View source for Talk:List of circulating currencies

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{{afd-merged-from|Highest-valued currency unit|Highest-valued currency unit|12 November 2013}}

== List by currency, not country ==
Can there be a version of this list that shows a list of currencies and what countries use them rather than a list showing countries and what currency they use? [[Special:Contributions/64.218.107.47|64.218.107.47]] ([[User talk:64.218.107.47|talk]]) 00:24, 24 October 2009 (UTC)
:There is another list at [[List of currencies]], except this list includes both current and historic currencies. – [[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 05:11, 24 October 2009 (UTC)
::Well, if that had circulating only, that'd be good. How about "List of circulating currencies by country"? [[Special:Contributions/64.218.107.47|64.218.107.47]] ([[User talk:64.218.107.47|talk]]) 22:07, 29 October 2009 (UTC)
:I don't think it's necessary to rename the article. – [[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 22:16, 29 October 2009 (UTC)
:: It is necessary because this list has clear criteria that bans circulating currencies that are not issued by a government.--[[User:HowardStrong|HowardStrong]] ([[User talk:HowardStrong|talk]]) 23:51, 25 October 2012 (UTC)
:::The table now sorts properly by name of currency. See §&nbsp;[[#Sorting the table by "Currency" |Sorting the table by "Currency"]]. --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 07:09, 28 December 2014 (UTC)

==Mils versus Dimes==
Note D groups Mils with Dime which can be misleading. I initially interpreted note D as meaning Zimbabwe had subdivided US$ into 1000 mils since unofficially adopting that currency. Adding that 10 cents is Dime in USA is both irrelevant and confusing to the note and the whole article. Many countries have names for various of their coins. [[User:Tiddy|Tiddy]] ([[User talk:Tiddy|talk]]) 02:33, 13 November 2009 (UTC)

:I don't think it's confusing, but how do you think it should be changed? – [[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 02:46, 13 November 2009 (UTC)

:Hi Zntrip. I notice the whole layout has been completely changed since my original comments. Other notes have been added giving individual examples of mils and any fractional units divided further into 10 mils. Obviously my previous comments did not relate to this revised layout. 
Note D now only appears against countries which use the US dollar so why retain the reference to mils? [[User:Tiddy|Tiddy]] ([[User talk:Tiddy|talk]]) 02:42, 19 November 2009 (UTC)

::The United States dollar is divided into dimes, cents, and mils; that is why all three are mentioned. – [[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 02:44, 19 November 2009 (UTC)

== Sortable table ==

I tried to make the table sortable (so you could list the countries by currency, for example), but the whole thing fell apart. And all I did was write "sortable" in front of "wikitable"...
So, do we want the table to be sortable, and what was the problem?--[[User:Mátyás|Mátyás]] ([[User talk:Mátyás|talk]]) 10:10, 30 August 2010 (UTC)

:I think the problem is that for some countries there are multiple currencies (i.e. there's a <code>rowspan="2"</code> for the first column which messes up the second table when it's sorted). I'm not too sure how to fix it, but I would imagine that it's possible. It would be nice for the table to be sortable. – [[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 19:15, 30 August 2010 (UTC)

== List non-sovereign entities under sovereign countries ==
Wouldn't it be better to list non-sovereign entities under the main countries? For example, the BES Islands are part of the Netherlands, but each is listed separately in the table. [[User:Pafelikaru|Pafelikaru]] ([[User talk:Pafelikaru|talk]]) 13:12, 12 December 2011 (UTC)
:The BES should be under the Netherlands entry then. [[User:Outback the koala|Outback the koala]] ([[User talk:Outback the koala|talk]]) 21:23, 12 December 2011 (UTC)

I would suggest a restructuring of the table on these lines:<br />
China, People's Republic of: Chinese yuan, Hong Kong dollar [Hong Kong], Macanese pataca [Macau]<br />
Netherlands, Kingdom of: Euro, US dollar [BES Islands], Aruban florin [Aruba], Netherlands Antilles Guilder [Curaçao, Sint Maarten]<br />
Alternatively, a new article could be created "List of circulating currencies by sovereign countries". [[User:Pafelikaru|Pafelikaru]] ([[User talk:Pafelikaru|talk]]) 05:40, 13 December 2011 (UTC)

== This list was never a list of ALL circulating currencies ==

A general title of "List of circulating currencies." is clearly inaccurate. To claim it is, is not neutral. Now, this is a list of circulating currencies within national/sovereign borders. The title should reflect that, thus the change to "List of circulating currencies by country". 

The consensus is Wikipedia needs to be a neutral, objective place.--[[User:HowardStrong|HowardStrong]] ([[User talk:HowardStrong|talk]]) 23:40, 25 October 2012 (UTC)

If somebody wants to create a list of ALL circulating currencies, they can. This page however is not that. It has specific criteria that would otherwise be subjectively applied under its original name. --[[User:HowardStrong|HowardStrong]] ([[User talk:HowardStrong|talk]]) 23:46, 25 October 2012 (UTC)
:I object to this move. No discussion has been made about it, nor has [[WP:RM|requested moves]] been used. I also disagree with the reasoning. It is entirely reasonable to exclude private scrip under the original title, as private scrips are not part of the common definition of the word "currency". Furthermore, several examples on this list are not countries, therefore, the current title is misleading. Therefore, I am moving this article back. If you want it moved, use our [[WP:RM|requested moves]] procedure. [[User:Heimstern|Heimstern Läufer]] [[User talk:Heimstern|(talk)]] 02:15, 26 October 2012 (UTC)

== use of italics? ==

Why are ''italics'' sometimes used for the country names? Is it because of defacto currency status? If so, the notes or table introduction should explain. – [[User:Srich32977|S. Rich]] ([[User talk:Srich32977|talk]]) 20:42, 9 February 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for the fix. – [[User:Srich32977|S. Rich]] ([[User talk:Srich32977|talk]]) 21:07, 9 February 2013 (UTC)

:Thanks for pointing it out. – [[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 21:08, 9 February 2013 (UTC)

:: For whatever reason, Ascension Island was still italicized. I took the italics out. --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 20:03, 27 January 2015 (UTC)

== North Korea == 
North Korea is officially the Democratic People's Republic of Korea, and sometimes get hot under the collar (well, by its standards mildly warm) about the name. (As they see it, being called _North_ is acknowledgement that it isn’t the government of the South.)

However, I don’t know the correct name for the currency. [[User:JDAWiseman|JDAWiseman]] ([[User talk:JDAWiseman|talk]]) 12:20, 25 September 2013 (UTC)

:I see nothing wrong with the name as it appears in the list. – [[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 23:18, 25 September 2013 (UTC)

== Stop. Edit. Warring! ==

Re <s>[https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=List_of_circulating_currencies&action=history]</s>  [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=List_of_circulating_currencies&action=history&year=2013&month=11&tagfilter=].
::<small>To make sense of this, it helps to have about the same history that {{u|Volunteer Marek}} was talking about. They posted this comment 18:07, 13 November 2013 (UTC). The latest history change before that was 16:35, 13 November 2013‎, by {{u|2Awwsome}}, whose username now is evidently {{u|☼}}. --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 03:29, 19 September 2015 (UTC)</small>

Look. I'm getting tired of your disruptive behavior, here and on several other articles. With respect to this particular issue:

The AfD suggested merging/redirecting but the main suggestion was to leave a short note, not the whole freakin' table.

You really really really really need to read [[WP:OR]]. Just because there's a citation added at the end *does not* mean it's not original research. The good folks who wrote WP:OR even spell this out explicitly and bold the relevant parts for you:

"To demonstrate that you are not adding OR, you must be able to cite reliable, published sources that are '''directly related''' to the topic of the article, and '''directly support''' the material being presented"

Can you please read that? I'm getting sick and tired of asking you.

Neither the link to some random exchange rate website, nor the "sources" at the end of the "Least valued currency unit" are '''directly''' related to the concept of a "least/highest valued currency unit" nor do they '''directly''' support the text. For the sources to be relevant they have to be '''about''' the concept of a "highest/least valued currency unit". All you got here is just websites which quote exchange rates and a bunch of irrelevant websites. And as was shown at the AfD *there are no sources* for "highest/least valued currency unit", most likely because such concepts are meaningless and stupid.

So when you say in your edit summary ''" it can't be original research if the sources explicitly say it"'' you are either making stuff up or you don't know what the word "explicitly" means.

As to the argument that I'm removing it only per [[WP:IDONTLIKEIT]], that's nonsense too. Of course, I don't like it, it's junk material that has no place in an encyclopedia. But I am not removing it per "I don't like it" (however I feel about it), I'm removing it per [[WP:NOR]], which is one of Wikipedia pillars.

Finally, please stop referring to other editors edits as "vandalism" when they clearly are not.

More generally, you really need to cut it out with the disruptive behavior, the edit warring and the revenge reverting. <small><span style="border:1px solid black;padding:1px;">[[User:Volunteer Marek|<span style="color:blue;background:orange;font-family:sans-serif;">'''&nbsp;Volunteer Marek&nbsp;'''</span>]]</span></small> 18:07, 13 November 2013 (UTC)
:It's not original research if it's sourced. You really need to read policies. The sources directly support the material. Now go vandalise some other wiki. [[User:2Awwsome|2Awwsome]]<sup>[[User talk:2Awwsome|Tell me where I screwed up]]. [[Special:Contributions/2Awwsome|See where I screwed up]]</sup> 18:24, 13 November 2013 (UTC)
::The claim, "it's not original research if it's sourced" displays a fundamental misunderstanding of [[WP:NOR]].  No original research means that, even if there are sources for a given point, you can't use them to produce something fundamentally new - which is precisely what this table is.  The source does not order currencies by value of the base unit.  Calling the edit vandalism is far from appropriate and could be taken as a [[WP:NPA|personal attack]].  I '''support''' Volunteer Marek's wording and '''oppose''' 2Awwsome's. ''[[User:Kahastok|Kahastok]]'' <small>''[[User Talk:Kahastok|talk]]''</small> 19:49, 13 November 2013 (UTC)

:::I think that this article is a completely inappropriate place to add this information. This is a list of currencies, plain and simple. This information is completely outside of the scope of the list. If we want to make a not about what the most valuable currency is, that can be done on the individual article for that specific currency. –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 21:45, 13 November 2013 (UTC)

::::{{anchor|up to date}}One suggestion on the AFD page I saw some consensus for was to add exchange information as one or more additional columns on this article. Then a person interested in "most/least value" can sort the currencies by their exchange rates in USD and/or EUR. The exchange information would not always be up to date, however. [[User:Breadblade|Breadblade]] ([[User talk:Breadblade|talk]]) 21:54, 13 November 2013 (UTC)

:::::The biggest problem, as you pointed out, is that there would be no practical way to keep that information up to date. Someone would have to update a lot of information at regular intervals to make sure that the list is accurate. I think a simpler solution would be to have a link or two in the external link section to currency conversion sites. –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 02:36, 14 November 2013 (UTC)


:::::Agree with Zntrip and Kahastok. The only viable and relevant suggestion at the AfD was to just make a short mention that the Kuwaiti dinar trades for more currency units than any other unit (this isn't exactly true, the Kuwaiti dinar is subdivided into 1000 units rather than a hundred, so it's "sort of" like comparing the 10 $ bill to the dinar). I left a note in the article to that effect but removed the table overall. More generally an encyclopedia shouldn't be in business of providing information on volatile and ever changing prices. We don't have lists of stock market quotes, and there's no reason to have the prices of currencies either.<small><span style="border:1px solid black;padding:1px;">[[User:Volunteer Marek|<span style="color:blue;background:orange;font-family:sans-serif;">'''&nbsp;Volunteer Marek&nbsp;'''</span>]]</span></small> 05:04, 14 November 2013 (UTC)

