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* [[Template talk:Infobox language/codelist/Archives/2024/October|Infobox language/codelist/Archives/2024/October]], [[Template talk:Infobox language/family-color/Archives/2024/October|Infobox language/family-color/Archives/2024/October]], [[Template talk:Infobox language/genetic/Archives/2024/October|Infobox language/genetic/Archives/2024/October]], [[Template talk:Infobox language/language family color table/Archives/2024/October|Infobox language/language family color table/Archives/2024/October]], [[Template talk:Infobox language/quilt/Archives/2024/October|Infobox language/quilt/Archives/2024/October]]
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* [[Template talk:ISO 639-1/Archives/2024/October|ISO 639-1/Archives/2024/October]], [[Template talk:Glottolink/Archives/2024/October|Glottolink/Archives/2024/October]], [[Template talk:Glottolog/Archives/2024/October|Glottolog/Archives/2024/October]], [[Template talk:AIATSIS/Archives/2024/October|AIATSIS/Archives/2024/October]]
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== Correction of misleading "family-color" groups ==

According to a search of the archives this has been brought up more than once over the years. Given that “Altaic” is widely rejected as a valid grouping, there should be separate colors at least for Turkic, Mongolic, and Tungusic languages. Koreanic and Japonic could get their own colors or use the "isolate" color. [[User:عُثمان|عُثمان]] ([[User talk:عُثمان|talk]]) 14:05, 23 March 2024 (UTC)

:This has alreaqdy been done at the French Wikipedia. <span style="font-weight: bold; background-color: #00c9c2; color: #000000;">[[User:Kepler-1229b|🪐Kepler-1229b]] &#124; [[User talk:Kepler-1229b|talk]] &#124; [[Special:Contributions/Kepler-1229b|contribs🪐]]</span> 00:22, 13 November 2024 (UTC)

== Endangered languages ==

I wish to request an edit for this template to include the classication of a given language's danger of extiction, given by UNESCO, as described [[Endangered language#Defining and measuring endangerment|on this article]]. There are already some articles that hack it in using the {{para|map}} paramater (see [[Adyghe language]]), but I believe that it should be included for completeness and as a useful metric to gauge a language's healthiness, compare the vulnerability classification on {{tl|Speciesbox}}. [[User:JnpoJuwan|Juwan]] ([[User talk:JnpoJuwan|talk]]) 12:00, 21 September 2024 (UTC)

:pinging @[[User:Kwamikagami|Kwamikagami]] who contributes to the template and might be interested. [[User:JnpoJuwan|Juwan]] ([[User talk:JnpoJuwan|talk]]) 12:01, 21 September 2024 (UTC)
:IIRC, there's some uneven consensus that we do not include that classification in the infobox. I do not think it adds much concrete information; moreover, something really rubs me the wrong way about presenting sociological data like language vitality identically to biodiversity metrics (though I'm not against the UNESCO schema in itself). It is also not a widely adopted schema IIRC. <span style="border-radius:2px;padding:3px;background:#1E816F">[[User:Remsense|<span style="color:#fff">'''Remsense'''</span>]]<span style="color:#fff">&nbsp;‥&nbsp;</span>[[User talk:Remsense|<span lang="zh" style="color:#fff">'''论'''</span>]]</span> 12:05, 21 September 2024 (UTC)
::@[[User:Remsense|Remsense]] sociological data is something that I look for often and, in my opinion, would better these articles. would you mind explaining a bit more what is your issues and ideas about these types of classifications? the biodiversity metric are only an example of what to think about but it doesn't need to be exactly that! [[User:JnpoJuwan|Juwan]] ([[User talk:JnpoJuwan|talk]]) 13:46, 21 September 2024 (UTC)
:::In general, infoboxes are designed to communicate key facts at a glance ({{cf.}} [[WP:INFOBOXPURPOSE]]); details that are significantly nuanced or require additional context to understand should be omitted. This classification is not quantitative, and is based on specific criteria that are not universally accepted, which is not adequately clear when listed alongside more quantitative or otherwise objective data about a language like number of speakers or uncontroversial phylogenetic relationships. Given this schema is not universally accepted, it requires additional context and thus should be omitted from the infobox in favor of being discussed in prose. <span style="border-radius:2px;padding:3px;background:#1E816F">[[User:Remsense|<span style="color:#fff">'''Remsense'''</span>]]<span style="color:#fff">&nbsp;‥&nbsp;</span>[[User talk:Remsense|<span lang="zh" style="color:#fff">'''论'''</span>]]</span> 22:43, 21 September 2024 (UTC)
::::I agree that language vitality is not easily captured by a one-dimensional scale, whether it is the UNESCO scale or the more detailed [[EGIDS]]. It fails to include vital aspects such as internal and external language attitudes, degree of bilingualism, presence in mass media, etc. I have observed communities speaking languages that formally appear as 6b on the EGIDS scale, but are more likely to persist than languages classified as 5 and 6a.
::::Also, as of now, most articles that fell victim to the senseless, disruptive mass-edit stunt of abusing the map-parameter blantantly violate [[WP:INFOBOXPURPOSE]], since they don't have a matching prose section about vitality status. Adding a dedicated parameter won't solve the issue, but rather might invite more additions to the infobox mechanically copied from UNESCO Atlas. –[[User:Austronesier|Austronesier]] ([[User talk:Austronesier|talk]]) 23:23, 21 September 2024 (UTC)
::::I support the idea of adding a language's endangerment status to the infobox. It's also something that I as a language researcher look for.
::::I don't think it's correct to say that these scales aren't quantitative; it's just that the metric doesn't capture all the relevant parameters. I also don't think it's true to say that the scales aren't universally accepted. They're not universally accepted in the ''literal'' sense, and all linguists acknowledge their shortcomings, but they're still a legitimate effort to provide an objective standardized metric aimed at assessing endangerment, and these scales are widely adopted and referenced among linguists. Endangerment scales are used for determining priority in grant funding, for example.
::::It seems to me like endangerment rating is a perfect fit for the purpose of the infobox. But I also acknowledge there's a lot of details in language infoboxes already, and there are tradeoffs to just how much info you can stuff in there before it defeats the purpose of an "at a glance" look. Plus, since there are multiple endangerment scales, there's the question of which to include. Including all 3 of the major ones seems a bit much. [https://glottolog.org/langdoc/status Glottolog's Agglomerated Endangerment Scale] might be a good choice though, because it's an aggregation of all of the other scales. [[User:Dwhieb|Dwhieb]] ([[User talk:Dwhieb|talk]]) 23:41, 6 November 2024 (UTC)

