in general, it is an exchange programme. And further more it is not a normal exchange programme given its design to make it much easier, provide large support grants for students and its cultural impact (the film [[L'Auberge espagnole]], the culture surrounding the programme such as "erasmus parties" and its use usage (compulsory for some courses) across the continent. I'm afraid jc37 has misunderstood the nature of the programme.- ''[[User:JLogan|J Logan]] <sup>[[User talk:JLogan|t]]</sup>'': 11:06, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
*:Even with that explanation, I'm still looking for how this helps contribution, rather than just interest in a single article (or possibly 2). It seems to me that a userpage notice should be enough. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 18:42, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
:::Oh like any of them help contribution, what about [[:Category:Wikipedians by alma mater: Groep T]] or [[:Category:Wikipedians by alma mater: Colorado College]]? Not really the point behind them.- ''[[User:JLogan|J Logan]] <sup>[[User talk:JLogan|t]]</sup>'': 12:01, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''', does not help users write an encyclopedia. As for [[:Category:Wikipedians by alma mater: Groep T]] and [[:Category:Wikipedians by alma mater: Colorado College]], [[WP:OTHERCRAPEXISTS]] is not a reason to keep. They should be deleted too. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 16:56, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
::Fair enough, so long as there are no double standards, getting rather tired of them.- ''[[User:JLogan|J Logan]] <sup>[[User talk:JLogan|t]]</sup>'': 18:23, 24 February 2008 (UTC)

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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians who like trigonometry ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Rename'''.  I'm also going to go ahead and list [[:Category:Wikipedians who like geometry]] and [[:Category:Wikipedians who like algebra]] as renames on the working page, as I feel this is an uncontroversial name change. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 00:17, 7 March 2008 (UTC)

*'''Rename''' [[:Category:Wikipedians who like trigonometry]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in trigonometry]] - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 00:53, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

*'''Rename''' - as nom. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 00:53, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Rename''' per nom. After considering the userbox and the subject, I think this is one of the rare cases where "who like" can be renamed to "interested in" without any substantial risk of miscategorisation. By the way, I think there is a similarly-named category for geometry... '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 03:07, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Rename''' per nom, and consider tagging and adding to this nomination both [[:Category:Wikipedians who like geometry]] and [[:Category:Wikipedians who like algebra]]. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 06:44, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
*:Fine with me. If so, this should be relisted to that date. Else feel free to nom those two in a separate nom. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 18:42, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''', does not help users write an encyclopedia. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 16:54, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
:*Are you even playing attention? -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 04:54, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
::*Yes, I am. I know this category was brought here for a name change, but I'd rather just have it deleted. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 05:02, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians who like Rome ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''speedy rename'''. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 01:32, 23 February 2008 (UTC)

:'''Rename''' [[:Category:Wikipedians who like Rome]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians who like Rome (TV series)]]. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 00:50, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Rename''' as nom. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 00:50, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Speedy rename''' - Seems straightforward. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 06:44, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians in the Faroe Islands ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:'' '''Delete without prejudice'''. If we have a future influx of Faroese editors, fair enough, but a one-editor category is pointless. -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO|talk]]) 23:39, 7 March 2008 (UTC)

:[[:Category:Wikipedians in the Faroe Islands]] - single Wikipedian cat. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 00:17, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

*<s>'''Delete''' as nom. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 00:17, 21 February 2008 (UTC)</s>
*I think this category could be useful for obtaining images of places or people in the [[Faroe Islands]], but the single user in the category has not edited in about 4 months (see [[Special:Contributions/Quackor|here]])... If deleted, I think it should be without prejudice to recreation. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 03:20, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' with prejudice to recreation - Only one user and less than 50,000 population, which has been the standard to delete so far.  Perhaps isolated locations like islands should be exempt from this standard, though? If that is determined, then allow recreation if more than one user is in the category within 5 days of recreation. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 06:44, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep'''. The category could potentially foster collaboration, although it has only one user now. But deleting the category wouldn't achieve anything useful. --[[User:Metropolitan90|Metropolitan90]] [[User talk:Metropolitan90|(talk)]] 07:49, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per Black Falcon. However, a word of caution is required here. People in the Faroe Islands generally do ''not'' want to be categorized as Danes for historical and political reasons that we should respect so no prejudice to recreation if more active Faroese Wikipedians want a category. [[User:EconomicsGuy II|EconomicsGuy]] ([[User talk:EconomicsGuy II|talk]]) 08:02, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' without prejudice to recreation, per above. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 18:42, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''', does not help users write an encyclopedia. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 16:54, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' and promote population. The only way people will be added is if they know the category exists. Deleting does not make sense with that in mind. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 04:57, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians in Espoo ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''delete''' without prejudice to recreation if more than a single Wikipedian joins the category within a few days of recreation. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 00:22, 7 March 2008 (UTC)

:[[:Category:Wikipedians in Espoo]] - single Wikipedian cat. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 00:09, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

*<s>'''Delete''' as nom. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 00:09, 21 February 2008 (UTC)</s>
*While this is a single-user cat, [[Espoo]] is the second-largest city in Finland and so perhaps merits a distinct category. However, since the sole user in the category is inactive (see [[Special:Contributions/Vallisso|contributions history]]) ... ''weak delete without prejudice to recreation''. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 03:16, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as single user category, but without prejudice to recreation if it gets more than one user in the category within 5 days of recreation. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 06:44, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as per Black Falcon. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 17:53, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' without prejudice to recreation, per above. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 18:42, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Speedy delete:''' Only one user uses the category, so it is kind of 'lonely'. --[[User:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;">'''The'''</span>]] [[User_talk:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:black;"> '''Helpful'''</span>]] [[Special:Contributions/Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;"> '''One'''</span>]] <sup>[[User:Thehelpfulone/Review|(Review)]]</sup> 18:01, 26 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' and promote population. The only way people will be added is if they know the category exists. Deleting does not make sense with that in mind. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 04:57, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

===February 20===
====Category:Wikipedians who are Cajuns====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''speedy rename'''. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 20:39, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

:[[:Category:Wikipedians who are Cajuns]] to [[:Category:Cajun Wikipedians]]
:'''''Speedy rename''' to match the convention of [[:Category:Wikipedians by ethnicity and nationality]].'' – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 00:10, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

====Wikipedians by radio station/network====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:'' '''Delete'''. -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO|talk]]) 23:36, 7 March 2008 (UTC)

*[[:Category:Wikipedians who listen to BBC Radio 4]]
*[[:Category:Wikipedians who listen to NPR]]
*[[:Category:Wikipedians who listen to Sirius Satellite Radio]]
*[[:Category:Wikipedians who listen to Air America Radio]]
*[[:Category:Wikipedians who listen to ESPN Radio]] - single-user category
These types of categories do not foster [[WP:NOT|encyclopedic collaboration]], since merely listening to a radio station does not imply possession of an above-average desire or ability to contribute encyclopedic content about it. (These categories could even include people who casually listen to the radio while driving or jogging.) See related precedents [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/February 2008#Category:Wikipedians who listen to FM 103.2|here]], [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/July 2007#Television Station categories|here]] and [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/August 2007#Category:Wikipedians who watch Sky News|here]].
*'''Delete all''' as nominator. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 23:30, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete all''' per nom. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 02:41, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete all''' per nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 06:44, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep'''. These cats, unlike previous cats I have voted to delete, are nationwide stations or networks, rather than single-market stations, and there are related categories (programs, personalities) associated with them. For example, it is likely that someone who listens to NPR can contribute to [[National Public Radio]] and at least one of the many programs on that network, such as [[All Things Considered]], [[Morning Edition]], [[Marketplace (radio program)|Marketplace]], [[Car Talk]] (which is a single-member subcat), or the multitude of other programs. The same could be said of [[Air America Radio]] or [[BBC Radio 4]]; AAR, in particular, is likely to have listeners who listen to more than one program on the network. The ESPN category contains two daughter categories (for specific programs), with more than a single user in each (each contains a discrete list, with some overlap), which is a valid use of sub-categorization. Sirius is a bit different; there is little to no relationship between the various channels offered by Sirius other than their medium of transmission. I suspect that most of the editors in this category listen to only one channel or program on Sirius ([[Howard Stern]]), which limits the utility of the category for collaboration, as they are interested only in Stern, not in Sirius or any of its other offerings. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 17:44, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*: I don't know. I think that that's a hard sell. If I were to "tune in", and listen to a single show, once a week, that technically makes me a listener of the station, even though I'm only interested in the single show. And what ''really'' makes this not work is syndication. If I only listen to [[Dr. Demento]] (interesting that the show is merged to the person's article), to what should I attribute my interest in the show? [[Westwood One]]? The individual station? No. Seems to vague, and too broad to be useful. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 18:42, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
:::My experience with listeners of NPR and Air America (I have friends who listen to each, to my consternation) is that they are ''very'' committed to their networks, and tend to listen to multiple programs on whichever network they favor. I don't want to mis-characterize their audiences, but they tend to be a bit more enthusiastic than listeners to Dr. Demento or other syndicated radio programs. Much as many fans of [[Rush Limbaugh]] or [[Coast to Coast AM]] are not just casual listeners, AAR attracts a fairly hardcore crowd, and they tend to be fairly knowledgeable about the network and its personalities.  This interest in multiple shows under the network banner is what makes the categories possibly useful, unlike Dr. Demento, which is a single show syndicated to a small ad hoc collection of stations, rather than through a full-fledged national network. The same holds true for almost all of the other talkers, whose shows are syndicated individually; the networks offer entire integrated packages of shows. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 20:47, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
::::I'm thinking also of their television counterparts, such as [[NBC]]. Just because I may watch [[The West Wing]], doesn't mean I'm knowledgeable about NBC, or (more importantly) interested whatsoever in collaborating/contributing to the NBC article or any of its related articles, save those which have to do with The West Wing. I see the same problem with the radio networks above. Do you disagree? - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 11:28, 23 February 2008 (UTC)

:::::TV networks are a bit different, as most people watch shows from multiple networks. My interest in ''[[Top Chef]]'' does not translate to an interest in [[Bravo (television network)|Bravo]], or to [[NBC Universal]], its parent. However, as I noted above, NPR and AAR have devoted followings. I have a good friend who seldom listens to any radio station other than NPR unless he is with friends who don't care for it; another friend didn't listen to the radio at all until an AAR affiliate sprang up near him, and it is the only station to which he listens. The networks grouped above have a more clearly defined focus than, say, '''Wikipedians who listen to Clear Channel stations''' or '''Wikipedians who watch CBS programs''', which are somewhat arbitrary groupings, because their only connection is based on ownership (who owns the transmitters), while there tends to be a cohesive, thematic grouping for PBS and AAR. (I am leaving the others out because I have little experience of knowledge of them; I have never had access to BBC4, and don't know much about ESPN. I've already addressed Sirius, which I can support deleting, as it is a grouping similar to the Clear Channel and CBS examples I provided above.) They are not single show groupings (such as the Limbaugh example I noted earlier (which has since been nominated for deletion), so there is a possibility of collaboration that doesn't exist with single-show categories. I am not strongly wedded to my argument, though, and I won't grieve if consensus runs against me here. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 16:26, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''', does not help users write an encyclopedia. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 16:53, 24 February 2008 (UTC)

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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians who maintain the Uruguayan Portal ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''No consensus''' on alternatives for "maintain". '''Rename''' "Uruguayan" to "Uruguay". - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 02:19, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

:[[:Category:Wikipedians who maintain the Uruguayan Portal]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians who maintain the Uruguay Portal]]
:'''''Speedy rename''' to replace the adjective ("Uruguayan") with the noun ("Uruguay").'' – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 00:15, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Comment''' - The userbox shown in the category says the user "contributes" to the Uruguayan portal, so I wonder if "who maintain" is the best naming convention we should have for portal categories. I'm thinking "who contribute to" or something else would be better. That being said, it may be a good idea to move this to the main section for further discussion. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 00:55, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
*<small>Moved to dated section. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 01:07, 20 February 2008 (UTC)</small>
*:Support renaming the portal cats to "...who contribute to...". - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 02:41, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
*::Also support renaming the portal cats to "...who maintain...", per below. (See how more discussion can make a person waffle between options? : ) - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 18:42, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*I think "who maintain" is a better standard, since an editor can make minor contributions to portal pages (e.g. updating links) without really being actively involved in maintaining the portal. Also, the userbox for [[Portal:Energy]] (see [[Template:User energy portal maintenance|here]]) uses the word "maintain"... '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 03:38, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
:*But is categorizing such users helpful?  I think it would be more helpful to categorize those who contribute, not simply maintain a portal.  If we do want to categorize those who maintain portals, does that mean we should have an additional category for those who do more than simply maintain them? I prefer "who contribute to" to "who maintain", but there may yet be a better naming convention I haven't thought of. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 06:44, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
::*Grouping users who maintain a portal creates a collaboration-oriented category, but I'm not sure how helpful it is on its own, since anyone wanting to contact such a user could just leave a message on the portal's talk page. (I suppose that the same could be said of WikiProject membership categories...) My concern with the "who contribute" wording is its ambiguity: does it refer to editors who make minor fixes (e.g. spelling, code) to portal pages, who write the articles that are displayed by portals, or who create a portal's subpages? The first group doesn't seem worth categorising, the second is fairly broad and undefined (one can write articles that fall under the scope of several portals without being involved with any of them), and the third could fall under a general interpretation of "who maintain". '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 14:40, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Rename''' as per nom. Once a portal is created, it is something that is maintained, which is why I support "maintain". Aligning the category with the name of the Portal is also a good idea, and it is something that Black Falcon has diligently pursued across a wide range of user categories. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 17:48, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''', does not help users write an encyclopedia, or even maintain a portal. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 16:52, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians who enjoy false-colour astronomy representations ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Delete''' - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 02:14, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

:{{Lc|Wikipedians who enjoy false-colour astronomy representations}}
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' Excessively narrow scope; the collaborative potential of this category, if any, seems to be limited essentially to one article only: [[false-colour]]. Moreover, it is questionable whether the message conveyed by the userbox that populates this category ([[Template:User FalseColour]]) has any clear relationship to encyclopedically-relevant interest in the subject of false-colour astronomy representations (i.e. an interest in improving articles related to the subject).
*'''Delete''' as nominator; if kept, rename to [[:Category:Wikipedians who like false-colour astronomy representations]]. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 00:52, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 00:55, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Oppose''' - per [[Wikipedia:User_categories_for_discussion/Archive/April_2007#Category:Wikipedians_who_enjoy_False_Colour_Representations|this discussion]]. While the userbox text is weak to support this, such Wikipedians could be helpful in creation/editing photos/graphics/images. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 07:35, 20 February 2008 (UTC) 
:*How do you come to that conclusion from a category grouping people who simply proclaim to enjoy the aesthetic value of a particular type of picture? I see nothing from that discussion that leads me to believe that any collaboration potential mentioned is anything more than imagined. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 06:44, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
::* Perhaps I'm incorrect, but interest in the topic would appear to lend itself to interest in ''making''. (Indeed, who has even heard of the term outside those who are involved in their production, or those who have discussed this here? : ) - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 18:42, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
:::*Someone could have stumbled upon the category, wondered what it was, saw a picture and went "cool!" and added themselves to the category.  "Who enjoy" is the dealbreaker for me here.  That in ''any'' category name is doubtful to support collaboration IMO.  As named, I don't think it is necessarily safe to assume the users within could help create such images. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 06:05, 3 March 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''', does not help users write an encyclopedia. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 16:51, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

====Category:Wikipedians who are fans of Linkin Park====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Delete'''. Would have prefered not to close this as I participated, but it is unanimous and lack of administrators active here makes it necessary. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 21:16, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{Lc|Wikipedians who are fans of Linkin Park}}
:'''''Delete''' per [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/July 2007#Category:Wikipedians by musician and all subcats]].'' – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 00:48, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom.  There are probably enough articles to support an "interested in" category if independently created, however. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 00:55, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per precedent and per nom. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 02:41, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

====Category:Wikipedians who are fans of the original ECW====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''delete'''. [[User:Wizardman|<span style="color:#060">'''''Wizardman'''''</span>]] 18:15, 1 March 2008 (UTC)
:{{Lc|Wikipedians who are fans of the original ECW}}
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' This is a category for fans of the defunct [[professional wrestling promotion]] [[Extreme Championship Wrestling]]. If it is judged to facilitate encyclopedic collaboration on articles related to ECW and to have an adequately broad scope, then it should be renamed to [[:Category:Wikipedian Extreme Championship Wrestling fans]], per the convention of [[:Category:Wikipedians who watch sports]].
*'''Delete''' as nominator; else rename. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 00:46, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom.  I'm a fan of the original ECW as well, but it doesn't help to categorize that fact as I have no interest at this time to collaborate on related articles. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 00:55, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

====Category:Wikipedians who play basketball====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''delete'''. [[User:Wizardman|<span style="color:#060">'''''Wizardman'''''</span>]] 18:12, 1 March 2008 (UTC)
:{{Lc|Wikipedians who play basketball}}
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' This category [[WP:NOT#MYSPACE|does not facilitate encyclopedic collaboration]]. The mere fact of having played a sport as popular as basketball implies neither an above-average knowledge of the sport nor an interest in contributing to articles relevant to the game. The userbox is sufficient to convey the sentiment; there is no need to generate a list of users who play the game.
*'''Delete''' as nominator. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 00:37, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Comment''' The same rationale could be said for everything else in [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in playing sports]], so perhaps a group nom is in order. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 00:55, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
:*I wasn't aware of the other categories. Perhaps this can be a test nomination of sorts? It could clarify whether the nomination rationale has acceptance and, if so, whether this applies to all subcats of [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in playing sports]] or is unique to the "basketball" category and perhaps some others. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 01:12, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
*<s>'''Keep for now'''</s>. Not sure how useful it is, but this has nothing to do with [[WP:NOT#MYSPACE]], and I'd much rather get larger community input on this considering the large numbers here. The previous purges leave me with the impression of a weak consensus. I'd likely still support making a better focus from these categories, or making some sort of transition to an acceptable form that is better aimed at collaboration, but these kinds of TfDs get used as "all or nothing" arguments all the time. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 05:39, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
:::*'''Neutral'''. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 06:51, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
:*The perception that user categories that contain a high number of users should be treated with more caution is often an illusion masked by the fact that such categories are generally populated by one or two userboxes. A category may contain several hundred user pages, but it only takes one editor to make one edit to one userbox to populate the category or to virtually empty it. As for a transition to something aimed at collaboration, I'm all for creating [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in basketball]] (though, for obvious reasons, I oppose a straightforward rename). Cheers, '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 06:47, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
::*A fair enough point, and I can't say I really feel strongly about it, but still.. eh, whatever, no big deal. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 06:51, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
:::*I think that the issue regarding population of a category by userboxes has come up in previous discussions, so I took a look at [[User:UBX/Basketball]]. In this case, it appears that the category is (almost) entirely populated by transclusions and/or substitutions of the userbox: there are 350 category members and ca. 350 transclusions of the userbox. Nonetheless, I think you hit on an important point when you suggested "making a better focus from these categories"; I don't feel that all sports categories should automatically be treated like this one. For instance, some sports have a fairly narrow base of participants and involve a fairly large commitment of time and effort (e.g. [[BASE jumping]]); in these cases, I think it's more likely (though not guaranteed) that people will have an encyclopedically-relevant interest in the subject. Thanks, '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 07:03, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' - I'm guessing almost every Wikipedian has played basketball at least one time in their life. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 06:44, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''', does not help users write an encyclopedia. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 16:50, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

====Category:Wikipedians who lend at Kiva====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''delete'''. [[User:Wizardman|<span style="color:#060">'''''Wizardman'''''</span>]] 18:04, 1 March 2008 (UTC)
:{{Lc|Wikipedians who lend at Kiva}}
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' Excessively narrow scope; the [[WP:NOT|collaborative potential]] of this category, if any, is limited to a single article: [[Kiva (organization)]].
*'''Delete''' as nominator. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 00:35, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 00:55, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

====Category:Wikipedians who follow the Chinmaya Mission====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''delete'''. [[User:Wizardman|<span style="color:#060">'''''Wizardman'''''</span>]] 17:37, 1 March 2008 (UTC)
:{{Lc|Wikipedians who follow the Chinmaya Mission}}
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' Excessively narrow scope; the collaborative potential of this category, if any, is essentially limited to two articles only: [[Chinmaya Mission]], [[Chinmayananda]].
*'''Delete''' as nominator; if kept, rename to [[:Category:Chinmaya Wikipedians]] or [[:Category:Chinmaya Mission Wikipedians]]. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 00:32, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 00:55, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians who use Unix-like Operating Systems ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Delete''' - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 04:18, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{Lc|Wikipedians who use Unix-like Operating Systems}}
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' There are many [[unix-like]] operating systems (about 20 are listed [[Unix-like#Current examples|here]]), and each has its own unique features, so this category seems to be too broad to be useful. It could perhaps function as a parent category, but [[:Category:Wikipedians by operating system]] is not so heavily populated as to require subcategorisation. If kept, the category needs to be renamed to fix the capitalisation of "operating systems".
*'''Delete''' as nominator; else rename. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 00:28, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 00:55, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' While the nom. is correct in saying that there are unique differences between all Unix-like O/S's, the enjoyed aspect of them is the Unix qualities. Compare to [[Microsoft Windows]]  [[User:Johnl1479|Johnl1479]] ([[User talk:Johnl1479|talk]]) 06:53, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
::Edit: I support rename to '''Wikipedians who use Unix-like operating systems''' — [[User:Johnl1479|Johnl1479]] ([[User talk:Johnl1479|talk]]) 17:42, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''', does not help users write an encyclopedia. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 16:49, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
:Couldn't that argument be used for near every user-related category? I propose the ignore the above [[User:Johnl1479|Johnl1479]] ([[User talk:Johnl1479|talk]]) 17:34, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
::Yes, it could, but that's no reason to ignore it. All user categories are useless and they should all be deleted. However, they're not all being discussed today. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 17:56, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
:::Touché. However, it could be argued that user's who belong to certain user categories may provide ''some'' knowledge to the relating article should any dispute arise. — [[User:Johnl1479|<font color="#0000FF">Jo</font><font color="#0033FF">hn</font><font color="#0066FF">l1</font><font color="#0099FF">47</font><font color="#00CCFF">9</font>]] 18:05, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
<s>*'''Keep''' Agree with [[User:Johnl1479]], Unix-like is a broad category, but it shows that the Wikipedian prefers the similarities that the o/s's have in common — [[Special:Contributions/71.197.96.202|71.197.96.202]] ([[User talk:71.197.96.202|talk]]) 17:41, 24 February 2008 (UTC)</s>
:*Removed obvious sockpuppetry vote, as per [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:User_categories_for_discussion&diff=193742275&oldid=193740919 this edit] where Johnl1479 accidentally signed as this IP. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 18:51, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
::Understood. See [[User_talk:Steel359|Steel's Talk Page]] for explanation: I neglected to log out of a public terminal — [[User:Johnl1479|<font color="#0000FF">Jo</font><font color="#0033FF">hn</font><font color="#0066FF">l1</font><font color="#0099FF">47</font><font color="#00CCFF">9</font>]] 19:35, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians who are fan of G-Unit Records ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  <s>'''Speedy Merge''' to [[:Category:WikiProject G-Unit Records members]] per creators comments about intended use of the category, below. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 01:07, 21 February 2008 (UTC)</s>
::'''Note:''' I intended to perform the merge, and discovered that the user's WikiProject userbox had apparebtly been deleted, and this cat was inserted in a series of "fans" userboxes, despite the user's comments below. When I removed this category (supposedly "intended" to be for WP:G-UNIT) from those fan userboxes, the category was empty. Therefore, '''Delete''' as C1 - empty of those for whom it was intended. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 01:20, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{Lc|Wikipedians who are fan of G-Unit Records}}
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' This category is for "fans of [[G-Unit Records]] or someone on their roster". If the precedent of [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/July 2007#Category:Wikipedians by musician and all subcats|this discussion]] does not apply, and if the category is judged to [[WP:NOT|facilitate encyclopedic collaboration]], then it should be renamed to a grammatically correct title, such as [[:Category:Wikipedians who like G-Unit Records]] or [[:Category:Wikipedian fans of G-Unit Records]].
:*'''Comment''': This Category is inteded for the [[WP:G-UNIT|G-Unit WikiProject]]. <span style="border:2px double #ffffff;padding:1px;background:#000000">&nbsp;[[User:UzEE|'''<span style="color:#15D5FE">U</span><span style="color:#E0D40F">z</span><span style="color:#80E221">E</span><span style="color:#FF4526">E</span>''']]&nbsp;</span> 05:25, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
::*[[:Category:WikiProject G-Unit Records members]] already exists and is populated by an unrelated userbox ([[Template:WikiProject:G-Unit Records/Userbox]]). Membership in a WikiProject and "fans of" userboxes and categories do not overlap, as one can be a fan of something without being a member of a WikiProject or having any interest in improving articles related to the topic. Incidentally, the userboxes that populate this category are listed [[User:UzEE/Userbox/Canned#G-Unit|here]]: two are "fans of" categories and one expresses a desire to be signed on by the record label. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 06:35, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as nominator; else rename. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 00:26, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. Being a "fan" of something does not mean one is interested on collaborating on articles related to that topic, so it is useless to Wikipedia. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 00:55, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Rename''' as appropriate. I am against delete. <span style="border:2px double #ffffff;padding:1px;background:#000000">&nbsp;[[User:UzEE|'''<span style="color:#15D5FE">U</span><span style="color:#E0D40F">z</span><span style="color:#80E221">E</span><span style="color:#FF4526">E</span>''']]&nbsp;</span> 05:25, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians who enjoy Tintin Graphic Novels ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Rename''' - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 07:00, 26 February 2008 (UTC)

:'''Rename''' [[:Category:Wikipedians who enjoy Tintin Graphic Novels]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians who read The Adventures of Tintin]]
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' To match the title of the comic book series (''[[The Adventures of Tintin]]''), per the convention of the [[:Category:Wikipedians who read comic books]]. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 00:19, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Speedy rename''' - Doesn't appear to be controversial, I'd do it myself but I presume the nominator had some doubts or he would have listed it in the speedy section in the first place, so i'll wait for further comment. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 00:55, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''', does not help users write an encyclopedia. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 16:49, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Rename''' per nom. — [[User:Johnl1479|<font color="#0000FF">Jo</font><font color="#0033FF">hn</font><font color="#0066FF">l1</font><font color="#0099FF">47</font><font color="#00CCFF">9</font>]] 18:27, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

===February 19===
==== Category:Protestant Christian Wikipedians ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''speedy merge'''. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 20:39, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

:[[:Category:Protestant Christian Wikipedians]] to [[:Category:Protestant Wikipedians]]
:'''''Speedy merge:''' Redundant categories.'' – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 19:08, 19 February 2008 (UTC)
:'''Support Speedy Merge''' - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 18:42, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

====Category:Latter-day Saint Wikipedians====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''speedy merge'''. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 22:28, 19 February 2008 (UTC)
:[[:Category:Latter-day Saint Wikipedians]] to [[:Category:Latter Day Saint Wikipedians]]
:'''''Speedy merge:''' Redundant categories.'' – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 19:00, 19 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Wikipedians who watch ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Mixture of Rename and Delete''' - Since it's been 2 weeks, with no closure, I'll go ahead and [[WP:IAR|ignore]] the typical guidelines and close this.

:'''Delete''' [[:Category:Wikipedians who watch Adult Swim]]
:'''Rename''' [[:Category:Wikipedians who watch "Are You Smarter Than a Fifth Grader"]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians who like Are You Smarter Than a 5th Grader?]]
:'''Rename''' [[:Category:Wikipedians who watch The Price is Right]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians who like The Price is Right]]
:'''Rename''' [[:Category:Wikipedians who watch The Golden Girls]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians who like The Golden Girls]]
:'''Delete''' the rest. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 02:02, 6 March 2008 (UTC)
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:'''Propose renaming:'''
:* [[:Category:Wikipedians who watch "Are You Smarter Than a Fifth Grader"]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians who like Are You Smarter Than a 5th Grader?]]
:* [[:Category:Wikipedians who watch Adult Swim]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians who like Adult Swim]]
:* [[:Category:Wikipedians who watch Charm School]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians who like Flavor of Love Girls: Charm School]]
:* [[:Category:Wikipedians who watch COPS (TV series)]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians who like COPS (TV series)]]
:* [[:Category:Wikipedians who watch Flavor of Love]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians who like Flavor of Love]]
:* [[:Category:Wikipedians who watch Survivor]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians who like Survivor]]
:* [[:Category:Wikipedians who watch The Golden Girls]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians who like The Golden Girls]]
:* [[:Category:Wikipedians who watch The Price is Right]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians who like The Price is Right]]
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' Per the convention of [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in television]]; some of these seem to be single- or few-article categories (e.g. ''[[Charm School]]'', ''[[COPS (TV series)]]'', ''[[Flavor of Love]]'', ''[[The Golden Girls]]'') and, thus, should perhaps be deleted. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 17:38, 19 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Rename all''' - While the convention "who like" certainly is no more collaborative than "who watch", in the interest of standard naming conventions these should be renamed. I support a group nom for these categories in the future to rename to "interested in", or delete and allow creation of "interested in" cats. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 00:55, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Oppose''' - I'm starting to think that maybe we should consider some group nominations to remove "who like"; "who love", and "who enjoy" from category naming conventions, as being just too confusing. (It may also help avoid [[WP:BITE|biting]] newbies to Wikipedian category creation.) - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 18:42, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete all''', none of these are helpful for encyclopedia building. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 16:40, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Rename all'' per nom.  <small>—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:Johnl1479|Johnl1479]] ([[User talk:Johnl1479|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Johnl1479|contribs]]) 18:29, 24 February 2008 (UTC)</small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
*'''Delete all''',  I see no good reason to keep or rename. - [[User:Epousesquecido|Epousesquecido]] ([[User talk:Epousesquecido|talk]]) 17:02, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Rename all''' - per VegaDark. [[User:Miller17CU94|Chris]] ([[User talk:Miller17CU94|talk]]) 03:48, 28 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Comment''' - To "hopefully" help prevent a closure of "no consensus", I'd like to suggest the following:
*:'''Delete''' [[:Category:Wikipedians who watch Adult Swim]] - it's a [[Broadcast programming|programming block]] of a [[Television network|network]], and as such is a "single article category", since the "block" of programming can and does change.
*:'''Keep''' or '''Rename''' [[:Category:Wikipedians who watch "Are You Smarter Than a Fifth Grader"]] and [[:Category:Wikipedians who watch The Price is Right]] as [[game show]]s. The latter, in particular has quite a few related articles.
*:'''Keep''' or '''Rename''' [[:Category:Wikipedians who watch The Golden Girls]] - per the rest of the Television series cats.
*:'''Delete''' the rest as [[reality show]]s of one sort or other. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 00:01, 3 March 2008 (UTC)
::*That would be fine with me if all the "Keep or renames" were renames (in the interest of standard naming conventions). [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 06:05, 3 March 2008 (UTC)
:::*I'd also be OK with that. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 07:02, 3 March 2008 (UTC)
----
:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

===February 18===
====Category:Wikipedians who are members of CAMRA====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''delete'''. If a Wikipedians interested in beer category wishes to be created, then by all means. [[User:Wizardman|<span style="color:#060">'''''Wizardman'''''</span>]] 18:01, 1 March 2008 (UTC)
:{{Lc|Wikipedians who are members of CAMRA}}
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' This category [[WP:NOT#MYSPACE|does not facilitate encyclopedic collaboration]]; being a member of the [[Campaign for Real Ale]] does not imply either an above-average interest in or ability to improve the encyclopedia. Moreover, there seems to be only one article that is directly related to the category, so opportunities for collaboration are inherently limited.
*<s>'''Delete''' as nominator and per [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/Topical index#Wikipedians by organization|ample precedent]]. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 00:45, 18 February 2008 (UTC)</s> <small>Stricken per discussion below. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 06:50, 18 February 2008 (UTC)</small>
*'''Comment'''. I do not think this category should be kept, but not for the reasons given. This category could possibly assist with collaboration on all articles on British real ales, as members of CAMRA are mostly extremely knowledgeable about such beers and often on many other types of beer. Is there [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in beer]] or similar title that it could be merged into? Let me declare an interest. Although living in Australia I am a member of CAMRA and first joined over 30 years ago. --[[User:Bduke|Bduke]] ([[User talk:Bduke|talk]]) 04:53, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
:*There is [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in breweries]], but the scope is obviously different. What level of knowledge or involvement is the norm with members of CAMRA? Does it involve knowledge of sources and relevant literature? (My impression was that it was an advocacy group not unlike thousands of others. Then again, the fact that there is an annual membership fee (£20) suggests a certain level of interest on the part of members...) – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 05:58, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
::*It is an advocacy group, but I very successful one. In the 1970s it stopped the big breweries removing real ale in wooden keg beers entirely from the market to concentrate on pressurized metal keg beers. Since then the market in real ale has increased significantly with many new small breweries being started. Members of CAMRA are very knowledgeable about these breweries and real ale in general. I have not time now as I am about to go out, to look up a list of articles that CAMRA members could collaborate on, but there are plenty. Sources - there are several CAMRA mamber written books that are very expert. --[[User:Bduke|Bduke]] ([[User talk:Bduke|talk]]) 06:06, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
:::*Thanks for clarifying... In light of your comments, I've stricken my "delete" recommendation in favour of some type of renaming, perhaps to [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in beer]] or [[:Category:Wikipedians in the Campaign for Real Ale]]. Normally, the interest category would be my first preference, but I worry that it would soon be populated by various userboxes for beer-drinkers who have no interest in ''articles'' about beer(s). '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 06:50, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
:::* (Comment in response to Bduke's comments) - That's like saying that members of a U.S. democratic party advocacy group would be knowledgeable to collaborate on quite a few articles related to various U.S. democrat politicians. This sounds like a decent WikiProject in-the-make, but not a good idea for a category. It's food related, and an advocacy (Support/oppose issue) cat. Both of which... - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 02:41, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Rename''' to [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in beer]] per above. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 20:38, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
:*I would support deletion as a second choice if no consensus to rename. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 06:44, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per precedent, and per my comments above. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 02:41, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''', does not help users write an encyclopedia. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 16:47, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

====Category:Wikipedians interested in the Kinsey Scale====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''delete'''. [[User:Wizardman|<span style="color:#060">'''''Wizardman'''''</span>]] 04:13, 1 March 2008 (UTC)
:[[:Category:Wikipedians interested in the Kinsey Scale]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in the Kinsey scale]]
:''Speedy rename to fix capitalisation (see [[Kinsey scale]]).'' – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 23:29, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
:*Switched to '''delete''' - given the way much of this category seems to have been populated (substitutions of an unrelated userbox) and its narrow scope. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 18:56, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Comment''' - please relist in main section. I only see one or two articles directly related to the category. [[Kinsey Reports]] being the other. More information would be welcome, however. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 00:08, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
:*Relisted. I also noticed that a few category members (perhaps up to 50%) are in the category due to substitution of [[User:UBX/kinsey]]; the userbox and category were decoupled by me in July 2007. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 00:22, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' - per comments above. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 00:26, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' - too narrow of a scope, only could support collaboration for a few articles. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 20:38, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
----
:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians who enjoy PhD Comics ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Delete''' - With no prejudice against creating a cat of the suggested rename name, if enough WIkipedians are interested. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 20:52, 24 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{Lc|Wikipedians who enjoy PhD Comics}}
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' Narrow scope; any collaborative potential is limited to 1-2 articles: [[Piled Higher and Deeper]] and [[Jorge Cham]]. In addition, the userbox that populates the category does not clearly express an interest in collaboration. If there is no consensus to delete, rename to [[:Category:Wikipedians who read Piled Higher and Deeper]], per the convention of [[:Category:Wikipedians who read comic strips]].
*'''Delete''' as nominator; else rename. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 00:15, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 20:38, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
----
:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