::::::That sounds agreeable to me. A lot of people who were arguing that these statistics are important and useful were really just arguing that xe.com is useful, since everything in the merged article could be found there. [[User:Breadblade|Breadblade]] ([[User talk:Breadblade|talk]]) 14:45, 14 November 2013 (UTC)
:::::::I added a source, so now it's definitely not OR, and that means that there is now ''no'' valid reason to delete the entry for the ''highest''. [[User:2Awwsome|2Awwsome]]<sup>[[User talk:2Awwsome|Tell me where I screwed up]]. [[Special:Contributions/2Awwsome|See where I screwed up]]</sup> 19:11, 16 November 2013 (UTC)
::::::::Is that the most reputable and trustworthy source out there that talks about this? [[User:Breadblade|Breadblade]] ([[User talk:Breadblade|talk]]) 21:23, 16 November 2013 (UTC)
:::::::::That's not a reliable source but just a Wikipedia mirror.<small><span style="border:1px solid black;padding:1px;">[[User:Volunteer Marek|<span style="color:blue;background:orange;font-family:sans-serif;">'''&nbsp;Volunteer Marek&nbsp;'''</span>]]</span></small> 21:58, 16 November 2013 (UTC)
::::::::::That's not a mirror, look at the formatting. and the page is different. [[User:2Awwsome|2Awwsome]]<sup>[[User talk:2Awwsome|Tell me where I screwed up]]. [[Special:Contributions/2Awwsome|See where I screwed up]]</sup> 16:02, 18 November 2013 (UTC)
:::::::::::Sigh. Yes, yes it is. That page went up April 2012. The exact same wording was present in the Wikipedia article as early as 2010 [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Highest-valued_currency_unit&oldid=370570890] if not long before. The stupid mirror page copied a stupid Wikipedia article. It's not a reliable source.<small><span style="border:1px solid black;padding:1px;">[[User:Volunteer Marek|<span style="color:blue;background:orange;font-family:sans-serif;">'''&nbsp;Volunteer Marek&nbsp;'''</span>]]</span></small> 12:33, 19 November 2013 (UTC)
::::::::::::You obviously don't know what a [[mirror site]] is. [[User:2Awwsome|2Awwsome]]<sup>[[User talk:2Awwsome|Tell me where I screwed up]]. [[Special:Contributions/2Awwsome|See where I screwed up]]</sup> 19:35, 23 November 2013 (UTC)
:::::::::::::Mirror or no mirror it's not a reliable source. Regardless, all of that is beside the point because there isn't even consensus to include information on exchange rates and currency value in this article. –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 20:16, 23 November 2013 (UTC)

:2Awwsome, my opposition to the inclusion of the information is that it is outside of the scope of the list. This article is a list of currencies that are currently circulated as legal tender. Information about the relative value of currencies is outside the scope of the list and is not easy to maintain. Can you make a case as to why it should be included? Simply having sources for information is not the same as a reason for including the information. –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 19:19, 16 November 2013 (UTC)
::The AfD said '''merge''', not '''delete and redirect'''. I will be forced to re-add it to the original page unless you stop removing it. [[User:2Awwsome|2Awwsome]]<sup>[[User talk:2Awwsome|Tell me where I screwed up]]. [[Special:Contributions/2Awwsome|See where I screwed up]]</sup> 19:25, 16 November 2013 (UTC)

:::The outcome of the AfD does not mean that the content is just copy and pasted to this page to remain here in perpetuity. All article content is subject to the consensus of the community. This talk page exists for formulating consensus, of which there is currently none with regard to the inclusion of information relating to currency value. If you think there is a good reason for including that information, please explain it here. –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 19:40, 16 November 2013 (UTC)
::::Just to be clear, there *is* consensus for *not* including that information. That's not the same as *no consensus* for one way or the other.<small><span style="border:1px solid black;padding:1px;">[[User:Volunteer Marek|<span style="color:blue;background:orange;font-family:sans-serif;">'''&nbsp;Volunteer Marek&nbsp;'''</span>]]</span></small> 21:57, 23 November 2013 (UTC)
:::::No, that's not what the discussion said. It said MERGE and as I understand it, that means the info from both articles into one, into THIS article and not removing and deleting it. Also see at the top of this page! There is definitely NO consensus for deleting and removing all the information, except between you and yourself... --[[User:Maxl|Maxl]] ([[User talk:Maxl|talk]]) 22:01, 28 January 2014 (UTC)

== List of least valued currency units? ==

Where did that list go and why is there a redirect to this list now? I cannot find any discussion about a deletion of the list of least valued currency units. And I believe it was an article that made sense. Who, er... took the liberty to delete all the info? --[[User:Maxl|Maxl]] ([[User talk:Maxl|talk]]) 21:48, 28 January 2014 (UTC)
:ok, I found a deletion discussion now. However, the outcome was MERGE and not DELETE and REDIRECT. So why doesn't the info show up in this article? Did someone a trick to first attempt to merge the list and then to stealthily delete the info from this page? I think the informatiopn MUST be put back at least into this page if not the original article is to be restored. As far as I can tell from the deletion debate it was a single person who disliked the article and who pushed all this through. I don't think that's fair to other Wikipedians. Fancy enough, all the old edits in the former article which existed befor the redirect are gone, something that is definitely odd as it is not normally done. Something went wrong here, very wrong. --[[User:Maxl|Maxl]] ([[User talk:Maxl|talk]]) 21:57, 28 January 2014 (UTC)
:: So that's why I haven't been able to find it.  Can someone please point me to the discussion about why it was deleted?  [[User:Gecko G|Gecko G]] ([[User talk:Gecko G|talk]]) 00:47, 29 January 2014 (UTC)

:::You can see the deletion discussion [[Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Highest-valued currency unit|here]]. The result of that discussion was "merge" to this article. However, the editors of this article, by consensus, did not merge any of the material (you can see the discussion in the preceding section on this talk page). Thus, the article is now a redirect. –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 04:09, 29 January 2014 (UTC)

::::Thanks Zntrip, but that is the one for the Highest-valued currency unit page.  However, I'm looking for the one on the lowest-valued currency unit.  In particular I want to know what the problem was with the table showing what was the lowest valued currency base unit at different points in history. [[User:Gecko G|Gecko G]] ([[User talk:Gecko G|talk]]) 01:27, 30 January 2014 (UTC)

:::::The discussion was for both lists. Right after the first nomination paragraph, it says, "I am also nominating the following related pages for obvious reasons: Least-valued currency unit". –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 03:55, 30 January 2014 (UTC)

:::Whatever non-pure-original-research material there was in the other article was merged into that one. Unfortunately that was pretty much nothing. [[User:Volunteer Marek|Volunteer Marek]] ([[User talk:Volunteer Marek|talk]]) 07:09, 29 January 2014 (UTC)

==The [[Abkhazian apsar]] is NOT a circulating currency!==

The Abkhazian apsar is NOT a circulating currency at all. The [[Russian rouble]] circulates in [[Abkhazia]], but the apsar is purely a [[medal-coin]] currency unit struck in gold & silver for sale to collectors in the numismatic community, just like the [[Krugerrand]] - ([[Special:Contributions/203.211.71.228|203.211.71.228]] ([[User talk:203.211.71.228|talk]]) 09:22, 8 March 2014 (UTC))

:There is already a note in the list that clarified this. –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 21:36, 8 March 2014 (UTC)
::It seems to merit more than a note and should be excluded from the list if it's not in general circulation.  If nobody objects, I recommend removal. [[User:Adamnelson|Adamnelson]] ([[User talk:Adamnelson|talk]]) 09:57, 20 March 2023 (UTC)

== List affiliated entities ==

I think it would be helpful to add the [[ISO 3166-1]] entities which share the administrating jurisdiction's currency.  Then this would be useful as a lookup table for the entire world.  Otherwise, it's somewhat unclear whether a given entity shares the same currency or has just been forgotten.  Not everyone knows which territories belong to which administrator, either. -- [[User:Beland|Beland]] ([[User talk:Beland|talk]]) 22:52, 21 March 2014 (UTC)

:{{ping|Beland}} I removed [[Template:incomplete]], which goes on articles to label them as needing improvement, not on talk pages to say that "Hey, this comment is here to say part of the article's incomplete." --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 01:26, 25 August 2015 (UTC)

::{{replyto|Thnidu}} I like putting [[Template:incomplete]] on talk pages so it doesn't mar the article for a minor request, but still puts it into the [[:Category:Articles to be expanded]] system.  But, since you didn't want it on the talk page, I added it to the article itself. -- [[User:Beland|Beland]] ([[User talk:Beland|talk]]) 01:32, 25 August 2015 (UTC)

:::{{ping|Beland}} {{ping|Thnidu}} I really don't want to escalate this, but I think it was highly inappropriate to add the tag to the article. While an editor may have a preference that the list be organized a certain way, the fact that it is not organized that way does make the list incomplete. –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 03:17, 25 August 2015 (UTC)

::::Well, maybe this is better handled by wikidata anyway. [https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:List_of_properties/Geographical_feature/en#Administrative_territorial_entity] -- [[User:Beland|Beland]] ([[User talk:Beland|talk]]) 03:57, 25 August 2015 (UTC)

== "None" ==

These "None"s make no sense (let alone cents or centavos):

{|class="wikitable sortable"
|- bgcolor="#cccccc"
! [[Country]] or [[territory (country subdivision)|territory]]<ref name="CIA">{{cite web |title=Field Listing: Exchange Rates |url=https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/fields/2076.html |accessdate=2013-12-06 |work=[[The World Factbook]] |publisher=[[Central Intelligence Agency]]}}</ref>
! [[Currency]]<ref name="CIA"/><ref name="ISO">{{cite web |url=http://www.currency-iso.org/en/home/tables/table-a1.html |title=Current currency & funds code list |accessdate=2013-12-06 |publisher=[[Swiss Association for Standardization]]}}</ref>
! [[Currency sign|Sign]]<ref name="ubc">{{cite web |last=Antweiler |first=Werner |title=Currencies of the World |url=http://fx.sauder.ubc.ca/currency_table.html |year=2006 |accessdate=2006-12-05 |publisher=[[University of British Columbia]]}}</ref>
! width=20px | [[ISO 4217|ISO code]]<ref name="ISO"/>
! width=45px | Fractional unit
! width=30px | Number to basic
|-
| rowspan="2" | {{flag|East Timor}}
| [[United States dollar]]
| $
| USD
| [[Cent (currency)|Cent]]{{Ref label|mills|D|D}}
| 100
|- 
| None
| None
| None
| [[East Timor centavo coins|Centavo]]
| None
|-
| rowspan="2" | {{flag|Ecuador}}
| [[United States dollar]]
| $
| USD
| [[Cent (currency)|Cent]]{{Ref label|mills|D|D}}
| 100
|-
| None
| None
| None
| [[Ecuadorian centavo coins|Centavo]]
| None
|-
|}

According to the column headers, that means
:Oh, by the way, besides the US dollar there also ''isn't'' another currency. This nonexistent currency has no sign or ISO code but does have a fractional unit called the centavo, which has no ratio to the basic unit. 
What nonsense! Yes, it's explained in the notes, but try this instead:

{|class="wikitable sortable"
|-
| rowspan="2" | {{flag|East Timor}}
| [[United States dollar]]
| $
| USD
| [[Cent (currency)|Cent]]{{Ref label|mills|D|D}}
| 100
|- 
| colspan="5" | Local coins are also used for fractional denominations; one [[East Timor centavo coins |centavo]] {{=}} one U.S. cent.
|-
| rowspan="2" | {{flag|Ecuador}}
| [[United States dollar]]
| $
| USD
| [[Cent (currency)|Cent]]{{Ref label|mills|D|D}}
| 100
|-
| colspan="5" | Local coins are also used for fractional denominations; one [[Ecuadorian centavo coins|centavo]] {{=}} one U.S. cent.
|-
|}

I'm putting a link to this Talk page section on the pages of the (five!) projects listed at the top here.  {{tl|ping}} me if you want to discuss it. --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 06:18, 4 April 2014 (UTC)
:{{Replyto|Thnidu}} I think your plan makes sense. <span style="font-family:copperplate gothic light;">[[User:Chris troutman|<span style="color:#36454F">Chris Troutman</span>]] ([[User talk:Chris troutman|<span style="color:#36454F">talk</span>]])</span> 06:42, 4 April 2014 (UTC)

::Thanks, [[User:Chris troutman|Chris]]. With your comment and a thanks from [[User:Jonpatterns]], I'm '''boldly''' making the change.
::BTW, I found it odd that the only two such entries in the table were adjacent; and while Ecuador is adjacent to Panama, I couldn't see why East Timor should use US currency, and I was suspicious. But I found reliable documentation on a [http://www.un.org/en/peacekeeping/missions/past/etimor/untaetPU/currency.pdf UN peacekeeping mission page] (2000) and [https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/geos/tt.html the CIA World Factbook] (March 25, 2014). --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 12:58, 4 April 2014 (UTC)
::: That make more sense now. it is curious that the only two countries listed as using cents and centavos begin with E. [[User:Jonpatterns|Jonpatterns]] ([[User talk:Jonpatterns|talk]]) 21:37, 4 April 2014 (UTC)


{{Reply to|Thnidu|Chris troutman|Jonpatterns}} Because the table is sortable, having a row that spans multiple columns creates some problems. What would you all think of the following format?