== Edit request 29 September 2024 ==

{{edit template-protected|Template:Infobox language/family-color|answered=yes}}
I propose creating new colors for many language families of the Americas at [[Template:Infobox language/family-color]] due to the comparatively high load of languages using the "American" color to other colors.

Some language families which could use their own colors are the proposed Penutian and hypothetical Hokan families, other large families in North America, and major families in South America like Macro-Jê and Tupian.

<!--'''Diff:'''
{{TextDiff|1=ORIGINAL_TEXT|2=CHANGED_TEXT}}--> <span style="font-weight: bold; background-color: #00c9c2; color: #000000;">[[User:Kepler-1229b|🪐Kepler-1229b]] &#124; [[User talk:Kepler-1229b|talk]] &#124; [[Special:Contributions/Kepler-1229b|contribs🪐]]</span> 17:36, 29 September 2024 (UTC)
:[[File:Red question icon with gradient background.svg|20px|link=|alt=]] '''Not done for now:''' it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a [[WP:EDITXY|"change X to Y" format]] and provide a [[Wikipedia:Reliable sources|reliable source]] if appropriate.<!-- Template:ETp --> Once you have consensus on a specific new color scheme, feel free to re-activate this request by changing the template back to {{para|answered|no}} <span class="nowrap">--[[User:Ahecht|Ahecht]] ([[User talk:Ahecht|<b style="color:#FFF;background:#04A;display:inline-block;padding:1px;vertical-align:middle;font:bold 50%/1 sans-serif;text-align:center">TALK<br />PAGE</b>]])</span> 19:16, 30 September 2024 (UTC)
::I have some consensus at [[WT:LANG]] on the addition of these specific family colors:
::* {{legend|#afced1|[[Salishan languages]]}}
::* {{legend|#91d1e3|[[Penutian languages]]}}
::* {{legend|#66c0cf|[[Hokan languages]]}}
::* {{legend|#3686cc|[[Oto-Manguean languages]]}}
::* {{legend|#4865bd|[[Mayan languages]]}}
::* {{legend|#98b1c7|[[Arawakan languages]]}}
::* {{legend|#c0e5e0|[[Quechuan languages]]}}
::* {{legend|#638ba8|[[Tupian languages]]}}
::* {{legend|#275379|[[Macro-Jê languages]]}}
::* {{legend|#1d8c97|[[Cariban languages]]}}
::* {{legend|#1f1780|[[Pano-Tacanan languages]]}}<span style="font-weight: bold; background-color: #00c9c2; color: #000000;">[[User:Kepler-1229b|🪐Kepler-1229b]] &#124; [[User talk:Kepler-1229b|talk]] &#124; [[Special:Contributions/Kepler-1229b|contribs🪐]]</span> 00:25, 23 November 2024 (UTC)
:{{complete2}}. '''''[[User:Paine Ellsworth|<span style="font-size:92%;color:darkblue;font-family:Segoe Script">P.I.&nbsp;Ellsworth</span>]]'''''&thinsp;,&nbsp;[[Editor|<span style="color:black">ed.</span>]]&nbsp;[[User talk:Paine Ellsworth|<sup>put'er&nbsp;there</sup>]]&nbsp;<small>04:35, 9 December 2024 (UTC)</small>