====Category:Wikipedians who support England F.C.====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Delete'''. [[User:The Placebo Effect|The Placebo Effect]] ([[User talk:The Placebo Effect|talk]]) 22:43, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{Lc|Wikipedians who support England F.C.}}
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' Most countries have a national football team and I think it's reasonable to assume that most people support the national team of their country of birth or residence. Thus, I would expect this type of category to be effectively redundant, in most cases, to existing [[:Category:Wikipedians by ethnicity and nationality|nationality]] or [[:Category:Wikipedians by location|location]] category. If there is no consensus to delete, then the category ought to be renamed to [[:Category:Wikipedian England national football team fans]], per the convention of [[:Category:Wikipedian football (soccer) national team fans]] and to match [[England national football team]].
*'''Delete''' as nominator; else rename. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 00:04, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 20:38, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. However, if this is the case, then perhaps all of the other '''Category:Wikipedians who support .....''' should also then be deleted? --[[User:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;">'''The'''</span>]] [[User_talk:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:black;"> '''Helpful'''</span>]] [[Special:Contributions/Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;"> '''One'''</span>]] <sup>[[User:Thehelpfulone/Review|(Review)]]</sup> 18:04, 26 February 2008 (UTC)
*:'''Neutral comment''' - Click [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special%3APrefixindex&from=Wikipedians+who+support&namespace=14 this link] to see a list of all '''Category:Wikipedians who support .....'''. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 03:28, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
*::'''Reply:''' - Ah okay! :) --[[User:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;">'''The'''</span>]] [[User_talk:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:black;"> '''Helpful'''</span>]] [[Special:Contributions/Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;"> '''One'''</span>]] <sup>[[User:Thehelpfulone/Review|(Review)]]</sup> 17:19, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

===February 17===
==== Category:Wikipedians by alma mater: Pine Bush High School ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Speedy Delete''' - Incidentally, I think we determined in the past that we just needed two admins to endorse to speedy cases like this. (Presuming unanimity of comment, of course.) So, as the nom is an admin + me = 2... - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 22:25, 17 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{Lc|Wikipedians by alma mater: Pine Bush High School}}
:'''''Speedy delete''' - see [[Pine Bush High School]]. With [[WP:UCFD/I#Wikipedians by high school|over 30 precedents]] over the course of seven months, it's more time-efficient to speedy these than to require a full 5 days of discussion. To quote [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] from a [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/February 2008#Category:Wikipedians by alma mater: Lower Merion High School|2 February 2008 discussion]]: "With 30 discussions of past precedent, there is no way any of these will ever survive UCFD without consensus for deleting high school categories being overturned at [[WP:DRV]] first, so a UCFD is really only a formality at this point."'' – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 08:36, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== The ====
<div class="boilerplate vfd" style="background:#bff9fc; margin:0 auto; padding:0 10px 0 10px; border:1px solid #AAAAAA;">
:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Rename''' to add "the" per noms. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 22:30, 17 February 2008 (UTC)

===== Category:Wikipedians interested in history of medicine =====
:[[:Category:Wikipedians interested in history of medicine]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in the history of medicine]]
:'''''Speedy rename''' to add a definite article.'' – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 08:25, 17 February 2008 (UTC)

===== Category:Wikipedians interested in History of Georgia (country) =====
:[[:Category:Wikipedians interested in History of Georgia (country)]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in the history of Georgia (country)]]
:'''''Speedy rename''' to fix capitalisation and add a [[definite article]].'' – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 08:20, 17 February 2008 (UTC)

===== Category:Wikipedians interested in Byzantine empire =====
:[[:Category:Wikipedians interested in Byzantine empire]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in the Byzantine Empire]]
:'''''Speedy rename''' to fix capitalisation (see [[Byzantine Empire]]) and add a [[definite article]].'' – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 08:14, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

====Category:Wikipedians who use Fedora Core====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''delete''', as I went and upmerged everything already. [[User:Wizardman|<span style="color:#060">'''''Wizardman'''''</span>]] 04:11, 2 March 2008 (UTC)
:'''Merge''' [[:Category:Wikipedians who use Fedora Core]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians who use Fedora]]
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' This seems to be an excessively narrow subdivision; also, [[Fedora (Linux distribution)#Releases|Fedora]] has had six distinct cores. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 23:38, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Merge''' per nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 20:38, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''', does not help users write an encyclopedia. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 16:46, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
:*Since merging a category involves deleting the category page, would you support deletion now without prejudice to the later nomination of the target category? (Only one of the categories was tagged, so unless the other is tagged and this discussion is relisted, only one can be affected by this CFD.) '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 04:25, 1 March 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians for the Pacific Union ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Delete''' - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 20:47, 24 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{Lc|Wikipedians for the Pacific Union}}
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' Political [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/Topical index#Wikipedians who support/oppose|support/oppose]] category for users who support the creation of the [[Pacific Union]]; does not facilitate [[WP:NOT|encyclopedic collaboration]].
*'''Delete''' as nominator. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 22:52, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 20:38, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
----
:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

====Category:Wikipedian League of Old Codgers====
<div class="boilerplate vfd" style="background:#bff9fc; margin:0 auto; padding:0 10px 0 10px; border:1px solid #AAAAAA;">
:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''delete'''. [[User:Wizardman|<span style="color:#060">'''''Wizardman'''''</span>]] 03:13, 1 March 2008 (UTC)
:{{Lc|Wikipedian League of Old Codgers}}
:'''Delete:''' Seems to be orphaned? Hardly used? --[[User:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;">'''The'''</span>]] [[User_talk:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:black;"> '''Helpful'''</span>]] [[Special:Contributions/Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;"> '''One'''</span>]] <sup>[[User:Thehelpfulone/Review|(Review)]]</sup> 16:46, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' or listify to [[Wikipedia:League of Old Codgers]] - The more I think about this, the more it seems to me that the category is nothing other than a bottom-of-the-page notice for a fairly specific in-joke. In this respect, it is similar to ''Category:Rouge admin'' (deleted recently), only it's significantly less populated or known. A userbox or project page (similar to [[Wikipedia:Knights of NPOV]] or [[Wikipedia:Rouge admin]]) would be more appropriate. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 20:45, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Weak Listify/Weak Keep''' - See the [[Wikipedia:User_categories_for_discussion/Archive/November_2007#Category:Old_Codgers.27_League|last discussion]] concerning this cat. I'm personally likely going to waffle in either direction depending on the discussion to follow. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 00:22, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' - Does not help the encyclopedia to categorize this. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 20:38, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
----
:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Divine Wikipedians ====
<div class="boilerplate vfd" style="background:#bff9fc; margin:0 auto; padding:0 10px 0 10px; border:1px solid #AAAAAA;">
:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Delete''' - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 20:37, 24 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{Lc|Divine Wikipedians}}
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' A [[WP:UCFD/I#Nonsense/joke/humour categories|joke category]] populated by [[User:UBX/god|this]] userbox, which states: "This user is [[God]]." While the userbox can be considered humorous, heretical, or somewhere in between (depending one's views and inclinations), the category is utterly without use.
*'''Delete''' as nominator. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 05:47, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' - serves no purpose. Is it actually a joke??? I cannot see how it helps encyclopaedic collaboration. [[User:EJF|EJF]] ([[User talk:EJF|talk]]) 18:07, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 20:38, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete'''. Category conveys no useful information. [[User:Jacob1207|Jacob1207]] ([[User talk:Jacob1207|talk]]) 13:07, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
----
:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians who play pen-and-paper games ====
<div class="boilerplate vfd" style="background:#bff9fc; margin:0 auto; padding:0 10px 0 10px; border:1px solid #AAAAAA;">
:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Delete''' - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 20:15, 24 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{Lc|Wikipedians who play pen-and-paper games}}
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' All-inclusive, does not facilitate encyclopedic collaboration. A category that includes everyone who has ever played [[tic-tac-toe]], [[hangman (game)|hangman]], [[connect the dots]], or any other game involving paper and a pen or pencil cannot possibly be useful.
*'''Delete''' as nominator. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 05:36, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. [[User:EJF|EJF]] ([[User talk:EJF|talk]]) 18:08, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 20:38, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
----
:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Asian Wikipedians ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Delete''' - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 20:28, 24 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{Lc|Asian Wikipedians}}
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' Per the consensus reached for ''Category:Eurasian Wikipedians'' (see [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion#Category:Eurasian Wikipedians|here]] or [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/February 2008#Category:Eurasian Wikipedians|here]]). Categorisation by race [[WP:NOT#MYSPACE|does not facilitate encyclopedic collaboration]], partly because [[Race (classification of human beings)|racial classifications]] are fairly broad and vague and partly because identifying with a certain racial group does not imply any type of ability to improve (or interest in improving) the encyclopedia. A userbox or userpage notice is adequate to convey the sentiment. Also, this category is populated by [[Template:User Filipinos Are Asians]], which is actually a userbox for ''belief'' rather than racial affiliation; one can hold the belief that Filipinos are racially Asian without being Asian.
*'''Delete''' as nominator. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 05:31, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' and I might take that last one to deletion review (strikes me as head counting rather than weighing of arguments). -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 05:45, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
:*What exactly is the argument in this or the other discussion that would justify retention? '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 06:38, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''', does not help in the construction of an encyclopedia. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 16:43, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
----
:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

===February 16===
====Category:Wikipedians by website and all subcategories====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''keep''', without prejudice to more focused individual or small group nominations (for deletion, renaming, or merging). '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 19:11, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{lc|Wikipedians by website}}
:{{lc|Wikipedians who contribute to Advogato}}
:{{lc|Wikipedians who contribute to Distributed Proofreaders}}
:{{lc|Wikipedians who contribute to Encyclopaedia Metallum}}
:{{lc|Wikipedians who contribute to Flags of the World}}
:{{lc|Wikipedians who contribute to Intellipedia}}
:{{lc|Wikipedians who contribute to LyricWiki}}
:{{lc|Wikipedians who contribute to Link Everything Online}}
:{{lc|Wikipedians who contribute to MusicBrainz}}
:{{lc|Wikipedians who contribute to the Open Directory Project}}
:{{lc|Wikipedians who contribute to OpenStreetMap}}
:{{lc|Wikipedians who contribute to WikiWikiWeb}}
:{{lc|Wikipedians who contribute to Wookieepedia}}
I think it's time for these categories to go.  There is [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/Topical index#Wikipedians by website|numerous past precedent]] to delete these individually, but I think as a group categorizing Wikipedians by what other websites they "contribute to" does not help Wikipedia in any way. I contribute to plenty of other websites, but that does not mean that I have anything relevant to add to the articles on those websites or any intent on collaboration on them. Additionally, even if a collaborative intent ''was'' implied by these categories, their scope would be too narrow to sustain a category past collaboration on a single article, which renders the purpose of having a category pointless (since collaboration on single articles can better occur on such articles' talk page). [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 22:46, 16 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete all''' as nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 22:46, 16 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Comment'''. I have no strong views, but it is often suggested that material should be transwikied. Would these categories help to find people who would do that? I am currently trying to clean up some articles by moving some material to another wiki. It would certainly be helpfull to know of other editors who worked on that other wiki, although it is not one with a category like these. --[[User:Bduke|Bduke]] ([[User talk:Bduke|talk]]) 23:27, 16 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Strong Oppose''' - As we are building an encyclopedia, which is, by its nature, a reference work, I think that it is quite useful, helpful, and, honestly, smart, to have a grouping of individuals who contribute to other online reference works. If we are to presume that Wikipedian categories have any value, certainly this would be one. These are individuals who, while we may or may not presume adpetness, they at least have a smattering of experience at contributing to reference works, and I would presume that accessing that knowledge base (by looking through the category grouping for someone) would be exactly the usage presumed for Wikipedian categories. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 20:08, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
:*I didn't even realize that the category was for "reference-based websites" only, so the parent category needs a rename to reflect that if kept.  That being said, I still disagree that we can assume any extra ability to collaborate on Wikipedia as a result of being in these categories, and even if that were true, I think there could be much better names for such categories.  For instance, let's say there was both a category for Wikipedians who contribute to Memory Alpha and a category for Wikipedians who contribute to Memory Beta.  Both are Star Trek Wikis, so there would be no benefit to have both categories since the users within each would presumably have the same skills.  This situation presents the fact that similar-content website categories would be duplicative of eachother if the argument to keep is that the users within would have some special skill related to the subject of the website they contribute to.  Further, I think it is a bit of a stretch to say that someone who simply "contributes" to another website has a better ability to contribute to wikipedia on that subject.  Contribute can mean anything from being a regular contrubutor for years to simply fixing a spelling error once as an anon years ago.  While it would be nice if the editors in the latter group wouldn't add themselves to the category, it is undeniable that such categorization occurs nonetheless (for those that like to add themselves to every category that applies to themselves, regardless of collaboration intent).  Therefore, I still feel these should be deleted, but if kept I think a rename to resolve the issues above is in order. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 21:26, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
::*I sincerely don't mean this as "snarky" (whatever ''that'' means) as this may appear, but... Read the page? It (I presume?) makes clear the category inclusion criteria. That said, what would your suggestions for a rename be? - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 00:22, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
:::*I don't think we should have to read the description to know what a category is about-the title should make it clear.  In this case, if kept a better name would be [[:Category:Wikipedians by reference-based website]].  As for subcategories, a better naming convention might be [[:Category:Wikipedians who contribute to music-related reference based websites]] (for websites like MusicBrainz and LyricWiki) or similar. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 20:38, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
::::*I agree about the accuracy in naming, to a point. Sometimes the inclusion criteria can be narrow enough for a category, but yet too large for a succinct name. For example, this category is specifically for reference-based websites, but also includes some free or roughly free (IANAL) content websites. That seems difficult to quantify in a single name, but yet not so broad an inclusion criteria as to make this parent cat "not useful". (And I dunno if we need to think about subcatting the cat yet.) - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 08:49, 19 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Strong oppose''' Keep as is--these are mostly or entirely relevant. They are some of them free projects, appropriate for cooperation. The specific names of the sites are distinctive for anyone who might possibly be interested  '''[[User:DGG|DGG]]''' ([[User talk:DGG|talk]]) 05:02, 19 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep all''' Reuse issues, both in ''both'' directions benefit from the free-content-site cats, and I see reasonable potential to include the others as well. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 06:35, 19 February 2008 (UTC)
:*Not to mention, the precedent cited includes some keeps for similar reasons. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 06:37, 19 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians who play Resident Evil ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Delete''' - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 03:12, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{lc|Wikipedians who play Resident Evil}}
Per precedent at [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/October 2007#Category:Wikipedians by video game]]. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 22:46, 16 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 22:46, 16 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

====Category:Wikipedians who play card games and all subcategories====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Deleted''' [[User:Nat|'''nat.u''']][[User talk:Nat|'''toronto''']] 09:23, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{lc|Wikipedians who play card games}}
:{{lc|Wikipedians who play blackjack}}
:{{lc|Wikipedians who play bridge}}
:{{lc|Wikipedians who play FreeCell}}
:{{lc|Wikipedians who play go fish}}
:{{lc|Wikipedians who play hearts}}
:{{lc|Wikipedians who play poker}}
:{{lc|Wikipedians who play solitaire}}
:{{lc|Wikipedians who play spades}}
:{{lc|Wikipedians who play spit}}

I've played almost every one of these at least once, yet I have no desire or above-average ability to collaborate on any of these articles just because I have played them.  Some of them are nearly all-inclusive (who hasn't played poker or freecell?) and some of them suffer from being too narrow of a topic for collaboration (go fish, spit, uno).  For those in these categories that do want to collaborate, they should create an "interested in" version of the category, since categorizing users by what game they play does not help anything.  A rename could introduce miscategorization, so independet creation of interested in categories would be a better idea. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 22:46, 16 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete all''' as nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 22:46, 16 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Comment''' - I might oppose deletion of a few of these. Some are, as the nominator notes, too specific, but not all of them. I would treat the naming convention "who play" similar to the Wikipedians by skill categories. I'd be interested in discovering how many multiple articles are category could represent. Further discussion would be welcome. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 20:39, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete all''' ''except'' the two collectible card games, which perhaps should be considered separately. I have, at one time or another, played almost all of these games (except the two collectible card games and UNO), yet I've no above-average knowledge of the subjects, access to or awareness of sources and literature regarding the subjects, or interest in contributing to articles related to these subjects. I'm sure that this is true of many or most others. Simply playing a card game -- especially considering how easy it is to do so on the computer -- doesn't imply any knowledge of it beyond the basic rules. I think players of the collectible card games may be more involved in the games (if nothing else, they must purchase the cards to play), and thus more knowledgeable about the subject. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 21:44, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Merge''' to {{lc|Wikipedians who play card games}}  These collectively would aid in improving the coverage of card games on WikiPedia.--[[User:Bedford|<span style="color:#000">'''Bedford'''</span>]] 21:50, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Comment''' - Would the nominator have any issue with splitting the "copyrighted" card games into individual nominations? - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 08:49, 19 February 2008 (UTC)
:*No, although UNO is copyrighted and there seems to be no agument to keep that- I assume you mean the other two? (I'd still support deletion for those, however, as "who play" ≠ "interested in"). [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 22:28, 19 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete all''' the above. I was going to suggest keeping, since there are quite a few articles on these, and my comments above concerning Wikipedians by skill. ([[Bridge]] and [[Poker]] in particular have a whole library of study on the specific topics.) However, the computer point was well-taken. These being in the "public domain", there are a myriad of games, variations ([[Solitaire]]? which one?), and so on, included in all sorts of books, video game packs, etc. There just is too far a divide between those who play for entertainment, and those who "study the game". While I tend to shy away from "interested in" if at all possible, there's just no getting around the confusion that applies to these. And along with that, I'd likely support a similar deletion/recreated-renamed of any "Wikipedians who play a specific game" cat. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 08:01, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

===== Category:Wikipedians who play UNO =====
:{{lc|Wikipedians who play UNO}}

*'''Comment''' - Split from main nom as requested above. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 07:48, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per my comments in the main nom. If kept (since there are a few articles that could be considered "related") I would ''weakly'' support a rename to "interested in". I think the "divide" is still a bit far, but not as wide as the above. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 08:01, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' (as original nom) - Too narrow to facilitate collaboration, as well as the fact that "who play" ≠ "interested in collaborating on topics related to". [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 20:19, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per my comment in the main nom and the comments directly above. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 15:09, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete'''. This is a single-article category. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 16:32, 23 February 2008 (UTC)

===== Category:Wikipedians who play CCGs =====
:{{lc|Wikipedians who play Magic: The Gathering}}
:{{lc|Wikipedians who play Vampire: The Eternal Struggle}}

*'''Comment''' - Split from main nom as requested above. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 07:48, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' the collectible cards categories. Magic has a WikiProject of its own. --[[User:Bedford|<span style="color:#000">'''Bedford'''</span>]] 21:50, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete all''' per my comments in the main nom. If kept, I would support a rename to "interested in" in this case, since the "divide" actually doesn't seem to be much of one here. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 08:01, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete both''' (as original nom) - "who play" ≠ "interested in collaborating on topics related to". If no consensus to delete, then rename to "interested in".  Categorizing everyone who has played these games is not helpful.  I have played MTG and have no interest in collaborating on articles related to MTG.  It certainly has enough articles to facilitate collaboration, but the current name does not convey that (and a delete is my first preference because a rename could introduce miscategorization, but I'd rather have that than keeping as is). [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 20:19, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete both''' - I requested that these categories be split from the main nomination because of the possibility that there might be a close connection between involvement and interest in these cases. However, I'm largely convinced by Jc37 and VegaDark's comments; they, in conjunction with a few other factors, lead me to suggest:
:*''Delete'' [[:Category:Wikipedians who play Vampire: The Eternal Struggle]] - single-user category with a relatively narrow scope (see [[:Category:Vampire: The Eternal Struggle]] - the articles about individual expansion sets could probably be merged into a single list).
:*''Weak delete'' [[:Category:Wikipedians who play Magic: The Gathering]] without prejudice to independent (of the userbox) creation of an interest category - the number of articles that could be covered by this category is quite high (see [[:Category:Magic: The Gathering]]), but the userbox responsible for populating most of the category ([[User:Malcolm/Userboxes/Magic: The Gathering]]) does not give much reason to believe that the users categorised have an interest in ''articles'' related to ''Magic: The Gathering'', as opposed to an interest in the game only. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 15:09, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Comment''' - [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in Magic: The Gathering]] sounds like a valid category to be created. However, I agree that the current userbox(es) don't seem to indicate "interest" in that way. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 18:42, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

====Category:Wikipedians who love the Star Wars music====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''speedily deleted as [[WP:CSD#C1]] on 00:28, 21 February 2008 by [[User:Jc37]]'''. [[User:Moonriddengirl|Moonriddengirl]] <sup>[[User talk:Moonriddengirl|(talk)]]</sup> 20:36, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
:{{lc|Wikipedians who love the Star Wars music}}
I love the Star Wars music myself, but it doesn't help Wikipedia to categorize that fact. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 04:41, 16 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 04:41, 16 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Comment''' - I found that there are quite a few articles on the themes and music from [[Star Wars]]. That said "who love" is probably not the best convention for this. I think "who listen to" was the most recent convention. I'm shying away from "interested in" in this case, but I won't oppose that rename, if there is consensus. (In other words, '''Delete''' "who love", with no prejudice for recreation of a more accurately named category, while alerting the current members of the new possibility.) - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 20:39, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
:*Agreed there are probably enough Star Wars music articles to facilitate collaboration, but my point still stands that it doesn't help to categorize "who loves" anything (which apparently you agree with, so I'm not sure why you opposed). [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 20:38, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
::*Changed to "Comment". - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 02:41, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. I'm fond of the music of various films, but I have no special interest in improving articles about those films or their soundtracks. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 03:28, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians who love documentary films ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Delete''' - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 03:17, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{lc|Wikipedians who love documentary films}}
Wikipedians who "love" documentary films do not necessarily want to collaborate on articles related to such films.  If that is the case, the users within should create and join [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in documentary films]]. As named, this does not foster collaboration.  A rename may introduce miscategorization, so independent creation of the new category would be the best option. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 04:41, 16 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 04:41, 16 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians interested in Friedrich Nietzsche ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Delete''' - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 03:18, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{lc|Wikipedians interested in Friedrich Nietzsche}}
Per [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/Topical index#Wikipedians by individual]], categorizing by individual is too narrow of a scope for user categories. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 04:41, 16 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 04:41, 16 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

====Category:Wikipedians interested in history====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Depopulate, retain as parent category'''. [[User:Moonriddengirl|Moonriddengirl]] <sup>[[User talk:Moonriddengirl|(talk)]]</sup> 20:32, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
:{{lc|Wikipedians interested in history}}
Like the recently nominated book category, this seems far too general and broad to facilitate any sort of collaboration by individual users in the category.  This should be kept as a parent category for more refined categories, but depopulated of individual users. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 04:41, 16 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Depopulate''' as nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 04:41, 16 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Depopulate''' per nom. The thing about history is -- there's just so much of it! :) '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 15:12, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Depopulate''' per nom. Far too broad to be useful, but appropriate as parent category. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 16:31, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

====Radio station categories====
<div class="boilerplate vfd" style="background:#bff9fc; margin:0 auto; padding:0 10px 0 10px; border:1px solid #AAAAAA;">
:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''delete'''. [[User:Moonriddengirl|Moonriddengirl]] <sup>[[User talk:Moonriddengirl|(talk)]]</sup> 15:36, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
:{{lc|Wikipedians who listen to SwitchAM 1197}}
:{{lc|Wikipedians who listen to Heart 106}}
:{{lc|Wikipedians who listen to 2Day FM}}
:{{lc|Wikipedians who listen to KCRW}}
:{{lc|Wikipedians who listen to KROQ}}
Per precedent set at [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/February 2008#Category:Wikipedians who listen to FM 103.2]], these types of categories are not helpful.  To quote the reasoning there, "This category does not foster encyclopedic collaboration, since merely listening to a radio station implies neither an above-average desire nor ability to contribute encyclopedic content about it. In addition, any possible collaborative merit is limited to just one article, so the category's scope is too narrow." [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 04:41, 16 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete all''' as nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 04:41, 16 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete all''' per nom. Precedents regarding similar categories for individual TV stations also seem applicable: see [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/July 2007#Television Station categories|here]] and [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/August 2007#Category:Wikipedians who watch Sky News|here]]. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 22:02, 16 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete all''' as per nom and precedent. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 22:04, 16 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete all''' - (And would support a nomination of all the parent category's sub-cats.) - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 07:26, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

===February 14===
====Category:User simple and all subcategories====
<noinclude>{{Delrevxfd|date=2018 December 13|page=Category:User simple-N}}</noinclude>
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Merge all''' to  [[:Category:User simple]] - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 05:33, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{lc|User simple}}
:{{lc|User simple-1}}
:{{lc|User simple-2}}
:{{lc|User simple-3}}
:{{lc|User simple-4}}
:{{lc|User simple-N}}
Usually my stance on language categories is that if a wikipedia exists or is likely to be created in that language, we should keep it, otherwise it should be deleted.  This is a bit of an anomaly from my stance, as we have a simple English Wikipedia, however I still feel these categories are not helpful.  Simple English, as far as I understand it, is not a real distinct language, but simply English simplified down to allow ESL students learn it easier (from [[Wikipedia:Simple English Wikipedia]]: "The Simple English Wikipedia was started as a response to needs of English learners (EAL students) and English teachers").  At first I was only going to nominate the native speaker category, but I realized this would probably best serve Wikipedia simply merged to [[:Category:User en-1]] and en-2.  Everyone in these categories would presumably be learning English, hence this is redundant to [[:Category:User en-1]] and [[:Category:User en-2]]. At minimum, however, [[:Category:User simple-N]] needs to be deleted/merged since, by definition, it is impossible to be a native speaker of simple English.  I know there is an argument to be made that it may take some skill to be able to reduce one's vocabulary enough to be effective at simple English, which could also be the source of some users in the category, but I think the presumption should be that most proficient speakers of English are sufficiently competent to be able to use simple English. Every time you talk to a young child you use simple English, so I don't think of being able to "not use big words", so to speak, is a good reason to categorize users. If there is a concern that there might be miscategorization by merging such users, I could support outright deletion of all the categories as well. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 22:46, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Merge 1 and 2 to [[:Category:User en-1]], Merge 3, 4 and N to [[:Category:User en-2]]''', or delete if no consensus to merge, as nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 22:46, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
* I find it quite hard to speak or write Simple English. Complex words and phrasings slip in inadvertantly. (see?) So although I'm en-N, I am at best simple-2. And yet, I don't think the normal language classification scheme works either. I'd suggest rather than a merge (I would be rather confused by being merged into en-1 when I am already in en-N, were I to badge my simple skills) that a rethink of the scheme of classification be undertaken. I think there is collaborative/encyclopedic value in knowing who might be good at proofing work when setting out to improve Simple English articles. But the current scheme doesn't convey this well as is, so I agree with the nominator, something needs doing... ++[[User:Lar|Lar]]: [[User_talk:Lar|t]]/[[Special:Contributions/Lar|c]] 23:26, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
:*My proposal certainly isn't set in stone, so feel free to propose an alternative solution.  Perhaps merge all somewhere? [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 15:39, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Comment''' any editor whose command of English was limited to Simple English would not be able to understand the nomination. [[User:DuncanHill|DuncanHill]] ([[User talk:DuncanHill|talk]]) 02:05, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
:*Luckily, this isn't [http://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Simple_English_Wikipedia the Simple English Wikipedia], so that shouldn't be an issue. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 15:39, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
*Keep N, delete the rest.  Or if no consensus for that, merge all.  Per Lar, I can see the value of knowing who can understand and write in Simple English.  I don't, however, see the need to break it up further.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 14:54, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
:*Wait, keep N? That's the only one that's ''impossible'' to actually be true.  You can't be a native speaker of a language that specifically describes itself as a simplified version of a language to help non-native speakers. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 15:39, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
:**Maybe don't call it "N" then... give it some other name/tag/letter that conveys "I feel I'm good at the (difficult for some) task of writing in simple"... (how about "E" for expert) Like I said, I'm not and I know it. I've tried writing over there, (mostly commenting on things like CU noms and the like) and rereading what I wrote, it came out stilted and difficult to understand. The vocab was smaller but the structure if anything was more tangled than how I normally speak. (if such is possible, I can hear my "fans" saying now!) This is a discussion where I think a heads up to the category members (or even a mention over on simple's village pump?) might get some more creative ideas flowing... ++[[User:Lar|Lar]]: [[User_talk:Lar|t]]/[[Special:Contributions/Lar|c]] 15:48, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
:**Good point.  How about merging all into [[:Category:User simple]]?  I like the E for expert, but I'm sure that will confuse people who are used to numbers and N's.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 15:55, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
*I agree with [[User:Lar|Lar]]. Being able to write in Simple English is not the same as being able to talk to children. It needs special skills. I think we should ask on simple's village pump. Let us see what users there would like to see here to recruit people to help them out. A possible solution, but I would await the comments from users over at the simple WP, is to just keep [[:Category:User simple]], but the userbox should say "This user can write in Simple English", not "This user can speak Simple English". It is writing skills that we want, not speaking skills. --[[User:Bduke|Bduke]] ([[User talk:Bduke|talk]]) 23:39, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
:*I have asked at [[:simple:Wikipedia:Simple talk|on simple]]. Replies may appear there. --[[User:Bduke|Bduke]] ([[User talk:Bduke|talk]]) 23:53, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
*Simple English is unusual in one main way. Understanding it and writing it are entirely different things. Understanding falls into three categories: none (speaks no English), moderate (speaks basic English) and native (native, fluent or high level English). This is mainly the reason it was created - to make it easy to understand. Writing it is entirely different. As stated above, there is no native speakers. Many times people believe because they are fluent in English, they are also fluent in SE. Even among our regular contributors and admins on Simple, there are few that would qualify for a 3 or 4. It is not so much that they cannot do it, but they don't know the rules. It is much like perfectly understanding English but knowing only 10% of the rules of grammar. Overall, the separation of levels/categories needs to be based on writing, not understanding. 0, 2, 3 and 4 would be the most likely divisions so I would suggest merging 1 into 2 and N into 4. [[User:Creol|Creol]] ([[User talk:Creol|talk]]) 03:45, 16 February 2008 (UTC) (Simple:wp admin)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

====Category:Traceur Wikipedians====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Rename to [[:Category:Wikipedian traceurs]]'''. "Traceur" is the tern for a person who practices parkour; "Wikipedian <foo>s" is the usual convention for subcategories under [[:Category:Wikipedians by skill]], to which this needs to be added. -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO|talk]]) 00:17, 23 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{lc|Traceur Wikipedians}}
"Wikipedians who practice [[Parkour]]" - [[Traceur]] redirects to Parkour, so at least a rename is in order.  However, I don't see why having this categorized is helpful to Wikipedia at all, so my first preference would be to delete. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 22:46, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as nom, rename to [[:Category:Wikipedians who practice parkour]] if no consensus to delete. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 22:46, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Rename''' to [[:Category:Wikipedians who practice Parkour]].  Presumably, if you are practicing this, you would know enough about it to help write articles, unlike the multitude of "interested in" categories.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 15:00, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' - Seems to be a single-article topic? - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 15:43, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
:*There are a number of articles in [[:Category:Parkour]], although it's questionable whether knowledge of the techniques of parkour would be relevant to most of the articles (e.g. the biographical or film articles). '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 03:26, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

===="Wikipedians of" categories====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Rename''' as per nom. I would recommend Black Falcon's suggested course of action, i.e. decoupling the userbox from the category. -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO|talk]]) 00:10, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Rename''' [[:Category:Wikipedians of the Piedmont Triad]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians from the Piedmont Triad]]
*'''Rename''' [[:Category:Wikipedians of Worcester]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians from Worcester]]
Per the latest discussion on the "Wikipedians by location" categories, there was more or less a consensus that "Wikipedians of" should be changed to "Wikipedians from", so let's make this official. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 22:46, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Rename both''' as nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 22:46, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Rename''' per nom.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 15:01, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Rename''' [[:Category:Wikipedians of Worcester]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians in Worcester, Massachusetts|Category:Wikipedians <u>''in''</u> Worcester, Massachusetts]]. The userbox is for users who "live in or hail from" Worcester, and most of the users seem to be of the former type, which probably makes "''in''" more appropriate. I could also support decoupling the userbox from the category. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 16:26, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

====Wikipedians on/who live in/citizens of categories====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''no consensus''' for [[:Category:Wikipedians on Vancouver Island]] and '''delete''' [[:Category:Wikipedian citizens of the European Union]] (the sole user in the category is already in two more specific subcats of [[:Category:Wikipedians in Europe]]). [[:Category:Wikipedians who live in Petrozavodsk]] has already been [[WP:CSD|speedy deleted]] per [[WP:CSD#C1|criterion C1]] (empty category). – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 02:44, 21 February 2008 (UTC)

*'''Rename''' [[:Category:Wikipedians on Vancouver Island]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians in Vancouver Island]]
*'''Rename''' [[:Category:Wikipedians who live in Petrozavodsk]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians in Petrozavodsk]]
*'''Merge''' [[:Category:Wikipedian citizens of the European Union]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians in the European Union]] (Side note: You can, in theory, have citizenship in the EU and not currently live in the EU, but for purposes of Wikipedia categorization, categorizing citizenship is unhelpful, so let's assume the lone user is in fact in the EU.  Wouldn't be opposed to deleting this particular category, either)
Per the latest discussion on the "Wikipedians by location" categories, there was more or less a consensus that these should be changed to "Wikipedians in", so let's make this official. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 22:46, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Rename/merge all''' as nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 22:46, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Comment''' - [[Vancouver Island]], unfortunately, as a geographical place doesn't work with "in". "on" or "from" seems to be the usage for that location. So I'd suggest "from" in that specific case. (Or, if necessary, allow "on" as a solitary exception, categorised with "in".) '''Rename''' [[:Category:Wikipedians who live in Petrozavodsk]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians in Petrozavodsk]] per nom. '''Merge/Delete''' [[:Category:Wikipedian citizens of the European Union]]. It's ''almost'' redundant with [[:Category:Wikipedians in Europe]], but at the same time appears to be a passive "Support/Oppose" category. As the user claims to be from [[Slovenia]] which, according to its article, is in central Europe, just merge to [[:Category:Wikipedians in Europe]]. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 08:06, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
:*Yes, I saw that and it doesn't sound right, although I thought it was still technically gramatically correct.  If not, it can be left as is or changed to from. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 15:39, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
::*Looking through other "in" categories, I found [[:Category:Wikipedians in Staten Island]], so whatever happens to this should apply to that as well. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 04:41, 16 February 2008 (UTC)
:::*I think the use of "in" may be more acceptable for [[Staten Island]], since it is not just an island but also an administrative area. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 02:44, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians interested in jury nullification ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Delete''' - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 07:23, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{lc|Wikipedians interested in jury nullification}}
All 26 users in the category are in the category as a result of [[User:DieWeisseRose/Userboxes/JuryNull|this userbox]], which states "This user supports Jury Nullification".  No indication any of the users are actually interested in collaborating on topics related to jury nullification, and even if they were, there is a question as to if this subject is sufficiently broad enough to facilitate collaboration past a [[Jury nullification|single article]], which I don't think it does. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 22:46, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as nom, with prejudice against recreation due to being too narrow of a subject for collaboration. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 22:46, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 15:03, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom as a support/oppose category mistitled as "interest". I think the precedent of [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/December 2007#Category:Wikipedians interested in the subject of Chinese reunification|this discussion]] is informative. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 23:14, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians who have read the BIG HUGE FREAKING PURPLE BOX ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
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The result of the discussion was '''Speedily close''' - In the past, when such categories have been created for [[WP:POINT]] reasons, due to a sudden semi-large scale drama, it was later determined that nominating them so close to the event was probably not a good idea. I'm extending this category the same courtesy. Feel free to re-nominate in at least a week or so, at editorial discretion. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 05:36, 14 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{lc|Wikipedians who have read the BIG HUGE FREAKING PURPLE BOX}}
Nonsense.  Probably speedyable but I brought it here in the interest of avoiding any complaints.  Created during fallout of [[Wikipedia:Administrators%27 noticeboard/Incidents#Block of User:Equazcion]]. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 05:13, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete/speedy delete''' as nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 05:13, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as [[WP:POINT]].  --[[User:Jayron32|Jayron32]].[[User talk:Jayron32|<small>talk</small>]].[[Special:Contributions/Jayron32|<small>contribs</small>]] 05:14, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Comment''' - Why not just wait til [[:Category:Rouge admins]] is done? That's what I'm doing. Whatever that closes as should apply here. On an unrelated note, I think we should call the incident "Equazciongate". I think that would be so totally rad. <small style="font:bold 10px Arial;display:inline;border:#009 1px dashed;padding:1px 6px 2px 7px;white-space:nowrap">[[User:Equazcion|<font color="#000">Equazcion</font>]] [[User talk:equazcion|•''✗'']]/[[Special:Contributions/Equazcion|''C'' •]] ''05:21, 14 Feb 2008 (UTC)''</small>
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

====Category:Wikipedians in Central California====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''upmerge'''; incidentally, many of the users in this category are already in the parent. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 08:32, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{lc|Wikipedians in Central California}}
Too vague/broad to facilitate collaboration. [[Central California]] goes to a disambiguation page. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 05:13, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 05:13, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Upmerge''' to [[:Category:Wikipedians in California]].  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 15:04, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
:*Upmerging is fine with me. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 15:39, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Small location categories ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Delete''' - In going through these, I discovered that several were the creations of a single editor. I went through the editor's [[User:Patricknoddy/Userboxes|userbox creation list page]], and removed nearly all the categories from the userboxes. They all were either redlinks, or had only userbox listing pages, or had only 1 or 2 actual members. (As well as the concerns of the nom, below, of course.) If this leaves them empty, I'll delete. The other nominations below are similar situations. Didn't upmerge as the few users involved already had several location cats, including a "step up". - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 06:41, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{lc|Wikipedians from Valdosta, Georgia}}
Only one user despite existing for over a year, city of 45,529 people as of 2006.
:{{lc|Wikipedians in Lahr}}
No users in category, only populated by a userbox page.  Created almost 2 years ago. Location with a population of only 43,810 as of 2005.
:{{lc|Wikipedians in Temple Cloud}}
Only one user despite existing for 17 months.  Population of 1,400 as of 2001.
:{{lc|Wikipedians in Bexley, Ohio}}
10 months, 1 user, 13,000 population as of 2000.
:{{lc|Wikipedians in Saratoga Springs, New York}}
15 months, 2 users, 26,000 population as of 2000.
:{{lc|Wikipedians in Cobourg, Ontario}}
Nearly 2 years, 1 user, 18,000 population as of 2006.
:{{lc|Wikipedians in Kirkland WA}}
18 months, 1 user, 46,000 population as of 2005.