{|class="wikitable sortable"
|- bgcolor="#cccccc"
! Country or territory
! Currency
! Sign
! width=20px | ISO code
! width=45px | Fractional unit
! width=30px | Number to basic
|-
| rowspan="2" | {{flag|East Timor}}
| [[United States dollar]]
| $
| USD
| [[Cent (currency)|Cent]]{{Ref label|mills|D|D}}
| 100
|- 
| —
| —
| —
| [[East Timor centavo coins|Centavo]]
| —
|-
| rowspan="2" | {{flag|Ecuador}}
| [[United States dollar]]
| $
| USD
| [[Cent (currency)|Cent]]{{Ref label|mills|D|D}}
| 100
|-
| —
| —
| —
| [[Ecuadorian centavo coins|Centavo]]
| —
|-
|}
–&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 22:17, 4 April 2014 (UTC)

:{{Reply to|Zntrip|Chris troutman|Jonpatterns}} Very nice, [[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]]. I've just put it in, and it sorts just fine. 
: I've added a note (<sup>[N]</sup>) to these two, saying essentially what I had in the colspanning cell: "Local coins are also used for this fractional denomination. See the link on the name for details." It's kind to the user to have the basic information on the same page.
:I've also replaced "None" with centered "''(none)''" throughout. This makes it easier to scan the table by eye for them. 
:Thanks, all, for your input! --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 02:09, 5 April 2014 (UTC)

<references />

== Improve accuracy ==

[[User: Zntrip|Zntrip]], this is my first time on what seems "your" page.
I came here, since you changed the category classification on [[Bitcoin]],with the edit summary: "Category:Circulating currencies contains only state-issued currencies". I dont see this piece of wisdom on your [[List of circulating currencies]] page.
My feedback :

*Add a (sourced) definition of "circulating currencies", i.e. as to what goes on this page.  
*When you say 'current', you need to insert "{{ as of| xx }}".  
*It s obvious, that virtual currencies are left out, here. It would help if you stated why.

Otherwise, you ought to expect reactions to your classification decision like "declared reason is completely irrelevant" from [[User:Ladislav Mecir|Ladislav]].
--[[User:Wuerzele|Wuerzele]] ([[User talk:Wuerzele|talk]]) 21:45, 25 October 2014 (UTC)

In the lead paragraph, there is a formulation: "... de facto currencies recognized as legal tender..." This formulation is self-contradicting, since any currency having the legal tender status is de jure currency, i.e., the opposite of de facto currency. This apparent inconsistency needs a correction. [[User:Ladislav Mecir|Ladislav Mecir]] ([[User talk:Ladislav Mecir|talk]]) 20:08, 26 October 2014 (UTC)

:You're right, I've removed it. –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 01:07, 27 October 2014 (UTC)

==Pleonasm in the name of the article==
According to the [[Currency]] article, the word "currency" means "circulating" in Latin. Therefore, "circulating currency" is a particularly ugly pleonasm, demonstrating poor knowledge of the terms. As such, it does not look appropriate as a part of the name of an encyclopedic article. [[User:Ladislav Mecir|Ladislav Mecir]] ([[User talk:Ladislav Mecir|talk]]) 08:55, 27 October 2014 (UTC)
 
:If you have a better idea don't keep it to yourself. –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 16:51, 27 October 2014 (UTC)

::I gave it a thought and since you are underlining that all the currencies in the list are legal tender, I would prefer something like "List of legal tender currencies", circulating being implied by the "currencies" word. Another, shorter, but equivalent-looking alternative might be "List of de jure currencies".[[User:Ladislav Mecir|Ladislav Mecir]] ([[User talk:Ladislav Mecir|talk]]) 18:19, 27 October 2014 (UTC)

:::The word "currency" does not imply "circulation" in the English language, even if the two have a common Latin root. There are currencies that don't circulate, such as those that are no longer in use. Regardless, I do like "List of legal tender currencies". –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 18:33, 27 October 2014 (UTC)

::::''The word "currency" does not imply "circulation" in the English language'' - actually, that is not true. According to Wikipedia (see the [[Currency]] definition): "money in any form when ''in actual use or circulation''". This excludes any former-, ex-, or historic currencies no longer functional as currencies. [[User:Ladislav Mecir|Ladislav Mecir]] ([[User talk:Ladislav Mecir|talk]]) 19:19, 27 October 2014 (UTC)

:::::I think you are being too precise to the point of absurdity. The definition of any noun is usually articulated in such a way as to apply to a current state of existence. For example, a common definition of "person" is "a living human" and a common definition of "car" is "a wheeled, self-powered motor vehicle used for transporting passengers". It would not be a pleonasm to say "living person" or "working car", just as it would not be a pleonasm to say "circulating currency". –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 19:34, 27 October 2014 (UTC)

::::::''For example, a common definition of "person" is "a living human"'' - have to disagree. "Person" is defined as "human being". As opposed to that, "currency" is defined as "money ... when in actual use...", so there ''is'' a difference. I think that the accuracy of the article is lamentable, taking into account all the problems discussed. Wikipedia editors are not supposed to use new, unpublished terminology like "unit of exchange" (any citation?), "circulating currency" (any citation?), write whatever comes to mind like "de facto currency is legal tender", or write unpublished definitions like "we define circulating currency as legal tender" (which source?). I must also note that I did not read more than a couple of sentences, but my findings convince me that the accuracy of the article is not based on reliable sources. [[User:Ladislav Mecir|Ladislav Mecir]] ([[User talk:Ladislav Mecir|talk]]) 00:18, 28 October 2014 (UTC)

:::::::You are free to make edits to the article as you see fit. If something sounds stupid, go ahead and change it. However, the list does not claim that "circulating currencies" is a term of art or a technical phrase. "Circulating" is simply an adjective used to concisely describe the scope of the article. I already said that I do not object to renaming the article ''List of legal tender currencies''. I simply stated that I object to your argument that "circulating currencies" is a pleonasm, because there are currencies that are no longer in circulation. –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 02:34, 28 October 2014 (UTC)

{{od|:::::::}} Whatever the technical, formal definition of ''currency'' may specify when used by bankers, collectors, and lawyers, in everyday English the word carries none of the implication of "at the present time" that goes with the word ''current'' (or its adverb ''currently''). Though the two clearly look related if one thinks about them, and in fact do have a common ancestry, to most native speakers of English neither word automatically suggests the other, and ''currency'' is just a formal word for "money in tangible form; medium of exchange".  [[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 00:46, 29 October 2014 (UTC)

== Amount outstanding for each ==
It would be interesting to add a column showing the value of each currency outstanding in cash (or some similar metric, whatever sources commonly report), converted to international dollars or something standard.  Or, we could make this a separate list.  I was curious today which currencies are most widely used in practice, and this would be valuable information to have in the encyclopedia somewhere. -- [[User:Beland|Beland]] ([[User talk:Beland|talk]]) 00:04, 19 November 2014 (UTC)

:I've taken out the "incomplete" tag, which is intended to be used in articles, not on talk pages, as it reads
::This section or list '''is incomplete'''. Please help to improve it, or discuss the issue on the '''talk page'''. ''[Boldface in original]''
:Note that such a list would require constant care and updating, especially if expressed in some conversion rather than units of the currency itself. See [[#up to date|these two comments]] (Breadblade <small>(21:54, 13 November 2013)</small> and Zntrip <small>(02:36, 14 November 2013)</small>) above.
:Speaking of which, I'd never heard of an "international dollar", so I googled it and found a WP article [[Geary–Khamis dollar]]. It begins
::The '''Geary–Khamis dollar''', more commonly known as the '''international dollar''', is a hypothetical unit of currency that has the same purchasing power parity that the U.S. dollar had in the United States at a given point in time. It is widely used in economics. 
:[[International dollar]] redirects there. --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 07:14, 20 November 2014 (UTC)

== Criteria for inclusion ==

Can anyone please explain why exactly are "currencies used by non-state entities, like the Sovereign Military Order of Malta, scrips used by private entities, and other private and alternative currencies" excluded?  [[User:Mrcatzilla|Mrcatzilla]] ([[User talk:Mrcatzilla|talk]]) 19:13, 30 November 2014 (UTC)

:This is just a guess, but: Where would you draw the line? A car wash in my neighborhood puts out coupons that look like US currency at first glance. Would you count those? Nation-states and their dependencies form a reasonably well defined set, small enough to work with and maintain. --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 21:03, 30 November 2014 (UTC)

::I would think a good cutoff would be a currency's market cap, so to speak - total value as expressed in, for instance, USD. The cutoff would still have to be some arbitrary number, true. I'd suggest $1 billion. [[User:Mrcatzilla|Mrcatzilla]] ([[User talk:Mrcatzilla|talk]]) 17:55, 2 December 2014 (UTC)

:Is it to keep the article from becoming a bitcoin circle jerk? If so, I'm all for it [[User:EditorInTheRye|EditorInTheRye]] ([[User talk:EditorInTheRye|talk]]) 22:58, 2 December 2014 (UTC)

::I wouldn't count on that if I were you. A "market cap" criterion might at some point exclude the legal currency of some very small country while including something like bitcoins or some local private currency. I'm not saying that WP should ignore the latter two, but they should not be confused with legal tender. Let me quote the lede (emphasis added):
:::This list contains the 180 '''currencies recognized as legal tender''' in United Nations (UN) member states, UN observer states, partially recognized or unrecognized states, and their dependencies. Dependencies and unrecognized states are listed here only if another currency is used in their territory that is different from the one of the state that administers them or has jurisdiction over them.
::This clearly defines the target topic of the article. 
::If other types of currency are to be described, it should be in (a) separate article/s, with ''See also'' or disambiguating hatnotes. If such articles are added, it might be appropriate to rename this one, of course with hatnotes &/or a [[WP:DAB|DAB]] page. --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 01:13, 7 December 2014 (UTC)

== Tokelau ==

Somehow [[Tokelau]] is missing from the list. Its article says ''New Zealand dollar (NZD)'', so why is it absent? Other NZ territories, Cook Islands and Niue, as well as UK territory Pitcairn Islands are listed with "New Zealand dollar". [[Special:Contributions/82.141.117.146|82.141.117.146]] ([[User talk:82.141.117.146|talk]]) 09:39, 16 December 2014 (UTC)

:From the article's introduction: ''Dependencies and unrecognized states are listed here only if another currency is used in their territory that is different from the one of the state that administers them or has jurisdiction over them.'' –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 18:33, 16 December 2014 (UTC)

::Oh sorry, I did not see that Cook Islands and Niue have their own dollars also. I had arranged the table by the currency... [[Special:Contributions/82.141.117.146|82.141.117.146]] ([[User talk:82.141.117.146|talk]]) 03:10, 19 December 2014 (UTC)

{{anchor|Sorting_the_table_by_.22Currency.22_is_useless}}
== Sorting the table by "Currency" ==

I was looking to see what countries (etc.) call their currency the ruble. Guess what? The table sort by '''Currency''' is useless for that, because all the "Currency" entries begin with a "State or Territory" name. Is there any way to make the sort refer to the actual name of the currency unit rather than the political unit that (because modifiers precede the noun in English) comes first in the cell? 

If you would like to discuss this with me, please {{Tn|Ping}} me. [[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 09:06, 23 December 2014 (UTC)

:{{Ping|Thnidu}} I see what you mean and I see how this is a problem. The best idea I have is to change the sorting for all the currencies. For example: "<nowiki>{{Sort|Dollar, United States|United States dollar}}</nowiki>" would still make the entry appear as "United States dollar", but make it sort as "Dollar, United States". –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 17:58, 23 December 2014 (UTC)

::{{ping|Zntrip}} Mph. Several hours' work at the least, though I can think of ways to speed it up, and best done in a sandbox, then pasted. Okay, thanks. I may well undertake it. --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 19:00, 23 December 2014 (UTC)
::''(memo to self: study [[Template:Sort]])''

It is useless, if you want to see that. But, there is [[List of currencies]], which has the currencies just as wished. Though that list does not tell which are circulating and which not. [[Special:Contributions/82.141.117.146|82.141.117.146]] ([[User talk:82.141.117.146|talk]]) 22:16, 27 December 2014 (UTC)
:{{ping|82.141.117.146}} Take a look at the table now, and the discussion [[Talk:List_of_circulating_currencies#Sorting the table by "Currency"|here]] since your comment. --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 19:22, 28 December 2014 (UTC)

:{{ping|Zntrip}} I've edited the table so '''Currency''' sorts by ''<name of currency>, <modifier>''. The "name of currency" here is the last word in the text. "Modifier" is whatever precedes it, usually just the adjectival name of the State or territory, but sometimes something else. 
:*Most often, that's "CFA" coming between "Central African" or "West African" and "franc"; these all sort first as "franc", then by the full modifier. 
:*"Bosnia and Herzegovina convertible mark" sorts as "mark".
:*"Cuban convertible peso" sorts as "peso".
:*"Peruvian nuevo sol" sorts as "sol".
:*The euro is just a "euro".