== Template-protected edit request on 1 November 2024 ==

{{edit template-protected|Template:Infobox language|answered=yes}}
Can someone please remove the invisible comment marks around the [[:Category:Language articles with Linguasphere code|category 'Language articles with Linguasphere code']] on {{tl|Infobox language/lingualist}}, because I've just created that category a few minutes ago now? [[User:PK2|PK2]] ([[User talk:PK2|talk]]; [[Special:Contributions/PK2|contributions]]) 09:14, 1 November 2024 (UTC)
:{{Done|{{U|PK2|Done}}}} &nbsp;&nbsp;<b>~</b>&nbsp;<span style="font-family:Monotype Corsiva; font-size:16px;">[[User:Tom.Reding|Tom.Reding]] ([[User talk:Tom.Reding|talk]] ⋅[[WP:DGAF|dgaf]])</span>&nbsp; 10:42, 2 November 2024 (UTC)

== Template-protected edit request on 5 November 2024 ==

{{edit template-protected|Template:Infobox language|answered=yes}}
Expand to fam20 (see [[Sercquiais]]). [[User:Arctic Circle System|Arctic Circle System]] ([[User talk:Arctic Circle System|talk]]) 04:35, 5 November 2024 (UTC)

:I must admit I am skeptical of the need for this level of diachronic granularity in an infobox. Wouldn't it be better to abridge it there and include a full tree in the article body if desired? <span style="border-radius:2px;padding:3px;background:#1E816F">[[User:Remsense|<span style="color:#fff">'''Remsense'''</span>]]<span style="color:#fff">&nbsp;‥&nbsp;</span>[[User talk:Remsense|<span lang="zh" style="color:#fff">'''论'''</span>]]</span> 04:39, 5 November 2024 (UTC)
::{{ping|Remsense}} Maybe, though as for how to implement such a thing, especially without it just being absurdly arbitrary, I wouldn't know. [[User:Arctic Circle System|Arctic Circle System]] ([[User talk:Arctic Circle System|talk]]) 23:52, 5 November 2024 (UTC)
::I also don't think 20 (or even the current 15) is really necessary.
::It's true that most languages ''can'' and ''do'' get that granular ([https://glottolog.org/resource/languoid/id/stan1293 here's English], for example), but in practice in the literature most scholars simply list the major branches. I would write this for English, for example:
::<code>English < Germanic < Indo-European</code>
::But if I were discussing the Germanic language family in particular, I'd get a bit more detailed:
::<code>English < West Germanic < Germanic < Indo-European</code>
::I agree with @[[User:Remsense|Remsense]] that the choice of branches to include is arbitrary. And that's actually okay—you ''should'' adjust the list based on context.
::In the context of Wikipedia, I think the notability principle is the most sensible criterion to go by. If a branch of a family isn't notable enough to warrant its own page, then it probably doesn't make sense to include it in the diachronic tree. [[User:Dwhieb|Dwhieb]] ([[User talk:Dwhieb|talk]]) 23:20, 6 November 2024 (UTC)
:{{not done for now}}:<!-- Template:ETp --> Are more than 15 really needed on that page? I see 15 in use now, and I don't see a discussion on the talk page or a more-detailed list within the article.  – [[User:Jonesey95|Jonesey95]] ([[User talk:Jonesey95|talk]]) 06:24, 5 November 2024 (UTC)
::{{ping|Jonesey95}} That's because the 16th entry isn't shown because the fam16 parameter doesn't exist yet. [[User:Arctic Circle System|Arctic Circle System]] ([[User talk:Arctic Circle System|talk]]) 23:51, 5 November 2024 (UTC)

== Template-protected edit request on 11 November 2024 ==

{{edit template-protected|Template:Infobox language|answered=yes}}

Could the limit of the <code>lcN=</code> and <code>ldN=</code> and <code>labelN=</code> parameters please be increased from 30 to 40? The current limit is causing problems at [[Nahuan languages]], where [[Durango Nahuatl]] cannot be appropriately split into [[Eastern Durango Nahuatl]] and [[Western Durango Nahuatl]], despite the code for Durango having been split back in 2011. This is because all 30 parameters are already in use. Thanks. [[User:Theknightwho|Theknightwho]] ([[User talk:Theknightwho|talk]]) 23:47, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
: I've granted you template editor rights so you can do it yourself instead. [[User:Pppery|* Pppery *]] [[User talk:Pppery|<sub style="color:#800000">it has begun...</sub>]] 18:46, 13 November 2024 (UTC)
:Shouldn't [[Nahuan languages]] use {{tlx|Infobox language family}} and {{para|childN}} instead, and leave the ISO codes to the individual language pages (which already have them)? [[User talk:Kanguole|Kanguole]] 18:51, 13 November 2024 (UTC)
::@[[User:Kanguole|Kanguole]] Quite possibly, but it turns out [[Malay language]] goes up to 37, so the increase was still needed anyway.
::@[[User:Pppery|Pppery]] Thanks for that - I've implemented the change (and have added the same limit for dialects, too, since at least one page was exceeding the old limit). This should probably be Lua-fied at some point, as no doubt another arbitrary increase will eventually be needed. [[User:Theknightwho|Theknightwho]] ([[User talk:Theknightwho|talk]]) 22:59, 13 November 2024 (UTC)

== Proposal for new parameter to include audio/video recording depicting a language ==