Per precedent to delete [[:Category:Wikipedians from Fox Chapel, PA]] below, these are too narrow to facilitate collaboration. Probably a lot more of these, but I got tired of looking. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 05:13, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete all''' as nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 05:13, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' [[:Category:Wikipedians in Lahr]] as unused and empty, '''upmerge''' the rest to parent "Wikipedians in foo" categories.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 15:08, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
:*Upmerging is fine with me. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 15:39, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

===February 13===
====Category:Rouge admins====
<div class="boilerplate vfd" style="background:#bff9fc; margin:0 auto; padding:0 10px 0 10px; border:1px solid #AAAAAA;">
:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Delete'''
:This was a rather lengthy discussion, and it could use at least ''some'' summary. (So I apologise in advance for the length of the closure.)

:The following is from a template posted to this discussion at one point. It's at least a decent start:

:'''''Arguments for Keep'''''
:*1.) Meant for humorous purposes only
:*2.) It's harmless/doesn't hurt anyone
:*3.) Disruption by some people doesn't mean anything is wrong with the category
:*4.) A [[:Category:Rouge editors|category]] has since been added for regular editors too
:*5.) Deleting it takes away an element of personality/tradition/culture from Wikipedia
:*6.) Nothing wrong with a joke restricted to admin use only
:*7.) Nothing wrong with it if it's open to use by all users

:'''''Arguments for Deletion'''''
:*1.) Admin-only joke category not in spirit of Wikipedia
:*2.) [[WP:ADMIN|Adminship]] not a cabal/trophy; restricted joke category serves to perpetuate view of adminship as a special club/clique 
:*3.) Divisive/offensive
:*4.) Would be okay as a joke but has had serious consequences/been taken seriously/not worth trouble it's caused
:*5.) Humorous category with no collaborative use/no real benefit
:*6.) Most humor-only categories are deleted, no reason this is different
:*7.) Could be viewed as an effort to suppress criticism, even if intended humorously
:*8.) Userbox/[[WP:ROUGE|page]] sufficient for humor purpose

:In addition to these there were several links to other essays. We have a tradition that commenters can link to an essay in lieu of retyping what the essay said in a specific discussion. As such, there were several links to various sections of [[WP:AADD]] and [[WP:NOT]].

:There were a few additional things that need to be noted (to which I gave additional weight in this closure):

:1.) While normally, [[Wikipedia:Argumentum ad Jimbonem]] might apply; in this case those comments are specifically placed at [[Wikipedia:Administrators#No_big_deal]], and I believe that there is a strong consensus agreeing with what was quoted: that admiship is "no big deal", and is merely a collection of tools, and a few added responsibilities which go along with those tools. 

:2.) The rather clear confusion between [[rogue]] and [[rouge]], even amongst those commenting here. (And by the way, it would be easy enough to discount every "vote" which indicated that the commenter thought that this was a category for ''rogue'' admins. But I did not do so, as the category has apparently grown in membership to include those who have/had that same mistaken opinion of the intended inclusion criteria of the category.) So it's clear that the category's inclusion criteria has become muddled at best.

::Lar's comments clarify the category's initial history well enough, I think:
::* ''"I suggest you and everyone else concerned about the category being " bad-faith, disruptive, divisive and deliberately so" might want to read [[Wikipedia:Rouge_admin]]. That ''essay/joke/whatever you want to call it'' is the definition of what it means to be "rouge" (not rogue, the typo is deliberate there) in the en:wp context. You can argue that irony doesn't work well on line, or that the category isn't making the point it is intended to make because people don't get the joke, or you can even argue that it has passed its day, if you like. But to say it's bad faith... misses the point. Back in the day, you used to gain admission to the category by some other admin spotting something particularly clueful you had done, some particularly astute or courageous edit or block.... to roll back the tide of linkspammers, POV pushers and assorted crazies with fringe theories to push. The addition sometimes even cited the diff, you never added yourself to it, that was declasse. It was a badge of honor among some. Again, perhaps that day has passed. Perhaps most in it now don't even recall that. Perhaps it needs deleting. Perhaps the existance of it is now divisive. Wikipedia is far bigger and more formal than it was even 2 years ago, and perhaps some inside lore and jokes that used to work, and work well, maybe they don't any more... Perhaps no one ''gets'' "Ha Ha only serious" any more? I don't know. But, whatever else it is, it's not bad faith. I hope that helps. ++[[User:Lar|Lar]]: [[User_talk:Lar|t]]/[[Special:Contributions/Lar|c]] 04:03, 13 February 2008 (UTC)"''

::Incidentally, one of the things that came out of the "Userbox wars" was that adding a userbox to someone else's userpage could be considered disruptive. If so, the same can be said about user categories. And if that was the intended usage, it's another reason to delete.

:3.) The incident which resulted in the block of a Wikipedian - While noteworthy, I won't duplicate the discussion here, except to say that adding oneself to a category which has inclusion criteria which does not fully describe you would seem to be an egregious violation of [[Wikipedia:Assume good faith]]. (I, and I presume everyone else, would want to believe that all categorisatons of Wikipedians are a true statement about themselves.) The question of "Is it humour" merely muddied the waters (and may have been partly a cause of the action/reactions).  And this is one of several reasons why Wikipedian categories based on humour have been repeatedly deleted ([[WP:UCFD/I]]). As noted in the discussion, one may question whether humour that causes someone to [[WP:SPIDER|dress up as spiderman and climb the Reichstag]] (another "humourous" page), '''''is''''' humour, or just [[WP:BITE|biting]] our fellow Wikipedians.  While the humour of the category may  or may not have been genuine at one time (and not necessarily at another Wikipedian's expense), [[Wikipedia talk:Rouge admin/Former category talk page#Unfunny joke at someone else's expense.3F|these comments]] are well taken.

:4.) Wikipedia history - I think that we have a precedent from [[Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Wikipedia:Esperanza]] called the "Messedrocker solution"(named after the Wikipedian who proposed it), for pages on Wikipedia which are of historical value, but which no longer are considered "a good idea". It would apply if this discussion was aimed at the Wikipedian page describing Rouge admins. But this is merely a category of inclusion. As such, I don't think that it would be contrary to the intent and spirit of that solution to place a salted notice (or possibly even a soft-redirect to [[Wikipedia:Rouge admins]]) at the category location.

:Again, I apologise at the length of the closure, but due to the length of the discussion, it was the only way, I felt, to make the closure clear enough for all. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 00:01, 18 February 2008 (UTC)
----

:{{Lc|Rouge admins}}<br />
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' We kept this before because it was understood that it was a humor category, and not to be taken seriously. A non-admin has now been blocked for using this category. If we can't use the joke category in a humorous and fun way, without fearing that paranoid admins are going to block us for it, then it's not a humor category. It just sucks all the fun out of it. [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 07:29, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
::'''Comment from nominator''' I think it's clear that most of us don't want to see this category get deleted, but none the less I believe the situation documented at [[WP:ANI#Block of User:Equazcion]] and this category need some clarification about its use. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 08:51, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
:::'''Comment/keep''' I just wanted to let everyone know that I no longer seek deletion of this category, and rather it would be kept, as a humor category. At the start I wouldn't have minded it if it had been deleted, but I made this nomination thinking it would likely be kept and simply get some constructive discussion on the issue. However, the issue really isn't with this specific category, but how dispute resolution was handled. I don't completely disagree about if non-admins should be allowed to use it or not. I'm sorry for coming to my senses a little late in the game, and I hope we don't axe a part of the humor in this community. A situation like this could have happened for any category, so my reasons for nominating this one don't really apply. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 03:02, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
:::: '''Point! Point!''' Block him! just kidding :) <small style="font:bold 10px Arial;display:inline;border:#009 1px dashed;padding:1px 6px 2px 7px;white-space:nowrap">[[User:Equazcion|<font color="#000">Equazcion</font>]] [[User talk:equazcion|•''✗'']]/[[Special:Contributions/Equazcion|''C'' •]] ''03:16, 14 Feb 2008 (UTC)''</small>
*Any links for this blockage? ''[[User:Dihydrogen Monoxide|dihydrogen monoxide]]'' <small>([[User talk:Dihydrogen Monoxide|H<sub>2</sub>0]])</small> 07:30, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
:*[[WP:ANI#Block of User:Equazcion]]. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 07:31, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep'''.  One user was annoyed because this category was kept at a previous XfD discussion.  Therefore (and WP:POINT is overused, but this is a perfect example) he figured that repeatedly adding himself to the category (and thus possibly giving the confusing impression that he was an admin) was a fine way to disrupt it.  Equazcion is by no means the worst offender (and I am not referring to the nom here either) but quite <b>why</b> we let a small group of editors - see ANI discussion - continue their tiresome "all admins are idiots/incompetent/whatever" campaign on Wikipedia is beyond me. [[User talk:Black Kite|<b style="color:black;">Black Kite</b>]] 07:45, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
:*I don't believe such a "campaign" is a factor here. I certainly don't believe that all admins are idiots or anything like that. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 08:08, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
::* I know - as I said, Ned, I don't include you in this. Your nom is reasonable under the circumstances, but I would hope that disruption by editors isn't a reason to delete, not because it's particularly important, but purely for the [[slippery slope]] factor.  [[User talk:Black Kite|<b style="color:black;">Black Kite</b>]] 09:05, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

* '''Keep'''.  One bad incident doesn't mean the category is bad, it means one user and one administrator each had poor judgment.  [[User:Ral315|Ral315]] ([[User talk:Ral315|talk]]) 07:45, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
:Poor judgment related to this affair abounded and continues to abound. By no means is it limited to one user and one administrator. [[User:Mike R|Mike R]] ([[User talk:Mike R|talk]]) 16:37, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' - Creates cabalism = Gone. ''[[User:Dihydrogen Monoxide|dihydrogen monoxide]]'' <small>([[User talk:Dihydrogen Monoxide|H<sub>2</sub>0]])</small> 07:47, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' per Ral315. One pointy attempt to suck the fun out of the project shouldn't spoil it for others. [[User:GlassCobra|Glass]]'''[[User talk:GlassCobra|Cobra]]''' 07:58, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''': Baby, bathwater, hive of deadly bees, per Black Kite and Ral315. Just because someone who wasn't an admin added himself to it to make a point, and was subsequently blocked for it, is no reason to delete it.—[[User:Ryulong|<font color="blue">Ryūlóng</font>]] ([[User talk:Ryulong|<font color="gold">竜龙</font>]]) 08:02, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
:*Making a point isn't blockable, disrupting to make a point is, but we don't really have any evidence of that (and no, the disruption caused by the anticipation of disruption doesn't count). The fact remains that someone got blocked for using a humor category, and that should be a big WTF to anyone. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 08:06, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
::*Yes someone got blocked for using a humor category. That someone is currently not an admin, yet the category has "admin" in its name. While it's not like he put [[:Category:Wikipedia administrators]] onto his user page, he is inadvertantly implying that he is an admin, when he is not.—[[User:Ryulong|<font color="blue">Ryūlóng</font>]] ([[User talk:Ryulong|<font color="gold">竜龙</font>]]) 08:40, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
:::*Next thing you know people will assume the ''Rouge'' part means something too! Oh noes! -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 08:47, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' Wikipedia does not need admin only fun clubs where admins laugh at the scum aka regular editors and boast about breaking the rules by writing stuff like "Rouge admins firmly believe that adminship is a trophy, and will block anyone who states otherwise." Extremely divisive and offensive, it sucks the fun out of the project for anyone not part of the club. -[[User:Lapinmies|<font color="green" face="system">Lapinmies</font>]] 08:08, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
**well now wait a second, I don't think any of the admins listed in this cat think that way. [[User:John]], the blocking admin, is not in this cat. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 08:10, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
***The implication clearly is that these admins don't care about the rules or the rights of the editors and I find this outrageous. Just click on the link to the rougelike game and it tells you what it means to be a rouge admin "Your character is a "rouge" admin, and you must commit as many outrageous actions as possible before you'll get forced out of Wikipedia." I understand that this is supposed to be a joke, but it is very offensive and divisive. -[[User:Lapinmies|<font color="green" face="system">Lapinmies</font>]] 08:17, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' on the same grounds that the humor cat [[:Category:Gayass Wikipedians]] was slaughtered and on the grounds that admins don't look good in drag anyway. I mean, "rouge" is makeup, isn't it?? '''-''' <font size="+1" color="red">✰</font><strong style="letter-spacing:1px;font-family:Verdana">[[User:Allstarecho|ALLSTAR]]</strong><font size="+1" color="red">✰</font> <sup><small>[[User_talk:Allstarecho|echo]]</small></sup> 09:06, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
:* '''Comment''' Not the same thing at all, but personally I would've kept [[:Category:Gayass Wikipedians]]. And I look terrible in drag. [[User talk:Black Kite|<b style="color:black;">Black Kite</b>]] 09:08, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep'''.  Omg drama. Omg no sense of humour.  Omg omg omg.  The justification for this MFD is effectively "It's not fair because non-admins can't be in a category that is specifically for admins" - just read that a few times and realise how silly it really is.  Equazcion didn't solely get blocked for using the category, he got blocked for being a dick about it when asked reasonably to remove a category from his userpage that identified the subject as an admin, and commenced a lame edit war.  I wouldn't have gone for a 24 hour block (maybe a 24 second one), but I can see why it was imposed. [[User:Neil|<u style="text-decoration:none;font:100% cursive;color:#060">Neıl</u>]] [[User_talk:Neil|<u style="text-decoration:none;color:#060">☎</u>]] 09:46, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*<s>'''Keep'''</s> '''Merge to Rouge Wikipedians''' since anything else would be pointy considering I created [[:Category:Rouge editors]]. Both admins and those who don't want adminship need to blow off steam sometimes and humor is the best way to do that. We now have two such categories, one for each group, and as long as we can keep it humorous and not take ourselves too seriously without losing focus on our primary task here this can work out. I think this has been blown way out of proportion. As for [[:Category:Gayass Wikipedians]] I didn't approve of that deletion (mildly speaking) and there were more serious issues at stake there. I don't think we should compare the two. [[User:EconomicsGuy|EconomicsGuy]] ([[User talk:EconomicsGuy|talk]]) 11:11, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

===== break 1 =====
* '''Comment''' - please see [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia%3AAdministrators%27_noticeboard%2FIncidents&diff=191067098&oldid=191067066 this ANI diff] and [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Category_talk:Rouge_admins&diff=prev&oldid=191076158 this cat_talk diff] I am afraid that many people apparently don't get the joke, or don't get how the joke makes a serious point. It used to be a badge of honor to have a fellow admin put you in this category (that's how it worked, you didn't put yourself in it, someone else did it) for some particularly astute comment, protection, or block that helped stem the tide of single purpose accounts and their POVish articles. Now the category is something that at least <s>3</s>4 non admins think is funny to be in, for some reason.  If the category can't achieve the goal it was created for, perhaps its time has passed. Perhaps it's fixable. Perhaps removing it from the administrative supercat it is in ([[:Category:Wikipedia administrators by inclination]]) would be sufficient. Perhaps the cat has to go but the essay could stay. Perhaps they both have to go. I don't quite know any more. It's no longer the same category. WP is no longer the same place, for good or ill, as it was when the category was created. I agree with Black Kite that disruption by editors isn't a reason to delete per se, but it is symptomatic of misalignment. ++[[User:Lar|Lar]]: [[User_talk:Lar|t]]/[[Special:Contributions/Lar|c]] 11:17, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
**Make that four, the nominator also felt it funny/important to add himself to the category. ++[[User:Lar|Lar]]: [[User_talk:Lar|t]]/[[Special:Contributions/Lar|c]] 11:29, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' I have no problem with the essay; I have no problem with the userbox; my problem is with the user category, which serves no purpose (why would anyone need to search for "rouge" admins) and is divisive (an admin-only humor category certainly refutes the claim that adminship is not a trophy, and the fact that several editors' userpages were edited ''by others'' to remove the category to maintain its purity only makes it worse). For those who point to [[:Category:Rouge editors]], please note the date stamp on that category, which was created all of two minutes before Equazcion was blocked, and is equally pointless. Neither category serves a purpose, and I would propose deleting both of them, along with [[:Category:Wikipedia administrators open to trout slapping]] and [[:Category:Wikipedians open to trout slapping]], which also serve no purpose. There are some admin-only categories that are useful and appropriate ([[:Category:Wikipedia administrators who will provide copies of deleted articles]], [[:Category:Wikipedia administrators willing to grant rollback requests]], and maybe [[:Category:Wikipedia administrators open to recall]]), but the other categories (especially the allegedly humorous ones) don't have any real function. Just as [[:Category:Well endowed Wikipedians]] was (properly) deleted (see [[Wikipedia:Categories for deletion/Log/2006 January 22#Category:Well endowed Wikipedians]]), [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/October 2007#Category:Wikipedians who defy categorisation]] resulted in nuking another joke category, and I could cite over a dozen more. Retaining this category is a net detriment to the project. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 12:10, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per sound reasoning by the nominator and the !voter above mine. This is not harmless humour. When admins don't understand the essentially humourous purpose of the cat. and perform bad blocks on user(s) in good standing of the community, then the existence of such category is evidently harmful. We don't reserve aimless humor at the expense of wiki drama. --[[User:PeaceNT|PeaceNT]] ([[User talk:PeaceNT|talk]]) 12:25, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
** Um, this particular user is only "sort of" in good standing, as it were, as the user has a (mild) history of 3RR issues and the way they started the discussion at this talk page suggests they possibly knew they were going to possibly cause disruption before they started. Also, the thread right above the removal thread on their user talk page is a warning about possible 3RR violation. But ya, there is something to the theory that if a joke isn't working, stop making it. That's especially true for ones that depend heavily on irony or sarcasm, or reverse psychology or the like. ++[[User:Lar|Lar]]: [[User_talk:Lar|t]]/[[Special:Contributions/Lar|c]] 12:58, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' per Neil. [[User:Kusma|Kusma]] ([[User talk:Kusma|talk]]) 12:27, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' per nominator's own statement "it's clear that most of us don't want to see this category get deleted". This is not the best place to get clarification on the use of a category or to discuss the appropriateness of a block. If a non-admin's ego is so fragile he or she can't handle not being in the rouge admin category, s/he can be added to [[:Category:Rouge editors]]. ThuranX said it best, [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Administrators'_noticeboard/Incidents&diff=prev&oldid=191067066 here]. - [[User:AuburnPilot|<font color="#0000cd">auburn</font><font color="#EF6521">pilot</font>]] [[User_talk:AuburnPilot|<small>talk</small>]] 13:05, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Comment'''- There are now two "Rouge" categories (see just above). there are also editors who will never get added to either category, nor wish to get involved. How about renaming if possible as Category:Admins/Rouge or Category:Administrators (rouge)? [[User:Newbyguesses|Newbyguesses]] - [[User_talk:Newbyguesses|Talk]] 13:21, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

===== break 2 =====
*'''Strong delete'''. This category's ''only'' function is to ridicule the notion of some admins being actually ''rogue''. I wouldn't mind the honest [[:Category:Rogue admins]], but this category here is needlessly inflammatory. Delete, and open the overdue MfD on [[Wikipedia:Rouge admin]]. Any efforts to suppress criticism, however far-fetched it may be, serve no collaborative purpose, but indeed actively hinder it. User:[[User talk:Dorftrottel|Dorftrottel]] 13:23,&nbsp;[[February 13]],&nbsp;200[[Special:Random|8]]
*'''Keep'''. Why not? Non admins can't be a member? I can't be a member of [[:Category:Wikipedia administrator hopefuls]], because it says that it is for people who are not already admins. I don't go and add myself to it and refuse to remove the category. There's no reason to delete this, at all, and no, I am not, and never have been, within this category. [[User:J Milburn|J Milburn]] ([[User talk:J Milburn|talk]]) 13:44, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep but admins to get over it and get a sense of humour and proportion and stop wasting everyone's time with blocks for unlicenced jokes on userpages, and while we're at it why not apply the same standards on all CfDs not just admin ones eh?'''. [[User:DuncanHill|DuncanHill]] ([[User talk:DuncanHill|talk]]) 13:49, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
**If I could empty quote an opinion, I would. --[[User:Haemo|Haemo]] ([[User talk:Haemo|talk]]) 01:48, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' - I didn't have any problem with this category when I was under the impression that it actually was intended purely as a joke. However my recent block, which resulted from adding myself to this supposedly joke category, has changed my mind. As [[User:Wikidemo]] pointed out, "[If] the category itself is a joke, ... it's fair game for all (an administrator-only joke area does not seem to be in the spirit of the project)..." If it's a joke, then by definition it's a joke that anyone should be able to partake in. If it's at all not a joke, it should be deleted. Even if there is some humorous reason to keep it around, the amount of divisiveness and controversy it has created is reason enough to get rid of it. It's fine to keep a joke around as long as it doesn't cause any harm and no one takes it remotely seriously, but since that doesn't seem to be the case and it's causing all this mess, with this being its third CfD, it's time for it to go. There's no compelling reason to keep a joke around if it causes this much trouble. Furthermore, categories that exist for humorous purposes only get deleted by the truckload every day, for the reason that they don't aid in encyclopedic collaboration.  It never matter that they're "just jokes". If they don't help people write the encyclopedia, they get deleted. That reason surely applies to this category. <small style="font:bold 10px Arial;display:inline;border:#009 1px dashed;padding:1px 6px 2px 7px;white-space:nowrap">[[User:Equazcion|<font color="#000">Equazcion</font>]] [[User talk:equazcion|•''✗'']]/[[Special:Contributions/Equazcion|''C'' •]] ''13:44, 13 Feb 2008 (UTC)''</small> <small>(copied over from usertalk by [[User:DuncanHill|DuncanHill]] ([[User talk:DuncanHill|talk]]) 13:57, 13 February 2008 (UTC))</small>
*'''Strong big fucking waste of time'''.  This won't be deleted, period.  Someone might as well close it now, so it can go to DRV and get endorsed.  The admins want their toys, the admins will have their toys.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 14:41, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Edit-conflicted Keep''' - The community deserves the ability to laugh at itself.  Equazcion, I'm sorry you got blocked for re-adding yourself, but it is what it is and I think the block was justified.  Common sense tells non-admins not to put {{tl|administrator}} on our user page or try and join [[User:LaraLove/Bathrobe Cabal|the bathrobe cabal]]--common sense can (and has, until now) tell non-admins not to join categories created for admins.  As for concerns that this is creating a special club or group out of admins...well, it seems to me that becoming an admin kind of [[Special:Listusers/sysop|puts you in a separate group anyway]]. --[[User:jonny-mt|<span style="color:#297AA3">'''jonny'''</span>]]-[[Special:Contributions/jonny-mt|<span style="color:#A3293D">'''m'''</span>]][[User talk:jonny-mt|<span style="color:#3DA329">'''t'''</span>]] 14:43, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
**'''Comment re Jonny-mt's ≠vote''' which would be all very well if admins didn't keep claiming to be just ordinary editors with a mop. Why can't they just come out with it and say "we're special - you aren't, we get to have our own clubs which you proles can't join". [[User:DuncanHill|DuncanHill]] ([[User talk:DuncanHill|talk]]) 14:48, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
***Reply to DuncanHill:  I thought it'd be obvious based upon the block and this cfd, but maybe not.  So here you go: we're special - you aren't, we get to have our own clubs which you proles can't join.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 14:57, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
****It is obvious - but a little more upfront honesty about it is kinda cool! For proles, read [[1984 (book)|1984]]. [[User:DuncanHill|DuncanHill]] ([[User talk:DuncanHill|talk]]) 15:03, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
**For what it's worth, jonny, the BRC is now open to all comers. :) [[User:GlassCobra|Glass]]'''[[User talk:GlassCobra|Cobra]]''' 19:57, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
***Great!  Now all I need is a bathrobe and a smile.  I mean, I only have one and not the other, but I'm sure I can improvise.... --[[User:jonny-mt|<span style="color:#297AA3">'''jonny'''</span>]]-[[Special:Contributions/jonny-mt|<span style="color:#A3293D">'''m'''</span>]][[User talk:jonny-mt|<span style="color:#3DA329">'''t'''</span>]] 09:30, 14 February 2008 (UTC)

===== break 3 =====
*'''Delete''' Per [[WP:DEAL]] if its a joke category then anyone can join being an admin does not grant special status to participate in a joke.  If the worry is that a Wikipedian may think that a user is an admin because they are in this category then the same Wikipedian may think the admin is rogue and will question the whole process. A joke stops being funny when people are hurt by it and the pain is obvious at [[Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents#Block of User:Equazcion]].  There are no possible benifits to the Wikipedia project in the [[:Category:Rouge admins]] [[User:Jeepday|Jeepday]] <small>([[User talk:Jeepday|talk]])</small> 15:02, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' Per [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:MYSPACE#Wikipedia_is_not_a_blog.2C_webspace_provider.2C_social_networking.2C_or_memorial_site| What wikipedia is not!] Does nothing to make the encyclopedia better yet it has proven itself to be disruptive to the working of this project so must be deleted. [[User talk:Hypnosadist|<small><sup><font color="#000">(<font color="#c20">Hypnosadist</font>)</font></sup></small>]] 15:13, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' Per statements made above - [[User:Epousesquecido|Epousesquecido]] ([[User talk:Epousesquecido|talk]]) 15:16, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep'''. The whole thing's silly and harmless. [[User talk:Orderinchaos|Orderinchaos]] 15:26, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
:I don't think Equazcion finds it too funny anymore. Turns out humor is serious business. — [[User:Save Us 229|<font color="007FFF">Save_Us</font>]] [[User talk:Save Us 229|<font color="000000">†</font>]] 18:02, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Speedy rename''' to Category:Wikipedian Rouge Admins. No opinion on the category's existence otherwise. —[[User talk:Random832|Random832]] 15:32, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''keep''' - this is why I love wikipedia.  The inability to understand a joke/bit of humor and the dhrahma that comes from it....priceless.  --[[User:Rocksanddirt|Rocksanddirt]] ([[User talk:Rocksanddirt|talk]]) 15:59, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
::Being a joke has got loads of categories deleted, why not this one? [[User talk:Hypnosadist|<small><sup><font color="#000">(<font color="#c20">Hypnosadist</font>)</font></sup></small>]] 16:32, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
:::Because it's an ''admin'' category.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 17:16, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per Horologium and Hypnosadist. [[User:Mike R|Mike R]] ([[User talk:Mike R|talk]]) 16:37, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep.''' Must we eviscerate every facet of our community? [[User:RyanGerbil10|RyanGerbil10]]<small>[[User_talk:RyanGerbil10|(Kick 'em in the Dishpan!)]]</small> 16:58, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*<s>'''Weak keep''' per</s> '''Weak delete''' in spite of nominator's manifest "process wankery" and multiple [[WP:POINT]] violations. Also <s>per</s> in spite of "I think it's clear that most of us don't want to see this category get deleted". While I could not care less long term whether this category is deleted (it is debatable whether it does any good to the project), it has existed a long time and I am very loath to delete it in this way, at this time, to suit those who do not appreciate that Wikipedia is [[WP:DEMOCRACY|not]] an experiment in social organization. --[[User:John|John]] ([[User talk:John|talk]]) 17:11, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
:Nevertheless, this is not a good reason to keep, so I have changed my mind, mainly per Lar and Tony. We move on. --[[User:John|John]] ([[User talk:John|talk]]) 21:17, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' Not finding it funny anymore is not a valid deletion criteria.  Is there some [[WP:POINT|point]] to filing this CFD?  --[[User:Jayron32|Jayron32]].[[User talk:Jayron32|<small>talk</small>]].[[Special:Contributions/Jayron32|<small>contribs</small>]] 17:43, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Merge''' with [[:Category:Rouge editors]]. Categories meant to used for humor become unfunny when legitimate editors are blocked by administrators who get overzealous with their tools. — [[User:Save Us 229|<font color="007FFF">Save_Us</font>]] [[User talk:Save Us 229|<font color="000000">†</font>]] 17:49, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*Good lord, has anyone made a plausible case on why categories based on wiki philosophies are harmful?  I still haven't seen it, yet people are spending all kinds of time trying to delete this stuff.  It seems like every time I turn around, yet another similar user category is being listed here.  '''Why?'''  [[User:Friday|Friday]] [[User talk:Friday|(talk)]] 18:01, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
::'''Yes!'''
::a)Reduces good faith; both on behalf of the rouge admin and on the person seeing that an admin is rouge.
::b)Wikipedia is not a comedy club its an encyclopedia.
::c)It can be viewed as insulting.
::d)It is disruptive yet serves no purpose in aiding the creation of wikipedia. [[User talk:Hypnosadist|<small><sup><font color="#000">(<font color="#c20">Hypnosadist</font>)</font></sup></small>]] 18:14, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

**Maybe because of that big purple box that claims it's humor, and yet someone got blocked because of this so-called humor.  Maybe because by blocking, admins just told everyone loud and clear that we are above the proles, and don't you dare screw with our joke.  Or maybe it's because we '''aren't''' above the proles, and we should stop acting like we are.  Just a few guesses.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 18:13, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
***Um, no. They got blocked because of the blue box (the one that says this is a category used for administration, the one that points out that the cat is a subcat of the supercat that collects the admin only categories), not the purple one. You seem to be polemicising and that may not be the best approach. ++[[User:Lar|Lar]]: [[User_talk:Lar|t]]/[[Special:Contributions/Lar|c]] 19:15, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
****I never had a problem with this category until [[User:Equazcion]] got blocked.  I thought it was harmless and funny.  But it's clear that the point of the joke, zenlike or not, is being missed by both admins and non-admins, and it either needs to be reworked or removed.  And considering the vast majority of people here are firmly in the keep or delete camps, reworking it probably isn't going to work.  Am I polimicising?  Perhaps.  I'm amazed this mess got this far over a joke (because it doesn't matter how many blue boxes you add to the category, the purple one still says it's humor).  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 21:22, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

*****I may be being thick, but I can't see a blue box which points out that the cat is a subcat of the supercat that collects the admin only categories. [[User:DuncanHill|DuncanHill]] ([[User talk:DuncanHill|talk]]) 21:24, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
******Actually, the blue box only says it's used for administration (not admins).  I believe Lar may be referring to [[:Category:Wikipedia administrators by inclination]], which Rouge admins is in.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 21:27, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*******Yes, I ''thought'' that that is what the blue box actually says. Clearly, not me being thick then. Good, thanks. [[User:DuncanHill|DuncanHill]] ([[User talk:DuncanHill|talk]]) 21:42, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

===== break 4 =====
*'''Delete''' per Dorftrottel and others.  This goes beyond being a harmless joke.  [[User:6SJ7|6SJ7]] ([[User talk:6SJ7|talk]]) 18:53, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' - what we're doing here is taking all the personality out of Wikipedia.  Would I have blocked someone for adding themselves to the cat?  Nah, it's a weak block and serves no real purpose.  But c'mon, things like this are at the heart and soul of Wikipedia.  When did we start taking ourselves to seriously that we can't have a little fun around here?  - [[User:Philippe|Philippe]] &#124; [[User talk:Philippe|Talk]] 19:22, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' - The block was just unnessesary drama, this is just one of a very few things that admins can use to relax themselves on a busy day. - [[User:Caribbean H.Q.|<b><span style="color:#0000DD;"><span style="color:#0066FF;">Ca<span style="color:#0099FF;">ri<span style="color:#00CCFF;">bb<span style="color:#00EEFF;">e</span>a</span></span>n</span>~</span><span style="color:#FF3333;">H.</span><span style="color:#FFCC00;">Q.</span></b>]] 19:26, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
**Adding themselves to [[:Category:Rouge admins]] is "just one of a very few things that admins can use to relax themselves on a busy day"? Is that true? Really? Wow, the job must be even lousier than I thought. [[User:Mike R|Mike R]] ([[User talk:Mike R|talk]]) 19:43, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
***Lovely sarcasm, items found on [[:Category:Wikipedia humor]] are just one of a very few things that admins can use to relax themselves on a busy day, how does that sound? - [[User:Caribbean H.Q.|<b><span style="color:#0000DD;"><span style="color:#0066FF;">Ca<span style="color:#0099FF;">ri<span style="color:#00CCFF;">bb<span style="color:#00EEFF;">e</span>a</span></span>n</span>~</span><span style="color:#FF3333;">H.</span><span style="color:#FFCC00;">Q.</span></b>]] 19:49, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
****My more subtle point was that it's only the category we're talking about deleting here, not [[WP:ROUGE]] or anything else. [[User:Mike R|Mike R]] ([[User talk:Mike R|talk]]) 20:06, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete'''.  A joke category?  Only if admins use it.  If non-admins use it it becomes serious business creating drama, and is a now blockable offense.  Divisive.  Cabalistic.  Stupid.  Get rid of it.  [[User:Captain Infinity|Captain Infinity]] ([[User talk:Captain Infinity|talk]]) 19:39, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Comment''' A related subject is [[Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/User:R/Single Letter Group]], which was similarly deleted for divisiveness, '''even though it was in userspace'''. I have not advocated deleting the essay or the userbox, only the user category. This seems to be yet another precedent that elitism is not appropriate on Wikipedia. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 19:41, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
**Speaking as the prime troublemaker over that one, the problem was that the admins in question were repeatedly deleting the page to remove edits which didn't come from non-single-letter users. Levity with admin tools is not good thing. [[User:Mackensen|Mackensen]] [[User_talk:Mackensen|(talk)]] 20:02, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