:All diacritized letters sort as their plain ASCII counterparts: 
:*The Vietnamese ''đồng'' as "dong" instead of "đồng", which would come after all the Latin-1 letters.
:*The Faroese and Icelandic ''króna''s as "krona", before "Swedish krona" instead of after it.
:Comments? --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 07:07, 28 December 2014 (UTC)
:PS: I've put a short note on the Talk page of each of the 5 wikiprojects named at the top of this page, briefly describing what I've done and pointing to this Talk section. --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 07:31, 28 December 2014 (UTC)

::{{Ping|Thnidu}} Very nice work! The sorting system you used makes the most sense and works very well. I've made two minor corrections, but it all looks really good to me. –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 08:20, 28 December 2014 (UTC)

:::{{Ping|Zntrip}} Thank you! — I've also just fixed the last column, "number to basic", to sort numerically, using <code>data-sort-type="number"</code>. I don't know how to get the order-of-magnitude separators in with that, though, so the cells that were '''1,000''' are now '''1000''' without the comma. --19:17, 28 December 2014 (UTC)

{{anchor|sort_fraction}}
:::{{Ping|Zntrip}} I've applied the same method to "Fractional unit". I've also made "''(none)''" and "—" sort as null string (""), which sorts prior to anything else. --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 04:40, 29 December 2014 (UTC)

I didn't think it would be like this, but it is very good. Nice job! [[Special:Contributions/82.141.117.146|82.141.117.146]] ([[User talk:82.141.117.146|talk]]) 05:02, 1 January 2015 (UTC)
:{{ping|82.141.117.146}} (I don't know if you'll get this ping, but) thank you! --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 07:23, 3 January 2015 (UTC)


{{ping|Zntrip}} I've added a note to the head of the section as an HTML comment. --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 16:38, 24 July 2015 (UTC)

== Crimea ==

Adding [[Crimea]], which officially uses only the Russian ruble as of June 1, 2014. See
* http://rt.com/business/162992-crimea-adopts-ruble-currency/ 
* http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-06-01/crimea-adopts-ruble-as-ukraine-continues-battling-rebels.html
I found these sources in [[Crimea#References]]. I have checked them both, and they both say this clearly. To discuss this with me, please {{Tn|Ping}} me. --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 01:27, 26 January 2015 (UTC)

:{{anchor|better_solution}}{{Ping|Thnidu}} I don't think Crimea should be a separate entry on the list. It is a disputed territory that uses the currency of the state which currently occupies it. I think a better solution would be to include the Russian ruble as a currency that circulates in Ukraine. A note can be included to say that the currency is only used in the parts occupied by Russia or pro-Russian separatists. –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 22:38, 26 January 2015 (UTC)

::{{Ping|Zntrip}} Makes sense. Done. --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 04:14, 27 January 2015 (UTC)

:::{{Ping|Thnidu}} Looks good, thanks. –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 04:32, 27 January 2015 (UTC)

::::{{Ping|Zntrip}}  YIKES! I just edited the table to get Ascension Island sorting right, and now the whole page is screwed up and I don't know why! I'm going to diff and see what I can do, and undo that last change if I can't figure it out. --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 04:43, 27 January 2015 (UTC)
::::{{Ping|Zntrip}} Whew! It's OK now. Must be something massively cockamamie with the Sort, Flag, or Flagicon template. --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 04:48, 27 January 2015 (UTC)


{{Ping|95.133.103.230|Zntrip}} I have undone the last two changes, which were made by this anonymous user (and were their only edits). The first has already been discussed; see [[#better_solution|above]] in this section. The second, apparently a good faith attempt to maintain the table, screwed it up. Please {{Tn|Ping}} me to discuss. --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 15:45, 24 July 2015 (UTC)

== Symbols: character vs. image ==

While it's a very good thing that Unicode is incorporating more currency symbols— [http://www.unicode.org/charts/PDF/U20A0.pdf Unicode Version 7.0, Currency Symbols] now uses 30 codepoints (U20A0–U20BD) out of its 48 (U20A0–U20CF)— it's not safe to assume that everybody has fonts that support those characters. For example, [[Unicode#Versions|Unicode 7.0]], the first version to incorporate the [[Russian_ruble#Currency_symbol|Russian ruble sign]], has been out for less than a year.

I noticed this problem just now, when I saw that the Abkhazian tenge symbol was represented on my screen by a "character unavailable" block with the hex digits 20B8. I'm changing that to the file image [[:File:Kazakhstani tenge symbol.svg]], at 9 pixel width: [[File:Kazakhstani tenge symbol.svg|9px]]. --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 18:53, 27 March 2015 (UTC)

== Fractional units ==

{{ping|Zntrip}} In your {{diff|title=List_of_circulating_currencies |diff=676724425 |oldid=676714607| label=most recent edit here}}, reverting another editor's deletion of the Japanese ''sen'', you said in the edit comment "fractional units are still used in finance and accounting". I agree entirely that we should list the ''sen'', the US mill, and other purely notional fractions, but is that clear enough from the text?:
:A currency is a kind of money and medium of exchange. Currency includes paper, cotton, or polymer banknotes and metal coins. States generally have a monopoly on the issuing of currency, although some states share currencies with other states. For the purposes of this list, only currencies that are legal tender, including those used in actual commerce or issued for commemorative purposes, are considered "circulating currencies".
ISTM that a reasonable reader could well conclude that we are only listing ''currency that exists physically'', namely coins and notes. A close reading of the paragraph could lead to the correct conclusion, that we are making no such exclusion; but the very fact that it takes a close reading is enough to call for a clearer statement. --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 19:12, 21 August 2015 (UTC)

:{{ping|Thnidu}} I have to admit that my edit summary did not reflect my complete reasoning on the matter. It seems that the easiest approach is to include all fractional units, even those that exist only on paper. The only thing that matters is that the currency in question is legal tender; the fractional unit column simply tells a reader what a 1/100 of that unit is called. –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 03:22, 25 August 2015 (UTC)

::{{ping| Zntrip}} I've added a sentence to the Criteria § making it explicit that we are including non-physical fractional units defined by the regulating government. --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 11:23, 25 August 2015 (UTC)

== Bitcoin again ==

{{ping|JeffWiant}} When you {{diff|List_of_circulating_currencies|diff=677501889|oldid=676724425|label=added Bitcoin}} into the table, you commented 
:Added Bitcoin as a circulating currency. Citing the www.blockchain.info as proof of widespread circulation around the globe (and growing volume.) It'd be great to have the formal BItcoin logo and "B" currency symbol added to this content. Thanks
This may seem like a good reason, and I assume you acted in good faith, but it does not meet the criteria that are plainly stated in the [[List_of_circulating_currencies#Criteria_for_inclusion|lead paragraph]] of the section (boldface added):
:For the purposes of this list, only currencies that are [[legal tender]], including those used in actual commerce or issued for commemorative purposes, are considered "circulating currencies". Currencies used by non-state entities, like the [[Sovereign Military Order of Malta]], [[scrip]]s used by private entities, and '''other [[Private currency|private]] and [[Alternative currency|alternative]] currencies are not under the purview of this list.'''

{{anchor|first-removal}}When an anonymous user {{diff|List_of_circulating_currencies|677512010|677511752|removed it and explained why in the edit summary}}— "Remove Bitcoin, as it does not meet the page criteria" — you put it back, still ignoring the criteria and the user's comment. This time it's hard to suppose that you still weren't aware of the criteria. 

This exact question has been [[Talk:List_of_circulating_currencies#Criteria_for_inclusion|discussed before]]. Please do not put Bitcoin back into the list. You are already on the edge of [[WP:ER|edit warring]]; don't step over the line. --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 00:38, 24 August 2015 (UTC)

'''{{ping|Thnidu}}''' When my first edit (adding Bitcoin) was removed, I was never notified why it was removed. As such, I added it back in. Thanks for providing the explanation. What criteria is not met? Obviously Bitcoin is legal tender (the US Internal Revenue Service has guidance on how to pay taxes on its use), it's used in actual commerce (many companies use it for payment for goods or services), it isn't "used by non-state entities" only, and it isn't used only "by private entities". It's supported by many Governments, as evidenced by their allowing it to exist and be used for payments. I won't cross the line and add the edit back but if an opportunity exists to evaluate Bitcoin's inclusion in the list I formally ask that the discussion be held. '''Additionally (and more importantly) I ask that Wikipedia consider accepting Bitcoin for donations! I'll donate to Wikipedia (and try to get others to) if you decide to accept Bitcoin.''' Thanks and an enjoy your week! --[[User:JeffWiant|JeffWiant]] 03:33, 24 August 2015 (UTC)

:{{ping|JeffWiant}} You're new to Wikipedia, so you may not have known about [[Help:Edit summary|edit summaries]]. The explanation for its removal was in the [[#first-removal|summary of the edit that removed it]]. 

:You say "It's supported by many Governments, as evidenced by their allowing it to exist and be used for payments." But allowing it to exist and be used for payments doesn't constitutes legal recognition; the same could be said of store coupons. The IRS also requires that taxes be paid on income through barter, and [http://www.irs.gov/taxtopics/tc420.html specifies how it should be done]— 
::Bartering is the exchange of goods or services. Usually there is no exchange of cash. An example of bartering is a plumber exchanging plumbing services for the dental services of a dentist. You must include in gross income in the year of receipt the fair market valuof goods or services received from bartering.
:— but that doesn't mean that plumbing services or dental services are legal tender. 

:And neither are "virtual currencies" such as Bitcoin. The IRS is clear about this ([http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-drop/n-14-21.pdf Notice 2014-21]; emphasis added):
::The Internal Revenue Service (IRS) is aware that “virtual currency” may be used to pay for goods or services, or held for investment. Virtual currency is a digital representation of value that functions as a medium of exchange, a unit of account, and/or a store of value. In some environments, it operates like “real” currency -- i.e., the coin and paper money of the United States or of any other country that is designated as legal tender, circulates, and is customarily used and accepted as a medium of exchange in the country of issuance -- '''but it does not have legal tender status in any jurisdiction'''. 
::Virtual currency that has an equivalent value in real currency, or that acts as a substitute for real currency, is referred to as “convertible” virtual currency. Bitcoin is one example of a convertible virtual currency. Bitcoin can be digitally traded between users and can be purchased for, or exchanged into, U.S. dollars, Euros, and other real or virtual currencies.
:And further down, in §4 (FAQ):
::Q-1: How is virtual currency treated for federal tax purposes? 
::A-1: For federal tax purposes, '''virtual currency is treated as property'''. General tax principles applicable to property transactions apply to transactions using virtual currency.
::Q-2: Is virtual currency treated as currency for purposes of determining whether a transaction results in foreign currency gain or loss under U.S. federal tax laws? 
::A-2: No. Under currently applicable law, virtual currency is not treated as currency that could generate foreign currency gain or loss for U.S. federal tax purposes.
:[[User talk:JeffWiant#A Barnstar for you!|Thanks for being cool-headed about this. :-)]] --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 02:10, 25 August 2015 (UTC)

:{{ping|JeffWiant}} On your two requests:
:#  ... if an opportunity exists to evaluate Bitcoin's inclusion in the list I formally ask that the discussion be held. 
:#: This article is specifically about ''governmental'' currencies, as specified in § [[List_of_circulating_currencies#Criteria_for_inclusion|Criteria for inclusion]]. [[Virtual currency|Virtual currencies]], and [[Bitcoin]] specifically, have their own articles. If you think the ''title'' of this article is unclear, you can propose renaming ([[WP:Move|moving]])it, via the Talk page and/or on the appropriate project pages (see the box at the top of this page).  
:# I ask that Wikipedia consider accepting Bitcoin for donations! I'll donate to Wikipedia (and try to get others to) if you decide to accept Bitcoin.
:#: I'm no one special here, just a Wikipedian like yourself, only more experienced. Ask about this at the [[WP:Teahouse|Teahouse]].
:--[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 14:08, 25 August 2015 (UTC)

== Tongan hau ==

I'm moving the note about the Tongan hau from the Fractional units column (on Seniti) to the Currency (main) column (on the Tongan paʻanga). It is not about a fractional unit but a multiple, whose name doesn't even appear in the table:
:One hundred [[Tongan paʻanga]] equal one [[Tongan paʻanga|hau]].
--[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 01:05, 24 August 2015 (UTC)

== Indian rupee sign  ==

An anonymous user ([[Special:Contributions/123.236.126.23|123.236.126.23]]) {{diff |List_of_circulating_currencies |680055294|679913576|removed}} the new [[Indian rupee sign]] {{INR}} from the [[List_of_circulating_currencies#List_of_circulating_currencies_by_state_or_territory| table in the article]] for two states, India and Bhutan, replacing it with the [[Devanagari script|Devanagari letter]] "र" (/r/) under India and leaving the cell blank for Bhutan.

