View source for Talk:Oxygen

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== Lavoisier's contribution, "Sur la combustion en général", mentions neither "vital air" or "azote" ==

I've been doing some basic research into the etymology behind Oxygen, and found that Lavoisier's contribution states that:

::''This and other experiments on combustion were documented in his book Sur la combustion en général, which was published in 1777. In that work, he proved that air is a mixture of two gases; 'vital air', which is essential to combustion and respiration, and azote (Gk. ἄζωτον "lifeless"), which did not support either.''

However when actually reading "Sur la combustion en général", neither "vital air" nor "azote" are ever mentioned:

[https://www.academie-sciences.fr/pdf/dossiers/Franklin/Franklin_pdf/Mem1777_p592.pdf]https://www.academie-sciences.fr/pdf/dossiers/Franklin/Franklin_pdf/Mem1777_p592.pdf

The closest he came to defining either (as far as I could find) is the line:

::''Ainsi, pour résumer, l’air est composé, suivant moi, de la matière du feu comme dissolvant, combinée avec une substance qui lui sert de base et en quelque façon qui la neutralise''

In English:

::''Thus, to summarize, air is composed, according to me, of the matter of fire as a solvent, combined with a substance which serves as its base and in some way which neutralizes it.''

The wikipedia text that claims he called these "vital air" and "azote" stems from reference [18]: "The Encyclopedia of the Chemical Elements." [https://archive.org/details/encyclopediaofch00hamp/page/500/mode/2up]https://archive.org/details/encyclopediaofch00hamp/page/500/mode/2up

::''In 1777 he published his work on combustion under the title "Sur la combustion en general." Lavoisier showed that air is essentially a mixture of two gases, which he called "vital air" and "azote."''

I don't disbelieve that Lavoisier started calling the two components of air "vital air" and "azote" at some point after his discovery, and the etymology of Oxygen aligns well with him mentioning that a lot of combustions produce acid later in the paper.

...But I'm not sure where Clifford A. Hampel, from ''"The Encyclopedia of the Chemical Elements,"'' found the terms "vital air" and "azote". From what I can gather, it can't be found in ''"Sur la combustion en général"''.

Now this is all hyper-nitpicky for sure, and maybe I've overlooked a very important line in Lavoisier's paper and I'm all wrong here, but when I came upon this discrepancy I figured it might be worth pointing out. :-) [[User:Fiets38|Fiets38]] ([[User talk:Fiets38|talk]]) 23:48, 16 June 2024 (UTC)

== “Dark Oxygen” found deep underwater  ==

[https://www.theguardian.com/environment/article/2024/jul/22/dark-oxygen-in-depths-of-pacific-ocean-could-force-rethink-about-origins-of-life] “ Charged metallic lumps found to produce oxygen in total darkness in process akin to how plants use photosynthesis” [[User:Doug Weller|<span style="color:#070">Doug Weller</span>]] [[User talk:Doug Weller|talk]] 19:30, 22 July 2024 (UTC)

== Image ==

Why does the image keep changing from gaseous to liquid O2 [[Special:Contributions/2603:8080:D03:89D4:9DA3:31CD:BFE5:1E18|2603:8080:D03:89D4:9DA3:31CD:BFE5:1E18]] ([[User talk:2603:8080:D03:89D4:9DA3:31CD:BFE5:1E18|talk]]) 00:21, 7 November 2024 (UTC)

== Plural ==

H, C and O, if referring to [[hydrogen]], [[carbon]], and [[oxygen]]; should be [[plural]]ized as H's, C's, and O's (with [[apostrophe]]s); as opposed to Hs, Cs, and Os (no apostrophes); to avoid confusion with Hs = [[hassium]], Cs = [[cesium]], and Os = [[osmium]]. The fact that hassium is an unstable, artificial element which has never been procured in macroscopic amounts, doesn't mean that clarity isn't compromised by the absence of said apostrophe. I remember, a chemistry book which was available online for free as a [[PDF]], did said plurals without an apostrophe; which annoyed me. [[User:Solomonfromfinland|Solomonfromfinland]] ([[User talk:Solomonfromfinland|talk]]) 03:04, 31 December 2024 (UTC)

== Pre-Far note ==
The article has are several single sentences, unsourced statements, and more coverage needs to be added.  🍕[[User:Boneless Pizza!|<span style="background:orange;border-radius:9999px;padding:1px 8px;color:white;"><span style="font-weight:bold">B</span>P!</span>]]🍕 ([[User talk:Boneless Pizza!|🔔]]) 03:42, 14 January 2025 (UTC)