*'''Keep'''. Good heavens people. Yes, it's something of a joke--''for admins''. I think it should be plenty obvious to anyone who spends far too much time here that it's isn't cabalish&ndash;any category that includes myself {{user|Geogre}} and {{user|David Gerard}} is by definition inclusive, at least as far as sysops are concerned. Given that the sysop who did the block was himself not in the category, I think it's safe to say that the category is not at fault (poor category!) Moving from the concrete to the abstract, the ''rouge experience'' does describe a certain approach and mentality toward adminship, including not taking one's self too seriously, but at the same time treating the project itself with utmost respect and veneration. [[User:Mackensen|Mackensen]] [[User_talk:Mackensen|(talk)]] 20:01, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
::But why does it need a category? WjBscribe's delete comment over at the SLG MfD very nicely sums up the whole "cabal" concern very nicely, and Pascal Tesson notes some uncomfortable parallels with Esperanza. Both of those concerns extend to this category as well. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 20:12, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
:::The parallel doesn't follow. In the case of Esperanza and SLG there were demonstrable concerns over cliquish behavior and (especially over Esperanza) empire-building. I'm not aware of any coordinated behavior of people in this category; some of them aren't even on speaking terms at the moment. This is no Esperanza here. [[User:Mackensen|Mackensen]] [[User_talk:Mackensen|(talk)]] 20:15, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
::::I was talking about the "exclusiveness" factor; several peoples' userpages were edited by others to remove what is supposed to be a joke category from their page, and one editor was blocked after rebuffing several admins and returning it to his page. It's hard to call something disruptive when it doesn't violate any policy and is confined to one's own userpage. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 20:22, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
:::::That would happen with any other "admin" category. Non-admins shouldn't be in a category which describes admins by temperament and approach. There's several fallacies here. First of all, it's not confined to his userpage, but rather puts his user page in a category, which misleadingly implies that he's an admin--which he's not. User pages are not supposed to be misleading in such a fashion; non-admins are not supposed to represent themselves as admins and there's plenty of precedent for that. Furthermore, it's against policy to edit-war, even on your own user page, although there's latitude there depending on what's up. Finally, note my original comment--it's something of a joke, but it is not a "joke category" in the sense you describe it. If it were we wouldn't be having this discussion. Exclusive, yes: exclusive to admins. The community recognizes that such a category of user exists, and jealously guards access to it. [[User:Mackensen|Mackensen]] [[User_talk:Mackensen|(talk)]] 20:27, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
::::::(Edit conflict) Point taken on edit-warring, although he only reverted twice before being blocked. My primary opposition to this category's existence has not been answered, however: ''Why does it exist?'' Every time I have asked that question, the answer invariably boils down to "I like it", or "It's funny" or something similar. Nobody has been able to articulate why a category is needed, in addition to the essay and the userbox. Those who assert their rougeness could always sign the manifesto, which would be accomplished by listifying. While I disagree with the philosophy, that is not driving my opposition. I look at this (and the similar trout slapping categories I cited way up there) and cannot understand how these categories serve any purpose at all. I have watched as similar jokey categories (that are not admin-only) have been deleted without a peep from the admins, and then watch as they shriek when it's a sacred cow admin humor category up on the block. When this was discussed in December, I watched a stream of admins stroll through UCFD for the first time (ever, in some cases, in quite a while for others) and discuss only the three admin cats; they didn't participate in any other way, despite the backlog of discussions requiring admin attention (and the backlog notice at the top of the screen). I watched a single admin spend all day closing a mountain of discussions, because only three admins regularly participated at UCFD, and two of them had contributed to or initiated all of the categories. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 20:54, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*Although I agree with everything Mackensen says, a joke that people don't get isn't a good joke. A parable that doesn't instruct ins't a good parable. A category that has devolved from a way that admins honor other admins by placing them in it to a butt of jokes by non admins and a source of hard feelings when POINT makers insist on acting out isn't a good category. Wish it weren't so, but I fear that the time when the English Wikipedia was a small enough community that this worked has passed. Will the world end without this category? No. Will the project end? No. Will I go away? No. But still, it is the community that has failed the category, and not the other way round. So then, with regret, '''Delete'''. <small> cue [[The Times They Are a-Changin']]</small> ++[[User:Lar|Lar]]: [[User_talk:Lar|t]]/[[Special:Contributions/Lar|c]] 20:44, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
**The times changed a long time ago Lar. They changed when admins started to care more about internal struggles, their own status and selected individual editors rather than responding to the concerns of the community. [[User:Valentinian]], a hugely productive editor, left over a month ago because of the deteriorating working conditions that no one is/was doing anything about. He didn't make a big deal out of it so no one cared except me andf a few other fellow Danes here. To even talk about a badge of honor for dealing with disruptive editors when things have evolved the way they have simply makes no sense. This isn't "the admins vs the trolls" any longer simply because we can no longer rely on the admins to take care of the issues we face. Like it or not the admins and non-admins are in this together and until you realize that we cannot take this category seriously. [[User:EconomicsGuy|EconomicsGuy]] ([[User talk:EconomicsGuy|talk]]) 21:07, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
***I am terrifically sorry to see Valentinan has stopped editing, he was one of the good guys. I always tried to respond when he brought issues to my attention, ever since I first became an admin (ask me about the "swedish meatballs are not as good as danish meatballs" POV war sometime).  Do people have bad days? sure. Are there some bad apples? sure. That's been the case from the start and always will be the case. But if you think ALL admins care more about things other than responding to the needs of the project, we all might as well hang it up. I don't think things are bad as all that. That's not quite the same as acknowledging that things have changed. Things can be different without necessarily being better, or worse.  ++[[User:Lar|Lar]]: [[User_talk:Lar|t]]/[[Special:Contributions/Lar|c]] 19:58, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
* I've always found this kind of humor uncomfortable, and if this category (to which someone once added me, presumably as a joke) wasn't there, the encyclopedia would not suffer one bit.  If you need a deletion reason, I'd say it's "File under juvenilia (community growth)".  --[[User talk:Tony Sidaway|Tony Sidaway]] 21:10, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

===== break 5 =====
*'''Delete''' per my stance that, just like we don't allow jokes in mainspace, we shouldn't allow jokes in the category space.  The userbox should be sufficient to convey the joke; categories on the other hand should actually be helpful to the project. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 23:28, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''', or delete all of Wikipedia due to historical inability to stop people from making tits of themselves everywhere else. <b>[[User Talk:JzG|Guy]]</b> <small>([[User:JzG/help|Help!]])</small> 23:56, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' and '''do not standardize''' for no specific reason. <i><b>[[User:Snowolf|<span style="color:darkmagenta;">Snowolf</span>]] <sup><small>[[User talk:Snowolf|<span style="color:darkmagenta;">How can I help?</span>]]</small></sup></b></i> 00:14, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete'''. Putting Lar and John's disruptive behavior to the side, the joke is not in good taste. [[User:Christopher Parham|Christopher Parham]] [[User talk:Christopher Parham|(talk)]] 01:35, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete'''.  It's immature, in bad taste, a walled garden among administrators, it has become a drama magnet, and is overall not the sort of thing that we should be doing here.  [[User:Wikidemo|Wikidemo]] ([[User talk:Wikidemo|talk]]) 02:03, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' and (as a rouge admin) I'll block anyone who !votes "delete". ···[[User:Nihonjoe|<span style="color:green;">日本穣</span>]]<sup>[[Help:Japanese|?]] · <small>[[User talk:Nihonjoe|Talk to Nihonjoe]]</small></sup> 05:16, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
**That would make you a ''rogue'' admin. User:[[User talk:Dorftrottel|Dorftrottel]] 20:24,&nbsp;[[February 15]],&nbsp;200[[Special:Random|8]]
*'''Keep per Neil and rename "[[wikt:Rogue|Rogue]]" Admins, as "[[wikt:Rouge|Rouge]]" is a color''' - Also fix the images, as the spelling is all fuxed up there, too. Stop the bullshit drama over anything containing humor, exaggerating situations to skew the circumstances. Instead, go be constructive. '''[[User:LaraLove|<span style="font-family:Georgia;color:#BA55D3">Lara</span>]]'''[[User:LaraLove/My heart|<span style="color:#00CED1">❤</span>]]'''[[User talk:LaraLove|<span style="font-family:Georgia;color:#FF1493">Love</span>]]''' 06:03, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Comment''' - Just to hopefully clarify this once and for all, the misspelling "rouge" was intentional, to make fun of old complaints against admins from people who spelled the word wrong. I still think this category should be deleted, but it's been bothering me seeing everyone thinking this is an unintentional misspelling. <small style="font:bold 10px Arial;display:inline;border:#009 1px dashed;padding:1px 6px 2px 7px;white-space:nowrap">[[User:Equazcion|<font color="#000">Equazcion</font>]] [[User talk:equazcion|•''✗'']]/[[Special:Contributions/Equazcion|''C'' •]] ''06:14, 14 Feb 2008 (UTC)''</small>
**Not even old as people ''still'' make the typo. (^_^) ···[[User:Nihonjoe|<span style="color:green;">日本穣</span>]]<sup>[[Help:Japanese|?]] · <small>[[User talk:Nihonjoe|Talk to Nihonjoe]]</small></sup> 07:40, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' Per [[User:Lapinmies|Lapinmies]] and others. We can have humour on Wikipedia, but when it goes out of hand.. thats it. [[User:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;">'''The'''</span>]] [[User_talk:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:black;"> '''Helpful'''</span>]] [[Special:Contributions/Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;"> '''One'''</span>]] <sup>[[User:Thehelpfulone/Review|(Review)]]</sup> 10:26, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete'''.  Useless, divisive, and unfunny.  What are the admins categorizing themselves as "rouge" are trying to say?  "Look at me, I am an admin with a complete disregard for rules"?  Ha-ha, I am ROFLing... not.  Use userboxes if you are so inclined to show a bad sense of humor, but don't make a whole category just for that.—[[User:Ezhiki|Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky)]]&nbsp;•&nbsp;([[User talk:Ezhiki|yo?]]); 15:17, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*<s>This category is obviously meant to be humorous, but I really don't understand the edit war started when a  "user adds himself to a category that identifies himself as an admin when he is not". This category should have ''no'' official status. I am stunned that a user was 3RR blocked for a small non-harmful addition to his userspace. How about a merge with [[:Category:Rouge_editors]] or instead the category should be protected? If neither, there is no need whatsoever for an admin to get trigger-happy with the block button if an 'edit war' breaks out over a non-admin adding themselves to this category again. [[User:EJF|EJF]] ([[User talk:EJF|talk]]) 19:32, 14 February 2008 (UTC).</s> change to '''strong delete''' - after carefully thinking this through, this category only generates ill-will. The fact that so many people are '''[[WP:NOTVOTE|voting]]''' for keep and not giving a reasoned argument rather than [[WP:ILIKEIT|I like it]], or [[WP:NOHARM|it doesn't do any harm]] - when in fact it did Equazcion harm. [[User:EJF|EJF]] ([[User talk:EJF|talk]]) 20:16, 16 February 2008 (UTC)  
*'''Keep'''. There is no reason for one unfortunate incident to sour us on a longstanding part of Wikipedia culture. [[User:IronGargoyle|IronGargoyle]] ([[User talk:IronGargoyle|talk]]) 22:55, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' - serves no practical purpose. [[User:Guest9999|Guest9999]] ([[User talk:Guest9999|talk]]) 00:45, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete'''. If anybody is getting blocked because of this silly and useless category then it should be deleted. [[User:Pocopocopocopoco|Pocopocopocopoco]] ([[User talk:Pocopocopocopoco|talk]]) 02:21, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' No real convincing reasons for deletion given. Lots of things cause pointless drama, it seems like en.wp can't get anything done without pointless drama anymore. Seriously, we probably have thousands of user categories, why would you put yourself into one that doesn't describe you? I don't live in Africa, therefore it would make no sense for me to put [[:Category:Wikipedians in Africa]] on my userpage. Do I put it on my page and then make a huge deal out of it (Not fair! Too Afro-centric! Category-equality for all!) when people tell me to take it off? No, that would be stupid. If you are seriously offended because people don't want you to put yourself into a category that doesn't describe you at all, you really need to realign your priorities here. <span style="font-family:Broadway;">[[User:Mr.Z-man|<span style="color:#056366;">Mr.</span>]]''[[User talk:Mr.Z-man|<span style="color:#056625;">'''Z-'''</span><span style="color:#054F66;">man</span>]]''</span> 03:44, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' zomg drama. <small>If you need a real reason: the case made for deleting the humor category is not convincing, and is based on a mountain made out of a molehill.</small> [[User:Titoxd|Tito<span style="color:#008000;">xd</span>]]<sup>([[User talk:Titoxd|?!?]] - [[WP:FAC|cool stuff]])</sup> 05:15, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''', amusing when '''not taken seriously'''. Don't attempt restrict to admins. If a non-admin wants to use it, who gives a shit? I certainly don't; as long as they're not using it to misrepresent themselves in serious discussions (Although who on earth would use "I r a rouge admin" as a credential in a serious discussion, I don't bloody know). Or maybe just rename the stupid thing to "rouge editor" for equality purposes, although that's not nearly as common a Wikimeme. Apologies should be immediately issued to Equazcion for the '''ludicrous''' drama of the block if they have not been already, and we should all move the fuck along. ♠[[User:PMC|P]][[User_talk:PMC|<span style="color:#FF00FF;">M</span>]][[Special:Contributions/Premeditated Chaos|C]]♠ 08:20, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

===== proposed alternative =====
I can't claim credit for this as I saw someone else suggest it. I believe it was [[User:Lar]] who had said that the main problem is that [[:Category:Rouge admins]] is a sub-category of [[:Category:Wikipedia administrators]]. What if we just remove it from that category? That way it would actually ''be'' a straight joke, with no ''technical'' admin connotation. 

The only question is, would this remedy cause the pertinent admins to regard the category as a pure joke, or would they still throw a fit if it's "misused"? If so, perhaps a slight rename, in conjunction with the above, would do the trick. Point being, I personally don't necessarily have a problem with joke categories, as long as they are actually regarded as such, without exception. So I'd be open to whatever needs to be done towards that end. <small style="font:bold 10px Arial;display:inline;border:#009 1px dashed;padding:1px 6px 2px 7px;white-space:nowrap">[[User:Equazcion|<font color="#000">Equazcion</font>]] [[User talk:equazcion|•''✗'']]/[[Special:Contributions/Equazcion|''C'' •]] ''00:39, 14 Feb 2008 (UTC)''</small>
:If the main problem is that the category is categorized correctly, there doesn't seem to be much of a problem to discuss here. [[User:Kusma|Kusma]] ([[User talk:Kusma|talk]]) 07:03, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
:: The point, of course, was that if this is intended as a joke, then perhaps it shouldn't be in a category that is supposed to imply something serious. And yes it is something to discuss here, since its status as a joke is seems to be pivotal in this discussion. <small style="font:bold 10px Arial;display:inline;border:#009 1px dashed;padding:1px 6px 2px 7px;white-space:nowrap">[[User:Equazcion|<font color="#000">Equazcion</font>]] [[User talk:equazcion|•''✗'']]/[[Special:Contributions/Equazcion|''C'' •]] ''15:38, 14 Feb 2008 (UTC)''</small>

:There is a discussion at [[Category talk:Rouge admins]] proposing removal from the admin-cat-tree. I say discussion, it don't seem to have had much activity. [[User:DuncanHill|DuncanHill]] ([[User talk:DuncanHill|talk]]) 16:14, 14 February 2008 (UTC)

::I don't see the need to break it off from the main admin category. Although it is a joke, ''it is'' only for admins. The fact that one non-admin found it appropriate to add himself to a category that results in his userpage giving the impression that he is an admin, and then ignoring admins that tell him it's inappropriate, is not a good reason for yet another pointless proposal to delete a joke. Not everyone gets every joke, so you can't base it off of "some people don't get it, so it fails." Neg. It's a joke admin category that is ''obviously'' for admin use only. If someone can't grasp that and has to popped in the head with a clue-by-four in the form of a 24-hour block, then that's not something you can fault the category for. '''[[User:LaraLove|<span style="font-family:Georgia;color:#BA55D3">Lara</span>]]'''[[User:LaraLove/My heart|<span style="color:#00CED1">❤</span>]]'''[[User talk:LaraLove|<span style="font-family:Georgia;color:#FF1493">Love</span>]]''' 19:04, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
:::On the other hand, one could legitimately ask why "admin joke categories" seem to be immune from the standards applied to "non-admin joke categories", and whether having different standards in this way is beneficial. I would also point out that until the recent events, there was nothing on the category page that made it obvious it was for admins only. What was obvious was that it was a joke, one in very poor taste, but a joke nonetheless. Nothing whatsoever to suggest that it was a private joke for the élite only. And I ''think'' I am right in saying that "it's funny" or "I like it" are normally not accepted reasons for keeping anything. If the admn-cat-tree is meant to be taken seriously, it should not have joke admin cats in it. If, on the other hand, one is not meant to take the admin-cat-tree seriously, then by all means populate it with jokes. [[User:DuncanHill|DuncanHill]] ([[User talk:DuncanHill|talk]]) 21:33, 14 February 2008 (UTC)

===== Case for the defense? =====
Lets turn this argument around, other than ''I like it'', ''Its funny'' and ''its an Admin thing'' is there a reason for this category to exist? [[User talk:Hypnosadist|<small><sup><font color="#000">(<font color="#c20">Hypnosadist</font>)</font></sup></small>]] 15:54, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
* As I understand it, being a member of the Rouge Admin category used to be something of a badge of honour, and admins did not add themselves to the category.  IF it were returned to that basis, and suitable explanation provided, and IF a similar rationale could exist for non-admin editors to be added to Rouge Non-Admins, then there might be some case that could be made for its retention.  It could be useful to have a category of admins to approach who are more likely to stop, listen, and decide on principle by using [[WP:IAR]] if necessary, rather than going to one of the admins who is addicted to detailed policy wordings.  The equivalent non-admin cat would then be for editors who have brushed aside policy impediments to get the best outcome for the encyclopedia.  Actually, they could even be combined to make a Rouge Wikipedians category.  As an alternative, some sort of Honour Board where any editor could add an admin (plus an equivalent for non-admins, or a joint board) might be less divisive.  It would need to have a rationale for adding someone, so that it had some genuine meaning.  I could even suggest a comparable Lemon Board, but I think that might be a little too divisive! [[User:Jay*Jay|Jay*Jay]] ([[User talk:Jay*Jay|talk]]) 16:55, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
** I have no problem with a joint category but it needs to emphasize that we are in this together. I suspect the rouge editors category will get deleted together with whatever other categories were created in response to this so the creation of a joint category focusing on actual issues and those who have dealt with those issues regardless of their status would be a welcome change of attitude. Heck, some of us might even start to feel appreciated enough to return to main space editing. [[User:EconomicsGuy|EconomicsGuy]] ([[User talk:EconomicsGuy|talk]]) 17:27, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*** Just a slightly unrelated comment: As much as that was a joke, you don't need to wait for admins to appreciate you in order to edit the mainspace (it probably won't happen anyway). Just because they act disruptively doesn't mean your contributions are going unappreciated by everyone else. We don't edit for admins; We edit for Wikipedians. <small style="font:bold 10px Arial;display:inline;border:#009 1px dashed;padding:1px 6px 2px 7px;white-space:nowrap">[[User:Equazcion|<font color="#000">Equazcion</font>]] [[User talk:equazcion|•''✗'']]/[[Special:Contributions/Equazcion|''C'' •]] ''17:35, 14 Feb 2008 (UTC)''</small>
**** Agree about the appreciation (but not about the source of disruption, you've got the wrong end of the stick on that). But I'll go farther. The two people you should be editing for are "yourself" and "the little girl in the Congo on her hand cranked laptop" who needs the knowledge you have to impart. Editing to get accolades from others, be they whoever, may not be effective. Accolades are spotty. Sometimes you get them and sometimes you don't. ++[[User:Lar|Lar]]: [[User_talk:Lar|t]]/[[Special:Contributions/Lar|c]] 20:02, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
***** Yeah Lar, because little girls in Congo totally have laptops. Bye. [[User:EconomicsGuy|EconomicsGuy]] ([[User talk:EconomicsGuy|talk]]) 20:18, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
******Is that a serious comment? I know some people like to assume all of Africa is nothing but jungles filled with lions and hippos, but even the Congo has places like [[Kinshasa]]. And yes, they have laptops. - [[User:AuburnPilot|<font color="#0000cd">auburn</font><font color="#EF6521">pilot</font>]] [[User_talk:AuburnPilot|<small>talk</small>]] 21:44, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
******My comment was metaphorical but the goal of this project is to make the sum of the world's knowledge available to all, including those who would otherwise not have access. As for those little girls getting their laptops, read up on [[OLPC XO]], it's not a 100 USD laptop, yet, but it's closer than anyone ever came before. My point stands... write for the readers, and for your own personal gratification, not for recognition, accolades, whatever, from others. ++[[User:Lar|Lar]]: [[User_talk:Lar|t]]/[[Special:Contributions/Lar|c]] 22:32, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
******* No one said anything about accolades. When EconomicsGuy originally made his "feel appreciated" comment, I really don't think he was stating his wish to be awarded compliments or barnstars. He was referring to a more general feeling, perhaps one he gets when situations like this arise, that people who otherwise work hard on this encyclopedia (ahem) get the bum's rush for stupid little reasons. I agree, to a point, in that it would be nice if appreciation were shown (in, again, an abstract way), at least in a refrain from hindrance, as it often feels like certain people have a mindset that only serves to create obstacles for constructive editors. But again, obstacles will come from all around, no one is purely good, even your supposed allies, and that's something you just have to deal with, on Wikipedia and in life. So remember all the people you're doing this for, whoever they might be, and try to imagine that they appreciate what you're doing. And remember Jimbo, who appreciates you because you make him rich :) <small style="font:bold 10px Arial;display:inline;border:#009 1px dashed;padding:1px 6px 2px 7px;white-space:nowrap">[[User:Equazcion|<font color="#000">Equazcion</font>]] [[User talk:equazcion|•''✗'']]/[[Special:Contributions/Equazcion|''C'' •]] ''00:35, 15 Feb 2008 (UTC)''</small>
********Thank you Equazcion that was exactly what I meant. AuburnPilot I know that but do you think they care that Equazcion added himself to this? I somehow don't think so. Those fortunate enough to have access care about the articles. And yes they do have laptops and Internet access. But they don't care about personal vendettas, hours after hours wasted on stupid debates about silly issues or who is in the "we don't need appreciation but here is our badge of honor" category which you defend with disruptive blocks. No, they care why [[George W. Bush]] needs semi-protection when there are 1400 admins to patrol the place, they care why so many articles lack references when so many people have to care if Equazcion added himself to a category and they care why people who are so much better off than themselves can't get along but needs to pursue personal vendettas to make themselves feel important. Once they have thought about that for long enough they simply walk away. So tell me, how are we helping the little girl in Congo who needs access to accurate information for free? I didn't ask for your barn stars, pats on the back or access to your exclusive club. Don't want it, don't need it. I simply ask that you realize that like it or not we are in this together - because that little girl in Congo simply doesn't care about these ridiculous disputes and personal vendettas. [[User:EconomicsGuy II|EconomicsGuy]] ([[User talk:EconomicsGuy II|talk]]) 06:27, 15 February 2008 (UTC) 

* Or more explicitly, how does this category facilitate encyclopedic collaboration?  If this isn't [[WP:MYSPACE|MySpace]] for religious wikipedians et al., it's not MySpace for Admins either.  [[User:DenisMoskowitz|DenisMoskowitz]] ([[User talk:DenisMoskowitz|talk]]) 19:25, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
:*It's very doubtful that people are making social connections via this category. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 00:39, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
::What is it for then Ned? [[User talk:Hypnosadist|<small><sup><font color="#000">(<font color="#c20">Hypnosadist</font>)</font></sup></small>]] 12:52, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
::*So it's not even as useful as the "myspace"ish categories? [[User:DenisMoskowitz|DenisMoskowitz]] ([[User talk:DenisMoskowitz|talk]]) 16:58, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
:::* and in case it's not clear, '''Delete''' per [[WP:NOT]] and [[WP:NFT]]. <small><span class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:DenisMoskowitz|DenisMoskowitz]] ([[User talk:DenisMoskowitz|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/DenisMoskowitz|contribs]]) </span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned -->

===== Are admins editors? (alternatively, "Arbitrary Break 6") =====
* '''Delete''' - Are admins not editors? If not, then there is a class system. If so, then the category for Rouge Editors would be sufficient for all without all the stupid WikiDrama that surrounds the admin category only being for admins. I see this as pretty simple... Either all Wikipedians are created equal and we only need a "Rouge Editors" category, or there is a class system with the upper-class (snobby?) admins and the peasant non-admin editors (like me, proud peasant). Why have the double-standard of two otherwise identical categories? [[User:VigilancePrime|VigilancePrime]] ([[User talk:VigilancePrime|talk]]) 09:20, 15 February 2008 (UTC) ''''':-)'''''
:*'''Comment:''' I agree with  [[User:VigilancePrime|VigilancePrime]]. Admins are editors just like the rest of us, except with other 'powers' to help keep the wiki in order (or give in maintenance) . They are still editors so we should all be treated the same. A quick read of [[WP:ADMIN]] shows this... 

:* '''Comment:''' Agree too. This is a good statement of the heart of the issue. <small style="font:bold 10px Arial;display:inline;border:#009 1px dashed;padding:1px 6px 2px 7px;white-space:nowrap">[[User:Equazcion|<font color="#000">Equazcion</font>]] [[User talk:equazcion|•''✗'']]/[[Special:Contributions/Equazcion|''C'' •]] ''12:02, 15 Feb 2008 (UTC)''</small>

:*'''Comment''':  I'll third that.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 15:11, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

:* Admins are most certainly editors, but administrative actions are not the same thing as editorial actions. <span style="font-family:Broadway;">[[User:Mr.Z-man|<span style="color:#056366;">Mr.</span>]]''[[User talk:Mr.Z-man|<span style="color:#056625;">'''Z-'''</span><span style="color:#054F66;">man</span>]]''</span> 18:16, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
::*such as being part of a joke category? that an admin action? <small style="font:bold 10px Arial;display:inline;border:#009 1px dashed;padding:1px 6px 2px 7px;white-space:nowrap">[[User:Equazcion|<font color="#000">Equazcion</font>]] [[User talk:equazcion|•''✗'']]/[[Special:Contributions/Equazcion|''C'' •]] ''18:20, 15 Feb 2008 (UTC)''</small>
:::*'''Comment:''' I will emphasise the sentence again! '''From early on, it has been pointed out that administrators should never develop into a special subgroup of the community but should be a part of the community like anyone else.''' Although ''administrative actions are not the same thing as editorial actions'' as you said, it doesn't mean that you should say that you are a subgroup... exactly like [[WP:ADMIN]] says. --[[User:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;">'''The'''</span>]] [[User_talk:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:black;"> '''Helpful'''</span>]] [[Special:Contributions/Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;"> '''One'''</span>]] <sup>[[User:Thehelpfulone/Review|(Review)]]</sup> 20:11, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
::::*Oh, yes, that's why people want to become admins, so they can be part of the special subgroup that can add themselves to admin categories. By that logic, we should not have [[:Category:Wikipedia administrators]]. What I mean is: how can one be a "rouge admin," when they couldn't do any rouge admin actions if they wanted to. Yes its a joke category., but its not funny if it doesn't make any sense. Something is seriously wrong with the train of thought of some of the people commenting here. The category is called "Rouge '''''<big>admins</big>'''''". If you aren't an admin, how is it funny to add yourself to the category? <span style="font-family:Broadway;">[[User:Mr.Z-man|<span style="color:#056366;">Mr.</span>]]''[[User talk:Mr.Z-man|<span style="color:#056625;">'''Z-'''</span><span style="color:#054F66;">man</span>]]''</span> 21:17, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
:::::* You contradict yourself. If it's funny to proclaim you're a "rouge" admin when it's not possible to be one, it should be all the more funny to proclaim you're a "rouge admin" when you're not even an admin. Either way, you're saying that you're something you're not. That's the source of the humor. Besides which, just because you don't get it doesn't mean it isn't funny. <small style="font:bold 10px Arial;display:inline;border:#009 1px dashed;padding:1px 6px 2px 7px;white-space:nowrap">[[User:Equazcion|<font color="#000">Equazcion</font>]] [[User talk:equazcion|•''✗'']]/[[Special:Contributions/Equazcion|''C'' •]] ''21:21, 15 Feb 2008 (UTC)''</small>
::::::*Its perfectly [[WP:IAR|possible]] to be one, you kind of need admin tools to do it though. <span style="font-family:Broadway;">[[User:Mr.Z-man|<span style="color:#056366;">Mr.</span>]]''[[User talk:Mr.Z-man|<span style="color:#056625;">'''Z-'''</span><span style="color:#054F66;">man</span>]]''</span> 21:35, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
:::::::* [[WP:IAR|No you don't]]. <small style="font:bold 10px Arial;display:inline;border:#009 1px dashed;padding:1px 6px 2px 7px;white-space:nowrap">[[User:Equazcion|<font color="#000">Equazcion</font>]] [[User talk:equazcion|•''✗'']]/[[Special:Contributions/Equazcion|''C'' •]] ''06:12, 17 Feb 2008 (UTC)''</small>
::::::::*How do you apply IAR to admin actions without being an admin? <span style="font-family:Broadway;">[[User:Mr.Z-man|<span style="color:#056366;">Mr.</span>]]''[[User talk:Mr.Z-man|<span style="color:#056625;">'''Z-'''</span><span style="color:#054F66;">man</span>]]''</span> 06:38, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
:::::::::*I'm not applying IAR to admin actions. I'm applying IAR to the contention that you must be an admin in order to identify yourself as one --  not that I even agree that this category identifies oneself as an admin, nor that there is even a rule saying you're not allowed to identify as such. But, even if there were such a rule, IAR. <small style="font:bold 10px Arial;display:inline;border:#009 1px dashed;padding:1px 6px 2px 7px;white-space:nowrap">[[User:Equazcion|<font color="#000">Equazcion</font>]] [[User talk:equazcion|•''✗'']]/[[Special:Contributions/Equazcion|''C'' •]] ''06:44, 17 Feb 2008 (UTC)''</small>

:'''In the very early days of Wikipedia, all users functioned as administrators, and in principle they still should. From early on, it has been pointed out that administrators should never develop into a special subgroup of the community but should be a part of the community like anyone else. Generally, the maintenance and administration of Wikipedia can be conducted by anyone, without the specific technical functions granted to administrators. While the tools granted to administrators are technical and do not convey authority per se, administrators are people that are entrusted with, if not used properly, very harmful tools.''' is directly from [[WP:ADMIN]] and then Jimbo's comment:

:{{Quotation|<p>I just wanted to say that becoming a sysop is *not a big deal*.</p><p>I think perhaps I'll go through semi-willy-nilly and make a bunch of people who have been around for awhile sysops. I want to dispel the aura of "authority" around the position. It's merely a technical matter that the powers given to sysops are not given out to everyone.</p><p>I don't like that there's the apparent feeling here that being granted sysop status is a really special thing.</p>|Jimbo Wales|[http://mail.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikien-l/2003-February/001149.html wikimedia.org archive entry], [http://article.gmane.org/gmane.science.linguistics.wikipedia.english/1125/ gmane archive entry]}}

:[[User:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;">'''The'''</span>]] [[User_talk:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:black;"> '''Helpful'''</span>]] [[Special:Contributions/Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;"> '''One'''</span>]] <sup>[[User:Thehelpfulone/Review|(Review)]]</sup> 11:54, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
:*'''"Fifthed"''', or so... User:[[User talk:Dorftrottel|Dorftrottel]] 20:17,&nbsp;[[February 15]],&nbsp;200[[Special:Random|8]]
*'''Delete''' category and immediately '''de-sysop''' all members, per my [[Category_talk:Rouge_admins#Unfunny_joke_at_someone_else.27s_expense.3F|hilarious rant]] on the Category:Rouge admins talk page.--[[User:The Fat Man Who Never Came Back|The Fat Man Who Never Came Back]] ([[User talk:The Fat Man Who Never Came Back|talk]]) 16:02, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

*'''Delete'''.  How manifestly disruptive must a category be before we realize that it's not worth the "humor" value?  Non-admins have their humor categories regularly deleted.  And frankly, this one stopped being funny when it started being used as a license to ignore any and all criticism.  Hubris from admins is too deleterious for me to find amusing at the moment.  To the many good admins in the category, please realize it doesn't take very many bad eggs to ruin the omelet.  I'm sorry that your brunch was ruined. --[[User:JayHenry|JayHenry]] ([[User talk:JayHenry|talk]]) 18:11, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
*If I counted right (this ''is'' mostly about headcount, right?) it's 22 '''k''' vs 6 '''d''' among admins, and 4 '''k''' vs 21 '''d''' among non-admins. Wow. Looks like Kbdank is right after all: ''"This won't be deleted, period. Someone might as well close it now, so it can go to DRV and get endorsed. The admins want their toys, the admins will have their toys."'' Good thing our admins are more mature than the rest of us. User:[[User talk:Dorftrottel|Dorftrottel]] 20:29,&nbsp;[[February 15]],&nbsp;200[[Special:Random|8]]
**I'm glad someone other than me brought this up, as I've been keeping a similar count. Show of hands, who predicted this outcome before voting even began? <small style="font:bold 10px Arial;display:inline;border:#009 1px dashed;padding:1px 6px 2px 7px;white-space:nowrap">[[User:Equazcion|<font color="#000">Equazcion</font>]] [[User talk:equazcion|•''✗'']]/[[Special:Contributions/Equazcion|''C'' •]] ''20:33, 15 Feb 2008 (UTC)''</small>
***Well, if that's the case about the votes, how about we get somebody other than admins and non-admins such as Jimbo himself to get into the discussion? [[User:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;">'''The'''</span>]] [[User_talk:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:black;"> '''Helpful'''</span>]] [[Special:Contributions/Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;"> '''One'''</span>]] <sup>[[User:Thehelpfulone/Review|(Review)]]</sup> 20:44, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
****Jimbo is an admin. User:[[User talk:Dorftrottel|Dorftrottel]] 20:53,&nbsp;[[February 15]],&nbsp;200[[Special:Random|8]]
*****I'm more concerned about the closing. Is it really fair that an admin will be closing this? What other possibilities are there? <small style="font:bold 10px Arial;display:inline;border:#009 1px dashed;padding:1px 6px 2px 7px;white-space:nowrap">[[User:Equazcion|<font color="#000">Equazcion</font>]] [[User talk:equazcion|•''✗'']]/[[Special:Contributions/Equazcion|''C'' •]] ''20:57, 15 Feb 2008 (UTC)''</small>
******Who said anything about fair? User:[[User talk:Dorftrottel|Dorftrottel]] 21:10,&nbsp;[[February 15]],&nbsp;200[[Special:Random|8]]
******Actually if an admin is going to do it I would suggest someone like Newyorkbrad if he wants the job. At least we know that he will see this from both sides. There is no way this is going to be 100% fair anyway - the best we can hope for is a closer with the guts to support a merge of the two categories. [[User:EconomicsGuy II|EconomicsGuy]] ([[User talk:EconomicsGuy II|talk]]) 21:20, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
*******I was actually toying with suggesting [[User:DGG]]. He's consistently been the most neutral person I know of, admin or otherwise. Even the admins have attested to that in the past. <small style="font:bold 10px Arial;display:inline;border:#009 1px dashed;padding:1px 6px 2px 7px;white-space:nowrap">[[User:Equazcion|<font color="#000">Equazcion</font>]] [[User talk:equazcion|•''✗'']]/[[Special:Contributions/Equazcion|''C'' •]] ''21:24, 15 Feb 2008 (UTC)''</small>
********Strong support for DGG as the closer. He has been consistently neutral and fair even when we have disagreed. [[User:EconomicsGuy II|EconomicsGuy]] ([[User talk:EconomicsGuy II|talk]]) 21:28, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
***So admins aren't a special subgroup, and are just a part of the community except when we're counting votes? <span style="font-family:Broadway;">[[User:Mr.Z-man|<span style="color:#056366;">Mr.</span>]]''[[User talk:Mr.Z-man|<span style="color:#056625;">'''Z-'''</span><span style="color:#054F66;">man</span>]]''</span> 21:25, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
****The question is how they consider themselves, not what they are. The voting statistic in this discussion appears to show a clear weight of admins vs. regular folks, so closing by an admin hardly seems fair. <small style="font:bold 10px Arial;display:inline;border:#009 1px dashed;padding:1px 6px 2px 7px;white-space:nowrap">[[User:Equazcion|<font color="#000">Equazcion</font>]] [[User talk:equazcion|•''✗'']]/[[Special:Contributions/Equazcion|''C'' •]] ''21:28, 15 Feb 2008 (UTC)''</small>
****Across the social strata, the opinions are equally divided, which means '''no consensus'''. The fact that some admins are ''voting'', some even without providing any rationale or simply parotting the strawman argument regarding the incident —which was the occasion but not the reason for this discussion— is nevertheless appalling. User:[[User talk:Dorftrottel|Dorftrottel]] 21:39,&nbsp;[[February 15]],&nbsp;200[[Special:Random|8]]
*'''Delete''', per [[User:Newyorkbrad|Newyorkbrad]] in the first [[Wikipedia:Miscellany_for_deletion/Wikipedia:Rouge_admin|MFD]] for [[WP:ROUGE]], "In a perfect world, this would be Keep, but it's just not worth having edit wars and quarrels repeatedly break out over a humor essay."[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Miscellany_for_deletion/Wikipedia:Rouge_admin&diff=prev&oldid=87473000] It's just not worth having more ridiculous [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Administrators%27_noticeboard/Incidents&oldid=191639620#Block_of_User:Equazcion ANI threads] and more ridiculous blocks over a lame joke category. No editor would ever have any need to look up a list of "rouge admins" &mdash; whether you personally find it funny or not. The category serves no actual purpose ''and'' it's disruptive and divisive. If admins want to have a little "fun" and joke about cabals and/or typos, they still have [[WP:ROUGE]] (for now) and that delightful IRC channel. Making [[WP:ROUGE]] appear like a [[clique]] is a Bad Idea™. The part about the "Rouge Admin Cabal" "[blocking] people at random" in [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:No_climbing_the_Reichstag_dressed_as_Spider-Man&oldid=191155823#Review WP:SPIDER] is not so funny in light of that trainwreck ANI thread. And this CFD better not be closed like that MFD was. The joke's over. --[[User:Pixelface|Pixelface]] ([[User talk:Pixelface|talk]]) 22:26, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' "In a perfect world, this would be Deleted, but it's just not worth having deletion quarrels repeatedly break out over a humor essay.--[[User:Doc glasgow|Doc]]<sup>g</sup> 22:54, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
:*This nomination concerns only the category, not the essay. Of course, I can understand your comment in light of the fact that much of the discussion has become about the essay, but still... '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 23:06, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' or '''listify''' to [[WP:ROUGE]]. I think there are a few points on which (almost) everyone can agree:
:#[[:Category:Rouge admins]] and [[Wikipedia:Rouge admins]] are related pages, but they are not inseparable.
:#The continued existence of this category is controversial.
:#This category is claimed to exist for the purpose of humour rather than to facilitate encyclopedic collaboration or administration/maintenance; however, not everyone finds it to be humorous.
:From the standpoint of a cost-benefit analysis, the costs of the continued existence of this category outweigh the benefits. The continued existence of the category is likely to be a source of tension and/or drama; the benefits, however, are nonexistent. The humour of the phrase "rouge admin" is found at [[WP:ROUGE]], '''''not''''' in this category. Deleting the category does not result in deletion of the "joke"; it will only result in the removal of the various bottom-of-the-page notices. (Note that there is ample precedent that categories - whether for user pages or articles - [[Wikipedia:Categorization|should not]] merely be bottom-of-the-page notices.) '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 23:04, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete'''. I have been keeping out of this, because as an admin I have never considered adding myself to the category. I am concerned that joke categories for admins are being preserved while those for non-admins are being deleted. I think we have now reached the point when all joke categories should be deleted. Anyway, it not the category that is the joke, assuming something is funny about all this. The joke is the article [[Wikipedia:Rouge admin]] itself and the template [[:Template:User rouge]] that an admin can put on their user page. Those should stay but the category is not funny in itself and serves no useful purpose. Let us delete it and leave it at that with no drama at deletion review or anywhere else. --[[User:Bduke|Bduke]] ([[User talk:Bduke|talk]]) 23:14, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' and create a ''Rouge Wikipedians'' category - preferebly with entry by nomination by others.  Failing having a RW category, simply '''delete'''.  The stratification associated with the existence of admins should be minimised as much as possible, and the fact that we ended up having a user blocked over this just demonstrates how silly this whole situation has become.  If this were truly still about a joke, that block would never have happened.  As for someone to close this, I would agree that [[user:Newyorkbrad|Newyorkbrad]] would be a good choice, although he may be seen as having a COI having commented in the earlier <s>CfD</s> MfD.  It does need to be someone with the near-unanimous respect and support of the community. [[User:Jay*Jay|Jay*Jay]] ([[User talk:Jay*Jay|talk]]) 11:42, 16 February 2008 (UTC)
**Newyorkbrad commented in the MfD, not the earlier CfDs. --[[User:Pixelface|Pixelface]] ([[User talk:Pixelface|talk]]) 16:55, 16 February 2008 (UTC)
***Thanks for the comment, Pixelface.  CfD stricken in favour of MfD. [[User:Jay*Jay|Jay*Jay]] ([[User talk:Jay*Jay|talk]]) 01:54, 17 February 2008 (UTC)