'''DON'T DO THAT.''' This is the official sign for the Indian rupee:
: The '''Indian rupee sign''' ([[currency sign|sign]]: {{INR}}; [[ISO 4217|code]]: '''INR''') is the currency sign for the [[Indian rupee]], the official [[currency]] of [[India]]. Designed by [[Udaya Kumar (designer)|D. Udaya Kumar]], it was presented to the public by the [[Government of India]] on 15 July 2010, following its selection through an “open” competition among Indian residents.  The symbol uses {{unichar|20B9|Indian Rupee Sign}} Unicode character. Before its adoption, the most commonly used symbols for the rupee were '''Rs''', '''Re''' or, if the text was in an Indian language, an appropriate abbreviation in that language.  The new sign relates solely to the Indian rupee; other countries that use a rupee, such as [[Sri Lankan rupee|Sri Lanka]], [[Pakistani rupee|Pakistan]] and [[Nepalese rupee|Nepal]], still use the generic {{unichar|20A8|Rupee Sign}} character. <br>—''[[Indian rupee sign]]''

And since the rupee used in Bhutan is also the Indian rupee, it should also have the same sign.
--[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 23:03, 8 September 2015 (UTC)

== Symbol for Kyrgyzstan som and Kazakhstan tenge ==
::'''''Answered for Kazakhstani tenge''' at [[Wikipedia:Teahouse/Questions#Where can I seek knowledgeable help about the current actual symbols for Kyrgyz and Kazakh currency?|Teahouse]].''

The table gives '''лв''' as the symbol for {{s|both the [[Kyrgyzstan som]] and}} the [[Kazakhstan tenge]] as well as for the [[Bulgarian lev]]. I consider the first {{s|two}} suspicious. '''лв''' consists of the Cyrillic letters "lv", neither of which is in the word "som" '''сом''' {{s|or "tenge" '''теңге'''}}; but it ''is'' the symbol for the [[Bulgarian lev]], '''лев'''. 

Here are some online references for '''лв''' as the symbol for one or both of these:
* {{cite web|title=Dollar to Som - USD/KGS|url=http://fx-rate.net/USD/KGS/|website=fx-rate|accessdate=19 September 2015}} (som)
* {{cite web|title=1200 Kyrgyzstan Som to Kazakhstan Tenge, 1200 KGS to KZT Currency Converter|url=http://u16201083.onlinehome-server.com/currency-converter/kyrgyzstan-som-kgs_kzt-kazakhstan-tenge.htm/1200|website=LikeForex|accessdate=19 September 2015}} (both)
* {{cite web|title=Currency symbols: list and codes for all countries|url=http://www.currencysymbols.in/|website=Currency Symbols|accessdate=19 September 2015}}  (both)

On the other hand, there are these (I've '''bolded''' all the Cyrillic and nothing else):
* The official currency in Kyrgyzstan is the som (sometimes written as '''сом''' or abbreviated as '''с''' in Cyrillic). <ref>{{cite web|title=Kyrgyzstan (§ Buy)|url=http://wikitravel.org/en/Kyrgyzstan#Cash|website=Wikitravel|accessdate=19 September 2015|archiveurl=https://web.archive.org/web/20150905125950/http://wikitravel.org/en/Kyrgyzstan|archivedate=2015-09-05}}</ref>
* Hmm, even on the national bank website, I don't see the symbol ''['''лв''']'' being used. I guessed at {{s|http COLON SLASH SLASH shop DOT kg}} {{color|red|{{hl|'''*'''}}}} being a Kyrgyzstani store, and lo and behold it is a store of sorts. One of the sites it links to actually uses '''сом''' for the symbol (the name of the currency in Kyrgyz), so I'm just going to go with that for now unless we can find a use with a symbol. Reference link here: {{s|http COLON SLASH SLASH danichkina DOT shop DOT kg/}}  ''{{color|red|{{hl|'''*'''}}}}''<br>Thanks for posting! This fix will be in Drupal Commerce 1.3, which should be released on Wednesday. <ref>{{cite web|author1=rszrama|title=Drupal Commerce : Issues : Add the Kyrgyzstani som (KGS) currency|url=https://www.drupal.org/node/1555886|website=Drupal|accessdate=19 September 2015|date=2012-05-08}}</ref>
:::  ''({{color|red|{{hl|'''*'''}}}} Masked because the domain has been [https://www.mywot.com/en/scorecard/shop.kg blacklisted] for phishing and malware. --Thnidu)''

None of these are governmental official websites. I've tried the CIA Factbook; no luck. (Sigh.) To be continued. Please {{Tn|Ping}} me to discuss. --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 04:11, 19 September 2015 (UTC)

:Question asked on Talk pages for Wikiprojects [[Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Kyrgyzstan#Is_the_som_symbol_really_.D0.BB.D0.B2.3F|Kyrgyzstan]], [[Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Kazakhstan#Is_.D0.BB.D0.B2_really_the_symbol_for_the_Kazakhstan_tenge.3F|Kazakhstan]], [[Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Central_Asia#Is_.D0.BB.D0.B2_really_the_symbol_for_the_Kyrgyzstan_som_and_the_Kazakhstan_tenge.3F|Central Asia]], and [[Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Finance#Actual_symbols_for_Kyrgyz_and_Kazakh_currency.3F|Finance]]. --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 04:27, 19 September 2015 (UTC)

{{reflist-talk}}

== ''How'' many currencies? ==

The lede says 180. Just now I sorted the table by name of currency and counted the different entries, ignoring the "(none)"s, and got 191.

Now of course it's easy to be off by a couple or three in counting a list on the order of 200, but I would swear that I wasn't off by eleven. I counted the footnoted ones and the ones that weren't linked. Maybe that made a difference, but there's nothing about it in the text. This needs to be clarified and corrected. --[[Special:Contributions/71.175.165.99|71.175.165.99]] ([[User talk:71.175.165.99|talk]]) 07:24, 4 October 2015 (UTC) Oops, this is {{u|thnidu}}.

Yes, really. --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 19:37, 4 October 2015 (UTC)

:I just did my own count and got 180. Remember that there are a few currencies repeated only twice, like for India/Nepal, Singapore/Brunei (x2), Israel/Palestine, everything bordering Western Sahara, etc. –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 23:46, 4 October 2015 (UTC)

== Vietnamese dong ==

I will correct its fractional unit to (none) right away. We have stopped using "hào", "xu" or any fractional units since 1985. [[User:Centaur271188|Centaur271188]] ([[User talk:Centaur271188|talk]]) 21:01, 9 April 2016 (UTC)
:Hmm, that doesn't seem to be in keeping with the practice on this page. Other discontinued fractional units are also listed on this article, for example, Japanese sen and Swedish öre. Then again, I wonder if it really makes sense to include any of these, at least not without a note saying something like "no longer in use". [[User:Heimstern|Heimstern Läufer]] [[User talk:Heimstern|(talk)]] 10:52, 10 April 2016 (UTC)
::Well, since this article is about ''circulating'' currencies, I prefer to describe their current conditions. We can say something about those fractional units in articles like [[List of historical currencies]], [[Japanese yen]] or [[Swedish krona]]. Just suggesting :) [[User:Centaur271188|Centaur271188]] ([[User talk:Centaur271188|talk]]) 19:08, 10 April 2016 (UTC)

== "Strength of currencies" map ==

{{Ping|szqecs}} I appreciate the work that must have gone into this map, but I don't think it should be here, for several reasons: 
# There's been considerable discussion about having tables of most and least valued currencies, and the consensus is not to have them. See 
## This article's talk page, section [[Talk:List of circulating currencies#List of least valued currency units?|List of least valued currency units?]]. 
## Same page, section [[ Talk:List of circulating currencies #Stop. Edit. Warring!|Stop. Edit. Warring!]]
## [[Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Highest-valued currency unit]], the archived discussion of deleting the named article, which is referenced in item 1.1.
# Even if it were notable and not [[WP:OR]] (see the discussions referenced above), it would require regular monitoring to keep up to date. Which leads to...
# The file's talk page says: 
#:: Strength of currencies relative to USD as of April 2016. For legend and edit instructions, see [[commons:File talk:Strength of currencies.svg|File talk:Strength of currencies.svg]]. 
#: That talk page gives the map's legend but no editing instructions. 
Please {{Tn|Ping}} me to discuss. --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 04:21, 18 April 2016 (UTC)

{{reply to|Thnidu}} 1. The first discussion was merged because it wasn't notable enough to a separate page, this is an image not a page. The second was about original research. I didn't cite any sources, and I probably should. But this is definitely not OR, it's hard facts. All info-graphic maps on Wikipedia can be considered OR, but they're not. The last discussion is about another one that was merged. Again, it's a page not a map. 

2. Yes the exchanges rates change all the time, but since the currencies are categorized into 16 bands, they won't change bands all the time. A lot of info on Wikipedia needs to be constantly updated anyway. Not to mention this map is intended to provide a rough idea of the value of different currencies, they don't need to be precisely in the right band. Canada and US are different colors and I can't even tell with the naked eye. 

3. I thought it would be apparent how to edit it if one knew what rates correspond to what band, but I can add it if you want. This is no grounds to remove the map. [[User:Szqecs|Szqecs]] ([[User talk:Szqecs|talk]]) 05:08, 18 April 2016 (UTC)

: {{Ping|szqecs}}
: You wrote: 
::*  I didn't cite any sources, and I probably should. But this is definitely not OR, it's hard facts. 
: You '''must''' provide sources. Anyone can say "It's not OR, it's hard facts", but "Hard references or it didn't happen!" See [[WP:VERIFY]] and [[WP:UNSOURCED]].
::* Canada and US are different colors and I can't even tell with the naked eye.
: Then sixteen shades of {{s|grey}} the same color are not very useful. If you want to keep the map up, use a more distinguishable set of colors. I ran a few web searches for "color code" and similar phrases. One of the hits from "Color scale" looks as though it could help you: 
:https://vis4.net/labs/multihue/#colors=lightyellow,%20orange,%20deeppink,%20darkred|steps=16|bez=1|coL=1
: Actually, when I first went to it, it was set for nine steps, so I just tried changing the number to 16 and that's what I got. Try fiddling with the list of colors, too. And in any case the color-coding will be meaningless to the reader unless you include a legend.
:&nbsp;
: It's customary to indent each comment on a talk page one level more than the comment it's replying to, using colons at the beginning of each paragraph, to make it easier to see the change of editor. You didn't indent your initial reply, so I'm just using one colon here. Please use two in your next reply. Thanks. 
: --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 18:05, 20 April 2016 (UTC)

::{{reply to|Thnidu}} Since you're being a nazi here, I went ahead and read the rules on original research and guess what I found: [[WP:OI]] "Original images created by a Wikipedian are not considered original research, so long as they do not illustrate or introduce unpublished ideas or arguments". There you go. And why are you telling me all this? If you think it should be improved, go improve it. If you want others to improve it, write it in the discussion page. If you want it deleted, request a deletion. I have no obligation to spend more time on it just to make you happy. [[User:Szqecs|Szqecs]] ([[User talk:Szqecs|talk]]) 21:01, 20 April 2016 (UTC)

:::{{reply to|Szqecs}} Thnidu is not being a Nazi, he is simply voicing legitimate concerns about the quality of this article (also, I think you need to be reminded of Wikipedia's [[Wikipedia:No personal attacks|no personal attacks policy]]). Regardless of the quality of the map itself, I think the more pertinent issue is whether it belongs on this article at all. In that regard, I do not think this article is an appropriate place for this map because it is only tangentially related to the article's subject. Perhaps the map would be more suited to an article related to exchange rates? One that comes to mind is "[[currency pair]]". –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 00:59, 21 April 2016 (UTC)

::::{{reply to|Thnidu}} Fine, I removed it. [[User:Szqecs|Szqecs]] ([[User talk:Szqecs|talk]]) 01:38, 21 April 2016 (UTC)

== ISO codes ==

:::'''Resolved''', in my view. See [[Wikipedia:Teahouse/Questions#Primary vs. secondary source when the primary is only updated infrequently | Teahouse]]. --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 22:45, 14 September 2016 (UTC)
:::See also [[#SIX-email| below]]. --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 03:53, 15 September 2016 (UTC)

{{ping| Normakku | Zntrip}} 

'''Recap''': Comrades, the two of you have been edit-warring, or nearly so, over some ISO 4217 codes for currencies, with {{u|Normakku}} adding purported ISO codes and {{u|Zntrip}} reverting them; I won't try to list them all. But most of your₂ edits this month have been disputes over the validity or not of purported codes. (I must add that, apart from the continual re-re-reversion, you have both behaved with [[WP:CIV|civility]], with none of the various forms of bad and worse behavior that we see all too often.)