I want to propose a new optional parameter called recording that could allow audio/video recordings. We now have such recordings on Commons of native speakers speaking their languages. These add encyclopedic value to an article depicting variants, accents, intonations, syntaxes and even gender-based variations which are important linguistic attributes. I'm personally [[:m:OpenSpeaks/Archives|working]] on a project to bring language media from CC-licensed documentaries. Some examples are [[Kusunda language|Kusunda]] and [[Baleswari Odia|Baleswari]]. However, there is no convention on inserting a recording in a proper format. So, a range of nonstandard approaches exist. The infobox parameter I'm proposing should be limited to audio and video only since a separate image parameter exists for images depicting the language. It's worth noting that images are of no use to depict languages with no writing systems (oral languages). This parameter can be called "recorded_media" allowing available audio/video on Commons and include within the infobox a supporting parameter called "recorded_media_depicts" (or "recorded_media_description") letting the uploader include what the media depicts. For brevity, those two should be enough. [[User:Psubhashish|Psubhashish]] ([[User talk:Psubhashish|talk]]) 17:27, 18 November 2024 (UTC)

:It's easy to add videos, recordings or images to an article (see for instance: [[Levantine Arabic]]). I don't see the point of adding this to the infobox. [[User:A455bcd9|a455bcd9 (Antoine)]] ([[User talk:A455bcd9|talk]]) 18:02, 18 November 2024 (UTC)
::: By that logic, there should be no parameter for image or native name. It's not about the "possibility" but keeping some of the very crucial information packaged in the infobox, encouraging editors to add recordings. --[[User:Psubhashish|Psubhashish]] ([[User talk:Psubhashish|talk]]) 19:27, 18 November 2024 (UTC)
::::Yes for "very crucial information" (number of speakers, language family, location, etc.) but a random recording chosen subjectively and arbitrarily is not "very crucial information". For instance, which accent/register/dialect will you choose to represent the language? What will they talk about? If we had something like article first of the declaration of human rights in all languages, then why not add this below for people to "experience" the language. But still, I don't think the infobox is made for that. Has any other Wikipedia edition done that? [[User:A455bcd9|a455bcd9 (Antoine)]] ([[User talk:A455bcd9|talk]]) 09:21, 19 November 2024 (UTC)

== Is using term "Country"/"Countries is more correct instead of "Native to" ==

I found that term "''Native to''" is not that term used for ancestral homeland of language, and currently instead used this term as dominant countries/nations (the country or nation where this language is spoken and centralized worldwide). 

It could be changed term from "''Native to''", replacing word with "''Countries''"/"''Country''" while keeping same function and is more correct.

When a single country or nation is displayed, it could be written as "''Country''". When two or more countries displayed in infobox (separated by comma <code>,</code>), it will display as ''"Countries"'', unless it bypassed by using wikitext/HTML codes <code>&amp;#44;</code> <code>&amp;#x2C;</code> <code>&amp;comma;</code>. If using these HTML codes, it can allow two or more nations to appear as "'''Countries'''".

Term "Native to" could be used for ancestral homelands of the language (that is currently is row "Region") [[Special:Contributions/217.113.21.9|217.113.21.9]] ([[User talk:217.113.21.9|talk]]) 06:58, 3 December 2024 (UTC)

== Plain lists in refs ==

The /refs subtemplate generates lists of refs using line breaks. This is deprecated for accessibility reasons in favour of real lists such as {{tlx|plainlist}}. In [[Template:Infobox_language/ref/sandbox|the sandbox]] I've used wiki bulleted lists instead. I'm not sure how to test this properly - tbh I don't understand how the infobox uses it, which is why [[Template talk:Infobox language/Archive 9#Please use accessible plain lists|I asked for someone else to do it in the first place!]] It's not as straightforward as putting a test case in [[Template:Infobox language/testcases]] because the infobox's sandbox doesn't use the sandbox version of the subtemplate. My attempts at [[Template:Infobox language/ref/testcases|testcases]] for the subtemplate directly (based on [[Armenian language]]) didn't work. [[User:Hairy Dude|Hairy Dude]] ([[User talk:Hairy Dude|talk]]) 17:50, 9 December 2024 (UTC)

== Edit request 17 December 2024 ==

{{edit template-protected|Template:Infobox language/family-color|answered=yes}}
'''I would like to change the color of the Penutian family in [[Template:Infobox language/family-color]], to make it more distinctive from the Na-Dene languages.'''

'''Diff:'''
{{TextDiff|1=#92d1e3|2=#6bc4de}} <span style="font-weight: bold; background-color: #00c9c2; color: #000000;">[[User:Kepler-1229b|🪐Kepler-1229b]] &#124; [[User talk:Kepler-1229b|talk]] &#124; [[Special:Contributions/Kepler-1229b|contribs🪐]]</span> 02:36, 17 December 2024 (UTC)

:Additionally, change the Pano-Tacanan color to include white text to make it more visible. <span style="font-weight: bold; background-color: #00c9c2; color: #000000;">[[User:Kepler-1229b|🪐Kepler-1229b]] &#124; [[User talk:Kepler-1229b|talk]] &#124; [[Special:Contributions/Kepler-1229b|contribs🪐]]</span> 23:28, 17 December 2024 (UTC)
:{{done}}<!-- Template:ETp --> [[User:Primefac|Primefac]] ([[User talk:Primefac|talk]]) 20:44, 25 December 2024 (UTC)