*'''Delete''' Should have been deleted a while ago.  [[WP:ROUGE]] is next. [[User:Alexfusco5|<b style="color:blue;">Alex</b>]][[User talk:Alexfusco5|<b style="color:red;">fusco</b>]][[Special:Contributions/Alexfusco5|<sup style="color:green;">'''5'''</sup>]] 16:03, 16 February 2008 (UTC)
::See [[Wikipedia:Miscellany_for_deletion/Wikipedia:Rouge_admin_(3rd_nomination)]] [[User:Alexfusco5|<b style="color:blue;">Alex</b>]][[User talk:Alexfusco5|<b style="color:red;">fusco</b>]][[Special:Contributions/Alexfusco5|<sup style="color:green;">'''5'''</sup>]] 16:13, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

=====Any arguments for this category=====
Lets turn this argument around, other than ''I like it'', ''Its funny'' and ''its an Admin'' thing is there a reason for this category to exist?

I asked the above question and got no answers. So i'm trying again because wikipedia is not a democracy so it does not matter how many admins vote keep, you are providing no reasons why this insulting and drama making Cat needs to exists while those of use who want it gone have provided lots of policy reasons. [[User talk:Hypnosadist|<small><sup><font color="#000">(<font color="#c20">Hypnosadist</font>)</font></sup></small>]] 13:35, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

*'''Comment'''. I think it's fair to note that while the main argument boils down to "it's fun", roughly half the people here don't agree to that, which means the point is moot regardless of the other half who enjoy the funniness of it. Also, as [[User:Bduke|Bduke]] pointed out above, the funniness functions primarily via [[Wikipedia:Rouge admin]] and the template. The category is a whole other story and I've yet to see an argument that demonstrates how the (in itself rather questionable, regarding the current 50:50 situation) funniness is linked to the category in particular, and how the essence of it couldn't be retained via the essay and userbox. User:[[User talk:Dorftrottel|Dorftrottel]] 13:37,&nbsp;[[February 16]],&nbsp;200[[Special:Random|8]]

*'''Keep''' Adding my voice. [[User:Spartaz|Spartaz]] <sup>''[[User talk:Spartaz|Humbug!]]''</sup> 17:31, 16 February 2008 (UTC)
**''Voting'', to be precise, which is [[Wikipedia:Deletion_policy#Deletion_discussion|discouraged]]. User:[[User talk:Dorftrottel|Dorftrottel]] 18:10,&nbsp;[[February 16]],&nbsp;200[[Special:Random|8]]
::Spartaz did you read what i posted? This is exactly what i'm complaining about. What policies support your position? [[User talk:Hypnosadist|<small><sup><font color="#000">(<font color="#c20">Hypnosadist</font>)</font></sup></small>]] 18:50, 16 February 2008 (UTC)
:::Of course voting is evil and in an ideal world my vote would be discarded by the closing admin because it adds nothing. The trouble with long xFDs like this one is that all the useful arguments  get used up in the first section and the remaining 40odd contributions are effectively metoos. In a conventional assessment of strength of argument this doesn't matter but long lengthy debates also need the closing admin to gauge the strength of community support for each position. Hence my vote. [[User:Spartaz|Spartaz]] <sup>''[[User talk:Spartaz|Humbug!]]''</sup> 08:25, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
::Then atleast do a Support according to X's arguements. [[User talk:Hypnosadist|<small><sup><font color="#000">(<font color="#c20">Hypnosadist</font>)</font></sup></small>]] 13:49, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
::Second Hypnosadist. You say you it's about ''"gaug[ing] the strength of community support for each position"'', so which particular position(s) do you support? User:[[User talk:Dorftrottel|Dorftrottel]] 15:23,&nbsp;[[February 17]],&nbsp;200[[Special:Random|8]]
:::The keep one of course. [[User:Spartaz|Spartaz]] <sup>''[[User talk:Spartaz|Humbug!]]''</sup> 15:54, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
::::Obviously you have no actual opinions on the arguements so your '''VOTE''' does not count. [[User talk:Hypnosadist|<small><sup><font color="#000">(<font color="#c20">Hypnosadist</font>)</font></sup></small>]] 15:59, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
:::::What's worse: it does... User:[[User talk:Dorftrottel|Dorftrottel]] 16:13,&nbsp;[[February 17]],&nbsp;200[[Special:Random|8]]
::::Seriously though, it's disppointing to see an admin try and turn this into a linguistic game. In the context of my comment, "position" obviously includes the ''reasoning or rationale'' that leads someone to take a ''general stance'' on an issue. So? User:[[User talk:Dorftrottel|Dorftrottel]] 16:19,&nbsp;[[February 17]],&nbsp;200[[Special:Random|8]]
*I agree with [[User:Dorftrottel]]'s comment above, the userbox is fine, but the category is the problem.  Also, with the discussion above regarding the parent category.  If it needs to have a cat, {{cl|Rouge editors}} is better, but do such categories really help the project?  Or even help with the social side help of Wikipedia.It would seem that if you added this category to your page and it is going to be a subcat of {{cl|administrators}} then you shouldn't be in both cats, which would be really weird.  If anyone wants to find the folks (admin or otherwise) who ascribe to this idea/joke he or she can always go to [[Special:Whatlinkshere/Template:User_rouge]] - don't worry, you won't be lost.  --[[User:Doug|Doug.]]<sup>([[User talk:Doug|talk]] <small>•</small> [[Special:Contributions/Doug|contribs]])</sup> 21:38, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

Hypnosadist: You're unlikely to get an answer. I asked the same question three days ago without getting an answer, and I asked two months ago when the user category was last proposed for deletion, and never got an answer then either. The problem is that too many people (especially admins who should know better) appear to be unable to separate the concept of (user) categories from essays and userboxes. The category is not the source of the amusement, but (as the block on Equazcion demonstrated) it is the source of the problem. Deleting it will eliminate the source of the strife, and eliminate the need for the (newly created) [[:Category:Rouge editors]]. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 21:59, 16 February 2008 (UTC)
: I agree but i'll keep asking the question. [[User talk:Hypnosadist|<small><sup><font color="#000">(<font color="#c20">Hypnosadist</font>)</font></sup></small>]] 22:28, 16 February 2008 (UTC)
:Wow, blaming a category rather then the blocking admin for a disputed block is, well, interesting to say the least. [[User:Spartaz|Spartaz]] <sup>''[[User talk:Spartaz|Humbug!]]''</sup> 07:38, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
::If the block had not been supported by several admins on the ground that it is admin-only, your argument might be more persuasive.  Quite a number of admins cited supporting the block for precisely that reason, not for edit-warring. When someone gets blocked, it's not funny. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 12:13, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
Hypnosadist: I'm sorry you didn't see my response as relevant to the question posed.  I was trying to suggest a way in which the category could possibly be modified so it served some (arguably) legitimate purpose.  Implicit in my answer was that, at present, I believe the answer to your question is 'No'. It is divisive in that it is elevating admins 'above' editors which policy does not support.  It is causing disruption (ie that recent block) and drawing attention away from encyclopedia building (per the active discussion here).  Whilst the user box and essay are fine, the category should go.  Hopefully this is a clearer response. [[User:Jay*Jay|Jay*Jay]] ([[User talk:Jay*Jay|talk]]) 02:01, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
:Thanks for a clear answer Jay. [[User talk:Hypnosadist|<small><sup><font color="#000">(<font color="#c20">Hypnosadist</font>)</font></sup></small>]] 13:47, 17 February 2008 (UTC)

I think it's interesting that [[Template:Rouge]], which is touted as an alternative to [[Template:User rouge]], doesn't invoke any categories. --[[User:Doug|Doug.]]<sup>([[User talk:Doug|talk]] <small>•</small> [[Special:Contributions/Doug|contribs]])</sup> 04:16, 17 February 2008 (UTC)

===== Recap =====
<!--<includeonly>{{#ifeq:{{NAMESPACE}}|Wikipedia|{{error:not substituted|recap}} }}</includeonly>
--><div style="float: left; border: 1px solid #690000; margin: 5px; width:95%; padding:10px;">
'' This is a {{#if:4|4|5}}-day recap of the discussion above. Please see '''[[Template:Recap]]''' for important information about this notice, especially if you plan to edit its content. <br />'''This is not the place to make original arguments. ''''' 
{{col-begin}}
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{{#if:Admin-only joke category not in spirit of Wikipedia|'''Summary of Delete rationale'''}}<!--
-->{{#if:Admin-only joke category not in spirit of Wikipedia|<br />&nbsp;&nbsp;1: Admin-only joke category not in spirit of Wikipedia}}<!--
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-->{{#if:Humorous category with no collaborative use/no real benefit|<br />&nbsp;&nbsp;5: Humorous category with no collaborative use/no real benefit}}<!--
-->{{#if:Most humor-only categories are deleted, no reason this is different|<br />&nbsp;&nbsp;6: Most humor-only categories are deleted, no reason this is different}}<!--
-->{{#if:Could be viewed as an effort to suppress criticism, even if intended humorously|<br />&nbsp;&nbsp;7: Could be viewed as an effort to suppress criticism, even if intended humorously}}<!--
-->{{#if:Userbox/[[WP:ROUGE|page]] sufficient for humor purpose|<br />&nbsp;&nbsp;8: Userbox/[[WP:ROUGE|page]] sufficient for humor purpose}}<!--
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{{#if:Meant for humorous purposes only|'''Summary of Keep rationale'''}}<!--
-->{{#if:Meant for humorous purposes only|<br />&nbsp;&nbsp;1: Meant for humorous purposes only}}<!--
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-->{{#if:Disruption by some people doesn't mean anything is wrong with the category|<br />&nbsp;&nbsp;3: Disruption by some people doesn't mean anything is wrong with the category}}<!--
-->{{#if:A [[:Category:Rouge editors|category]] has since been added for regular editors too|<br />&nbsp;&nbsp;4: A [[:Category:Rouge editors|category]] has since been added for regular editors too}}<!--
-->{{#if:Deleting it takes away an element of personality/tradition/culture from Wikipedia|<br />&nbsp;&nbsp;5: Deleting it takes away an element of personality/tradition/culture from Wikipedia}}<!--
-->{{#if:Nothing wrong with a joke restricted to admin use only|<br />&nbsp;&nbsp;6: Nothing wrong with a joke restricted to admin use only}}<!--
-->{{#if:Nothing wrong with it if it's open to use by all users|<br />&nbsp;&nbsp;7: Nothing wrong with it if it's open to use by all users}}<!--
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{{#if:|'''Additional comments:''' {{{comment}}}}}
</div>{{-}}This template was originally posted by: <small style="font:bold 10px Arial;display:inline;border:#009 1px dashed;padding:1px 6px 2px 7px;white-space:nowrap">[[User:Equazcion|<font color="#000">Equazcion</font>]] [[User talk:equazcion|•''✗'']]/[[Special:Contributions/Equazcion|''C'' •]] ''06:40, 17 Feb 2008 (UTC)''</small>
*''discussion moved to talk page'' <small style="font:bold 10px Arial;display:inline;border:#009 1px dashed;padding:1px 6px 2px 7px;white-space:nowrap">[[User:Equazcion|<font color="#000">Equazcion</font>]] [[User talk:equazcion|•''✗'']]/[[Special:Contributions/Equazcion|''C'' •]] ''21:50, 17 Feb 2008 (UTC)''</small>


Putting this here as an attempt at compromise. I do not endorse the content or format of this template. --[[User talk:Tony Sidaway|Tony]] 18:42, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
*<small>''moved from main page''</small>
----
:As a matter of interest how many of those voting to keep are members of this Cat, and is that a CoI. [[User talk:Hypnosadist|<small><sup><font color="#000">(<font color="#c20">Hypnosadist</font>)</font></sup></small>]] 13:14, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
:Is this a vote count, or was the discussion actually read?  Can whoever closes this take into account that while I didn't add a bold delete to my comments, that is indeed what I wanted.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 13:43, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
::Add yourself to the delete list then. [[User talk:Hypnosadist|<small><sup><font color="#000">(<font color="#c20">Hypnosadist</font>)</font></sup></small>]] 13:46, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
:::I have added Kbdank71 and Tony Sidaway, whose comment after arbitrary break 4 clearly supports deletion. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 14:40, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
::::Kbdank71, I apologize for not adding you, I just didn't want to take it upon myself to interpret those remarks, lest I be wrong. Anyone who feels they've been mis-listed or left out can of course do whatever fixing is necessary. <small style="font:bold 10px Arial;display:inline;border:#009 1px dashed;padding:1px 6px 2px 7px;white-space:nowrap">[[User:Equazcion|<font color="#000">Equazcion</font>]] [[User talk:equazcion|•''✗'']]/[[Special:Contributions/Equazcion|''C'' •]] ''14:47, 17 Feb 2008 (UTC)''</small>

The recap was removed by Tony Sidaway. Is anyone in agreement with that? I only added it because I thought it was useful in such a long discussion. If no one else agrees I'm fine with it being removed, but I just wanted to get other opinions. Thanks. <small style="font:bold 10px Arial;display:inline;border:#009 1px dashed;padding:1px 6px 2px 7px;white-space:nowrap">[[User:Equazcion|<font color="#000">Equazcion</font>]] [[User talk:equazcion|•''✗'']]/[[Special:Contributions/Equazcion|''C'' •]] ''15:05, 17 Feb 2008 (UTC)''</small>
:I think it should be restored - it was a useful summary and presently in a balanced way.  I would have questioned the removal on Tony Sidaway's talk page, but that has already been done. [[User:Jay*Jay|Jay*Jay]] ([[User talk:Jay*Jay|talk]]) 15:08, 17 February 2008 (UTC)<br />
:Note also that one of the comments removed by Tony, made by Horologium and seen [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:User_categories_for_discussion&diff=192067799&oldid=192066831 here] has not been restored.  I note that the edit summary says the recap template was "extremely unwikipedian". [[User:Jay*Jay|Jay*Jay]] ([[User talk:Jay*Jay|talk]]) 15:12, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
::If Tony actually cares about discusion not voting then he should berate the umpteen admins who have voted as opposed to discussing this issue. Re-add the template. [[User talk:Hypnosadist|<small><sup><font color="#000">(<font color="#c20">Hypnosadist</font>)</font></sup></small>]] 15:13, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
::I restored that other comment Tony removed, thanks for pointing that out. <small style="font:bold 10px Arial;display:inline;border:#009 1px dashed;padding:1px 6px 2px 7px;white-space:nowrap">[[User:Equazcion|<font color="#000">Equazcion</font>]] [[User talk:equazcion|•''✗'']]/[[Special:Contributions/Equazcion|''C'' •]] ''15:14, 17 Feb 2008 (UTC)''</small>
::I'm re-adding the template below for now, but if anyone else objects please let me know. Let's please discuss it next time rather than simply removing it. Thanks. <small style="font:bold 10px Arial;display:inline;border:#009 1px dashed;padding:1px 6px 2px 7px;white-space:nowrap">[[User:Equazcion|<font color="#000">Equazcion</font>]] [[User talk:equazcion|•''✗'']]/[[Special:Contributions/Equazcion|''C'' •]] ''15:19, 17 Feb 2008 (UTC)''</small>

:::Can you add whether the user is an admin or non admin as well please? --[[User:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;">'''The'''</span>]] [[User_talk:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:black;"> '''Helpful'''</span>]] [[Special:Contributions/Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;"> '''One'''</span>]] <sup>[[User:Thehelpfulone/Review|(Review)]]</sup> 15:20, 17 February 2008 (UTC)

::::That's not really possible currently as the template isn't written for that. Besides I'm not sure if it's entirely appropriate. There's a script I use to help out with that though, try adding this to your monobook.js: <code><nowiki>importScript('User:Ais523 non-admin/adminrights.js');</nowiki></code> And this to your monobook.css: <code><nowiki>.ais523_adminrights_admin {background-color:#D0E3FF !important}</nowiki></code><small style="font:bold 10px Arial;display:inline;border:#009 1px dashed;padding:1px 6px 2px 7px;white-space:nowrap">[[User:Equazcion|<font color="#000">Equazcion</font>]] [[User talk:equazcion|•''✗'']]/[[Special:Contributions/Equazcion|''C'' •]] ''15:27, 17 Feb 2008 (UTC)''</small>

[[User:Tony Sidaway|Tony Sidaway]] has [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:User_categories_for_discussion&diff=192074182&oldid=192073914 remmoved himself] from the list of those in favour of deletion in the recap template below.  The closing admin might thus like to note that his comment from above: ''I've always found this kind of humor uncomfortable, and if this category (to which someone once added me, presumably as a joke) wasn't there, the encyclopedia would not suffer one bit. If you need a deletion reason, I'd say it's "File under juvenilia (community growth)"'' should not be read as supporting the deletion. [[User:Jay*Jay|Jay*Jay]] ([[User talk:Jay*Jay|talk]]) 15:36, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
:I assume Tony only removed himself from the template because he doesn't want people to think he supports use of the template itself, since he has nominated it for deletion -- which isn't really sound thinking, in my opinion. <small style="font:bold 10px Arial;display:inline;border:#009 1px dashed;padding:1px 6px 2px 7px;white-space:nowrap">[[User:Equazcion|<font color="#000">Equazcion</font>]] [[User talk:equazcion|•''✗'']]/[[Special:Contributions/Equazcion|''C'' •]] ''15:40, 17 Feb 2008 (UTC)''</small>

[[User:Tony Sidaway|Tony Sidaway]] has listed this template below for deletion: [[Wikipedia:Templates for deletion/Log/2008 February 17#Template:Recap]]  <small>—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:Hypnosadist|Hypnosadist]] ([[User talk:Hypnosadist|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Hypnosadist|contribs]]) 15:41, 17 February 2008 (UTC)</small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
: I don't support the template, I believe its presence can only mislead those who are participating in the discussion, and I wish you hadn't created it.  I encourage all those whose usernames were included without permission below to remove themselves from the list so as to prevent this malignant and damaging influence on the discussion gaining any currency. --[[User talk:Tony Sidaway|Tony Sidaway]] 15:45, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
::What is a "malignant and damaging influence" is the Rouge Admins Category. [[User talk:Hypnosadist|<small><sup><font color="#000">(<font color="#c20">Hypnosadist</font>)</font></sup></small>]] 15:49, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
::: It is possible to support (as I do) the deletion of both this category and the recap template. They are entirely different things. --[[User talk:Tony Sidaway|Tony Sidaway]] 15:55, 17 February 2008 (UTC)

Tony, the "malignant and damaging influence" that this template is having on the discussion is to make absolutely clear the divisiveness of the category under discussion - with those in favour of its retention being primarily admins, and those in favour of its deletion being primarily non-admins.  This fact may not be palatable, but don't blame the template - blame the other admins who created this issue by acting in a way guaranteed to provoke a response. Also, and as I have noted in the deletion discussion, this template summarises the ''arguments'' advanced by those of differing opinions, making weighing those arguments easier, and making it much easier for someone joining the discussion late to recognise if the policy concern they have has been raised and recognised.  Making community involvement in deletion discussion easier and consesnsus more transparent may be uncomfortable for admins who want to be able to substitute their own opinions for the consensus in closing discussions, but that is hardly a reason to prevent it from happening. [[User:Jay*Jay|Jay*Jay]] ([[User talk:Jay*Jay|talk]]) 16:00, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
: As you've made it clear that the primary purpose of using the template on this occasion is polemical and to promote division between admins and non-admins, I am removing it again. --[[User talk:Tony Sidaway|Tony Sidaway]] 17:58, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
::How about it's meant to ''illustrate'' the apparent existence of that division? User:[[User talk:Dorftrottel|Dorftrottel]] 18:12,&nbsp;[[February 17]],&nbsp;200[[Special:Random|8]]
:::Tony, I said no such thing.  The template is '''not''' promoting division.  It is merely making crystal clear that the division already exists.  You are trying to shoot the messenger, but that won't change the message.  You have also now removed the recap twice '''''and''''' nominated the template for deletion.  Perhaps you might like to read [[WP:3RR]] again, because you are moving awfully close to a blockable dsruption of this CfD. [[User:Jay*Jay|Jay*Jay]] ([[User talk:Jay*Jay|talk]])  <small>—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|comment]] was added at 18:29, 17 February 2008 (UTC)</small><!--Template:Undated--> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
:::: By pointing out a division between editors of different types, one cannot help but promote those divisions as significant.  This is why I say that it's a divisive template (just as the category who deletion we're discussing is evidently divisive to some extent).  Since we can't agree on the appropriateness of the use of this template, might I suggest that it be place on the talk page of this discussion?  It is not productive to threaten an editor with bogus threat of blocking under the "three revert rule". --[[User talk:Tony Sidaway|Tony]] 18:38, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
:::::Tony, as you would be well aware, I have zero ability to institute a block, so saying I made a threat is dubious (at best).  The sequence, to this point, is as follows: you unilaterally removed the recap (plus other editors posts) from this discussion; you were challenged about this on your talk page; Equazcion asked whether there was any support for your removal; Following comments that it should be restored, Equazcion did so; you nominated the template for deletion; there was continued discussion ''during which not a single post was made supporting your removal of the template''; you unilaterally removed it for a second time with a specious rationale based on a misreading of my comment.  If you think your actions sound like consensus building, or that they are supported, then you are mistaken.  You have made clear your objection to the template.  Your [[WP:POINT|pointy]] removal of it for a second time is not constructive.  Remember that [[WP:3RR]] does not give a blanket right to three reverts.  I have acted in good faith in indicating to you that your actions could be seen as a disruption; you have the right to ignore my view if you choose.  As for the argument that pointing out divisions is akin to promoting them as significant, you are again trying to blame the messenger.  The divisions exist irrespective of the recap template.  They have been noted by others above.  Admins and non-admins have (generally) adopted opposite positions on the category under discussion.  I expect that virtually everyone contributing to this thread knows this is the case.  The template did not create the division and it is unlikely to encourage anyone to change sides.  It simply summarises the policy arguments advanced, and lists the people who have advocated one (or more) of the explanations offered.  It really shouldn't be that concerning. [[User:Jay*Jay|Jay*Jay]] ([[User talk:Jay*Jay|talk]]) 19:02, 17 February 2008 (UTC)

:::::The template has been moved to [[Wikipedia_talk:User_categories_for_discussion#Recap_of_listing_for_Category:_Rouge_admins]], done by [[User talk:Tony Sidaway|Tony]] [[User:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;">'''The'''</span>]] [[User_talk:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:black;"> '''Helpful'''</span>]] [[Special:Contributions/Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;"> '''One'''</span>]] <sup>[[User:Thehelpfulone/Review|(Review)]]</sup> 18:49, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
:::::: Yeah anyone should feel free to restore it to the bottom here. Tony says he's done this as a compromise, but a compromise between him and what basically looks like everyone else so far is hardly a compromise that needs to be imposed. I'd do it myself but I already restored it once, and I don't want to be accused of edit warring. <small style="font:bold 10px Arial;display:inline;border:#009 1px dashed;padding:1px 6px 2px 7px;white-space:nowrap">[[User:Equazcion|<font color="#000">Equazcion</font>]] [[User talk:equazcion|•''✗'']]/[[Special:Contributions/Equazcion|''C'' •]] ''18:55, 17 Feb 2008 (UTC)''</small>
:::::::I support the move so that makes 2. Frankly the signal to noise ratio of this discussion is reaching the point where no admin will close it either way. I'd suggest that if you want a result you just leave it be for the moment. [[User:Spartaz|Spartaz]] <sup>''[[User talk:Spartaz|Humbug!]]''</sup> 19:05, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
:: As there now seems to be consensus on the removal of the user tallies from the template, and that has been done, I no longer think it needs to be deleted ''in its present form''.  I would support the moving of ''this'' particularly cluttered and (sadly) acrimonious metadiscussion on [[Template:Recap]] to the talk page, and the now potentially useful template may perhaps be used here. --[[User talk:Tony Sidaway|Tony]] 19:50, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
:::Support moving this discussion to the talk page, and moving the recap back here in its place. <small style="font:bold 10px Arial;display:inline;border:#009 1px dashed;padding:1px 6px 2px 7px;white-space:nowrap">[[User:Equazcion|<font color="#000">Equazcion</font>]] [[User talk:equazcion|•''✗'']]/[[Special:Contributions/Equazcion|''C'' •]] ''19:53, 17 Feb 2008 (UTC)''</small>

----
:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

=== February 11 ===
==== Category:Wikipedian football (soccer) club team fans ====
<div class="boilerplate vfd" style="background:#bff9fc; margin:0 auto; padding:0 10px 0 10px; border:1px solid #AAAAAA;">
:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Merge''' per nom. Per [[Football team]], [[Football club]] (a redirect to football team) is a synonym. So "club team" is redundant. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 20:10, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

:[[:Category:Wikipedian football (soccer) club team fans]] to [[:Category:Wikipedian football (soccer) team fans]]
:'''''Speedy merge:''' Redundant, unnecessary intermediate level of categorisation.'' – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 17:54, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
*<s>'''Um''', there is a closely related discussion [[Wikipedia:User_categories_for_discussion#Category:Wikipedian_football_.28soccer.29_fans|below]]. Is it useful to have two discussion at once? User:[[User talk:Dorftrottel|Dorftrottel]] 18:11,&nbsp;[[February 11]],&nbsp;200[[Special:Random|8]]</s>
:*Nevermind. User:[[User talk:Dorftrottel|Dorftrottel]] 18:14,&nbsp;[[February 11]],&nbsp;200[[Special:Random|8]]
::*You're right ... it probably was a little premature of me to open this discussion while the other was ongoing. After all, if the scope of the Feb. 7 nomination was expanded, this discussion would become moot. However, I really intended this to be a minor speedy fix (as a matter of fact, I'll move it to the speedy section). '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 18:22, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Comment''' - I'll admit to being somewhat confused by the above discussion. If this could be clarified, I'd be happy to close this : ) - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 18:42, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
:*At the time I posted this nomination, there was another nomination (see [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/February 2008#Category:Wikipedian football (soccer) fans|here]]) concerning the deletion of the entire [[:Category:Wikipedian football (soccer) fans|Wikipedian football (soccer) fans]] category tree. This discussion is intended to eliminate the "club team fans" vs. "team fans" distinction within the category tree. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 20:05, 22 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

====Category:Wikipedians in Sault Ste. Marie====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''speedy merge'''. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 01:44, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
:[[:Category:Wikipedians in Sault Ste. Marie]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians in Sault Ste. Marie, Ontario]]
:'''''Speedy merge:''' redundant categories; the main article is located at [[Sault Ste. Marie, Ontario]].'' – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 17:45, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

=== February 10 ===
==== Category:Eurasian Wikipedians ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
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The result of the discussion was  '''Delete''' - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 07:39, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{Lc|Eurasian Wikipedians}}
The concept of race, as applied to humans, is a vague and mostly subjective social construct. According to the article [[Race (classification of human beings)]]:
<blockquote>The term race refers to the concept of dividing people into populations or groups on the basis of various sets of characteristics and beliefs about common ancestry. The most widely used human racial categories are based on visible traits (especially skin color, cranial or facial features and hair texture), and self-identification.<br>
Conceptions of race, as well as specific ways of grouping races, vary by culture and over time...</blockquote>
Thus, the classification "Eurasian" can and does mean different things to different people. For example, someone who is one-sixteenth Japanese and fifteen-sixteenths Slavic may consider him/herself Asian, Eurasian, European, or none of the three. More generally, a grouping of users on the basis of a characteristic as broad and undefined as race [[WP:MYSPACE|does not facilitate encyclopedic collaboration]], because it does not tell use anything about the ability or willingness of an editor in the category to collaborate on certain aspects of the encyclopedia. (Note that we do not actually have - nor do I think we should have - a "Wikipedians by race" classification scheme.)
*'''Delete''' as nominator. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 20:02, 10 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 16:19, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 21:59, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. [[User:Stephan Schulz|Stephan Schulz]] ([[User talk:Stephan Schulz|talk]]) 07:54, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Strong keep'''.  Those who don't care about race don't have to add racial categories to their user pages. If someone wants to identify as Eurasian it is unreasonable and unfair to say they should be prohibited from doing so.  Race is important to some people.  If the category appears to be sincere it is overbearing and racially insensitive to deny people the right to racially idenitfy.  The statement that your race does not matter to your writing and editing is highly POV - some people would disagree.[[User:Wikidemo|Wikidemo]] ([[User talk:Wikidemo|talk]]) 02:11, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
:*I'm not trying to argue that editors should be prohibited from self-identifying as Eurasian. However, they can (and do) do so via userboxes and typed statements; there is no need to create and maintain a list of Eurasian users. Categories should not merely be "bottom-of-the-page" notices. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 19:28, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' I don't see ''anything'' in [[WP:MYSPACE]] that applies to this category (which has been used way too often, and out of context, on uCfD). I would have no problem with "Wikipedians by race", if people choose to make that known. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 01:50, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedia Good Article contributors ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''No consensus''' (12 days later...) - Too many coments/suggestions going in different directions to determine a clear consensus. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 22:12, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

:[[:Category:Wikipedia Good Article contributors]] - Potentially all-inclusive category. And likely to grow larger and larger every day. (And how does one non-subjectively define the criteria for inclusion?) Anyone looking to collaborate with someone knowledgeable about [[Wikipedia:Good articles|Good articles]], need merely drop a note on [[Wikipedia talk:Good articles|that talk page]]. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 10:45, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