{{Collapse top|title=From the article's history page}}
Normakku's edits are in italics, Zntrip's in boldface, and unrelated ones underlined. 
:* '' 21:01, 8 September 2016‎ Normakku . . (42,510 bytes) (-18)‎ . . (Undid revision 738309236 by Zntrip (talk) http://www.iso.org/iso/home/standards/currency_codes.htm, http://www.xe.com/iso4217.php)
:* {{uu|(Two unrelated edits by me, Thnidu)}}
:* ''' 04:31, 8 September 2016‎ Zntrip . . (42,367 bytes) (+18)‎ . . (Undid revision 738304839 by Normakku (talk); not an actual ISO code; please look at the source for the ISO codes column on this list) 
:* '' 03:50, 8 September 2016‎ Normakku . . (42,349 bytes) (-18)‎ . . (http://www.xe.com/currency/tvd-tuvaluan-dollar) 
:* ''' 20:57, 6 September 2016‎ Zntrip m . . (42,367 bytes) (-373)‎ . . (Undid revision 738052115 by Normakku (talk); that's not how ISO codes work; they are only assigned by the issuing agency) 
:* '' 17:13, 6 September 2016‎ Normakku . . (42,740 bytes) (+373)‎ . . 
:* {{uu|(unrelated edit by third person, and Z's reversion of it)}}
:* ''' 17:56, 4 September 2016‎ Zntrip m . . (42,088 bytes) (-60)‎ . . (→‎List of circulating currencies by state or territory: removing ISO 4217 codes that are not listed in the cited sourced at the top of the column) 
:* '' 06:10, 4 September 2016‎ Normakku . . (42,148 bytes) (+138)‎ . . (See my edit on Somaliland shilling. Alternatively, see http://www.investopedia.com/terms/forex/s/sos-somali-shilling.asp) 
:* '' 05:42, 4 September 2016‎ Normakku . . (42,010 bytes) (-18)‎ . . (See my edit on Tuvaluan dollar. Alternatively, see http://www.xe.com/currency/tvd-tuvaluan-dollar) 
:* '' 05:10, 4 September 2016‎ Normakku . . (42,028 bytes) (-10)‎ . . (Undid revision 737535809 by Zntrip (talk) There is an ISO 4217. See my edit on Sahrawi peseta.) 
:* '' 05:08, 4 September 2016‎ Normakku . . (42,038 bytes) (+528)‎ . . (Undid revision 737644764 by Normakku (talk)) 
:* '' 05:05, 4 September 2016‎ Normakku . . (41,510 bytes) (-528)‎ . . (Undid revision 737535809 by Zntrip (talk) There is an ISO 4217. See my recent edit on Sahrawi peseta.) 
:* '' 05:03, 4 September 2016‎ Normakku . . (42,038 bytes) (+518)‎ . . 
:* ''' 13:23, 3 September 2016‎ Zntrip m . . (41,520 bytes) (+10)‎ . . (Undid revision 737487710 by Normakku (talk); a Wikipedia article is not a valid source) 
:* '' 04:01, 3 September 2016‎ Normakku . . (41,510 bytes) (-10)‎ . . (Undid revision 737468693 by Zntrip (talk) There is an ISO 4217. See Sahrawi peseta) 
:* ''' 00:43, 3 September 2016‎ Zntrip m . . (41,520 bytes) (-96)‎ . . (→‎List of circulating currencies by state or territory: no source for "pending" status of Niue dollar's ISO code) 
:* ''' 00:42, 3 September 2016‎ Zntrip m . . (41,616 bytes) (-3)‎ . . (→‎List of circulating currencies by state or territory: Vietnam format) 
:* ''' 00:40, 3 September 2016‎ Zntrip m . . (41,619 bytes) (+10)‎ . . (Undid revision 737448590 by Normakku (talk); there is no such code) 
:* '' 21:37, 2 September 2016‎ Normakku . . (41,609 bytes) (+115)‎ . . 
:* '' 21:15, 2 September 2016‎ Normakku . . (41,494 bytes) (-10)‎ . .
{{Collapse bottom}}


'''Debatables''':
In some cases Normakku asserts a source, though (often?) only in the edit summary, not as a reference, and Zntrip denies its official force, e.g., 
* "that's not how ISO codes work; they are only assigned by the issuing agency"
* "not an actual ISO code; please look at the source for the ISO codes column on this list"
 

'''Example''':
One of Normakku's unofficial sources,<ref name=xe.com>[http://www.xe.com/iso4217.php ISO 4217 Currency Codes]</ref> from xe.com, begins
: Listed below is every world currency along with their ISO 4217 Currency Code. The list includes some currencies (marked with an asterisk) that are not officially recognized by the ISO.
It includes "TVD — Tuvalu Dollar", without an asterisk. Well, that looks good.... but xe.com is not the issuing agency. According to ISO:<ref>[http://www.iso.org/iso/home/standards/currency_codes.htm Currency codes - ISO 4217]</ref>
:'''What is ISO 4217?
: ISO 4217 is the International Standard for currency codes. The most recent edition is ISO 4217:2015.
:...
:{{anchor|amendments}}'''Maintaining ISO 4217
:Periodically, amendments must be made to ISO 4217:2015 and these are managed by the Secretariat of the Maintenance Agency, in this case the SIX Interbank Clearing Ltd on behalf of the Swiss Association for Standardization, SNV.


'''Solution?''':
But wait a minute! We're talking about ISO 4217:'''2015'''. Here we are more than halfway through 2016, and what's happening with the ISO 4217? Look up there: "'''Periodically, amendments must be made to ISO 4217:2015'''". Well, we can't see the most current version of the list (and the last one was in 2008<ref>[http://www.iso.org/iso/iso_catalogue/catalogue_ics/catalogue_detail_ics.htm?csnumber=46121 ISO 4217:2008 : Codes for the representation of currencies and funds] Quote: "This standard has been revised by: ISO 4217:2015"</ref>) without paying for it, but surely [[xe.com]] subscribes and always has the latest version, and they seem to be pretty well regarded. In other words, comrades, here we have a [[WP:RS|reliable source]] that says<ref name=xe.com />
: '''TVD - Tuvaluan Dollar
: Tuvalu, Dollar
: The Tuvaluan Dollar is the currency of Tuvalu. The currency code for Dollars is TVD, and the currency symbol is $.


'''The morals''':
:'''Normakku''': It's not enough to mention your source in the edit summary. You ''have'' to cite a reference ''in the article''; [[xe.com]] is a good one, Wikipedia is not. That doesn't mean you have to ref it for each ISO code you add that isn't in ISO 4217:2015. It'll be sufficient to ref it once, in the header for the symbol column.

:'''Zntrip''': A reference doesn't have to cite The Official Fount and Origin of All Wisdom in the matter involved. There may well be others that are perfectly well qualified. And after all, ISO and its [[#amendments |deputies]], the SNV and SIX Interbank Clearing Ltd, are [[WP:PRIMARY |primary sources]], while XE.com is a reliable secondary one.


Honored fellow editors, I hope you will now be able to put an end to your edit warring and furnish the article with up-to-date, well-referenced data on the ISO codes.

Please {{Tn|Ping}} me to discuss. --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 02:34, 9 September 2016 (UTC)

:{{ping|Normakku|Thnidu}} Thnidu, I appreciate your attempt to mediate this editing dispute and I invite Normakku to join the discussion. I've already reached out at Normakku's talk page, but have yet to hear anything. My position is rather simple. The ISO 4217 standard is promulgated by an organization, which has published the list on its website, so there can't be a real dispute as to whether an abbreviation is part of ISO 4217. There is absolutely nothing wrong with using a primary source in this instance because no interpretation is necessary. Relying on a secondary source that unambiguously contradicts a primary source is simply unconscionable, in my view. –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 19:16, 12 September 2016 (UTC)

:{{ping|Normakku|Thnidu}} I think I've discovered a solution that we can all agree upon. I've simply added a note after "TVD" stating "This currency code is not part of the ISO 4217 standard, but is used commercially." This note is used elsewhere on the article. –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 20:00, 13 September 2016 (UTC)

::{{ping|Normakku|Zntrip}} That's good, that'll help. I think I've got something more, but it's not ready yet. --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 22:01, 13 September 2016 (UTC) --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 05:21, 14 September 2016 (UTC)

::{{ping|Normakku|Zntrip}} Relying on ''an up-to-date'' secondary source that is reliable and that unambiguously contradicts ''an out-of-date'' primary source is simply common sense, in my view. ISO 4217:2015 was indisputably the most reliable source for ISO 4217 codes when it came out, as was ISO 4217:2008 when it was first released. How many currencies became obsolete, how many were revised or redefined, how many were first issued in the following seven years? Surely a significant number, or why bother to issue ISO 4217:2015? And where was a reliable source to be found in 2014? 

::Even if there had been only one or two changes between the 2008 and 2015 editions (I tried to find a list, but couldn't), XE.com would have listed them almost as soon as ISO announced the change. [[WP:RS#Age matters]] cautions:
::: Be sure to check that older sources have not been superseded, especially if it is likely the new discoveries or developments have occurred in the last few years.

::I am taking this question to the [[Wikipedia:Teahouse/Questions#Primary vs. secondary source when the primary is only updated infrequently|Teahouse]]. Please {{Tn|Ping}} me to discuss. --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 00:59, 14 September 2016 (UTC)

:::{{ping|Thnidu}} I think there is a misunderstanding here. The International Organization for Standardization published the ISO 4217:2015 standard in 2015, but the standard is updated as necessary by a maintenance agency. In this case the maintenance agency is the Swiss Association for Standardization ([http://www.iso.org/iso/home/standards/currency_codes.htm see here]). The most recent version of the standard can be found [http://www.currency-iso.org/en/home/tables/table-a1.html here] and it was made on July 1, 2016. –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 01:12, 14 September 2016 (UTC)


:::: {{ping|Normakku|Zntrip}}: I've just written to xe.com as follows: 

::::: I've been looking all over your site (via Firefox on my mobile), and this is the only address I've found to contact you by. If you're not the right people to answer my question, please pass it along to whoever is.

::::: Your page '''[http://www.xe.com/iso4217.php ISO 4217 Currency Codes]'''  says
:::::: Below, we list ISO 4217 codes for currencies in circulation, plus some (marked with an asterisk) that are not officially recognized by the ISO.

:::::Your list includes "TVD | Tuvalu Dollar", with no asterisk. But ISO's own '''[http://www.currency-iso.org/en/home/tables/table-a1.html Current currency & funds code list]''', dated July 1, 2016), doesn't list anything for Tuvalu except the Australian dollar, AUS.

::::: So my question is, Is TVD without an asterisk accurate or a typo? And if it's accurate, when did it become official under ISO 4217?

::::: Sincerely, 

:::: --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 03:23, 14 September 2016 (UTC)

:::: {{ping|Normakku|Zntrip}}:  See current answer to my Q at [[Wikipedia:Teahouse/Questions#Primary vs. secondary source when the primary is only updated infrequently|Teahouse]]. --05:21, 14 September 2016 (UTC)

:::::{{ping|Thnidu}} Writing to XE is a good idea. I've taken another look at its ISO 4217 webpage and I now question its reliability. It appears to be out of date because it still lists the old code for the Belorussian ruble, which was redenominated on July 1 (the date the Swiss Association for Standardization updated its list). Also, as you can see [https://web.archive.org/web/20110119193717/http://www.xe.com/iso4217.php here], the page has listed "TVD" since at least 2011, so this isn't some recent update. While XE may be a reliable source for exchange rates, I don't think the same can be said about its presentation of ISO 4217. –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 17:09, 14 September 2016 (UTC)


::::::{{anchor|SIX-email}} {{ping| Thnidu| Zntrip}} I apologize for the late response; I had a busy schedule during the past few days. 