== Edit request 19 December 2024 ==

I pressed many links of this, I see that original list (even in Wayback Machine archive), these links are dead and it seen as error screen that is moved to GitHub Multitree.

https://github.com/linguistlist/multitree [[Special:Contributions/217.113.21.9|217.113.21.9]] ([[User talk:217.113.21.9|talk]]) 06:06, 19 December 2024 (UTC)

:What are you trying to accomplish? <span style="font-weight: bold; background-color: #00c9c2; color: #000000;">[[User:Kepler-1229b|🪐Kepler-1229b]] &#124; [[User talk:Kepler-1229b|talk]] &#124; [[Special:Contributions/Kepler-1229b|contribs🪐]]</span> 02:18, 20 December 2024 (UTC)
::I think the point is that the pages pointed by {{para|linglist}} are dead, so the parameter should be removed, or at least no longer generate a link. Most (all?) of these codes are redundant to {{para|iso3}} anyway. [[User talk:Kanguole|Kanguole]] 17:46, 20 December 2024 (UTC)
:::There are two situations here. One, ISO codes where LingList is the ISO governing authority for the code. The ISO page provides a link to Ethnologue that doesn't go anywhere; Ethnologue won't actually have a page for that language. The question here is how we handle a recognized authority when that authority is defunct / no longer online. 
:::The second are ISO codes in the private-use range [e.g. beginning with Q], as well as private non-ISO codes with digits in them. Because such codes are not universal, and have no utility outside LingList, I don't see any point to keeping them. Glottolog will often [though not always] cover the lect, and in such cases that link is often a more than adequate replacement. [Note though that in cases where Glottolog sets the name in italics to indicate that it's a dialect, its coverage is typically a mirror of LingList and not an independent or particularly RS, though that is gradually changing.] 
:::IMO, we should keep the LingList label in case 1 until ISO provides a new authority for them, at which point we can remove the LingList coding from the infobox template. If we can't link them to anything useful, we should remove the link coding from this template; we can always restore it if something becomes available. 
:::We should remove any surviving links in case 2 now. [At one point I removed all the case-2 links, but some may have been restored.] [[User:Kwamikagami|— kwami]] ([[User talk:Kwamikagami|talk]]) 19:38, 20 December 2024 (UTC)
::::LingList was the source of several ISO 639-3 codes, but doesn't seem to have any continuing role. The ISO 639 Maintenance Agency is now reachable via iso639-3@sil.org. [[User talk:Kanguole|Kanguole]] 21:01, 20 December 2024 (UTC)
:::::AFAIK, ISO only maintains the codes, names and aliases. They don't maintain definitions of those codes/names. For most codes, Ethnologue maintains that information, but for most languages extinct before 1950, it was LingList that did so. Now that the LingList project is defunct, it doesn't appear that anyone does. Ethnologue hasn't picked up the slack. [[User:Kwamikagami|— kwami]] ([[User talk:Kwamikagami|talk]]) 21:30, 20 December 2024 (UTC)

== Edit request 5 January 2025 ==

{{edit template-protected|answered=yes}}
Could we change the text color for Pano-Tacanan and Macro-Je please? they are barely visible. <!-- Template:Unsigned --><small class="autosigned">—&nbsp;Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:ZKevinTheCat|ZKevinTheCat]] ([[User talk:ZKevinTheCat#top|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/ZKevinTheCat|contribs]]) 05:41, 5 January 2025 (UTC)</small>
:[[File:Red question icon with gradient background.svg|20px|link=|alt=]] '''Not done''': it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a [[WP:EDITXY|"change X to Y" format]] and provide a [[Wikipedia:Reliable sources|reliable source]] if appropriate.<!-- Template:ETp --> [[User:Nardog|Nardog]] ([[User talk:Nardog|talk]]) 02:28, 7 January 2025 (UTC)
::I believe the change being referred to here is that the Pano-Tacanan and Macro-Je language colors should have white text like the color for conlangs, since the text is barely visible. <span style="font-weight: bold; background-color: #00c9c2; color: #000000;">[[User:Kepler-1229b|🪐Kepler-1229b]] &#124; [[User talk:Kepler-1229b|talk]] &#124; [[Special:Contributions/Kepler-1229b|contribs🪐]]</span> 04:16, 12 February 2025 (UTC)
::: Please make the exact edit you want made to the appropriate template sandbox for this and the below requests. [[User:Pppery|* Pppery *]] [[User talk:Pppery|<sub style="color:#800000">it has begun...</sub>]] 20:44, 30 March 2025 (UTC)

== Template-protected edit request on 5 January 2025 ==

{{edit template-protected|Template:Infobox language|answered=yes}}
Can someone please add the {{tlxs|tfm|Infobox proto-language}} tag to this template so I can nominate it for merging with {{tl|Infobox proto-language}}. I've already added it to that template just now because it's not currently protected. [[User:PK2|PK2]] ([[User talk:PK2|talk]]; [[Special:Contributions/PK2|contributions]]) 09:11, 5 January 2025 (UTC)
: Done. [[User:Pppery|* Pppery *]] [[User talk:Pppery|<sub style="color:#800000">it has begun...</sub>]] 05:54, 6 January 2025 (UTC)