*'''Delete''' - as nominator. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 10:45, 10 February 2008 (UTC)
*<s>'''Delete'''.  Including everyone that made an edit to any good article just makes a very unwieldy and useless category.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 15:58, 11 February 2008 (UTC)</s> (see below)
*'''Delete''' per nom. Pretty sure there is a featured article equivelant for this category as well. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 21:59, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep'''. I've found this cat to be useful in helping to promote comradery and co-operation among Wikipedians interested in GAs. [[User:Johnfos|Johnfos]] ([[User talk:Johnfos|talk]]) 04:37, 12 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''', these are users who have specified a distinct area of interest, even if by an odd criteria (odd to some, personally I don't think it's odd). -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 06:11, 12 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep'''.  A useful category.  In the wonderful, but thoroughly unlikely, event that all Wikipedians suddenly became interested in improving content then this category would still be useful as a parent category, subdivided by interests within the Good Article process (reviewers, writers, copy editors, pop culture GAs, or what have you).  User categories around our most important processes ought to be considered valid and have clear collaborative potential. --[[User:JayHenry|JayHenry]] ([[User talk:JayHenry|talk]]) 07:13, 12 February 2008 (UTC)
:*Just a question:  How useful?  If I make a one-word addition to a good article, doesn't that make me a contributor?  Take [[Atom]], for example, a recently listed good article.  In the last 150 edits, there are well over 20 separate contributors.  How many more are there in the entire history?  How many more for all of the good articles out there?  And every day, there would be more contributors as more and more people edit good articles.  How useful is that?  Are you really interested in collaborating with just about everyone?  Can you really tell me this is anything more than editors wanting to toot their own horns?  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 15:38, 12 February 2008 (UTC)
::* How useful?  On a scale of 1 to 17 it has a usefulness rating of 11.4 in my estimation :)  Is your point that users can frivolously and unhelpfully add themselves to user categories?  Certainly true, but nothing unique to this category.  Perhaps separate the category from the userbox if that's a concern.  Say with this user category (true for other big categories as well), if I had a question about Good Articles, I have encountered hundreds of editors and don't know off the top of my head which of them are interested or familiar with the GA process.  Now I can look through the category to find an editor who I am comfortable approaching.  As I said above, the category could (and maybe should) be further sub-categorized by more specific interest.  How about we leave a note at GA talk encouraging them to do this? --[[User:JayHenry|JayHenry]] ([[User talk:JayHenry|t]]) 19:20, 12 February 2008 (UTC) 
*It may be relevant to note the existence of [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Good articles]] and [[:Category:WikiProject Good Articles members]]. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 19:24, 12 February 2008 (UTC)
**See, this I can get behind.  [[:Category:WikiProject Good Articles members]] says collaboration.  That is where I would go to ask a question about good articles.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 19:36, 12 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Merge''' it into [[:Category:WikiProject Good Articles members]], which is fairly duplicative, and more explicitly about collaboration. '''[[User:Krimpet|<span style="color:#ff9900;">krimpet</span>]][[User talk:Krimpet|<span style="color:#ff6699;">✽</span>]]''' 07:03, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
:*I think merging may obscure the scope of the proposed target category. This category is for editors who contribute to good ''articles'', whereas the other category is for users who contribute to the GA ''process'' as reviewers, nominators, writers, or something else. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 21:34, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Merge''' per Krimpet.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 15:13, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Comment''' - It sounds like those supporting keeping are advocating a category titled [[:Wikipedians interested in contributing to Good Articles]] (or something similar) which I would support keeping.  Simply categorizing those who have ever contributed to an article with GA status, however, as this currently does, is not helpful.  A rename might not capture everyone in the category, so a deletion with indpendent creation under a better title would be the best solution IMO. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 15:39, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Comment''' I'll weakly support the merge suggestion, though I hesitate, since "interest", unfortunately doesn't necessarily equal "participant in a WikiProject". I'd rather see this deleted, with a note to those who are not yet in the WIkiProject one that they may include themselves. When faced with the possibility of miscategorising Wikipedians, I tend to prefer to err on the side of caution, and not categorise. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 20:39, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. + this type of recognition encourages an [[Wikipedia:Ownership of articles|Ownership of articles]] attitude, in my opinion. [[User:Mr.grantevans2|Mr.grantevans2]] ([[User talk:Mr.grantevans2|talk]]) 23:00, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
**I must respectfully disagree. It doesn't list something like "Good article contributors to <INSERTARTICLEHERE>." I doubt anyone who's improved an article to GA status is ignorant of WP:OWN. '''''[[User:Bibliomaniac15|<span style="color:black;">bibliomaniac</span>]][[User talk:Bibliomaniac15|<span style="color:red;">1</span>]][[Special:Contributions/Bibliomaniac15|<span style="color:blue;">5</span>]]''''' 23:06, 17 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Neutral, oppose merging'''. I am essentially undecided about this category, but I oppose merging for the reason stated above, in my post dated "21:34, 15 February 2008 (UTC)". – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 00:55, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians by text editor ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''No consensus''' (12 days later...) - It looks like this needs to be split up into separate noms (Emacs in particular) in order for consensus to be found. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 22:10, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

:[[:Category:Wikipedians by text editor]]
:[[:Category:Wikipedians who use gedit]]
:[[:Category:Wikipedians who use Vim]]
:[[:Category:Wikipedians who use Textpad]]
:[[:Category:Wikipedians who use TextMate]]
:[[:Category:Wikipedians who use Nano]]
:[[:Category:Wikipedians who use Kate]]
:[[:Category:Wikipedians who use jEdit]]
:[[:Category:Wikipedians who use Emacs]]
:While each has its own set of "bells and whistles", it shouldn't matter which editor is used, even as [[Help:External editors|External editors]]. A userpage notice should be enough. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 10:22, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

*'''Delete all''' as nominator. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 10:22, 10 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep all''' - See [[editor war]] for some insight on how important people think their editor is.  What's the point in deleting them?  (As a plan B, I'd vote to delete all but the Emacs option - those other editors are mere toys). --[[User:Gronky|Gronky]] ([[User talk:Gronky|talk]]) 19:27, 10 February 2008 (UTC)
:*'''Comment''' [[WP:BATTLE|Wikipedia is not a battleground]]. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 20:40, 10 February 2008 (UTC)
::*'''Comment''' you seem to have missed his point. This has nothing to do with making a battle on Wikipedia, he's just pointing to an article that offers some insight on user preferences. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 03:21, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete all''' as per nom. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 20:40, 10 February 2008 (UTC)
:*I must be missing something.  What criteria is it being deleted under?  (Other than the nom's comment "''it shouldn't matter''")  A quick search of en.wikipedia.org for the string "Wikipedians_who_are" shows that pretty much all such categories of this type are of the "I think it shouldn't matter" variety. --[[User:Gronky|Gronky]] ([[User talk:Gronky|talk]]) 20:59, 10 February 2008 (UTC)
::*The basic criterion under which user categories are judged is: Does a grouping of users on a certain characteristic facilitate coordination and collaboration amongst users for the purpose of improving the encyclopedia? '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 21:31, 10 February 2008 (UTC)
:::*This seems to justify keeping the categories for any editor which has a significant amount of related content in Wikipedia.  For Emacs, there are five detailed articles plus about seven medium length articles on derivatives.  For vi and vim there's probably similar.  So those two should stay.  For the other editors, you ''may'' be right that facilitating communication between their users cannot lead to any significant contribution to Wikipedia. --[[User:Gronky|Gronky]] ([[User talk:Gronky|talk]]) 15:17, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
::::*You have a point. However, since Emacs is the only one of these that qualifies, and the text editor category is not particularly relevant to contribution (unlike most of the other software cats), it might be appropriate to move it to [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in Emacs]], a subcategory of [[:Category:Wikipedians by interest]]. From what little I know of Emacs (MicroEMACS was installed on my Amiga 4000, but I don't think I ever used it), it's freeware, which means it would fit nicely inside [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in free software]]. My point is that we shouldn't have a parent category with only a single child inside, and [[:Category:Wikipedians by text editor]] cannot directly contain any users, because of its name. BTW, EMACS has its own article category, [[:Category:Emacs]], with 41(!) articles in the cat; neither vi nor any of the others have an equivalent, which is why Emacs should be treated differently from its peers. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 16:21, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
:::::*I wasn't aware of the by-interest categories.  Then yes, I agree that the "''Wikipedians who use Emacs''" category should be renamed to "''Wikipedians interested in Emacs''".  How do we signal this new suggestion to the closing admin?  For want of knowing better: '''HEY CLOSING ADMIN''' :-)
:::::*(Emacs is indeed [[free software]], but a merge to "''interested in free software''" would be too broad - free software has 100 million users while emacs probably has less than 100thousand.) --[[User:Gronky|Gronky]] ([[User talk:Gronky|talk]]) 09:42, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
::::::*The EMACS cat can be moved as a subcat of the free software interest cat, not a straight merge into it. I agree that interest in EMACS and interest in free software are not necessarily the same thing, but it ''is'' a subset. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 13:52, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete'''.  I don't see this as anything more than "look at me, I use x".  Especially when a reason to keep is "People think their editor is important".  Well, of course they do, but that doesn't mean you need a category for it.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 16:04, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete all''' per nom. Although there a number of articles related to some text editors, such as Emacs, the fact of merely using a particular text editor does not imply an interest in or ability to contribute to articles related to that editor. That is, just because someone uses a particular text editor does not automatically mean that they want to write ''about'' that editor. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 17:09, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
:*I'm in [[:Category:Wikipedians who use Mozilla Firefox]], but I will probably never edit [[Firefox]]. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 03:27, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep all''' This one is actually appropriate to contributing to the encyclopedia. Seeing who uses what in selecting how one wishes to work around here can be a very valuable thing to do. Given the deficiencies of the internal editor, I might well want to ask others about their experiences. '''[[User:DGG|DGG]]''' ([[User talk:DGG|talk]]) 18:30, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
:*'''Wikipedians with negative experiences with the internal editor'''? Sounds awful close to being a "Support/Oppose" category. ("Deficiency" is, of course, subjective to the preferences of the users in question, I would presume.) In addition, the ''current'' categories don't specify that this is how the editors edit '''''Wikipedia''''', merely that they have a preference for using a certain editor over other editors. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 20:43, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
::*Another comment that bewilders me. It's pretty obvious that the category is talking about contributing to Wikipedia (just as we assume with the browser categories) -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 03:25, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
:*Why?  This isn't about ''what'' you're contributing, but ''how''.  Would you honestly say to someone, "Wow, I sure would like to help you write that article, but you're using Textpad, sorry.  I only collaborate with people who use gedit."  No, you wouldn't.  What people say is ultimately more important than the tool they use to say it.  So I ask, how is this information valuable? --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 15:46, 12 February 2008 (UTC)
::*That.. really doesn't have anything to do with what DGG just said... -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 03:25, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
:::*No?  DGG said knowing who uses what is valuable.  I asked how so.  (Yeah, I know, I also said some other stuff.  If you wish, ignore that and concentrate on the questions I asked)  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 15:19, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete all''' per Black Falcon. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 21:59, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''<code>:0,$d</code>'''. '''[[User:Krimpet|<span style="color:#ff9900;">krimpet</span>]][[User talk:Krimpet|<span style="color:#ff6699;">✽</span>]]''' 04:07, 12 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep all''', same justification as what browsers people use. Sorry if some people don't feel the information is useful, but though people do find it useful, and it doesn't violate anything. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 06:12, 12 February 2008 (UTC)
:*Deletion of the category doesn't remove the "information", useful or otherwise. It can still exist on someone's userpage. This is about the category grouping. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 09:02, 12 February 2008 (UTC)
::*So we should manually go out and check every single userpage in order to collect the same information? To claim that it's ok to delete a category, being used ''as a category'', is ok because people can still individually state what they're doing. All that information isolated is pretty much worthless. The value comes when it's collected together, and in a manageable form. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 03:19, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
:*There's a difference between claiming that something is useful and being able to explain ''why'' or ''how'' it is useful. If one cannot do the latter, then there is generally no basis for the former. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 18:57, 12 February 2008 (UTC)
::*Then allow me to explain. Understanding how people work with Wikipedia, what tools they use, is very valuable information. At any given time someone can use these categories to contact users that use these different methods, to gain information that can be shared with others. I'm not sure how many people use these categories, but the number of users alone might be useful information. Not to mention that people often will make some sort of script or plug-in that works with a specific text editor, and would like to find a way to tell others about it (that is, one that is Wikipedia related). These things happen all the time for the browsers categories, and I see no reason to believe they don't have that potential for text editors. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 03:17, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
:::*I used to be in many "wikipedians who use foo" categories, but it was simply to let people know what I used.  I didn't use them to broadcast how I edit related categories (because I didn't) or to show how helpful I would be if contacted (because I wouldn't have been if I had).  I figured if someone had a question or wanted to collaborate, they'd get in contact with a wikiproject, or some other gathering place for people who actually wanted to help and had the knowledge to do so.  These categories convey neither.  Hell, I'm even in [[:Category:Wikipedia administrators]], but only because I am one, not because of my helping nature.  If you want admin help, go to the admin noticeboard, not to me.  And I will eat my hat if more than 10% of all wikipedians put themselves into a wikipedian category because they want to help.  Most of them just got lumped in because they are using a userbox.  And I will also guarantee that the vast majority of them wouldn't give a damn (or even notice) if the category that was attached to their userbox was removed from the template.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 15:31, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
::::*Well, that's you then. *shrug* -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 05:52, 20 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' per DGG. I'm actually pretty curious what people use when they edit Wikipedia and how their experience is. I find the built-in editor pretty clunky myself. In a way I'm glad these got nominated because I didn't know they existed; now I can investigate this. But of course I hope they don't get deleted, because they certainly are useful. These aren't just more of the "look at me" myspace-type cats. <small style="font:bold 10px Arial;display:inline;border:#009 1px dashed;padding:1px 6px 2px 7px;white-space:nowrap">[[User:Equazcion|<font color="#000">Equazcion</font>]] [[User talk:equazcion|•''✗'']]/[[Special:Contributions/Equazcion|''C'' •]] ''01:10, 14 Feb 2008 (UTC)''</small>
*I use [[UltraEdit]] to edit articles (by cutting and pasting) all the time because it has fairly powerful search/replace as well as macro capabilities. Although it is not a category under discussion I would get use from knowing who else uses UltraEdit so I could share tips/techniques or ask questions. (as I do for people who use Perl, Excel, etc. Rename them as you like, but '''keep''' the categories as they do foster collaboration. Not so much on the articles about the editors, but around the tools and techniques that they can bring to bear on editing articles about completely unrelated things. Unlike what brand of coffee you favour, what editor you use has a direct impact on the likelihood of my deciding to ask you a question about how to accomplish a particular tricky thing. The category is a better way of finding who might be a good person to ask than any other vehicle.  ++[[User:Lar|Lar]]: [[User_talk:Lar|t]]/[[Special:Contributions/Lar|c]] 20:29, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

===February 9===
==== Category:Wikipedians interested in actors ====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''Delete''' - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 03:29, 14 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{Lc|Wikipedians interested in actors}}
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' This is a category for "Wikipedians who favor certain actors and actresses". It is not especially useful as a parent category since there is ample precedent (see [[WP:UCFD/I#Wikipedians by individual|here]]) to delete "Wikipedians who like" categories for individuals, including actors and actresses, for having an overly narrow scope. It is not useful as a regular user category because it is too vague: "''certain'' actors and actresses". In addition, favouring certain actors and actresses is not equivalent to having an encyclopedically-relevant interest in editing articles about them. I'm sure that many people favour [[George Clooney]], [[Hugh Grant]], [[Scarlett Johansson]], and [[Nicole Kidman]], but very few make substantial edit to those articles.
*'''Delete''' as nominator. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 23:31, 9 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per precedent & nom. Doesn't help collaboration. '''[[User:hmwith|<span style="background:#999;color:#fff;padding:0 4px">нмŵוτн</span>]][[User talk:hmwith|<span style="background:#666;padding:0 4px;color:#fff;">τ</span>]]''' 23:38, 9 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as per nom. It sounds like it was created as a parent category, but constant weeding has rendered it obsolete. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 19:28, 10 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom.  "Interested in" doesn't translate to collaboration or even editing.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 16:05, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 21:59, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians who like Numberwang ====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''Delete''' - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 03:30, 14 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{Lc|Wikipedians who like Numberwang}}
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' This category cannot facilitate [[WP:NOT#MYSPACE|encyclopedic collaboration]] since it lacks a head article. The category also has an overly narrow scope, since (even if a head article existed) any potential for collaboration would be limited to just one article.
*'''Delete''' as nominator. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 02:13, 9 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per precedent & nom. Doesn't help collaboration. '''[[User:hmwith|<span style="background:#999;color:#fff;padding:0 4px">нмŵוτн</span>]][[User talk:hmwith|<span style="background:#666;padding:0 4px;color:#fff;">τ</span>]]''' 23:38, 9 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 16:06, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 21:59, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians interested in the Car-free movement ====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''Delete''' - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 03:31, 14 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{Lc|Wikipedians interested in the Car-free movement}}
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' Despite its title, this category is actually populated primarily by transclusions and substitutions of a social-issue identification userbox that does not express an encyclopedically-relevant interest in the subject of the [[car-free movement]]. This category was created following the deletion of [[:Category:Car-free Wikipedians]] (see [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/June 2007#Category:Car-free Wikipedians|discussion]]), and the same userbox that populated the deleted category now populates this one.
*'''Delete''' as nominator, with no prejudice toward proper recreation. Else, remove userbox miscategorisation ([[User:DieWeisseRose/Userboxes/NoCar|here]] and [[Template:User car-free|here]]) and rename to [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in the car-free movement]] (capitalisation). – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 02:07, 9 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' or decouple from userbox as per nom. I don't own a car (or have a license), but that doesn't mean I am interested in the car-free movement. (I'm not.) '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 20:50, 12 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

====Category:Wikipedians of Multiracial ancestry====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''

:''The result of the discussion was:''  '''Merge''' - no consensus to delete. I suggest that there needs to be a broader discussion of the utility of racial self-categorisation. -- [[User:ChrisO|ChrisO]] ([[User talk:ChrisO|talk]]) 00:11, 23 February 2008 (UTC)

:'''Merge''' [[:Category:Wikipedians of Multiracial ancestry]] to [[:Category:Multiracial Wikipedians]]
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' Redundant, single-user category with a capitalisation issue ("multiracial" should be lower-case). – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 01:30, 9 February 2008 (UTC)
:*Switched to 'delete' as first preference. <small>'''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 17:19, 11 February 2008 (UTC)</small>
*'''Merge''' as redundant. '''[[User:hmwith|<span style="background:#999;color:#fff;padding:0 4px">нмŵוτн</span>]][[User talk:hmwith|<span style="background:#666;padding:0 4px;color:#fff;">τ</span>]]''' 23:42, 9 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete both''' - As non-specific. Even if we were to entertain the notion that being of more than one "race" might be useful for collaboration, this isn't specific to which races are included. Just looking at [[Race (classification of human beings)]], I see:
:*''"The term '''race''' refers to the concept of dividing people into [[population]]s or [[Group (sociology)|group]]s on the basis of various sets of characteristics and beliefs about common ancestry. [http://www.physanth.org/positions/race.html AAPA Statement on Biological Aspects of Race] American Association of Physical Anthropologists "Pure races do not exist in the human species today, nor is there any evidence that they have ever existed in the past." The most widely used human racial [[Category (taxonomy)|categories]] are based on visible [[Trait (biological)|trait]]s (especially [[skin color]], [[cranium|cranial]] or [[face|facial features]] and [[hair|hair texture]]), and self-identification."''
: Sooo, which, what and who? Just too vague to be useful. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 09:47, 10 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Merge''' as per nom. While I understand what JC37 is saying, I don't think I can agree with the link, which is part of a larger sociopolitical debate; this category does not, in and of itself, espouse any particular philosophy. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 19:51, 10 February 2008 (UTC)
*:That's part of the problem. There simply is no specific criteria for inclusion. Is this a category of those whose parents had different skin colours? Those whose parents had distinctive facial features? And further, what about the generally accepted races themselves. Is there any collaborative use for someone who may be of American Indian and and Taiwanese ancestry to be grouped with someone of Western European and Latin American ancestry? This category is just a big melting pot of subjective additives. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 06:55, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' both per JC.  I'm not seeing how someone of two or more races would be able to collaborate on any article where a person of only one race would not.  And it is pretty subjective.  How far back can I go to show that I have more than one race in me?  And what percentage must each be to be considered multiracial? --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 16:18, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete both''' per jc37. (Both categories are tagged, so there should be no procedural problems with deletion, assuming there is consensus to do so.) In addition to the lack of defined criteria for inclusion, there is also the issue of usefulness. A grouping of multiracial users doesn't facilitate collaboration, and it seems to me that this category is little more than a "bottom-of-the-page" notice. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 17:19, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete both''' per above. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 21:59, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Merge''' per nom.  A deletion of the main category is procedurally inappropriate because it hasn't been nominated, and in very poor form given that race is an important issue to some people for self-identification, and telling someone of mixed race that race does not or should not exist is highly and aggressively POV.  [[User:Wikidemo|Wikidemo]] ([[User talk:Wikidemo|talk]]) 02:08, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*:This page, just as CFD, is a "Categories for ''discussion''" page. It doesn't matter what the nominator intends. The closure is a result of consensus. And as both have been tagged, there is no reason why the categories can't be merged/deleted/renamed/whatever, depending on what the consensus is determined to be. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 02:49, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*:No one's insisting that race does not or should not exist, nor that editors should not express their racial identification. Rather, the argument is that there is no need to maintain a list of multiracial Wikipedians, as such a grouping [[WP:NOT#MYSPACE|does not facilitate encyclopedic collaboration]]. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 19:31, 14 February 2008 (UTC)

----
:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians of Taiwanese heritage ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
----
The result of the discussion was  '''Merge''' [[:Category:Wikipedians of Taiwanese heritage]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians of Taiwanese ancestry]] - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 07:36, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

:'''Merge''' [[:Category:Wikipedians of Taiwanese heritage]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians of Taiwanese ancestry]]
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' Redundant categories. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 01:25, 9 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Merge''' as redundant. '''[[User:hmwith|<span style="background:#999;color:#fff;padding:0 4px">нмŵוτн</span>]][[User talk:hmwith|<span style="background:#666;padding:0 4px;color:#fff;">τ</span>]]''' 23:42, 9 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Merge''' as per nom. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 19:51, 10 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Merge''' per nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 21:59, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
----
:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Religious pluralist Wikipedians ====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''Delete''' - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 03:33, 14 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{Lc|Religious pluralist Wikipedians}}
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' This category is much too vague to be able to faciliate [[WP:NOT#MYSPACE|encyclopedic collaboration]]. [[Religious pluralism]] can refer to "the worldview that one's religion is not the sole and exclusive source of truth", "the promotion of unity, co-operation, or improved understanding between different religions, or denominations within the same religion", and a condition of "religious tolerance". Thus, users in this category can be characterised by possession of a general philosophical belief, support for a general philosophical goal, support for a general philosophical principle or actual state of being, or any combination thereof.
*'''Delete''' as nominator and per precedent regarding similarly-vague philosophy categories (see [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/October 2007#Category:New Age Wikipedians|1]], [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/October 2007#Category:Panentheist Wikipedians|2]], [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/October 2007#Category:Mystic Wikipedians|3]]). – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 01:10, 9 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 21:59, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians who use Netflix ====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''Delete''' - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 03:34, 14 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{Lc|Wikipedians who use Netflix}}
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' Grouping users by which video rental service they happen to use does not facilitate [[WP:NOT#MYSPACE|encyclopedic collaboration]].
*'''Delete''' as nominator. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 00:50, 9 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete.''' It was actually nominated for deletion while I was writing up my nomination to have it deleted. <span style="font-family: Verdana">[[User:WODUP|'''<font color="#4169E1">W<font color="#191970">ODU</font>P</font>''']]</span> 00:59, 9 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' Doesn't help collaboration. '''[[User:hmwith|<span style="background:#999;color:#fff;padding:0 4px">нмŵוτн</span>]][[User talk:hmwith|<span style="background:#666;padding:0 4px;color:#fff;">τ</span>]]''' 23:47, 9 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as per nom. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 19:45, 10 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 21:59, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
*How is this any different or worse than grouping users by nationality or religion? I'm not trying to invoke WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS, but how is this any less helpful than something like [[:Category:LGBT Wikipedians]], or [[:Category:Muslim Wikipedians]]? I think the Keep arguments at [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion#Category:Wikipedians by religion and related]] could apply here too and am voting '''Keep''. '''<span style="border: 2px Maroon solid;background:#4682B4;font-family: Monotype Corsiva">[[User:TJ Spyke|<span style="color:Maroon;">TJ</span>]] [[User talk:TJ Spyke|<span style="color:Maroon;">Spyke</span>]]</span>''' 09:02, 12 February 2008 (UTC)
:*Does shopping at a particular store give people an above-average ability or desire to contribute encyclopedic content about that store? ... This category is not comparable to the nationality and religion categories since it has a significantly narrower and more trivial scope. Moreover, a number of the "keep" arguments at the religion discussion revolve around the fact that deletion would be controversial; I doubt that anyone would be as emotional about the deletion of this category. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 19:03, 12 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians who are Distributed Proofreaders ====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''Merge''' [[:Category:Wikipedians who are Distributed Proofreaders]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians who contribute to Distributed Proofreaders]] - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 03:38, 14 February 2008 (UTC)

:'''Merge''' [[:Category:Wikipedians who are Distributed Proofreaders]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians who contribute to Distributed Proofreaders]]
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' The categories seem to have the same scope. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 00:43, 9 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Merge''' as redundant. '''[[User:hmwith|<span style="background:#999;color:#fff;padding:0 4px">нмŵוτн</span>]][[User talk:hmwith|<span style="background:#666;padding:0 4px;color:#fff;">τ</span>]]''' 23:48, 9 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Merge''' as per nom. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 19:45, 10 February 2008 (UTC)
'''Merge''' per nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 21:59, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

===February 8===
==== Category:Wikipedians who are interested in Ramayana ====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''Delete''' - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 03:22, 14 February 2008 (UTC)

:[[:Category:Wikipedians who are interested in Ramayana]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in Ramayana]]
:<s>'''''Speedy rename''' to match the convention of [[:Category:Wikipedians by interest]].''</s> – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 02:08, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''', no encyclopedic usefulness. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 22:25, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
*<small>Moved from the "[[#Speedy nominations|Speedy nominations]]" section to encourage discussion. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 06:15, 8 February 2008 (UTC)</small>
*'''Delete'''.  The one user in the category has never even edited [[Ramayana]].  I understand that isn't a requirement, but then what's the point of the category?  This isn't myspace.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 21:09, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Weak delete'''. The sole user does not seem to have actively edited any article in [[:Category:Ramayana]] or [[:Category:Ramayana epic]] (soon to be merged) in the past 6 months or so. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 01:15, 9 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per above. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 21:59, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' -- [[User:Avraham|Avi]] ([[User talk:Avraham|talk]]) 15:57, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians who collect challenge coins ====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''Delete''' - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 03:25, 14 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{lc|Wikipedians who collect challenge coins}}
Obscure "collect" category, precedent to delete at [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/July 2007#Category:Wikipedians who collect Hello Kitties]].  Only one user despite existing for 15 months.  I'm not sure we need any "who collect" categories, but certainly we don't need ones for uncommon things like this, or it would set precedent to keep any other "who collect" category.  Additionally, this is only associated with a single article, making a category pointless. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 04:39, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 04:39, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom: it is a single-user category (despite the fact that it has existed for 15 months) that has a relatively narrow scope. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 06:12, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per above.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 21:09, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Comment''' I am ''positive'' that we have had a discussion about this category in the past, but I cannot find the discussion. I remember it because of a comment I made concerning challenge coins, as I have two of them (I don't collect them, but my last command had two varieties of challenge coins). I believe someone made the suggestion to merge it into coin collecting, which is not the same thing. FWIW, I'm '''neutral''' about the category, as many military personnel (especially those in Europe) have some of these coins; they seem to be especially popular with Air Force units. We have a lot of military types here, which might be a pool from which to draw cat members. With only one person in the cat right now, deletion is certainly reasonable, but I'd like to see it deleted without prejudice to recreation if enough users express interest. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 00:26, 9 February 2008 (UTC)
:*Is [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/October 2007#Category:Wikipedians in Challenge Coin Association|this]] the discussion of which you were thinking? '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 00:30, 9 February 2008 (UTC)
::*Yes, I just found it, but you beat me to the punch. Not quite the same thing, but close. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 00:38, 9 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

===February 7===
==== Category:Wikipedian football (soccer) fans ====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''No consensus''' - Confusion over empty or not, and the late additions suggests to me that this should be relisted, starting over. Feel free to do so at editorial discretion. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 03:34, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{Lc|Wikipedian football (soccer) fans}}<br />
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' I'm seriously tempted not to state the obvious. Anyway: This category and its subcategories do not serve any encyclopedia-related purpose. User:[[User talk:Dorftrottel|Dorftrottel]] 21:39,&nbsp;[[February 7]],&nbsp;20[[Special:Random|08]]
*'''Delete'''.  No users in it, just a parent category for two more parent categories with no users.  What's a user category with no users?  A bad joke, any way you look at it.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 21:12, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''', empty... <font face="Segoe UI">[[User:WBOSITG|<font color="navy"><sub>'''WEBURIEDOURSECRETSINTHEGARDEN'''</sub></font>]] [[User talk:WBOSITG|<font color="#666666"><sup>round of applause</sup></font>]]</font> 19:00, 10 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Comment''' They are quite assuredly not empty. This is an example of a proper use of parent categories. Open up the subcats and you will discover '''many''' categories and users. The parent category should not have any users, only child categories. As to the encyclopedic worth of the topic, I will remain steadfastly neutral. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 19:57, 10 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Comment:''' Since none of the subcats have been tagged, this discussion can realistically have one of only two outcomes: upmerge or keep, since plain deletion would leave the two subcats uncategorised. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 20:29, 10 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Nom comment:''' I've now tagged [[:Category:Wikipedian football (soccer) team fans]] and [[:Category:Wikipedian football (soccer) league fans]]. I suggest deleting all of the sparsely populated subcategories (should I tag  each of those, too?). Most of those soccer-club-specific subcats have anywhere from 1 to 5 users in them. But even more densely populated categories like [[:Category:Wikipedian Manchester United F.C. fans]] or [[:Category:Wikipedian Liverpool F.C. fans]] do not serve any collaborative purpose that couldn't be better fulfilled by [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Football/Participants]] where people can sign up and indicate the club articles they are interested in. Note: I do ''not'' propose merging the fan categories into the wikiproject football participants list! Those users interested in coordinated collaboration regarding specific clubs can sign up at that page at any time. Moreoever, the list could be extended with a league column if that is wished for. User:[[User talk:Dorftrottel|Dorftrottel]] 14:19,&nbsp;[[February 11]],&nbsp;200[[Special:Random|8]]
:*Yes, all of the individual subcategories should be tagged if you want the entire category tree to be deleted, else any deletion would be overturned at [[WP:DRV]] (you can ask a bot operator to do it since there are so many -- [[User:Cydebot|Cydebot]] and [[User:AMbot|AMbot]] do a lot of work with CFD). However, in light of the fact that this discussion has been open for four days and there was some initial confusion regarding its scope, it may be easier to wait until it's closed and start a new nomination then. Another option is to expand the nomination's scope, inform the participants, and relist the discussion to today's date... '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 18:04, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
:**Ok thanks, I'll wait then and eventually open a proper discussion at a later point. User:[[User talk:Dorftrottel|Dorftrottel]] 18:14,&nbsp;[[February 11]],&nbsp;200[[Special:Random|8]]
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians open to constructive criticism ====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''Delete''' - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 03:35, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{lc|Wikipedians open to constructive criticism}}
Lots of past precedent to delete categories that should include all Wikipedians by default, which this category does. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 02:00, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 02:00, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' as creator.  This category has no trout slapping at all in it.  You're obviously annoyed at my anti-trout attitude.[[User:Wjhonson|Wjhonson]] ([[User talk:Wjhonson|talk]]) 05:54, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as someone who holds the view that trouts are [[godless killing machines]] whose sole purpose is to realise the downfall of humanity through a bloody, yet mildly titillating, [[cybernetic revolt]]. ... More seriously, any user who is not open to constructive criticism will within a short period of time: (1) leave the project; (2) be blocked per the [[WP:NPA]] policy; or (3) avoid interaction with other users and, therefore, opportunities for collaboration. While I can appreciate the context in which this category was created, I have to wonder: what's next? ''Category:Wikipedians open to constructive criticism and physical assault with a trout''? ''Category:Wikipedians who are open to constructive criticism and are also occasionally excited at the prospect of being slapped silly with a wet and slightly decomposed fish carcass''? – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 08:01, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as it implies that users who do not include themselves are not open to constructive criticism. Moreover, since [[WP:AGF|we will just assume that everybody is open for constructive criticism]], the category includes all users. User:[[User talk:Dorftrottel|Dorftrottel]] 21:42,&nbsp;[[February 7]],&nbsp;20[[Special:Random|08]]
*'''Keep''', there is no requirement that all editors be open to constructive criticism. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 06:46, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
:*It's essentially impossible to be a non-disruptive member of a collaborative project without a certain degree of openness to constructive criticism... '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 07:38, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''', no usefulness for encyclopedia-building. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 07:33, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
*Hmmm, [[:Category:Wikipedians not open to constructive criticism]].  Red link?  Yep.  Ok, '''delete''' this one too.  I've said it before, and I stand by it:  There is no need to create a category for EVERY SINGLE person, affliction, situation, like, dislike, etc, etc, etc.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 21:23, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per Black Falcon's alternatives to openness to constructive criticism. <span style="font-family: Verdana">[[User:WODUP|'''<font color="#4169E1">W<font color="#191970">ODU</font>P</font>''']]</span> 00:41, 9 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as a fork of a category which <s>should not exist</s> the community feels is useful. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 20:00, 10 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' - the category does not include all Wikipedians by default, and so the provided rationale for deletion is invalid.  Further, I consider it useful in deciding whether or not I would feel comfortable offering someone constructive criticism, and because those who have cited its un-usefulness have not detailed ''how'' it is un-useful, I cannot comment on their opinions.  --[[User talk:Iamunknown|Iamunknown]] 23:24, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
:*While it is (unfortunately) true that this category would not include all Wikipedians by default, the vast majority are or should be -- a collaborative project cannot function if its members are not open to constructive criticism. So, the argument for the "un-usefulness" of the category is that it does not facilitate encyclopedic collaboration; if you're seeking something more concrete, then you're essentially asking for proof of nonexistence. Since we should not assume that something is useful until proven otherwise, I think the more feasible approach is to try to show how and whether it is useful. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 01:21, 12 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikimania 2007 Users ====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''Delete''' - All but one of the users were added to the category by [[Template:User Wikimania|this userbox]]. (And I'll leave a note on that person's talk page.) So no need to listify as one can do a WHATLINKSHERE on the userbox. (Though obviously anyone who wishes to listify "somewhere" - probably the Wikimania wiki would be best- is welcome to.) - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 03:13, 14 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{lc|Wikimania 2007 Users}}
Can't see why categorizing this is useful, especially since it has already come and gone. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 02:00, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 02:00, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. Whatever usefulness this category may or may not have had, it has outlived its purpose. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 08:03, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep or listify''' Want to find someone who went to Wikimania in 07? Well here ya go. Believe it or not, that can be useful information ''after'' the event has happened. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 06:45, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete'''. Useful for what? Not encyclopedia writing, at any rate. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 07:34, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Listify''' and delete.  A category isn't necessary.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 21:24, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Listify''' and delete, as per Kbdank71. A category is superfluous. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 20:02, 10 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' - easier to maintain than a list and serves a purpose finding user who have participated in previous wikimanias to get their input for future events. [[User:Ryan Postlethwaite|'''<span style="color:#000088;">Ry<span style="color:#220066;">an<span style="color:#550044;"> P<span style="color:#770022;">os<span style="color:#aa0000;">tl</span>et</span>hw</span>ai</span>te</span>''']] 13:53, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
:*A more complete list of attendees exists at http://wikimania2007.wikimedia.org/wiki/Attendees. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 19:00, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
::*That's just a list of people who may and may not have been going. A cat here makes the names accessible to en.wiki users who may wish to collaborate a bid locally at first - not everyone is going to go straight to the wikimania wiki at first. [[User:Ryan Postlethwaite|'''<span style="color:#000088;">Ry<span style="color:#220066;">an<span style="color:#550044;"> P<span style="color:#770022;">os<span style="color:#aa0000;">tl</span>et</span>hw</span>ai</span>te</span>''']] 01:53, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' - per Ryan/Ned. Also: Still useful to see at a glance if the user whose page you happen to be looking at attended the event. Not likely that people would look through the list every time they're curious about someone specific. <small style="font:bold 10px Arial;display:inline;border:#009 1px dashed;padding:1px 6px 2px 7px;white-space:nowrap">[[User:Equazcion|<font color="#000">Equazcion</font>]] [[User talk:equazcion|•''✗'']]/[[Special:Contributions/Equazcion|''C'' •]] ''01:02, 14 Feb 2008 (UTC)''</small>
*'''Listify''' on [http://wikimania2007.wikimedia.org http://wikimania2007.wikimedia.org]. The link provided by Black Falcon is a prevision about who will or won't be there, not an information after it happened. <i><b>[[User:Snowolf|<span style="color:darkmagenta;">Snowolf</span>]] <sup><small>[[User talk:Snowolf|<span style="color:darkmagenta;">How can I help?</span>]]</small></sup></b></i> 01:06, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