:The article is already pretty long, what kind of coverage are you suggesting? [[User:Keresluna|Keres🌕]][[User_talk:Keresluna|Luna]] <sup>[[Special:Contributions/Keresluna|edits!]]</sup> 16:26, 21 April 2025 (UTC)
::Oops, sorry for the late reply. Added bunch of tags. 🍕[[User:Boneless Pizza!|<span style="background:orange;border-radius:9999px;padding:1px 8px;color:white;"><span style="font-weight:bold">B</span>P!</span>]]🍕 ([[User talk:Boneless Pizza!|🔔]]) 00:31, 7 May 2025 (UTC)
:::I will try to get to these tags and issues within a month, but I am very busy right now. [[User:Keresluna|Keres🌕]][[User_talk:Keresluna|Luna]] <sup>[[Special:Contributions/Keresluna|edits!]]</sup> 21:50, 16 May 2025 (UTC)
::::Just take your time, no rush. 🍕[[User:Boneless Pizza!|<span style="background:orange;border-radius:9999px;padding:1px 8px;color:white;"><span style="font-weight:bold">B</span>P!</span>]]🍕 ([[User talk:Boneless Pizza!|🔔]]) 01:40, 18 May 2025 (UTC)
:::::{{ping|Boneless Pizza!}} All cn tags have been taken care of. [[User:Keresluna|Keres🌕]][[User_talk:Keresluna|Luna]] <sup>[[Special:Contributions/Keresluna|edits!]]</sup> 16:23, 27 May 2025 (UTC)
::::::It seems like the common issue have been resolved already (nice job), though I'm not sure if this one still needs more eyes since I'm not expert at this subject. 🍕[[User:Boneless Pizza!|<span style="background:orange;border-radius:9999px;padding:1px 8px;color:white;"><span style="font-weight:bold">B</span>P!</span>]]🍕 ([[User talk:Boneless Pizza!|🔔]]) 01:17, 28 May 2025 (UTC)
:Should the lead have a long paragraph about respiration mechanisms of animals? The topic is not covered in the article AFAICT. [[User:Johnjbarton|Johnjbarton]] ([[User talk:Johnjbarton|talk]]) 19:05, 28 May 2025 (UTC)
::I cut the lead and moved the citation from the intro into the body. {{done}} [[User:Johnjbarton|Johnjbarton]] ([[User talk:Johnjbarton|talk]]) 18:31, 6 June 2025 (UTC)
:The History / Discovery section has some issues. The paragraph on Sendivogius relies on one Polish source with possible bias.  The Maples source seems to have been written by a [[Mason (Freemasonry)]] and it does not anyway verify the content
:* {{tq|This discovery of Sendivogius was however frequently denied by the generations of scientists and chemists which succeeded him.}}
:In other sources it's clear that later scientists did not understand the consequences of Sendivogius' work anymore than he did. That's quite a lot different than "denied".
:A much better source for the entire section would be
:* Severinghaus, J. W. (2016). Eight sages over five centuries share oxygen's discovery. Advances in physiology education, 40(3), 370-376.
:In particular the early studies did not "discover" oxygen as a molecule or element but rather noted some properties and found steps towards purification. (The whole concept of "discovery" of these early elements makes no sense.) [[User:Johnjbarton|Johnjbarton]] ([[User talk:Johnjbarton|talk]]) 03:54, 29 May 2025 (UTC)
::I reworked the history section.  I would like to include more about the Cavendish/Priestley/Lavoisier outlined in the Severinghaus source. Cavendish showed Lavoisier that hydrogen and air produced water, a key to discrediting philogiston, but I want to find another source to confirm. But I think the current content is good enough for now. {{done}} [[User:Johnjbarton|Johnjbarton]] ([[User talk:Johnjbarton|talk]]) 18:53, 6 June 2025 (UTC)

== We know the objective is to reach a consensus for BrE. ==
{{hat|LTA infestation}}
There is the consensus template above for British English. Oxygen is international. [[Special:Contributions/2600:6C5A:557F:D058:FC51:A35B:329D:9634|2600:6C5A:557F:D058:FC51:A35B:329D:9634]] ([[User talk:2600:6C5A:557F:D058:FC51:A35B:329D:9634|talk]]) 23:26, 19 April 2025 (UTC)

:Can you link to the discussion that established that consensus? [[User:ZergTwo|ZergTwo]] ([[User talk:ZergTwo|talk]]) 23:36, 19 April 2025 (UTC)
::A discussion between 1101 & Zefr, Zefr accepted [[Special:Contributions/96.33.107.226|96.33.107.226]] ([[User talk:96.33.107.226|talk]]) 02:12, 27 April 2025 (UTC)
{{hab}}

== Consensus for BrE ==
<s>I would like a consensus to use BrE. [[Special:Contributions/96.33.107.226|96.33.107.226]] ([[User talk:96.33.107.226|talk]]) 02:19, 27 April 2025 (UTC) </s>
:I think the consensus should be here. [[User:Zefr|Zefr]] ([[User talk:Zefr|talk]]) 02:21, 25 April 2025 (UTC)
:I believe there shouldn't be without a good reason. [[User:ZergTwo|ZergTwo]] ([[User talk:ZergTwo|talk]]) 03:47, 27 April 2025 (UTC)
::<s>Here's the reason: This article is transcluden in other articles using British English. [[User:Theonepoppa6|Theonepoppa6]] ([[User talk:Theonepoppa6|talk]]) 20:45, 10 May 2025 (UTC)</s>
:::That's not really a reason, or if it were we'd have to throw out one guideline or the other. If one cares about that {{tlx|engvar}} can be made flexible. <span style="border-radius:2px;padding:3px;background:#1E816F">[[User:Remsense|<span style="color:#fff">'''Remsense'''</span>]]<span style="color:#fff">&nbsp;‥&nbsp;</span>[[User talk:Remsense|<span lang="zh" style="color:#fff">'''论'''</span>]]</span> 20:50, 10 May 2025 (UTC)
Comment: I struck some socks/evasion-IPs. [[User:DMacks|DMacks]] ([[User talk:DMacks|talk]]) 03:19, 18 May 2025 (UTC)

:What was the result of this discussion? [[User:Dotsenter21|Dotsenter21]] ([[User talk:Dotsenter21|talk]]) 01:06, 19 June 2025 (UTC)

== not to scale ==

The table "Ten most common elements" has bar graph but is labeled "not to scale". The entire point of a bar graph is to provide visual comparisons: it must be to scale to be useful. [[User:Johnjbarton|Johnjbarton]] ([[User talk:Johnjbarton|talk]]) 18:53, 28 May 2025 (UTC)

:Scaled. [[User:Keresluna|Keres🌕]][[User_talk:Keresluna|Luna]] <sup>[[Special:Contributions/Keresluna|edits!]]</sup> 15:01, 29 May 2025 (UTC)