== Edit request 13 February 2025 ==

{{Edit template-protected|answered=yes}}

'''Description of suggested change:'''
I propose adding two new language family colors to this template; namely those for {{legend inline|#a0c7f9|[[Chibchan languages]]}} and {{legend inline|#5491a3|[[Tucanoan languages]]}}.
<!--{{Edit template-protected|answered=}}

'''Description of suggested change:'''
I propose to add two language family colors for the Tucanoan and Chibchan language families:
*{{legend|#82edfd|Chibchan
*{{legend|#0000FF|Tucanoan}} ~~~~
-->
'''Diff:'''
{{TextDiff|1=ORIGINAL_TEXT|2=CHANGED_TEXT}} <span style="font-weight: bold; background-color: #00c9c2; color: #000000;">[[User:Kepler-1229b|🪐Kepler-1229b]] &#124; [[User talk:Kepler-1229b|talk]] &#124; [[Special:Contributions/Kepler-1229b|contribs🪐]]</span> 05:26, 13 February 2025 (UTC)

== Set `mapscale=1` by default? ==

Presently by default maps tend to stretch out the infobox to fill up half the reading area unless one manually specifies a figure like {{para|mapscale|1}}. I think 1 is a pretty reasonable default value. If there are any issues or objections please let me know. <span style="border-radius:2px;padding:3px;background:#1E816F">[[User:Remsense|<span style="color:#fff">'''Remsense'''</span>]]<span style="color:#fff">&nbsp;‥&nbsp;</span>[[User talk:Remsense|<span lang="zh" style="color:#fff">'''论'''</span>]]</span> 15:17, 26 February 2025 (UTC)