====Category:Wikipedians from Fox Chapel, PA====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''delete'''. <i><b>[[User:Snowolf|<span style="color:darkmagenta;">Snowolf</span>]] <sup><small>[[User talk:Snowolf|<span style="color:darkmagenta;">How can I help?</span>]]</small></sup></b></i> 01:00, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
:{{lc|Wikipedians from Fox Chapel, PA}}
According to [[Fox Chapel, Pennsylvania]], "The population was 5,436 at the 2000 census".  Only one user in the category despite existing for over 8 months.  Too small of a location for a category, if we allowed categories for locations with this few people, that would set precedent for many thousands of similar categories.  I think for cities below 50,000 people or so (or whatever consensus decides), categories should be deleted for the individual city and replaced with a category for the county (or in cases of other countries, whatever the equivelant is).  In this case, the category would be renamed to [[:Category:Wikipedians from Allegheny County, Pennsylvania]].  In this case, since there is only one user in the category, however, I wouldn't mind deletion either.
*'''Rename or delete''' as nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 02:00, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. The single user in the category already appears in [[:Category:Wikipedians in Pennsylvania]]. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 08:05, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per BF.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 21:26, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as per nom, but would suggest a discussion somewhere about standards for this type of category. 50,000 is way too low a cap, as Florida alone has over 50 cities that qualify. We could end up with dozens of single-editor categories. My suggestion would be to eliminate the concept entirely, and limit it to states or participation in city-specific WikiProjects. YMMV. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 19:26, 10 February 2008 (UTC)
:*While the proliferation of single-user categories makes navigation more difficult and is undesirable, the specificity of "by-city" categories may be useful on occasion. Of course, it's difficult to define a non-arbitrary balance... In terms of a discussion, I think [[:Category:Wikipedians in Ontario]] could be a good [[case study]]. It contains both multi-user categories for large cities like [[London, Ontario|London]] and single-user categories for small cities like [[Russell, Ontario|Russell]]. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 17:40, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

====Category:Wikipedian donors to Wikipedia====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''delete'''. <i><b>[[User:Snowolf|<span style="color:darkmagenta;">Snowolf</span>]] <sup><small>[[User talk:Snowolf|<span style="color:darkmagenta;">How can I help?</span>]]</small></sup></b></i> 01:00, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
:{{lc|Wikipedian donors to Wikipedia}}
Don't see how categorizing this is useful unless the Wikimedia foundation plans on soliciting the people in the category for donations.  Can't think of any encyclopedic reason to seek out donors, nor do I think it would be used since anyone can add themselves to the category, donor or not. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 02:00, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 02:00, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Listify''' if the information absolutely must be kept, otherwise '''delete''' per nom.  I'm sure the Wikimedia foundation has donor lists they can refer to if they want to hit people up for money in the future.  If wikipedians want to tell the world they donated, they don't need a category to do it.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 21:28, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom and Kbdank71. The category is obviously not oriented toward collaboration, and it doesn't seem to be especially useful in terms of supporting Wikipedia administration/fundraising either. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 08:01, 10 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as per above. This is essentially a vanity category. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 19:27, 10 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

=== February 6 ===
==== Category:Wikilibertarians ====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''Delete''' - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 21:32, 11 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{Lc|Wikilibertarians}}
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' This is a category for Wikipedians who "generally have a hands-off philosophy about personal userpage content". I agree with this philosophy, but do not feel that this category (which itself does not qualify as userpage content) can foster [[WP:NOT#MYSPACE|encyclopedic collaboration]]. It seems to have fairly little to do with ''editing philosophy'' as it relates to articles (see [[:Category:Wikipedians by Wikipedia editing philosophy]]) and reflects an opinion about a fairly narrow aspect of Wikipedia. If kept, the category should be renamed to [[:Category:Wikilibertarian Wikipedians]] to match the convention of its parent.
*'''Delete''' as nominator. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 20:32, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' - Firstly, I dispute collaboration is the end-all of the Wikiverse any longer.  And B, this category could assist libertarians to collaborate on political articles.[[User:Wjhonson|Wjhonson]] ([[User talk:Wjhonson|talk]]) 05:56, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
:*Despite its title, this isn't actually a category for ''political'' libertarians. '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 19:29, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
*Obvious '''delete''' since collaboration is the definite end-all of the Wikiverse. User:[[User talk:Dorftrottel|Dorftrottel]] 21:44,&nbsp;[[February 7]],&nbsp;20[[Special:Random|08]]
*'''Delete''', there's no such thing as a user category that can foster encyclopedic collaboration. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 22:27, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete'''.  A category for a philosophy regarding userpage content?  [[WP:MYSPACE]].  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 21:32, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Egocentric Wikipedians ====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''delete'''.  Would have prefered not to close as I participated in this, but considering it was unanimous and considering the lack of admin activity at UCFD I find it necessary to close. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 23:51, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

:[[:Category:Egocentric Wikipedians]] - Rationales should be obvious, but here's the most basic: there's no need for a category grouping of such Wikipedians. Those who wish to identify in this way may do so with a userpage notice (such as adding text, or a userbox). - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 10:56, 6 February 2008 (UTC)

*'''Delete''' - as nom. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 10:56, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom.  Does not foster collaboration.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 15:52, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete'''. I don't think a category should be created for every random humorous statement or joke classification; also, this category is partly a case of "[[WP:UCFD/I#Wikipedians by template use|Wikipedians by template use]]", against which there is long-established and consistent precedent. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 17:40, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per Kbdank. This sure won't help people work together. [[User:Wryspy|Wryspy]] ([[User talk:Wryspy|talk]]) 19:52, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as per nom and Black Falcon. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 20:00, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 02:00, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Mom user templates ====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''speedy delete''' per [[WP:CSD#G4|CSD G4]] (recreation of deleted material), see [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/June 2007#Category:Wikipedians by parenthood]]. Despite a title that suggests that this is a template category, the only content is a userpage. As a template category this would deserve separate consideration but would also be redundant to [[:Category:Family user templates]]. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 02:31, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
:'''Propose renaming''' [[:Category:Mom user templates]] to [[:Category:Wikipedian moms]]
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' Only one page in cat, from a userbox-like link on [[User:Geaugagrrl]]. [[User:Leolaursen|Leo Laursen]]<span style="white-space:nowrap;font-size:50%;line-height:1em;position:relative;bottom:0.5em;"> ( [[User talk:Leolaursen|T]] ¦ [[Special:Contributions/Leolaursen|C]] )</span> 17:41, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as unlikely to expand to more than 1 or 2 templates.  If this is proposed to be renamed to a user category, it should be moved to [[WP:UCFD]]. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 01:01, 4 February 2008 (UTC)
*:moved to UCFD. [[User:Carlossuarez46|Carlossuarez46]] ([[User talk:Carlossuarez46|talk]]) 02:26, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians who listen to FM 103.2 ====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''Delete''' - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 21:35, 11 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{Lc|Wikipedians who listen to FM 103.2}}
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' This category does not foster encyclopedic collaboration, since merely listening to a radio station implies neither an above-average desire nor ability to contribute encyclopedic content about it. In addition, any possible collaborative merit is limited to just one article, so the category's scope is too narrow. Finally, the category contains only one user despite having existed for 17 months.
*'''Delete''' as nominator. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 02:25, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete'''Per nom <span style="color:blue;">'' '''[[User:Compwhizii|<span style="color:blue;">Compwhiz II</span>]]'''<sup>([[User_Talk:Compwhizii|<span style="color:blue;">Talk</span>]])</sup><sub>([[Special:Contributions/Compwhizii|<span style="color:blue;">Contribs</span>]])</sub> ''</span> 14:45, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 15:53, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as per precedent at [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/July 2007#Television Station categories]]. Television stations or radio stations—the transmission medium is irrelevant. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 20:11, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 02:00, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians who are armigerous ====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''Delete''' - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 21:39, 11 February 2008 (UTC)

:[[:Category:Wikipedians who are armigerous]]
:<small>''This nomination also includes [[:Category:Wikipedians who have arms from Canada]], [[:Category:Wikipedians who have arms from Scotland]] and [[:Category:Wikipedians who have arms from the College of Arms]]''</small>
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' These four categories (which, incidentally, include only one user) [[WP:MYSPACE|do not foster encyclopedic collaboration]]. Merely having a [[coat of arms]] does not imply an encyclopedically-relevant interest in [[heraldry]]; in any case, there is [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in heraldry]] for that.
*'''Delete all''' as nominator. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 01:58, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete all'''.  Per [[Armiger]], "''A person can be so entitled ... by virtue of a grant of arms to him or herself.''"  So I can grant myself a coat of arms just...because?  I can't see how this would help collaboration.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 15:58, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as per nom. Appears to be a vanity category, rather than a useful topic for collaboration. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 20:21, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete all''' per nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 02:00, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians who participated in YLA ====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''Delete''' - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 21:51, 11 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{Lc|Wikipedians who participated in YLA}}
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' This category does not offer opportunities for encyclopedic collaboration as the main article was deleted following [[Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Youth Legislative Assembly|this]] AfD discussion.
*'''Delete''' as nom. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 01:37, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per AFD and nom.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 16:12, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as per nom and Kbdank. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 20:22, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 02:00, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians who are Silver Surfer fans ====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''delete'''. <i><b>[[User:Snowolf|<span style="color:darkmagenta;">Snowolf</span>]] <sup><small>[[User talk:Snowolf|<span style="color:darkmagenta;">How can I help?</span>]]</small></sup></b></i> 00:59, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
:{{Lc|Wikipedians who are Silver Surfer fans}}
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' This category is for fans of a single fictional character and the [[User:Zuracech lordum/User boxes/Silver Surfer|userbox that populates it]] does not exactly suggest any interest in collaboration. Since the title could refer to the version of the character in the comics, the film, the video game, or the TV series, a merge into [[:Category:Wikipedians who read Marvel Comics]] may result in miscategorisation. If there is no consensus to delete, then rename to [[:Category:Wikipedians who like the Silver Surfer]].
*'''Delete''' as nom; else rename. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 00:58, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom.  Just because someone is a fan of a particular superhero does not imply they are interested in collaboration on the topics related to that superhero. For those who are, they should create an "interested in" category. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 01:07, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' - Though I'll admit that if this was [[Batman]] or [[Superman]] (with reference to their many related articles), I might have said "keep". - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 01:45, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep and rename''' - Per Jc37, comic bigotry must not prevail!  Also I'd note there are already several members and apparently they are already collaborating.[[User:Wjhonson|Wjhonson]] ([[User talk:Wjhonson|talk]]) 05:58, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
*:"Comic bigotry"? I was referring to the '''''many''''' articles directly related to those two characters. (Superman, even has his own WikiProject/Taskforce/whatever you want to call it.) SO, sorry - Silver Surfer doesn't even come close in quantity of articles. And so, no, no need for a category to group Wikipedians for collaborating on [[Silver Surfer]]. The page's talk page and/or edit history, works just fine for that. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 21:30, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

=== February 5 ===
==== Category:Wikipedians interested in books ====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''depopulate of users'''. <i><b>[[User:Snowolf|<span style="color:darkmagenta;">Snowolf</span>]] <sup><small>[[User talk:Snowolf|<span style="color:darkmagenta;">How can I help?</span>]]</small></sup></b></i> 00:58, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
:[[:Category:Wikipedians interested in books]] - This isn't a nomination to delete the category, but rather to depopulate it for use only as a [[Template:Wikipedia parent category|Wikipedia parent category]]. The cat is populated by several copies (and subst) of "This user is a [[bibliophile]]". Ok, so we use/love books. (Yes, I have the userbox too : ) - But I think this is too general a criteria to be useful as a category. (And is rather close to just being an example of an "identification"-based category.) Incidentally, the subcats are currently split into two category groups: by [[author]]s and by [[book series]]. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 00:39, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Depopulate''' members but not subcats, as nom. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 00:39, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Depopulate''' members per nom's reasoning ("too general a criteria to be useful as a category"). – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 00:45, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Depopulate''' - per nom.  A category for users "interested in books" is far too general to be useful. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 00:51, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Depopulate''' and add note to category page explaining that it is a parent category. That information is missing right now. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 01:48, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''keep''': as a historian of print culture I must emphasize the distinction between people interested in books for content or authorship, and people interested in books ''as physical artefacts''. As the article [[Bibliophile]] says: "a bibliophile loves books, but especially ''for qualities of format''" (my italics). If there are wikipedians categorized as "bibliophiles" simply because they like to read, weed them out of the category. The category as such could be immensely useful. --[[User:Paularblaster|Paularblaster]] ([[User talk:Paularblaster|talk]]) 20:07, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
*:Loving books, even "for qualities of format", '''''still''''' doesn't show how such a grouping is useful for collaboration. This is something that may be useful to note on one's userpage, but there's no need for a ''category'' for it. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 21:30, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians who are fans of The Apprentice ====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''Per Jc37''' (me : ) - Since it was nearly unanimous (save one dissenter who supported "Delete all"), including the nominator, and since we have a backlog, I'm going to go ahead and [[WP:IAR|ignore]] the guideline, and close this. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 03:44, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
::'''Amending closure:''' I removed [[:Category:Wikipedians who are fans of The Apprentice]] from [[User:UBX/The Apprentice]], which says: ''"This user is a fan of ''[[The Apprentice]]''."'' I intended to leave the category removed from this userbox, since it said "fan", and I didn't want to change the userbox text. Well, removing the category from the userbox, left the category empty. And I also removed [[:Category:Wikipedians who are fans of Entourage]] from [[User:UBX/Entourage]], which says: ''"This user says [[Entourage (TV series)|"Lets hug it out, bitches."]]"'', which left a single user in the category. Due to this, I'm deleting both, with no prejudice for creation of the "who like" versions suggested below, if enough interest is shown (but not by re-adding to the two userboxes listed, as neither suggest intention for collaboration). - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 04:33, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
:::Same thing with [[:Category:Wikipedians who are fans of the Redwall Series]] and [[:Category:Wikipedians who are fans of the Richard Sharpe series]], deferring to the above. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 04:53, 14 February 2008 (UTC)

:'''Nominator's rationale:''' Only 5 user categories of "who are fans of" exist. The standard form for templates describing your interests to a book/TV show/band is "who like". [[User:Iceshark7|~Iceshark7]] ([[User talk:Iceshark7|talk]]) 17:25, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

:'''Propose renaming:'''
* [[:Category:Wikipedians who are fans of The Apprentice]] '''→'''  [[:Category:Wikipedians who like The Apprentice]]
* [[:Category:Wikipedians who are fans of the Eraserheads]] '''→''' [[:Category:Wikipedians who like The Eraserheads]]
* [[:Category:Wikipedians who are fans of the Redwall Series]] '''→''' [[:Category:Wikipedians who like Redwall]]
* [[:Category:Wikipedians who are fans of the Richard Sharpe series]] '''→''' [[:Category:Wikipedians who like Richard Sharpe]]
* [[:Category:Wikipedians who are fans of Entourage]] '''→''' [[:Category:Wikipedians who like Entourage]]

*'''Comment:''' Suggest that 2 of the proposed renames be [[:Category:Wikipedians who like the Redwall series]] and [[:Category:Wikipedians who like the Richard Sharpe series]] to keep the distinctions to the series themselves as opposed to elements of said series.  --[[User:BrokenSphere|<span style="color:#2B60DE;">'''Broken'''</span><span style="color:#E8A317;">'''Sphere'''</span>]]<sup>[[User talk:BrokenSphere|Msg me]]</sup> 18:15, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
*In order:
*:'''Rename''' [[:Category:Wikipedians who are fans of The Apprentice]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians who like The Apprentice]]
*:'''Delete''' [[:Category:Wikipedians who are fans of the Eraserheads]] per [[Wikipedia:User_categories_for_discussion/Archive/Topical_index#Wikipedians_by_musician|precedent]]
*:'''Rename''' [[:Category:Wikipedians who are fans of the Redwall Series]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians who read Brian Jacques]]. Else '''Rename''' to [[:Category:Wikipedians who read the Redwall series]].
*:'''Merge''' [[:Category:Wikipedians who are fans of the Richard Sharpe series]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians who read Bernard Cornwell]]. Else, '''Rename''' to [[:Category:Wikipedians who read the Richard Sharpe series]]. (However, if this is determined to include [[Sharpe (TV series)|the television series]], then I prefer '''Rename''' to [[:Category:Wikipedians who like the Richard Sharpe series]]. - "who like" being the broader term - and then it should also be further (re-)categorised.)
*:'''Rename''' [[:Category:Wikipedians who are fans of Entourage]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians who like Entourage]] - Unless it's a competition of skill (such as sports), Television shows are currently "who like". (Though I wouldn't oppose a group nom to "interested in", in this specific case.)
* For books, "who read" is the current convention. In addition, I'm torn between "by series", and "by author", and will likely waver either way depending on consensus. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 00:18, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
:*'''Comment''' - If I ''have'' to choose, I'll weakly lean towards "series" over "author" since that was the apparent intent of the cat creators. And from what I can tell from the edit history, the cat creator named the author of the book series, rather than the popular actor of the TV series, so leaning towards "who read...series" for that one as well. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 01:43, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Per Jc37'''. I'm ambivalent about a mass renaming of "who like" categories to "interested in" (these categories are often populated by userboxes that do not suggest any ''interest'' in collaboration), but I support the current set of changes. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 00:39, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Per Jc37''' without a preference for the two categories he lists multiple solutions for. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 00:51, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Per Jc37''' - I agree. I don't have much knowledge with precedents, so it's best to follow the ways applied in those. [[User:Iceshark7|~Iceshark7]] ([[User talk:Iceshark7|talk]]) 15:49, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete all'''. None of these categories has any encyclopedic usefulness. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 07:31, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

=== February 4 ===
==== Category:Wikipedians with diabetes ====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''Delete'''. <i><b>[[User:Snowolf|<span style="color:darkmagenta;">Snowolf</span>]] <sup><small>[[User talk:Snowolf|<span style="color:darkmagenta;">How can I help?</span>]]</small></sup></b></i> 00:56, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
:[[:Category:Wikipedians with diabetes]] - per [[Wikipedia:User_categories_for_discussion/Archive/Topical_index#Wikipedians_by_medical_condition|precedent]]. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 02:46, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

*'''Delete''' - as nominator. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 02:46, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom, userbox or notice on user page should be sufficient for self-identification.  No encylopedic purpose to specifically seek out other diabetics.   [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 04:18, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom and VegaDark. I was happy to notice that [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in diabetes]] exists. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 18:37, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete'''. The category was added to {{tlu|User:Ginkgo100/Userboxes/User Diabetes}} on 22 January; I removed it and <s>it is likely that</s> the category <s>will be</s> is depopulated as a result. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 01:56, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' Per above <span style="color:blue;">'' '''[[User:Compwhizii|<span style="color:blue;">Compwhiz II</span>]]'''<sup>([[User_Talk:Compwhizii|<span style="color:blue;">Talk</span>]])</sup><sub>([[Special:Contributions/Compwhizii|<span style="color:blue;">Contribs</span>]])</sub> ''</span> 14:46, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per precedent and users above. [[User:Bart133|Bart133]] <sup>[[User talk:Bart133|(t)]] [[Special:Contributions/Bart133|(c)]]</sup> 02:03, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as '''no user population present'''.[[User:Wjhonson|Wjhonson]] ([[User talk:Wjhonson|talk]]) 06:00, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Strong keep''' per my argument at '''[[User:Ned Scott/User categories]]'''. Again, the past precedent was '''very''' weak and did not consider a great many things (such as proven facts about these kinds of categories being useful for collaboration. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 06:40, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Strong delete'''.  An empty category equals no collaboration.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 21:36, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Comment''' Ned Scott reverted my removal of the category from the userbox (which was not originally part of it!), and then AshleyVH changed the included category to [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in diabetes]], which may or may not be an appropriate category for that userbox. (I think the category is appropriate, just not with that userbox, since having diabetes does not necessarily equate to having an interest in it.) My original removal (with the edit summary "test") was just that, a test. I was not sure how many, if any, of the users in the category were there because of the userbox. When it totally depopulated after removal, I noted that in my above !vote. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 23:12, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
:*I have reverted to Ned Scott's version, providing the explanation in the [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User%3AGinkgo100%2FUserboxes%2FUser_Diabetes&diff=190071049&oldid=189926975 edit summary]. I suppose that whether any form of categorisation ultimately remains can be determined through this discussion. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 00:02, 9 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians who support regiving ====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''Delete'''. <i><b>[[User:Snowolf|<span style="color:darkmagenta;">Snowolf</span>]] <sup><small>[[User talk:Snowolf|<span style="color:darkmagenta;">How can I help?</span>]]</small></sup></b></i> 00:53, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
:[[:Category:Wikipedians who support regiving]] - "[[Wikipedia:User_categories_for_discussion/Archive/Topical_index#Wikipedians_who_support.2Foppose|Support/Oppose issue]]" category. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 02:43, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as nominator. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 02:43, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 04:18, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom as a social issue support/oppose category. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 18:33, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians interested in Teeline shorthand ====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''delete [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in Teeline shorthand]], no consensus on [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in shorthand]]'''. <i><b>[[User:Snowolf|<span style="color:darkmagenta;">Snowolf</span>]] <sup><small>[[User talk:Snowolf|<span style="color:darkmagenta;">How can I help?</span>]]</small></sup></b></i> 00:54, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
:[[:Category:Wikipedians interested in Teeline shorthand]] - Single article category. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 02:41, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

*'''Delete''' - as nominator. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 02:41, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 04:18, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' - Why would Teeline not be a suitable collaboration topic for a User Category but Biology would be ([[:Category:Wikipedian biologists]])? --[[User:Ashleyvh|Ashley VH]] ([[User talk:Ashleyvh|talk]]) 10:40, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
*:It's not that it's not a "suitable collaboration topic", it's that a category grouping of Wikipedians isn't needed for a single article. Compare also to the many Biology-related articles. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 00:00, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*::Point taken and I've created [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in shorthand]] as a collaborative categorization which spans several article types.--[[User:Ashleyvh|Ashley VH]] ([[User talk:Ashleyvh|talk]]) 00:14, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*:::I have moved the new category into an appropriate parent cat; it is now located in [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in linguistics]], which includes several other language-related categories. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 00:35, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' both this and [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in shorthand]] for having, like all user categories, no benefit to the encyclopedia. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 07:29, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
:* If you want to also delete [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in shorthand]], can you suggest a category name for "wikipedians interested in collaborating in improving, maintaining and extending Wikipedia articles relating to shorthand" which is why that category was established and is its stated goal on the page? — [[User:Ashleyvh|Ashley VH]] ([[User talk:Ashleyvh|talk]]) 23:21, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians who use Gateways ====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''delete'''.  Would have prefered not to close as I participated in this, but considering it was unanimous and considering the lack of admin activity at UCFD I find it necessary to close. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 23:51, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

:[[:Category:Wikipedians who use Gateways]] - per [[Wikipedia:User_categories_for_discussion/Archive/Topical_index#Wikipedians_by_computer_hardware|precedent]] - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 02:39, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' - as nominator. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 02:39, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 04:18, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. A grouping of users on the basis of which company made the computer they happen to use [[WP:MYSPACE|does not foster encyclopedic collaboration]]. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 18:31, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as per Black Falcon. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 01:57, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per falcon <span style="color:blue;">'' '''[[User:Compwhizii|<span style="color:blue;">Compwhiz II</span>]]'''<sup>([[User_Talk:Compwhizii|<span style="color:blue;">Talk</span>]])</sup><sub>([[Special:Contributions/Compwhizii|<span style="color:blue;">Contribs</span>]])</sub> ''</span> 14:47, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians who use HPs ====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''delete'''.  Would have prefered not to close as I participated in this, but considering it was unanimous and considering the lack of admin activity at UCFD I find it necessary to close. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 23:51, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

:[[:Category:Wikipedians who use HPs]] - per [[Wikipedia:User_categories_for_discussion/Archive/Topical_index#Wikipedians_by_computer_hardware|precedent]]. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 02:38, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' - as nominator. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 02:38, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 04:18, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. A grouping of users on the basis of which company made the computer they happen to use [[WP:MYSPACE|does not foster encyclopedic collaboration]]. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 18:30, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as per Black Falcon. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 01:57, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per above <span style="color:blue;">'' '''[[User:Compwhizii|<span style="color:blue;">Compwhiz II</span>]]'''<sup>([[User_Talk:Compwhizii|<span style="color:blue;">Talk</span>]])</sup><sub>([[Special:Contributions/Compwhizii|<span style="color:blue;">Contribs</span>]])</sub> ''</span> 14:48, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians who like The Fugitive ====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''delete'''.  Would have prefered not to close as I participated in this, but considering it was unanimous and considering the lack of admin activity at UCFD I find it necessary to close. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 23:51, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

:[[:Category:Wikipedians who like The Fugitive]] - single film cat. Per the precedent of the recent January closures. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 02:37, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as nominator. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 02:37, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 04:18, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as per nom. As a side note—How did you find this category, Jc37? It's orphaned, with no links anywhere except to this page. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 02:00, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom (limited scope). Incidentally, I wonder how many people are in the category because they like the text of [[User:C0N6R355/Userboxes/fugitive|the userbox]] rather than the film itself... – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 01:24, 12 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians who like Clear and Present Danger ====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''delete'''.  Would have prefered not to close as I participated in this, but considering it was unanimous and considering the lack of admin activity at UCFD I find it necessary to close. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 23:51, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

:[[:Category:Wikipedians who like Clear and Present Danger]] - single film cat. Per the precedent of the recent January closures. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 02:35, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' - as nominator. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 02:35, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 04:18, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as per nom. Again, how was this category discovered? '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 02:01, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom (limited scope). Incidentally, I wonder how many people are in the category because they like the text of [[User:C0N6R355/Userboxes/cleardanger|the userbox]] rather than the film itself... – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 01:24, 12 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Users who doesn't tolerate harassment ====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''speedy delete''' per [[WP:CSD#G4|CSD G4]] (recreation of material deleted via a deletion discussion); see [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/December 2007#Category:Wikipedians who does not tolerate harassment]]. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 03:45, 4 February 2008 (UTC)
:{{Lc|Users who doesn't tolerate harassment}}<br />
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' Only one user in the category, not useful at all, since Wikipedia as a whole does not tolerate harrasment [[User:RogueNinja|<span style="color:navy;">RogueNinja</span>]]<i>[[User_talk:RogueNinja|<sub style="color:forestgreen;">talk</sub>]]</i> 02:18, 4 February 2008 (UTC)
*Moved from CfD as this is a user category. Agree with non, '''delete'''. If kept it has to be made grammatical of course - [[:Category:Users who do not tolerate harassment]]. --[[User:Bduke|Bduke]] ([[User talk:Bduke|talk]]) 03:36, 4 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Speedy delete''' as soon as someone finds the old UCFD debate on this- 99% sure this is a substantially similar creation to a previously deleted category.  If not, obvious delete anyway as all-inclusive, as this should be presumed. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 03:41, 4 February 2008 (UTC)

*'''Comment''' Ummm...why is this page threatened to be deleted by a non-admistrator?
[[User:Ineversigninsodonotmessageme|Ineversigninsodonotmessageme]] ([[User talk:Ineversigninsodonotmessageme|talk]]) 03:45, 4 February 2008 (UTC)Ineversigninsodonotmessageme
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

=== February 3 ===
==== Category:Wikipedians by hardware ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
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The result of the discussion was  '''[[Wikipedia:Criteria for speedy deletion#C1|C1]] - empty''' - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 21:55, 14 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{Lc|Wikipedians by hardware}}
'''Delete''' - As with [[Wikipedia:User_categories_for_discussion#Category:Wikipedians_who_use_Pentium_D]], [[Wikipedia:User_categories_for_discussion#Category:Wikipedians_who_use_Dells]] and [[Wikipedia:User_categories_for_discussion#Category:Wikipedians_who_use_HD_DVD]], a mother category listing these types of categories isn't going to be much use aswell. [[User:Iceshark7|~Iceshark7]] ([[User talk:Iceshark7|talk]]) 13:58, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' assuming the 3 subcategories will all be deleted, which looks like the case so far. This will be a C1 speedy as empty once that happens anyway. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 18:00, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom and precedent against [[WP:UCFD/I#Wikipedians by ownership|"Wikipedians by ownership"]] and [[WP:UCFD/I#Wikipedians by computer hardware|"Wikipedians by hardware"]] categories. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 19:19, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' (or rename) - Wouldn't the same rationale be true for [[:Category:Wikipedians by software]] as this is not quite the same thing as ''Wikipedians interested in collaborating on articles about'' a software type. Has this already been discussed somewhere? --[[User:Ashleyvh|Ashley VH]] ([[User talk:Ashleyvh|talk]]) 13:44, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
:*Not quite... Some software categories may be useful for collaboration, particularly those that group users by the ability to use software that could be relevant to improving articles (e.g. using a graphics editor to create images of molecules). – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 18:25, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
:*Then shouldn't these categories be of the type ''Wikipedians who contribute with...'' rather than ''Wikipedians who use...'' (e.g. [[:Category:Wikipedians who use Gimp]])? Furthermore if that is acceptable then why not ''Wikipedians who contribute with '''an iPhone'''''? For example it would seem very useful to know which users contribute with a Mac system as the keyboard layout would change how plugins work with a particular wikipedia editor.--[[User:Ashleyvh|Ashley VH]] ([[User talk:Ashleyvh|talk]]) 23:29, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
*I'm not convinced this is a bad thing, and like '''many''' CfDs, the  "precedent" is set by three or four users. I would support keeping this and have discussion about inclusion criteria. I don't think a blanket ban of "by ownership" is good, because there are likely collaborative categories to be found with some types of ownership. I also find myself agreeing with the points Ashley VH brings up. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 06:37, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
:*'''Comment''' - Let's see... At the very least, I might own a [[toothbrush]], a [[Television set]], a [[radio]], a [[computer]], a [calculator]], a pair of [[shoe]]s, a [[shirt]], [[stockings]], [[underwear]], a [[hat]], a [[monitor]], a [[chair]], a [[table]], a [[desk]], an [[iPod]], an [[automobile]], an [[umbrella]], etc. And whie I may think it's interesting to note on my userpage that I own these items, there is no need for a category of all of us who own such items. In addition, ownership does not equal usership. I'll freely admit to owning things that I don't use, or for that matter things which I use which I know little about, or even (more importantly to this discussion) things which I own, use, and may even know something about, but have no interest in '''''collaborating''''' about. That said, please feel free to create [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in computer hardware]] (or some such name), as ''that'' seems to be what you're (Ned Scott) talking about. (Though with no guarantees, of it not being nominated, of course.) - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 21:30, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete (all)''' - per nom, precedent, and my comments above. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 21:30, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' Per nom and precedent. --[[User:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;">'''The'''</span>]] [[User_talk:Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:black;"> '''Helpful'''</span>]] [[Special:Contributions/Thehelpfulone|<span style="color:red;"> '''One'''</span>]] <sup>[[User:Thehelpfulone/Review|(Review)]]</sup> 10:22, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
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:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians by religion and related ====
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:''The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
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The result of the discussion was  '''No consensus.'''

:(Note: This has been open for almost twice the normal length of a CfD discussion (even with a backlog tag at the top of this page), so I'm going to [[WP:IAR|ignore]] the normal guidelines and close it.)

:Whether you "vote count", or whether you look at all the various reasons/rationales of the commenters (this "discussion" was all-over-the-place), no real consensus to be found here, though perhaps future category nominations may hopefully learn from this discussion. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 21:53, 14 February 2008 (UTC) 

:[[:Category:Wikipedians by religion]]
:'''Delete category plus all subcategories except [[:Category:Wikipedians who are interested in Ramayana]] as it is neutral and collaboration-fied.'''
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' While nobody would deny anyone regardless of religious affiliation the opportunity to edit the encyclopedia, it is clear that this category and all of its subcategories can be divisive, is offensive to some segments of the community, and most importantly, grouping users on the basis of interest [[WP:MYSPACE|does not foster encyclopedic collaboration]]. Perhaps the category, after deletion, can be restarted as "Wikipedians interested in religious issues" - with each subcategory adhering to similar naming guidelines. That would clearly be collaborative. This is a good faith attempt to follow precedent in user category organization. Several of these cats are orphaned, some only have 1 user in them, and some were created as a subcat with another subcat below it but both subcats being the same purpose (example:[[:Category:Latter Day Saint Wikipedians]] and [[:Category:Latter-day Saint Wikipedians]]). There's even [[:Category:Universal Life Church Wikipedians]]. Come on now, ULC? The "church" that ordains anyone, for free, over the internet? Therefore, please also use good faith when discussing. Per [[User:Jc37|Jc37]]'s suggestion below. '''-''' <font size="+1" color="red">&#10032;</font><strong style="letter-spacing:1px;font-family:Verdana">[[User:Allstarecho|ALLSTAR]]</strong><font size="+1" color="red">&#10032;</font> <sup><small>[[User_talk:Allstarecho|echo]]</small></sup> 12:08, 3 February 2008 (UTC)