::::::In regard of Zntrip's position, I think that the idea to apply the note "This currency code is not part of the ISO 4217 standard, but is used commercially." to the "TVD" ISO code works '''temporarily''' with the format of this list. This proposition causes a few problems such as using the International Organization of Standardization and XE's ISO 4217 currency codes list as a reliable source. Three days ago, I wrote an email to the Secretariat of the Maintenance Agency (Swiss Association for Standardization or SIX Interbank Clearing) regarding the [[Tuvaluan dollar]]. 

::::::'''Excerpt from the email:
	
:::::::Hello, 

:::::::I am conducting academic research on international currencies, and I'd like to inquire about a number of circulating currencies and their respected ISO 4217 codes. 

:::::::My first question is regarding the Tuvaluan dollar. I'd like to know if the Tuvaluan dollar has an assigned ISO 4217 code (i.e. TVD). According to the "Current currency & funds code list" published at "http://www.currency-iso.org/en/home/tables/table-a1.html" (XLS and XML lists), the ISO code is instead the Australian Dollar (AUD). Can you please clarify - is there an official Tuvaluan dollar ISO 4217 code?

:::::::Secondly, can you confirm if the currency "Sahrawi peseta" has an ISO 4217 code of EHP?

:::::::Thank you for any assistance.

:::::::Kind regards,

::::::'''They responded:

:::::::Dear Mr. ,
 
:::::::Thank you for your inquiry. The Tuvaluan dollar has no ISO 4217 currency code because the official currency of Tuvalu is the Australian dollar. The Tuvaluan dollar has been withdrawn from circulation around 1994.
 
:::::::The Sahrawi Arab Democratic Republic is not a recognized state by the UN: http://unstats.un.org/unsd/methods/m49/m49alpha.htm therefore no currency code can be assigned.
 
:::::::Kind regards,
:::::::Secretariat of the Maintenance Agency for ISO 4217
:::::::c/o SIX Interbank Clearing Ltd

::::::This email from the Secretariat of Maintenance Agency states that the Tuvaluan dollar '''has been withdrawn from circulation around 1994'''. On [[Tuvaluan dollar]] article it states "After the 1994 issue, Tuvaluan coins ceased to be produced and Australian coins sent in their stead. However, Tuvalu coins remain as legal tender and continue to circulate alongside Australian ones." (without a source). 

::::::Should the Tuvaluan dollar be included in this article? Emails are not considered a reliable source, and according to [[Wikipedia:Verifiability#Reliable_sources]] they are unpublished. – [[User:Normakku|Normakku]] ([[User talk:Normakku|talk]]) 03:01, 15 September 2016 (UTC)

::::::: {{ping|Normakku}} 1) Life happens. 2) Excellent hunting! I recommend going to the [[Wikipedia:Teahouse/Questions#Primary vs. secondary source when the primary is only updated infrequently|Teahouse discussion]] of this question and asking advice of the mentors there. --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 03:53, 15 September 2016 (UTC)

:::::::: {{ping|Normakku}} Nice work Normakku. Perhaps a note stating that the Tuvaluan dollar only circulates as commemorative currency and not in actual transactions? We could easily find a source on some commemorative coin websites. A quick look on the web shows that Tuvaluan dollars are still being minted (i.e. [http://www.govmint.com/world-coins/by-country-s-z/tuvalu-coins/2016-tuvalu-5-oz-silver-star-trek-enterprise-high-relief-proof.html 2016 Tuvalu 5-oz Silver Star Trek Enterprise High Relief Proof]). –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 05:50, 15 September 2016 (UTC)
{{Od|8}}
{{Ping| Zntrip}}  "Not legal tender" is not the same as "not used in actual transactions" I wouldn't be surprised if the older Tuvaluan coinage is still used in everyday transactions, never mind whether government considers it "legal tender". (That is, not that we should ignore it but rather that the population considers it largely irrelevant.) --[[User:Thnidu|Thnidu]] ([[User talk:Thnidu|talk]]) 14:50, 15 September 2016 (UTC)

{{Reftalk}}

== Zimbabwean Bond Notes. ==

[[Zimbabwean Bond Notes]] are in the process of being released. So far, a 2 Dollars Bond Note has been released, along with a bimetallic 1 Dollar Bond Coin.

The currency expressed is [[U.S. dollar]]s. - ([[Special:Contributions/119.224.80.18|119.224.80.18]] ([[User talk:119.224.80.18|talk]]) 01:29, 7 December 2016 (UTC))

== Inclusion Question ==

Why is "Akrotiri and Dhekelia" included if it uses the Euro? I can understand Andorra, I guess, since it's part of the UN, but why Akrotiri and Dhekelia or Bonaire? Did they have some sort of currency before that doesn't circulate but is related somehow? [[User:Renassault|Cornelius]] ([[User talk:Renassault|talk]]) 17:58, 6 March 2018 (UTC)

:From the lead: "Dependencies and unrecognized states are listed here only if another currency is used in their territory that is different from the one of the state that administers them or has jurisdiction over them." –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 03:13, 7 March 2018 (UTC)

::Oh ok, I see, thank you. I misunderstood that part. [[User:Renassault|Cornelius]] ([[User talk:Renassault|talk]]) 22:48, 15 March 2018 (UTC)

== List ==

I was expecting a list of currencies with the countries where they are used, not a list of countries with their respective currencies...! [[Special:Contributions/41.221.193.165|41.221.193.165]] ([[User talk:41.221.193.165|talk]]) 16:06, 14 August 2018 (UTC)
[[User:41.221.193.165]]
: The list is sortable, just click the Currency column. [[User:Reywas92|Reywas92]]<sup>[[User talk:Reywas92|'''Talk''']]</sup> 18:22, 14 August 2018 (UTC)
:: Thanks, [[User:Reywas92|Reywas92]]. I've just found out that sorting is not available on my cell phone. No problem on my computer, though. [[Special:Contributions/41.221.193.174|41.221.193.174]] ([[User talk:41.221.193.174|talk]]) 09:42, 21 August 2018 (UTC)

== Hong Kong Dollar HKD ==

HKD has larger notes than 100, you will see [[Banknotes of the Hong Kong dollar]] it has 500 and 1000HKD notes. [[User:Jtbobwaysf|Jtbobwaysf]] ([[User talk:Jtbobwaysf|talk]]) 19:45, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

:The list doesn't say anything about banknotes. The "100" refers to how many fractional units (i.e. cents) there are to the primary unit (i.e. the dollar). –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 02:42, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

== Cabo Verde and Czechia are the current preferred names. ==

Cape Verde, the Czech Republic, Swaziland, and Macedonia have changed their short names over the last five years to Cabo Verde, Czechia (along the lines of the Slovak Republic --> Slovakia), Eswatini, and North Macedonia.  Why only change only two of them?  Do the others' main articles just need to be updated with their current names?  [[User:Paploo|Paploo]] ([[User talk:Paploo|talk]]) 01:21, 26 February 2019 (UTC)

:The article titles are considered the common English names for the countries on the encyclopedia. It is best to be consistent across all articles. –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 03:49, 26 February 2019 (UTC)

== Zimbabwe dollar is back ==

Zimbabwe dollar has been reinstated as the sole legal tender in Zimbabwe. All the others are outlawed. See https://thisisafrica.me/zimbabwe-dollar-reinstated-as-sole-legal-tender/?fbclid=IwAR0C-_ZCKq9mTipzwsHQ4k9QFyASsmYspd617xFxAawC19QjvT29McAEBtg --[[User:Baronedimare|Baronedimare]] ([[User talk:Baronedimare|talk]]) 20:49, 4 July 2019 (UTC)

== Swiss franc ==

{{Reply|ZH8000}} The [https://www.admin.ch/opc/de/classified-compilation/20000792/index.html reference] you provided clearly states "Die amtlichen Bezeichnungen für die schweizerische Währungseinheit und deren Abkürzungen lauten: deutsch: Franken (Fr.)" (translation: The official designations for the Swiss currency unit and their abbreviations are: German: Franken (Fr.)". Therefore, "Fr." is the German abbreviation for the currency. "CHF" is just the ISO 4217 code, which is already mentioned in the list. –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 05:40, 28 July 2019 (UTC)

:{{Ping|Zntrip}} your argument is perfidious and first of all not applicable. It is not applicable simply – as you say yourself – it is only valid for the German language. BUT THIS IS ENGLISH WIKIPEDIA.

:And it is perfidious by you just to extract that single (and non-applicable) item what suits your POV, but not mentioning the whole article. Which actually says in German:

::"Die amtlichen Bezeichnungen für die schweizerische Währungseinheit und deren Abkürzungen lauten:
:::a. deutsch: Franken (Fr.) und Rappen (Rp.);
:::b. französisch: franc (fr.) und centime (c.);
:::c. italienisch: franco (fr.) und centesimo (ct.);
:::d. rätoromanisch: franc (fr.) und rap (rp.);
:::'''e. international gültige Abkürzung für Schweizer Franken nach ISO-Norm Nr. 4217: CHF'''."

:Which means in English (incredibly easy to translate):

::"The official designations for the Swiss currency unit and its abbreviations are as follows:
:::a. German: Franken (Fr.) and Rappen (Rp.);
:::b. French: franc (fr.) and centime (c.);
:::c. Italian: franco (fr.) and centesimo (ct.);
:::d. Rhaeto-Romanic: franc (fr.) and rap (rp.);
:::'''e. internationally valid abbreviation for Swiss franc according to ISO standard no. 4217: CHF.'''."

:Either you can not read, or then pretend to do so; both are not valid. --- <!-- Template:Unsigned --><small class="autosigned">—&nbsp;Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:ZH8000|ZH8000]] ([[User talk:ZH8000#top|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/ZH8000|contribs]]) 17:08, 29 July 2019 (UTC)</small>

:::{{Reply|ZH8000}} I would like to remind you that all editors are presumed to act in [[Wikipedia:Assume good faith|good faith]]. We have to try to communicate with each other in a civil manner to reach a consensus. My interpretation of the source is that "Fr." is the symbol used for the Swiss franc and that "CHF" is the ISO code. Before you altered the list, this is what was reflected. In other words, the list reflected what I interpret the source to say. From what I understand of your argument, the list cannot show "Fr." because the list is in English and "Fr." is not a state-sanctioned English abbreviation. I do not believe that the source says that and I also believe holding that view is antithetical to the purpose of this article, which is to list the commonly used symbol for a currency. These symbols are used in day-to-day dealings by people that actually use the currency and most are rarely, if ever, used in the English language. For example "د.ا" is used in Jordan to refer to the dinar and ".ރ" is used in the Maldives for the rufiyaa, but you would never actually see these used in English. –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 02:48, 30 July 2019 (UTC)

::::{{Reply|Zntrip}} I may apologize if you really honestly interpreted the legal words in your given way. But I think there is no room for interpretation. But first of all, let me make clear that there is <u>no symbol</u> for the Swiss franc, such as € or £; additionally, the law never speaks about a symbol. There are just abbreviations, either "Fr.", or "fr.", or "CHF". The mismatch of symbol with abbreviation may lead to a (further) misunderstanding. Anyhow, you can simply read point e. as "internationally valid abbreviation for Swiss franc: CHF" since "according to ISO standard no. 4217" is just an explanatory subclause in order to make obvious what is the source for the <u>internationally valid abbreviation</u> for the Swiss franc. I hope this makes it clear enough. -- [[User:ZH8000|ZH8000]] ([[User talk:ZH8000|talk]]) 23:13, 31 July 2019 (UTC)
:::::{{Reply|ZH8000}}No, that does not make it clear. Many currencies do not have a "symbol" that is a separate typographical character, but all have some sort of abbreviation that is used in accounting. What abbreviation do people it Switzerland use for the the franc? The source you cited says the official abbreviation is "Fr." Why should we not include that in the list? –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 02:41, 1 August 2019 (UTC)

::::::"<s>''The source you cited says the official abbreviation is "Fr." Why should we not include that in the list?''</s>" – No, it does not. Now I am starting again to doubt you can read correctly. "Fr." is only valid in GERMAN language, full stop.