:I feel a larger scale, like 1.35, might make it easier to see the images. The UNESCO endangerment images are notably hard to see. <span style="font-weight: bold; background-color: #00c9c2; color: #000000;">[[User:Kepler-1229b|🪐Kepler-1229b]] &#124; [[User talk:Kepler-1229b|talk]] &#124; [[Special:Contributions/Kepler-1229b|contribs🪐]]</span> <span style="font-weight: bold; background-color: #00c9c2; color: #000000;">[[User:Kepler-1229b|🪐Kepler-1229b]] &#124; [[User talk:Kepler-1229b|talk]] &#124; [[Special:Contributions/Kepler-1229b|contribs🪐]]</span> 16:02, 26 February 2025 (UTC)
::(Side note, we should not be putting the UNESCO rating images there at all—see the above discussion from a few months back. It's misusing the parameter for something it was very clearly not designed for, also. I would appreciate help in removing the rest that I haven't gotten around to yet.)
::Like I said, I think the solution here is generally cropping the map or just putting it in the article body instead. These are cramped confines, and a global political map is very often not a good medium at thumbnail size to begin with on Wikipedia. <span style="border-radius:2px;padding:3px;background:#1E816F">[[User:Remsense|<span style="color:#fff">'''Remsense'''</span>]]<span style="color:#fff">&nbsp;‥&nbsp;</span>[[User talk:Remsense|<span lang="zh" style="color:#fff">'''论'''</span>]]</span> 16:05, 26 February 2025 (UTC)
:::I feel that including visual information for a given language's endangerment (or extinction) would be helpful, but there should be information in the text that discusses the language's sociolinguistic situation. <span style="font-weight: bold; background-color: #00c9c2; color: #000000;">[[User:Kepler-1229b|🪐Kepler-1229b]] &#124; [[User talk:Kepler-1229b|talk]] &#124; [[Special:Contributions/Kepler-1229b|contribs🪐]]</span> 20:02, 26 February 2025 (UTC)
::::It is certainly something that can be mentioned with the article body, but to reemphasize: the categories are not universally accepted, the data is old, and the presentation purposefully draws a direct parallel between biological diversity and language vitality which I find personally to be particularly inappropriate. <span style="border-radius:2px;padding:3px;background:#1E816F">[[User:Remsense|<span style="color:#fff">'''Remsense'''</span>]]<span style="color:#fff">&nbsp;‥&nbsp;</span>[[User talk:Remsense|<span lang="zh" style="color:#fff">'''论'''</span>]]</span> 20:06, 26 February 2025 (UTC)
:::::In the discussion above a suggestion was made to use Glottolog's evaluation. If SVG graphics can be made for this we could implement this and replace the current UNESCO atlas graphics, which are outdated anyway. <span style="font-weight: bold; background-color: #00c9c2; color: #000000;">[[User:Kepler-1229b|🪐Kepler-1229b]] &#124; [[User talk:Kepler-1229b|talk]] &#124; [[Special:Contributions/Kepler-1229b|contribs🪐]]</span> 20:16, 26 February 2025 (UTC)
::::::I would be apprehensive about a graphic. If in the infobox, I would prefer we implement a parameter for listing it as plain text. <span style="border-radius:2px;padding:3px;background:#1E816F">[[User:Remsense|<span style="color:#fff">'''Remsense'''</span>]]<span style="color:#fff">&nbsp;‥&nbsp;</span>[[User talk:Remsense|<span lang="zh" style="color:#fff">'''论'''</span>]]</span> 20:19, 26 February 2025 (UTC)
:::::::Moving back to the issue of mapscale, I would prefer a scale of 1.35 to make certain maps larger, and most global maps are only used for large-scale discussions of languages/families, or large macrofamilies which are not gfenerally accepted. <span style="font-weight: bold; background-color: #00c9c2; color: #000000;">[[User:Kepler-1229b|🪐Kepler-1229b]] &#124; [[User talk:Kepler-1229b|talk]] &#124; [[Special:Contributions/Kepler-1229b|contribs🪐]]</span> 22:12, 26 February 2025 (UTC)
::::::::If a map can't comfortably fit in the infobox, the first impulse should be to move it out of the infobox, not bloat the layers width along its entire height. The parameter can always be specified manually when that is deemed best, but 1.35 is a terribly ill fitting default. <span style="border-radius:2px;padding:3px;background:#1E816F">[[User:Remsense|<span style="color:#fff">'''Remsense'''</span>]]<span style="color:#fff">&nbsp;‥&nbsp;</span>[[User talk:Remsense|<span lang="zh" style="color:#fff">'''论'''</span>]]</span> 22:20, 26 February 2025 (UTC)
:::::::::Then what would you suggest, if 1 would be unsuitable? <span style="font-weight: bold; background-color: #00c9c2; color: #000000;">[[User:Kepler-1229b|🪐Kepler-1229b]] &#124; [[User talk:Kepler-1229b|talk]] &#124; [[Special:Contributions/Kepler-1229b|contribs🪐]]</span> 01:14, 27 February 2025 (UTC)
::::::::::I think 1.1 or 1.15 may be alright for readers' default settings, as long as the map isn't stretching out the infobox by default. <span style="border-radius:2px;padding:3px;background:#1E816F">[[User:Remsense|<span style="color:#fff">'''Remsense'''</span>]]<span style="color:#fff">&nbsp;‥&nbsp;</span>[[User talk:Remsense|<span lang="zh" style="color:#fff">'''论'''</span>]]</span> 01:17, 27 February 2025 (UTC)
:::::::::::Agreed. I believe 1.15 is better that 1, mainly due to a lack of visibility for 1. <span style="font-weight: bold; background-color: #00c9c2; color: #000000;">[[User:Kepler-1229b|🪐Kepler-1229b]] &#124; [[User talk:Kepler-1229b|talk]] &#124; [[Special:Contributions/Kepler-1229b|contribs🪐]]</span> 01:42, 27 February 2025 (UTC)
::::::::::::A default of 1 seems to leave too much unused horizontal space with the default settings. {{tlx|Infobox country}} has a default of 1.15. Anything more than 1.25 would make the box wider, which should be avoided. I agree that the invented graphics for endangerment should go. [[User talk:Kanguole|Kanguole]] 09:33, 27 February 2025 (UTC)
:::::::::::::I believe that visual information on a language's endangerment would be helpful, so instead of outright removing the current graphics, we could perhaps replace them with graphics for a more updated endangerment classification. <span style="font-weight: bold; background-color: #00c9c2; color: #000000;">[[User:Kepler-1229b|🪐Kepler-1229b]] &#124; [[User talk:Kepler-1229b|talk]] &#124; [[Special:Contributions/Kepler-1229b|contribs🪐]]</span> 19:50, 27 February 2025 (UTC)
::::::::::::::I'm now reading the 2018 paper by the authors.<ref>* {{cite journal | last=Hammarström | first=Harald | last2=Castermans | first2=Thom | last3=Forkel | first3=Robert | last4=Verbeek | first4=Kevin | last5=Westenberg | first5=Michel A. | last6=Speckmann | first6=Bettina | title=Simultaneous Visualization of Language Endangerment and Language Description |journal=Language Documentation & Conservation | publisher=University of Hawaiʻi Press |volume=12 | year=2018 | issn=1934-5275 | url=https://scholarspace.manoa.hawaii.edu/items/86f02994-a6fa-4f9e-9ced-14279b5b601f }}</ref> Given it's not clear from the label what "Shifting" means, it probably needs to be visually presented in context of the other categories. I've started working on a SVG graphic for this purpose. <span style="border-radius:2px;padding:3px;background:#1E816F">[[User:Remsense|<span style="color:#fff">'''Remsense'''</span>]]<span style="color:#fff">&nbsp;‥&nbsp;</span>[[User talk:Remsense|<span lang="zh" style="color:#fff">'''论'''</span>]]</span> 22:32, 27 February 2025 (UTC)
{{talk ref}}

== Glottolog ACE parameter graphic? ==

[[File:Glottolog ACE Extinct.svg]]