*This looks like a good faith effort to rid Wikipedia of cats that have the potential to divide the community, offend some users, and clearly do not foster collaboration. In any event, I say '''delete'''. [[User:Jeffpw|Jeffpw]] ([[User talk:Jeffpw|talk]]) 12:53, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Note''' - This category has been [[Wikipedia:User_categories_for_discussion/Archive/June_2007#Category:Wikipedians_by_religion|previously nominated for deletion]], and the result of the discussion was Delete. However, the category has been restored via [[WP:DRV]] according to the information found from the previous nomination and from [[Category_talk:Wikipedians by religion]]. [[User:Iceshark7|~Iceshark7]] ([[User talk:Iceshark7|talk]]) 13:20, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
:*Overturned via [[Wikipedia:Deletion review/Log/2007 June 25]]. '''-''' <font size="+1" color="red">&#10032;</font><strong style="letter-spacing:1px;font-family:Verdana">[[User:Allstarecho|ALLSTAR]]</strong><font size="+1" color="red">&#10032;</font> <sup><small>[[User_talk:Allstarecho|echo]]</small></sup> 13:25, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''', users have the right to express their religion, and a category doesn't do any harm. [[WP:NOT|Wikipedia is not paper]]. [[User:GreenJoe|GreenJoe]] 13:28, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
:*As has been established in many of these cat deletion discussions, this sort of category has the potential to create horrible divisions in the community, and is more for social networking than anything else. [[User:Jeffpw|Jeffpw]] ([[User talk:Jeffpw|talk]]) 13:40, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
:*As a post script, <s>if you click the link from the various categories, it does not bring you to this section specifically</s>, that should be changed or I'll have to take this to DRV if deletion is decided. [[User:GreenJoe|GreenJoe]] 13:28, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
::*Thanks for pointing that out. I forgot when tagging multiple cats to include the UCfD link in the cfd-user template. <s>I'm doing them all now.</s> They are all fixed now. '''-''' <font size="+1" color="red">&#10032;</font><strong style="letter-spacing:1px;font-family:Verdana">[[User:Allstarecho|ALLSTAR]]</strong><font size="+1" color="red">&#10032;</font> <sup><small>[[User_talk:Allstarecho|echo]]</small></sup> 13:38, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Comment/delete''' - [[:Category:LGBT Wikipedians]] has been recreated, so the arguments of "Why should religion get to keep their categories while sexuality categories get deleted" doesn't 100% apply unless that category is re-deleted.  As for this category, I'm leaning towards supporting '''deletion'''.  Categories are for grouping users to make finding them easier for collaboration on Wikipedia pages.  For any other self-identification, userboxes or other statements on the userpage should be sufficient.  I think that just because someone belongs to a particular religion does not mean that they should add themselves to a Wikipedia category, which the current system encourages.  The categories, as named, simply state self-identification that can be done on the user page, it gives no implication that the person adding the category to their page would be interested in collaborating on articles related to that religion, which is supposed to be the whole point of user categorization.  Unless guidelines for user categories develop stating that certain non-collaborative user categories are acceptable, I can only go with my gut that these type of categories should be named [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in religion x]] or [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in collaborating on x religion related topics]] (my personal preference). Since those who belong to a religion are not necessarily interested in collaborating on articles related to their religion, a rename could introduce miscategorization, so a deletion of all these and creation of "Interested in" cats seems like the best option. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 17:57, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Strong Keep''' - Let's see, we now have over 2 million articles, during the bigger time of which user categories were present. User categories such as the "Taco Bell eaters", "Users who attended underwater basketweaving 101", etc are utter nonsense and should be kept out of the project. However, user categories of religion are more serious. Users who add themselves to them are showing good faith of their background, and it doesn't mean that they edit without consideration of NPOV. The worst POV pushers I have seen never added themselves to a user cat or even used a userbox on their userpage. They simply ramrod their POV with their edits only. Why this fear of user cats? Will the project come to an end if we don't delete them? Why focus on this non-issue when we have red-links for articles that need to be written? While you are at it, why not go and target the portals and noticeboards for the same reasoning you want to delete user categories. My suggestion, find something else to do and stop disrupting the project with the witch hunts. [[User:Junglecat|<font color="green">JungleCat</font>]]  <small>[[User talk:Junglecat|<font color="blue">Shiny!</font>]]/[[Special:Contributions/Junglecat|<font color="blue">Oohhh!</font>]]</small> 18:12, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
:*Gee, where were you when they deleted all the gay wikipedian categories? '''Delete''', by the way. Somebody deleted my delete vote earlier. [[User:Jeffpw|Jeffpw]] ([[User talk:Jeffpw|talk]]) 18:16, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
::*Whoops, sorry. <sup>[[User:Avruch|<strong style="color:#fff;background:#000;border:1px solid #ccf">Avruch</strong>]][[User talk:Avruch|<strong style="color:#fff;background:#000;border:1px solid #ccf">talk</strong>]]</sup> 18:17, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
:::*I didn't see that CfD. Also, some of the past CfD's were done rather quickly considering the number of users who could have gave their input. [[User:Junglecat|<font color="green">JungleCat</font>]]  <small>[[User talk:Junglecat|<font color="blue">Shiny!</font>]]/[[Special:Contributions/Junglecat|<font color="blue">Oohhh!</font>]]</small> 18:21, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Comment'''. As a way queer wikipedian whose categories have been repeatedly targeted for deletion for (hmmmmmmmmm) various reasons it seems there might be an elegant solution to migrate all user categories to ''user interested in ______'' rather than a self-identifier which, to me would foster more of the collaborative nature of building articles rather than the perceptions of social networking. In any case the same rules should apply to all. If I self identify as worshiping the [[Flying Spaghetti Monster]] (or any other gods), as being a person of [[puce|color]] and into some fetish then my choices should be treated equally as any other wikipedians. [[User:Benjiboi|<u style="text-decoration:none;font:95% cursive;color:#32127A">Benji</u>]][[User_talk:Benjiboi|<u style="text-decoration:none;font:90% cursive;color:#090">boi</u>]] 01:22, 4 February 2008 (UTC)
:*The problem with a straightforward renaming of these categories, as opposed to deletion of these categories and natural creation of "interest" categories, is that these are identification categories and identification does not automatically imply interest. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 02:20, 4 February 2008 (UTC)
::*As long as all categories are treated equally I guess they should either all stay or all go then. [[User:Benjiboi|<u style="text-decoration:none;font:95% cursive;color:#32127A">Benji</u>]][[User_talk:Benjiboi|<u style="text-decoration:none;font:90% cursive;color:#090">boi</u>]] 03:39, 4 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' unless renamed and re-scoped to clearly state collaborative merit. –[[User talk:Pomte|Pomte]] 01:50, 4 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep'''. I would not want to use one of these categories myself, but I think they can be useful for collaboration. Removing them all is also going at annoy a lot of editors without real benefit, although I suspect some people are not even aware that they are in the category as a result of using the userbox. If deleted, all userboxes need editing to remove the reference to a category. --[[User:Bduke|Bduke]] ([[User talk:Bduke|talk]]) 02:55, 4 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep'''. Nominator says these categories "can be" divisive and asserts that they are offensive. If some editor is going to be offended by the fact that another editor adheres to a certain belief system, isn't it better to get that out in the open? Also, didn't we just go through this? Looking back, it was about 7 months ago (seems sooner), but that still seems a bit soon. Has consensus (or policy) changed that much since then, or are we asking the other parent? At the very least, at least the whole group of subcats is up now, rather than cherry-picking as it was last time, so long as it's done to all or none, I think that's fair. I just think it should be none. [[User:Ryanjunk|Ryanjunk]] ([[User talk:Ryanjunk|talk]]) 14:58, 4 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' Come on guys, how often has this been put up for CSD now?  Keep per Ryanjunk's rationale. -- <span style="font-family:Old English Text MT; font-size:15px">[[User:P.B. Pilhet|<font color="#000080">P.B. Pilhet</font>]]</span> 17:35, 4 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Strong delete'''.  Nobody is saying you can't shout your religious beliefs from the highest mountain.  But you don't need categories to do that.  Especially ones that cause more problems than they solve.  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 18:19, 4 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Comment''' Could one of the people who thinks these would be better replaced with "Wikipedians interested in..." categories actually make those categories?  I'd be more inclined to go along with this deletion if its replacement was in place.[[User:DenisMoskowitz|DenisMoskowitz]] ([[User talk:DenisMoskowitz|talk]]) 18:50, 4 February 2008 (UTC)
:*I'd create them (as subcategories of [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in religions]]) were it not for the fact that they'd all be empty and thus subject to speedy deletion per CSD C1. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 18:11, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Comment''' - In a previous removal of CfD tags, it seems that some cats were miscategorised. (Some that were philosophy/belief, were grouped under religion.) I've fixed that. However, I have not removed the current CfD tags. Further, I would not oppose this nom being expanded to include religious-like philosophies (such as the -deist philosophies), as I noted in the closure below (the apparent source of ''this'' nom). If it is not expanded, then those should not be considered to be included in this nom. If it ''is'' done, then the date of this nom should be adjusted to when those are included.  In addition, it could be argued that taoism is or is not a "religion", and so if the philosophy cats aren't included in this nom, then the taoist cat should probably be split into its own nom. (There are a few others that could possibly be split off for similar reasons.) - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 21:49, 4 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' Worth spending a few minutes of my much needed vacation on. This is a broad enough nomination to ensure we don't single out anyone in particular. Consistency ''is'' important and I do believe that these would serve as much purpose as ''Users interested in...'' categories as those that have already been moved to such broader categories. There appears to be a consensus per other UCFD's involving self-identification categories that self-identification is not a sufficient reason for a category and as such I believe these should be deleted as well and the editors using them asked to use the ''Users interested in...'' categories. [[User:EconomicsGuy|EconomicsGuy]] ([[User talk:EconomicsGuy|talk]]) 13:14, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as self-identification categories that [[WP:MYSPACE|do not foster encyclopedic collaboration]] and are little more than bottom-of-the-page notices. A number of users in favour of keeping the categories have argued that users have a right to express their religion and/or that expressions of religion are not inherently divisive. I can agree with both claims, but that still doesn't tell us how or why a <u>grouping of users</u> based on religion is useful. Although users have a right to express their religion, they do not need a user category to do that (in fact, categories should ''not'' just be bottom-of-the-page notices). – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 18:19, 5 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' Knowledge of other people is relevant to encyclopedic collaboration in general, as is a sense of community. I'd never self-identify in any such category here, but I see nothing inappropriate about those who do. There is no evidence that such a category have been used for vote-stacking or tendentious editing. The use is encouraging users, including those  who want to express themselves without interfering with the encyclopedia. '''[[User:DGG|DGG]]''' ([[User talk:DGG|talk]]) 00:42, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' Initially I was tempted to support the deletion, based on [[user:HalfShadow|HalfShadow's argument]] [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Administrators%27_noticeboard&diff=prev&oldid=185691996] that "this is not a singles bar" (for context and response: [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Administrators%27_noticeboard/Archive124#A_brief_note_to_let_you_know_I.27m_signing_off_WP]), but then I reflected - if such a notion is an offensive stereotype for LGBT Wikipedians, maybe some religious groups are unfairly steretyped at times as well.  Dare I mention Muslims in a lot of Western countries, or Jews in Arabic countries, or...
:The argument for these categories is rooted in policy.  It's obvious in [[Wikipedia:Guidelines for user categories]] (I know, not widely used) but also found in [[Wikipedia:Userboxes#User categories]]: "User categories (categories of Wikipedians) are intended for grouping Wikipedians in order to aid in facilitating collaboration on the encyclopedia".  Note that this ''does '''not''' '' say the evidence of its use for collaboration is required, only that it should '''aid in facilitating collaboration'''.  Now, if I were editing an article on religious intolerance in country X, then it is obvious that Wikipedians who adhere to that religion are more likely to know of [[WP:RS|acceptable]] sources of [[WP:N|relevant]] [[WP:V|verified]] material.  Note that this is not an argument for those editors adding [[WP:OR|their own experiences]], merely that those editors are more likely to have relevant knowledge that would assist a collaborative effort to improve an article.  I am aware that this argument has been made [[WP:Deletion review/Log/2008 January 21|before]] in relation to the [[:category:Queer Wikipedians]].  Hopefully this discussion will be evaluated and closed by an admin who won't substitute their own opinion for consensus (as happened previously [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Deletion_review/Log/2008_January_21&diff=prev&oldid=186823916] in similar cases), and will not simply disregard policy-based [[User talk:GRBerry#Category:Queer_Wikipedians|comment]] without evidence or explanation. [[User:Jay*Jay|Jay*Jay]] ([[User talk:Jay*Jay|talk]]) 05:36, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
'''Strong Keep''' and trout slap the lot of you.  Re-run the entire ridiculous position that '''every cat must be collaborative'''.  Why must it? It's one of the most [[WP:POINT|pointy]] things going.  I sure there are better things to be doing than running all these non-collaboration cats over and over and over. Thanks![[User:Wjhonson|Wjhonson]] ([[User talk:Wjhonson|talk]]) 06:06, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
:Trout slap Wjohnson for a strong keep with no reasoning.  I see you've typed a lot of complaining-type words, but none of them say why you want to keep. :)  --[[User:Kbdank71|Kbdank71]] 14:55, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
* '''Keep''' if some Wikipedians feel a social need to bond with similar users via such a ''cat'' let them. If it makes their stay in Wikispace more pleasant, great. Hopefully, they will be more productive Wikipedians - in the meantime the rest of us can ignore them and get on with editing.  --[[User:Sansumaria|<font color="blue">'''''S<small>ansumaria</small>'''''</small></font>]]<sup>[[User talk:Sansumaria|'''<small>t@lk</small>''']]</sup> 12:09, 7 February 2008 (UTC)''
::See [[Wikipedia:What Wikipedia is not#Wikipedia is not a blog, webspace provider, social networking, or memorial site]]. '''-''' <font size="+1" color="red">&#10032;</font><strong style="letter-spacing:1px;font-family:Verdana">[[User:Allstarecho|ALLSTAR]]</strong><font size="+1" color="red">&#10032;</font> <sup><small>[[User_talk:Allstarecho|echo]]</small></sup> 12:20, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' all, including [[:Category:Wikipedians who are interested in Ramayana]]. Delete all user categories, while you're at it. There is not one single user category that has a useful encyclopedic purpose, including the categories associated with the encyclopedically useless Babelboxes. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 22:24, 7 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Sigh''' We've been over this. Users who have, say, an affinity for a particular [[:Category:Users who like Aerosmith|band]] do not necessarily have the knowledge to contribute to articles thereon; on the other hand, those who have an affinity or affiliation with a [[:Category:Christian Wikipedians|religion]] do. '''[[User:Octane|<font color=#FF6600>Oc</font>]][[User_talk:Octane|<font color=#FBCF03>t</font>]][[User:Octane|<font color=#FF6600>ane</font>]]''' <sup><nowiki>[</nowiki>[[User:Octane/improvement|improve me]]<nowiki>]</nowiki></sup> <small> 07.02.08 2348 (UTC)</small>
:*True, but editors don't have to be categorized to contribute to articles. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 07:23, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
::*Actually, I would dispute that. How is a Christian inherently better able to write articles on Christianity than a non-Christian? I can see the argument holding for someone who has an interest in Christianity or who is a cleric or theologian, but one doesn't have to be a Christian to be interested in or knowledgeable about the religion, and claiming to adhere to Christianity is no guarantee of possession of an encyclopedically-relevant interest in or knowledge of the subject. (By the way, I've chosen Christianity just as an example; the same could be said of any religion categories.) – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 19:28, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
:::*No, I suppose you're right. I'd forgotten about the open-ended churches. Off with its head then—or, you know, whatever. '''[[User:Octane|<font color=#FF6600>Oc</font>]][[User_talk:Octane|<font color=#FBCF03>t</font>]][[User:Octane|<font color=#FF6600>ane</font>]]''' <sup><nowiki>[</nowiki>[[User:Octane/improvement|improve me]]<nowiki>]</nowiki></sup> <small> 10.02.08 0718 (UTC)</small>
::::*'Out with its innards'... ;) '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 07:58, 10 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' users who are easily offended by such things should probably take a moment and slap themselves as hard as they can. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 06:30, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete'''.  Religion/lack of religion ''userboxes'' are useful in that they show which editors have which POVs.  Such editors won't necessarily push their POVs when editing, but userboxes caution other editors that a person may not be completely neutral in some matters.  That said, I don't see anything about the ''category'' that does anything more than a userbox would do.—[[User:Ezhiki|Ëzhiki (Igels Hérissonovich Ïzhakoff-Amursky)]]&nbsp;•&nbsp;([[User talk:Ezhiki|yo?]]); 18:32, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' per Jay*Jay.  --[[User:Phyesalis|Phyesalis]] ([[User talk:Phyesalis|talk]]) 00:54, 9 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Strong Keep'''. Agree points alread made. -- [[User:AmeriCan|AmeriCan]] ([[User talk:AmeriCan|talk]]) 20:59, 9 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Stongest Machoest posssible found Keep on Wikipedia''' per......anyone who supported this--[[User:Angel David|Angel David]] ([[User talk:Angel David|talk]]) 02:40, 10 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep'''. ''Selbsverstandlich'' -- [[User:Avraham|Avi]] ([[User talk:Avraham|talk]]) 17:47, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
*I'm against user categories most of the time, and in favour of fostering WikiProject participants lists instead, but this category is one of the exceptions. This is not some fan category. It is reasonable to assume that people who include themselves in this category are either knowledgeable on the issue, or can point one to appropriate places and people to get editorial assistance. The only viable alternative I see would be some reference desk / assistance requests oriented solution (imo [[Wikipedia:Reference desk/Humanities]] is too inclusive). Until then we should '''keep''' this category. ''Selbstverständlich'' btw. User:[[User talk:Dorftrottel|Dorftrottel]] 18:10,&nbsp;[[February 11]],&nbsp;200[[Special:Random|8]]

* '''KEEP''' Although I quite understand the motivation behind this move. The deletion of [[:category:Gay Wikipedians]] ''was a bad decision''. I don't understand why people can't have whatever categories they wish to have to label themselves whatever they care to. I identify in [[:category:Quaker Wikipedians]] and in the short-lived [[:category:Gayass Wikipedians]]. Keep in mind that people don't have to label themselves as anything at all if they wish. Keeping all of you in the gay light... --[[User:Moni3|Moni3]] ([[User talk:Moni3|talk]]) 02:00, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Strong keep'''.  Wikipedia should not be in the business of denying people the right to self-identify and associate based on their religious convictions.  That's just plain oppressive.  If you don't want to add your religion you don't have to.  If religion is important to someone, it suppresses religion to say they may not express it as a category.  [[User:Wikidemo|Wikidemo]] ([[User talk:Wikidemo|talk]]) 02:17, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' - I would not consider these categories divisive, and are merely informative. If an editor are offended by a member of the editing community being a member of one of these categories, it would be censorship to delete the category for that reason. I see no reason to believe that these categories are offensive, and allow users to self-identify. Indeed when editing, if a user's own 'meatspace' opinion is known, then there can be less chance of accusations of underhand POV-pushing. [[User:EJF|EJF]] ([[User talk:EJF|talk]]) 18:48, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' - I was going to stay neutral in this, but after reading the discussion of the Rouge Admins category elsewhere on this page - if we can keep a joke category that only admins can add themselves to, on pain of banning, we can keep Wikipedians by Religion. [[User:DenisMoskowitz|DenisMoskowitz]] ([[User talk:DenisMoskowitz|talk]]) 19:20, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
----
:''The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:American Wikipedians ====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''Speedily closed''' - I was going to comment in the discussion below to note that this had been recently nominated (though somewhat as a [[WP:POINT|pointy]] action), and was hoping that concensus might form this time. However, the category (and sub-cats) were not tagged, and (more to the "point") comments on the user's talk page suggest that this is also such a [[WP:POINT|pointy]] nom. Please remember that [[Wikipedia:What Wikipedia is not#Wikipedia is not a battleground|Wikipedia is not a battle ground]], and taking such action due to mis-ascribed [[Wikipedia:Ownership of articles|ownership]] issues of something that was deleted is probably not good for any of us, and especially not good for Wikipedia. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 10:43, 3 February 2008 (UTC)

:[[:Category:American Wikipedians]]
:'''Delete cat plus all subcategories.'''
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' While nobody would deny Americans the opportunity to edit the encyclopedia, it is clear that this category can be divisive, is offensive to some segments of the community, and most importantly, grouping users on the basis of nationality [[WP:MYSPACE|does not foster encyclopedic collaboration]]. Perhaps the category, after deletion, can be restarted as "Wikipedians interested in editing American articles". That would clearly be collaborative. [[User:Jeffpw|Jeffpw]] ([[User talk:Jeffpw|talk]]) 09:49, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Christian Wikipedians ====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''Speedy close''' - Let's just nip this in the bud before it becomes needlessly disruptive. Per the ''many'' previous nominations of the religion-related Wikipedian categories, this would need to be nominated with all the other Wikipedians by religion categories, and possibly even all the religion-related Wikipedians by philosophy categories as well. If this is the intention, feel free to attempt to create such a group nomination. But this isolated nomination has a [[WP:SNOW|snowball's chance]] of finding consensus. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 10:32, 3 February 2008 (UTC)

:[[:Category:Christian Wikipedians]]
:'''Delete cat plus all subcategories.'''
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' While nobody would deny Christians the opportunity to edit the encyclopedia, it is clear that this category can be divisive, is offensive to some segments of the community, and most importantly, grouping users on the basis of interest [[WP:MYSPACE|does not foster encyclopedic collaboration]]. Perhaps the category, after deletion, can be restarted as "Wikipedians interested in editing Christian articles". That would clearly be collaborative. [[User:Jeffpw|Jeffpw]] ([[User talk:Jeffpw|talk]]) 09:44, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedian mountain bikers ====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''Delete''' - The only member of the category was already in the target category. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 21:06, 11 February 2008 (UTC)

:'''Merge''' [[:Category:Wikipedian mountain bikers]] to [[:Category:Wikipedian cyclists]]
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' Is there a significant difference—in terms of potential to aid collaboration—between a grouping of users who are cyclists and a grouping of users who are mountain bikers? If there is not, then there is no need for the categories to be separate. In addition, the category currently includes only one user (its creator - who has been inactive since May 2007), despite having existed for 13 months (see [[Special:Undelete/Category:Wikipedian_Mountain_bikers|original page log]]).
*'''Merge''' (perhaps without prejudice to recreation) as nom. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 07:55, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
:'''Delete.'''  A grouping of users on the basis of interest [[WP:MYSPACE|does not foster encyclopedic collaboration]]. Precedent was firmly established at the time of the purge of all gay wikipedian categories. [[User:Jeffpw|Jeffpw]] ([[User talk:Jeffpw|talk]]) 09:34, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Merge''' per nom or delete per above. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 18:00, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Comment:''' Yes, there is a massive difference. Mountain bikers bike for fun, with specialized bikes, ussually off-road and without much concern for traffic. Cyclists is a much larger category including utility cyclists and commuters, racers, and cyclotourists. I would not expect a mountain biker to care about panniers or traffic laws, or a general cyclists to be up-to-date on the latest Rock Shox products. --[[User:Stephan Schulz|Stephan Schulz]] ([[User talk:Stephan Schulz|talk]]) 18:45, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians who use Pentium D ====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''delete'''. [[User:The Placebo Effect|The Placebo Effect]] ([[User talk:The Placebo Effect|talk]]) 20:47, 12 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{Lc|Wikipedians who use Pentium D}}
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' A grouping of users on the basis of which computer processor they happen to use [[WP:MYSPACE|does not foster encyclopedic collaboration]].
*'''Delete''' as nom and per precedent (see [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/June 2007#Category:Wikipedians Who Have Amd Sempron|here]] and [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/August 2007#Category:Wikipedians who use computers with AMD processors|here]]). – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 00:39, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom, along with everything else in [[:Category:Wikipedians by hardware]]. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 01:13, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/Topical index#Wikipedians by computer hardware|precedent]]. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 11:01, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' how many of these are there? <span style="color:blue;">'' '''[[User:Compwhizii|<span style="color:blue;">Compwhiz II</span>]]'''<sup>([[User_Talk:Compwhizii|<span style="color:blue;">Talk</span>]])</sup><sub>([[Special:Contributions/Compwhizii|<span style="color:blue;">Contribs</span>]])</sub> ''</span> 14:49, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as per nom and precedent. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 20:07, 10 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians who use Dells ====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was '''Delete''' [[User:The Placebo Effect|The Placebo Effect]] ([[User talk:The Placebo Effect|talk]]) 20:47, 12 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{Lc|Wikipedians who use Dells}}
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' A grouping of users on the basis of which company manufactured the computer they happen to use [[WP:MYSPACE|does not foster encyclopedic collaboration]].
*'''Delete''' as nom. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 00:32, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' Not useful at all. <i><b>[[User:Snowolf|<span style="color:darkmagenta;">Snowolf</span>]] <sup><small>[[User talk:Snowolf|<span style="color:darkmagenta;">How can I help?</span>]]</small></sup></b></i> 00:33, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as per nom. No utility to the category. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 00:37, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom, along with everything else in [[:Category:Wikipedians by hardware]]. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 01:13, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per ''much'' [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/Topical index#Wikipedians by ownership|precedent]]. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 11:01, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' ''sigh'' <span style="color:blue;">'' '''[[User:Compwhizii|<span style="color:blue;">Compwhiz II</span>]]'''<sup>([[User_Talk:Compwhizii|<span style="color:blue;">Talk</span>]])</sup><sub>([[Special:Contributions/Compwhizii|<span style="color:blue;">Contribs</span>]])</sub> ''</span> 14:50, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

=== February 2 ===
==== Category:Wikipedians who use HD DVD ====
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:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''delete'''.  Would have prefered not to close as I participated in this, but considering it was unanimous and considering the lack of admin activity at UCFD I find it necessary to close. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 23:51, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{Lc|Wikipedians who use HD DVD}}
:'''Nominator's rationale:''' Despite the name, this is actually a support/oppose category – populated solely by transclusions of [[User:TJ Spyke/Userboxes/HD DVD|a userbox]] – for users who "prefer [[HD DVD]] over [[Blu-ray Disc]]". There is overwhelming precedent to delete such categories (see [[WP:UCFD/I#Wikipedians who support/oppose|here]]) as they [[WP:MYSPACE|do not foster encyclopedic collaboration]] and violate the spirit of [[WP:NOT#Wikipedia is not a battleground]], especially when they are about issues that are unrelated to Wikipedia. Even if the support/oppose element is taken away (rendering the category empty), a category of users who use HD DVD still does not foster encyclopedic collaboration. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 23:28, 2 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete'''. The category does not support collaboration, and it might be a ruse disguising a Gay Wikipedians category. [[User:Jeffpw|Jeffpw]] ([[User talk:Jeffpw|talk]]) 23:31, 2 February 2008 (UTC)
::lmao! '''-''' <font size="+1" color="red">&#10032;</font><strong style="letter-spacing:1px;font-family:Verdana">[[User:Allstarecho|ALLSTAR]]</strong><font size="+1" color="red">&#10032;</font> <sup><small>[[User_talk:Allstarecho|echo]]</small></sup> 01:24, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' oppose categories are inherently divisive, and there is (at best) limited utility to the category even if it was rewritten to eliminate the oppositional attitude. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 00:39, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 01:13, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' duh. '''-''' <font size="+1" color="red">✰</font><strong style="letter-spacing:1px;font-family:Verdana">[[User:Allstarecho|ALLSTAR]]</strong><font size="+1" color="red">✰</font> <sup><small>[[User_talk:Allstarecho|echo]]</small></sup> 01:24, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' - "Support/Oppose" category. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 11:01, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per above <span style="color:blue;">'' '''[[User:Compwhizii|<span style="color:blue;">Compwhiz II</span>]]'''<sup>([[User_Talk:Compwhizii|<span style="color:blue;">Talk</span>]])</sup><sub>([[Special:Contributions/Compwhizii|<span style="color:blue;">Contribs</span>]])</sub> ''</span> 14:51, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
*It seems like the only rationale the nominator is providing it that it's against Blu-ray Disc (won't go into that). So if I changed the wording to just say "This user supports HD DVD" or "This user uses HD DVD", then the nominator would have no ground to stand out and it would be kept. '''<span style="border: 2px Maroon solid;background:#4682B4;font-family: Monotype Corsiva">[[User:TJ Spyke|<span style="color:Maroon;">TJ</span>]] [[User talk:TJ Spyke|<span style="color:Maroon;">Spyke</span>]]</span>''' 09:34, 12 February 2008 (UTC)
:*Actually no. See [[Wikipedia:User_categories_for_discussion/Archive/Topical_index#Wikipedians_by_ownership|these previous discussions]] concerning Wikipedians by ownersip. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 09:43, 12 February 2008 (UTC)
::*But the only reason given by the nominator is because it supposedly advocates a battle. Not that different from an AFD in this regard. '''<span style="border: 2px Maroon solid;background:#4682B4;font-family: Monotype Corsiva">[[User:TJ Spyke|<span style="color:Maroon;">TJ</span>]] [[User talk:TJ Spyke|<span style="color:Maroon;">Spyke</span>]]</span>''' 10:27, 12 February 2008 (UTC)
:::*See my comment above; it was specifically crafted in response to this particular possibility. Additionally, every single user is this category is there because of your userbox, which doesn't match the category name (preferring one format over the other does not necessarily equate to actually ''using'' that format). In any case, this is really a CSD G4, as the same category was deleted as a result of [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/June 2007#Category:Wikipedians who support HD DVD]], which is essentially the same thing, with only a slight variation in name. That category was attached to the '''same''' user box; the discussion there is relevant to this discussion, as nothing has changed.  '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 13:40, 12 February 2008 (UTC)
::::*I should clarify that the main reason given by me (the nominator) is that it does not facilitate encyclopedic collaboration in any form (as a support/oppose category or as an ownership category). As for changing the meaning of the userbox, I don't think that's necessarily good practice: the people who currently use the userbox do so because they "prefer HD DVD over Blu-ray Disc", not just because they "use HD DVD". (In fact, someone can prefer HD DVD over Blu-ray Disc without currently using HD DVD. For instance, I prefer the [[Audi A8]] over the vehicle I currently own, but...) – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 19:15, 12 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

==== Category:Wikipedians by alma mater: Lower Merion High School ====
<div class="boilerplate vfd" style="background:#bff9fc; margin:0 auto; padding:0 10px 0 10px; border:1px solid #AAAAAA;">
:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''Delete''' - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 20:59, 11 February 2008 (UTC)

:{{Lc|Wikipedians by alma mater: Lower Merion High School}}
:'''''Delete''' per [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/August 2007#Category:Wikipedians by high school and subcats]].'' – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 20:52, 2 February 2008 (UTC)
::''(Also see: [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/August 2007#Category:Wikipedians who went to Lowndes High School|1]], [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/September 2007#Category:Hasland Hall Students|2]], [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/September 2007#Category:Wikipedians who attend Delta Secondary School|3]], [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/September 2007#Category:Wikipedians by alma mater: Gosford High School|4]], [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/October 2007#Category:Wikipedians studying in German Swiss International School|5]], [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/October 2007#Category:Montgomery Bell Academy Wikipedians|6]], [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/October 2007#Category:Wikipedians by alma mater:Chatham House Grammar School|7]], [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/October 2007#Category:Wikipedians studying in an ESF school|8]], [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/November 2007#Category:Wikipedians by alma mater: Oxford Falls Grammar School|9]], [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/November 2007#Category:Wikipedians by alma mater: The Friends' School, Hobart|10]], [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/November 2007#Category:Wikipedians by alma mater: Melbourne High School (Victoria)|11]], [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/December 2007#Category:Wikipedians by alma mater: Middle School Attached to Nanjing Normal University|12]], [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/December 2007#Category:Wikipedians by alma mater: Baroda High School, Alkapuri|13]], [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/December 2007#Category:Wikipedians by alma mater: De La Salle-Santiago Zobel School|14]], [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/December 2007#Category:Wikipedians by alma mater: Don Vicente Rama Memorial National High School|15]], [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/December 2007#Category:Wikipedians by alma mater: Xavier School|16]], [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/December 2007#Category:Wikipedians by alma mater: Danforth Collegiate & Technical Institute|17]], [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/December 2007#Category:Wikipedians by alma mater: East York Collegiate Institute|18]], [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/December 2007#Category:Wikipedians by alma mater: Lourdes School of Mandaluyong|19]], [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/December 2007#Category:Wikipedian Dunmanians|20]], [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/December 2007#Category:Wikipedians by alma mater: Millfield School|21]], [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/December 2007#Category:Wikipedians by alma mater: City of London School|22]], [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/December 2007#Category:Wikipedians by alma mater: Archbishop Temple School|23]], [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/December 2007#Category:Wikipedians by alma mater: Bristol Grammar School|24]], [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/December 2007#Category:Wikipedians by alma mater: Clifton College|25]], [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/December 2007#Category:Wikipedians by alma mater: King Edward's School|26]], [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/December 2007#Category:Wikipedians by alma mater: William Tennent High School|27]], [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/December 2007#Category:Wikipedians by alma mater: Benet Academy|28]], [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/December 2007#Category:Wikipedians by alma mater: Williamsville East High School|29]], [[Wikipedia:User categories for discussion/Archive/December 2007#Category:Wikipedians by alma mater: Christian Brothers College High School|30]])''
*'''Delete''', possibly speedy delete these from now on per [[WP:IAR]].  With 30 discussions of past precedent, there is no way any of these will ever survive UCFD without consensus for deleting high school categories being overturned at [[WP:DRV]] first, so a UCFD is really only a formallity at this point. Additionally, for future noms such as these I would reccommend to the nominator to only list a few examples-No need to go to the work of linking to 30 debates for a cut and dry UCFD such as this. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 21:03, 2 February 2008 (UTC)
:*Perhaps 30 links ''is'' a little bit of overkill ... ;) '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 19:35, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as per nom and overwhelming precedent. Concur with VegaDark's assessment. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 00:41, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

====Category:Wikipedians who fix double redirects====
<div class="boilerplate vfd" style="background:#bff9fc; margin:0 auto; padding:0 10px 0 10px; border:1px solid #AAAAAA;">
:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''Delete'''. <i><b>[[User:Snowolf|<span style="color:darkmagenta;">Snowolf</span>]] <sup><small>[[User talk:Snowolf|<span style="color:darkmagenta;">How can I help?</span>]]</small></sup></b></i> 00:49, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
:{{lc|Wikipedians who fix double redirects}}
On the surface, it looks like this category could actually be useful to the project.  However, considering [[Special:DoubleRedirects]] says "It is not necessary to fix these by hand. Bots will go through the entire list periodically and fix all of the double redirects.", I don't see the point of the category.  If this wasn't the case, I could possibly see users too busy to fix ones they created seeking out users in the category to do it for them, but since bots will do the work, whatever usefulness this category might have had has pretty much disappeared. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 03:39, 2 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 03:39, 2 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' - it's true that bots do fix double redirects, but many users do also and this is an ideal location to find help from experienced users who know how to fix them, and why the should be fixed. Sometimes users want to fix double redirects quick, and again - this category is useful for users wanting to find users that are efficient in the task. [[User:Ryan Postlethwaite|'''<span style="color:#000088;">Ry<span style="color:#220066;">an<span style="color:#550044;"> P<span style="color:#770022;">os<span style="color:#aa0000;">tl</span>et</span>hw</span>ai</span>te</span>''']] 03:58, 2 February 2008 (UTC)
:*How often do the bots go through the list?  Unless it's particularly seldom, I can't think of a scenerio where leaving the double redirects for a little while longer would be harmful.  Additionally, Someone who has the time to go through the category, find someone who is active, and leave them a message about fixing double redirects would be able to fix a couple themselves in that amount of time.  So this category wouldn't be helpful in cases where only a couple double redirects are created, it would only be useful in cases where a large amount are created.  Usually, as it so happens, those are the times when people request bots to do the work.  So unless the amount of double redirects created isn't too large or too small, I don't see this category ever being used.  Even with that, I am very doubtful this category would be used much if at all.  How many people even know about this category?  How many people, even if they did know, would use it rather than let the bots deal with it or just fix it themselves?  I'm not convinced this is useful enough to keep. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 04:34, 2 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' Obsolete with advancements. '''[[User:MBisanz|<span style='color: #FFFF00;background-color: #0000FF;'>MBisanz</span>]]''' <sup>[[User talk:MBisanz|<span style='color: #FFA500;'>talk</span>]]</sup> 05:03, 2 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per nom and MBisanz. There was a time when this category may have been useful (although ... the process of fixing double redirects is fairly simple and I don't think it's likely that a situation would arise where someone would need to ask for help in fixing them), but it is no longer so. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 20:42, 2 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as per nom, MBisanz, and Black Falcon. '''[[User:Horologium|<span style="color:DarkSlateGray;">Horologium</span>]]''' <small>[[User talk:Horologium|(talk)]]</small> 00:42, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' - While there are tasks on Wikipedia complex enough that such a category might be useful, I don't think that this is one of them. (That and, to me, it seems duplicative of the categories of WikiGnomes and/or bot owners : ) - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 11:01, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' While you might think it's silly, since bots do this, it's still a user cat that is regarding actual Wikipedia collaboration. -- [[User:Ned Scott|Ned Scott]] 06:26, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete'''. What next, [[:Category:Wikipedians who contribute to articles]]? Like all user categories, this has no benefit to the encyclopedia. —[[User:Angr|'''An''']][[User talk:Angr|''gr'']] <sup>[[User:Angr/If|If you've written a quality article...]]</sup> 07:26, 8 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

====Category:Wikipedians that use the Print Screen key====
<div class="boilerplate vfd" style="background:#bff9fc; margin:0 auto; padding:0 10px 0 10px; border:1px solid #AAAAAA;">
:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''speedy deleted'''...that was fast. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 02:59, 2 February 2008 (UTC)
:{{lc|Wikipedians that use the Print Screen key}}
Non-collaborative, potentially all-inclusive category. No encyclopedic reason to ever seek out other users in this. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 02:55, 2 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' as nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 02:55, 2 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>

===February 1===
====Wikipedians who like X part 2====
<div class="boilerplate vfd" style="background:#bff9fc; margin:0 auto; padding:0 10px 0 10px; border:1px solid #AAAAAA;">
:''The following discussion is an archived debate regarding the category or categories above. <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''
The result of the discussion was  '''delete all'''. '''[[User:hmwith|<span style="background:#999;color:#fff;padding:0 4px">нмŵוτн</span>]][[User talk:hmwith|<span style="background:#666;padding:0 4px;color:#fff;">τ</span>]]''' 19:14, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
:{{lc|Wikipedians who like V for Vendetta}}
:{{lc|Wikipedians who like 300}}
:{{lc|Wikipedians who like Blade Runner}}
:{{lc|Wikipedians who like Dumb and Dumber}}
:{{lc|Wikipedians who like The Rocky Horror Picture Show}}
:{{lc|Wikipedians who like Transformers (film)}}
:{{lc|Wikipedians who like The Phantom Menace}}
Originally missed these as they were on the elusive page 2 of the parent category.  Per precedent and reasoning below, these are not helpful to the project. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 03:35, 1 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete all''' as nom. [[User:VegaDark|VegaDark]] ([[User talk:VegaDark|talk]]) 03:35, 1 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete all''' - per nom. Provides no significant help when editing articles. [[User:Iceshark7|~Iceshark7]] ([[User talk:Iceshark7|talk]]) 21:11, 2 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete all''' as categories that lack a [[WP:NOT#MYSPACE|clear collaborative purpose]] (merely liking a movie does not imply an interest in collaborating on an article about it) and are too narrow in scope. – '''[[User:Black Falcon|Black Falcon]]''' <sup>([[User talk:Black Falcon|Talk]])</sup> 23:14, 2 February 2008 (UTC)
*'''Delete all''' - While the case could be made that some of these could be merged into broader categories (such as [[:Category:Wikipedians who like The Phantom Menace]] to [[:Category:Wikipedians interested in Star Wars]]), and I wouldn't oppose such merging, if there was consensus for it, I think in this case, it's probably better to just delete, and allow the Wikipedians to self select the broader categories. (Just because someone may be interested in a specific film, doesn't mean that they may be interested in any topic related to the series - or franchise - or, more to the point, that they might be interested in collaborating such topics. - [[User:Jc37|jc37]] 11:01, 3 February 2008 (UTC)
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.  <span style="color:red">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this section.''</div>