::::::"''What abbreviation do people it Switzerland use for the the franc?''" – That's irrelevant for ENGLISH wikipedia. The law undoubtly says that "CHF" is the official abbreviation internationally or for any other language besides German, French, Italian, and Romansh. FULL STOP. -- [[User:ZH8000|ZH8000]] ([[User talk:ZH8000|talk]]) 15:46, 2 August 2019 (UTC)

:::::::{{Reply|ZH8000}} I think it would help to have another native German speaker assist us, because I believe there may be a miscommunication. I will reach out to another editor who has been active on this article in the past and who also speaks German. –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 19:12, 3 August 2019 (UTC)

Hi all! Two points: My reading agrees with Zntrip's, namely, that the source does not give an English '''abbreviation''' for Swiss francs. And second, a brief research tour around site:.ch on Google and Google News shows that CHF, SFr and Fr all seem to be in use, but with very few sources for the latter and more for the first two. (Not sure whether that helps us here, though.) —[[User:Nightstallion|<span style="font-variant:small-caps">Nightstallion</span>]] 06:43, 4 August 2019 (UTC)

:English is not an official language in Switzerland, therefore you cannot expect that the law explicitely designate an official abbreviation for a non-national language. BUT for anything else, and this is called ''internationally'' aka CHF.

:The translation is obvious. But you also have it in French:

::"Les dénominations officielles de l'unité monétaire suisse et leurs abréviations sont:
::a. en allemand: Franken (Fr.) et Rappen (Rp.);
::b. en français: franc (fr.) et centime (c.);
::c. en italien: franco (fr.) et centesimo (ct.);
::d. en romanche: franc (fr.) et rap (rp.);
::e. '''sur le plan international: CHF''', conformément à la norme ISO No 4217."

:or Italian:

::"Le denominazioni ufficiali e le abbreviazioni dell'unità monetaria svizzera sono:
::a. in tedesco: Franken (Fr.) e Rappen (Rp.);
::b. in francese: franc (fr.) e centime (c.);
::c. in italiano: franco (fr.) e centesimo (ct.);
::d. in romancio: franc (fr.) e rap (rp.);
::'''e. sul piano internazionale: CHF''', conformemente alla norma ISO N° 4217."

:You can hardly get any more redandancy for your interpretation doubt. -- [[User:ZH8000|ZH8000]] ([[User talk:ZH8000|talk]]) 14:09, 4 August 2019 (UTC)
::Firstly, I still don't agree with your reading of the text (“International” is not a language, for one), but more importantly, the tone you choose in discussions is really borderline insulting in many places. Please be more civil in interactions with other editors. Thanks. —[[User:Nightstallion|<span style="font-variant:small-caps">Nightstallion</span>]] 07:43, 5 August 2019 (UTC)

:::{{Reply|ZH8000}}{{Reply|Nightstallion}} Seeing that there has been no additional input, and that both Nightstallion and myself seem to agree that the source cited does not support the assertion that ZH8000 has made, I have gone ahead and modified the list to show that "Fr." is the symbol/abbreviation for the Swiss franc. I am not so naive as to think that we are all in agreement, but we have two editors who do not agree with the interpretation of another editor's source, and I do think the burden is on that editor, especially in this case when the article being modified is, by its nature, a mostly static one. That being said, I am willing to explore other methods of dispute resolution if all engaged are willing to make a good faith effort. –&nbsp;[[User:Zntrip|Zntrip]] 01:56, 21 August 2019 (UTC)

::::Zntrip, I don't think your approach is correct; no new consensus has been reached. Therefore your blatant revert is not valid. -- [[User:ZH8000|ZH8000]] ([[User talk:ZH8000|talk]]) 05:22, 21 August 2019 (UTC)
::::I concur with Zntrip: CHF is the ISO code for the currency but certainly not its symbol or abbreviation. The commonly used abbreviation for the currency is obviously Fr. This is what is used on Swiss coins as an abbreviation and should naturally be listed in the abbreviation column. Switzerland may suggest CHF for international usage but to list that here as the symbol or abbreviation is silly since it obviously does not follow the spirit of the column's purpose. [[User:Reywas92|Reywas92]]<sup>[[User talk:Reywas92|Talk]]</sup> 07:14, 21 August 2019 (UTC)

:::::{{ping|Reywas92}} Once again: There is no symbol for the Swiss franc. Secondly, the international abbrev. is CHF, since it is even defined by law. "''The spirit of the column's purpose''"?? – Pardon-me, where is this "definition" defined?? But well, see below. -- [[User:ZH8000|ZH8000]] ([[User talk:ZH8000|talk]]) 22:02, 26 August 2019 (UTC)
:::{{Reply|Nightstallion}}Of course "international" is not a language, but a placeholder for any other situation versus the points a.-d.. There is no place for another interpretation. -- [[User:ZH8000|ZH8000]] ([[User talk:ZH8000|talk]]) 05:22, 21 August 2019 (UTC)
::[[File:Einfranken.jpg|thumb|right]]
::<small>removed per [[WP:BANREVERT]]</small> [[User:HansHeidel|HansHeidel]] ([[User talk:HansHeidel|talk]]) 12:36, 21 August 2019 (UTC)

:::Yes, the abbreviation on Swiss coins is "Fr.". But this is only true for coins. It is <u>not</u> used on bank notes.

:::And nowaydays, it is rather seldom the case for printed and listed prices. You will find '''at least the three locally used abbreviatios''': namely "CHF", "Fr.", and "fr." – and in this order of events!
:::See for example [https://www.post.ch/de/pakete-versenden/pakete-inland Swiss Post for German CH ("'''Alle Preise in CHF''', inkl. MWST.")] or [https://www.post.ch/fr/expedier-des-colis/colis-suisse Swiss Post for French CH ("'''Prix en CHF''', TVA comprise")] or [https://www.post.ch/it/spedire-pacchi/pacchi-svizzera Swiss Post for Italian CH ("'''Prezzi in CHF''', IVA inclusa")] or [https://www.post.ch/en/sending-parcels/domestic-parcels Swiss Post in Eglish ("'''All prices in CHF''', incl. VAT.")], [https://www.apple.com/ch-fr/shop/buy-mac/macbook-air Apple in Switzerland], [https://www.swiss.com/ch/de/Book/Outbound/ZRH-LON/from-2019-08-27/to-2019-09-03/adults-1/children-0/infants-0/class-economy/al-LX/sido2um Swiss International Airlines (''pretend to be someone from CH and change the corresponding language in the upper right corner'')] – Except for one, all of these relevant examples are addressed to local buyers (sic!) and <u>the used currency abbreviation is ''always'' "CHF"!</u> So is the case nowaydays on most printed slips you get in a restaurant or shop. Of course, you will also find "fr." and "Fr.", but you will encounter problems to find just a few.

:::"''are there any these days?''": Yes, of course. Just check the list! LOL -- [[User:ZH8000|ZH8000]] ([[User talk:ZH8000|talk]]) 22:02, 26 August 2019 (UTC)
::::You are being absurd. Change the Swiss Airlines currency to US Dollar, and it says USD, pick Britische Pfund, and it says GBP! They are consistently using the ISO codes for every currency. It's quite common to see "Prices in USD" or "Prices in GBP" elsewhere – I would not expect to see "Prices in Fr." any more than "Prices in $" since what is obviously an attempt to unambiguously give the currency with precision for all naturally uses the international standard for it! None of this means commonly used currency codes should supercede what is obviously the symbol/abbreviation in line with everything else. [[User:Reywas92|Reywas92]]<sup>[[User talk:Reywas92|Talk]]</sup> 00:34, 27 August 2019 (UTC)

::Jumping into the fray here. It seems clear that the intention of the "Abbrev. / Symbol" column is to show local usage. The entry for Mexico shows "$" as the symbol. Clearly this is a ''local'' usage, as internationally, the "$" would be assumed to represent the US dollar unless otherwise specified. Following this logic, the local usage within Switzerland is to use the "Fr." abbreviation, and I believe that is the entry we should have in the table. [[User:WikiDan61|<span style="color: green;">WikiDan61</span>]]<sup>[[User talk:WikiDan61|ChatMe!]]</sup><sub>[[Special:Contributions/WikiDan61|ReadMe!!]]</sub> 12:59, 21 August 2019 (UTC)

:::"''It seems clear that the intention of the "Abbrev. / Symbol" column is to show local usage.''" – If this is really the case (??), <u>then I suggest it is made explicit</u>: Then say it so in the column head! – But then, the local abbreviation for Swiss franc is <u>all three of them: "CHF", "fr." and "Fr."</u>! -- [[User:ZH8000|ZH8000]] ([[User talk:ZH8000|talk]]) 22:02, 26 August 2019 (UTC)

::<small>removed per [[WP:BANREVERT]]</small> [[User:HansHeidel|HansHeidel]] ([[User talk:HansHeidel|talk]]) 17:23, 22 August 2019 (UTC)

:::''Formal remark: '''Please follow the [[WP:THREAD]] instruction in order to keep the talk pages readable.''' THX'' -- [[User:ZH8000|ZH8000]] ([[User talk:ZH8000|talk]]) 22:02, 26 August 2019 (UTC)
*{{admin note}} User HansHeidel has been blocked as a sockpuppet. An admin reverting their edits per [[WP:EVADE]] and another editor reverting that revert have inadvertently perpetuated an edit war that has already been going on for several days, so I have protected the page from editing. Ping me when consensus is reached. [[User:Ivanvector|Ivanvector]] (<sup>[[User talk:Ivanvector|Talk]]</sup>/<sub>[[Special:Contributions/Ivanvector|Edits]]</sub>) 12:15, 27 August 2019 (UTC)
**{{ping|Ivanvector}} Even without HansHeidel, we have four users for the status quo ante, which I restored in reverting the unneeded procedural revert of Hans, and just one advocating that the ISO code should be used as the symbol/abbreviation, despite there already being an abbreviation and no other currency using the ISO code as such. I see no need for further edits but also no need for full protection. [[User:Reywas92|Reywas92]]<sup>[[User talk:Reywas92|Talk]]</sup> 17:39, 27 August 2019 (UTC)

== Redirects to this page nominated at RfD ==

[[Least-valued currency unit]] and 9 other similar redirects to this page have been nominated at RfD, see the discussion at [[Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2020 July 30#Least-valued currency unit]]. [[User:Thryduulf|Thryduulf]] ([[User talk:Thryduulf|talk]]) 12:16, 30 July 2020 (UTC)

== Bitcoin in Central African Republic ==

Bitcoin is now legal tender in CAR [[User:Baronedimare|Baronedimare]] ([[User talk:Baronedimare|talk]]) 12:05, 28 April 2022 (UTC)

== Circulating Currencies by Value in Circulation (or other valuation) ==

I'm not sure what the best way to value total currency in circulation but this article would benefit from a column or columns that allows the reader to find, for instance, the 20 largest currencies in circulation by various valuation measures. [[User:Adamnelson|Adamnelson]] ([[User talk:Adamnelson|talk]]) 10:00, 20 March 2023 (UTC)

== Brunei dollar and Singaporean dollar ==

These currencies are accepted at both countries' banks, but are they actually in circulation in each respective country? Would a business in Singapore actually accept Brunei dollars? If not, shouldn't the values for Brunei and Singapore just be their own currencies? [[User:Wkpdsrnm2023|Wkpdsrnm2023]] ([[User talk:Wkpdsrnm2023|talk]]) 01:28, 12 April 2023 (UTC)

:A business in Singapore legally should take Brunei dollars, whether or not they do in practice may differ. [[User:Chipmunkdavis|CMD]] ([[User talk:Chipmunkdavis|talk]]) 02:06, 12 April 2023 (UTC)

== Is there a reliable source for currency symbols? ==

I have just gone over the symbols being used in the World Bank Group style guide and Xe.com's symbols list but both of those sources differ from each other as well as other information on Wikipedia. Is there a singular source of information that lists all of the different symbols for every currency available anywhere? [[User:Wkpdsrnm2023|Wkpdsrnm2023]] ([[User talk:Wkpdsrnm2023|talk]]) 02:54, 12 April 2023 (UTC)

== Date of currency adoption ==

The article should show the years when each currency was adopted.

Example: Brazilian Real was adopted in 1994

Or maybe we should create a page called "List of currencies by year of adoption" [[User:MatheusGeo|MatheusGeo]] ([[User talk:MatheusGeo|talk]]) 16:52, 6 August 2024 (UTC)