Continuing above convo, I'm not sure this is going to work so far, for the sole reason that the abbreviations used by ACE aren't at all intuitive, so it's not clear what meaning SH should have in relation to MB or TH etc. <span style="border-radius:2px;padding:3px;background:#1E816F">[[User:Remsense|<span style="color:#fff">'''Remsense'''</span>]]<span style="color:#fff">&nbsp;‥&nbsp;</span>[[User talk:Remsense|<span lang="zh" style="color:#fff">'''论'''</span>]]</span> 22:06, 28 February 2025 (UTC)
{{Infobox |label1 = [[EGIDS]] |data1 = 6b (Threatened) }}
:That seems less accessible than just adding a field with a text value like
:[[User talk:Kanguole|Kanguole]] 22:52, 28 February 2025 (UTC)

:I think so too. @[[User:Kepler-1229b|Kepler-1229b]], what do you think? I would be on board with adopting EGIDS more readily even, as it is much more multidimensional and less teleological in its categories, while remaining useful.<span style="border-radius:2px;padding:3px;background:#1E816F">[[User:Remsense|<span style="color:#fff">'''Remsense'''</span>]]<span style="color:#fff">&nbsp;‥&nbsp;</span>[[User talk:Remsense|<span lang="zh" style="color:#fff">'''论'''</span>]]</span> 00:41, 1 March 2025 (UTC)
::Pretty good so far. EGIDS should be good. <span style="font-weight: bold; background-color: #00c9c2; color: #000000;">[[User:Kepler-1229b|🪐Kepler-1229b]] &#124; [[User talk:Kepler-1229b|talk]] &#124; [[Special:Contributions/Kepler-1229b|contribs🪐]]</span> 01:02, 1 March 2025 (UTC)
:::@[[User:Kepler-1229b|Kepler-1229b]] you mean regarding Kanguole's textual parameter? That is what I would prefer for the reasons stated.
:::I also think we should consider excluding the parameter for both safe (0–6a) and extinct (10) languages, as those statuses are fairly obvious and do not require infobox placement imo. <span style="border-radius:2px;padding:3px;background:#1E816F">[[User:Remsense|<span style="color:#fff">'''Remsense'''</span>]]<span style="color:#fff">&nbsp;‥&nbsp;</span>[[User talk:Remsense|<span lang="zh" style="color:#fff">'''论'''</span>]]</span> 00:35, 3 March 2025 (UTC)
::::I was referring to the created graphic. A textual parameter would also work. I also agree that extinct and safe languages do not need to be included. <span style="font-weight: bold; background-color: #00c9c2; color: #000000;">[[User:Kepler-1229b|🪐Kepler-1229b]] &#124; [[User talk:Kepler-1229b|talk]] &#124; [[Special:Contributions/Kepler-1229b|contribs🪐]]</span> 01:24, 3 March 2025 (UTC)

== Edit request 18 March 2025 ==

{{Edit template-protected|answered=yes}}

Add two new language family colors: {{legend inline|#a0c7f9|[[Chibchan languages]]}} and {{legend inline|#5491a3|[[Tucanoan languages]]}}. <span style="font-weight: bold; background-color: #00c9c2; color: #000000;">[[User:Kepler-1229b|🪐Kepler-1229b]] &#124; [[User talk:Kepler-1229b|talk]] &#124; [[Special:Contributions/Kepler-1229b|contribs🪐]]</span> 22:54, 18 March 2025 (UTC)
: This is a duplicate of [[#Edit request 13 February 2025]]. [[User:Pppery|* Pppery *]] [[User talk:Pppery|<sub style="color:#800000">it has begun...</sub>]] 20:43, 30 March 2025 (UTC)

== Two invocations of AIATSIS create a problem ==

When {{tl|AIATSIS}} is used on the same page twice, an ugly red text appears in the references stating that there are two references named AIATSIS. Is it possible to fix it? See the [[Uradhi language]] as an example (the problem had appeared after the merge). Thank you in advance! [[User:Викидим|Викидим]] ([[User talk:Викидим|talk]]) 04:46, 21 March 2025 (UTC)

:I can think of 2 approaches -- [1] create a special AIATSIS param for a 2nd info box that will generate a ref with a different name, or [2] have each AIATSIS entry generate a separate reference
:With [2] we could just use 'aiatsis6' as the parameter for the second info box in the Uradhi article, and we'd also have 6 references to AIATSIS, one for each code we use [[User:Kwamikagami|— kwami]] ([[User talk:Kwamikagami|talk]]) 10:31, 21 March 2025 (UTC)

== Edit request 26 April 2025 ==

{{Edit template-protected|answered=yes}}

"e28" in "ref" does not work for {{tl|e28}}.

'''Diff:'''
{{TextDiff|1=ORIGINAL_TEXT|2=CHANGED_TEXT}} [[User:A455bcd9|a455bcd9 (Antoine)]] ([[User talk:A455bcd9|talk]]) 14:57, 26 April 2025 (UTC)
:Fixed at {{tl|Infobox language/ref}}. – [[User:Jonesey95|Jonesey95]] ([[User talk:Jonesey95|talk]]) 15:35, 26 April 2025 (UTC)
::Thanks! [[User:A455bcd9|a455bcd9 (Antoine)]] ([[User talk:A455bcd9|talk]]) 06:43, 5 May 2025 (UTC)