View source for Talk:Croquette

{{merged-from|Crocchè|27 December 2023}}
{{dyktalk|25 September|2004|entry=...that the [[Dutch]] delicacy '''[[Croquet (food)|Croquet]]''' is rumored to contain [[offal]]?}}
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==General==
The lead should probably have a reference to [[Escoffier]]'s definition of a croquette.  I have also propose a level three heading for each country.  Anyone who likes the croquettes of a given country, please modify the bolded country name using three equal signs (start and end) instead.  It will automatically be added to the TOC.   Those with more expertise may know how to do this en masse.   [[User:Codwiki|Codwiki]] ([[User talk:Codwiki|talk]]) 18:53, 28 October 2009 (UTC)

==USA==
In the US, '''chicken croquettes''' were a luncheon dish that went out of favor after the 1950s. [[User:Wetman|Wetman]] 11:32, 23 Sep 2004 (UTC)

==Offal==
Brilliant last paragraph; very funny. 

BTW Van Dobben and Kwekkeboom are made by the same company (as their vandobben.nl and kwekkeboom.nl whois info shows). They do taste slightly different, though.

What's wrong with offal? Are the Dutch really that squeamish? --[[User:Heron|Heron]] 19:45, 24 Sep 2004 (UTC)

== Proposed rename to "croquette" ==

I have changed the spelling to the more usual "croquette" throughout (apart from acknowleding in the intro the existence of the spelling "croquet").

I believe the article should be renamed '''Croquette''', as not only is that easily the most common English-language form of the word, but it avoids any confusion with "croquet" (the game) and obviates the need for "(food)". At the moment, a simple move is not possible because "Croquette" already exists (as a re-direct to "Croquet (food)"). What's the procedure? -- [[User:Picapica|Picapica]] 11:57, 28 May 2005 (UTC)

== Other countries ==

Being a brazilian, I know for a fact that croquetes are very popular in my home country also. We have the "original" potato croquete, but a few varieties include ≥croquetes filled with ground beef and minced chicken. [[User:Quase|Quase]] 00:34, 29 September 2005 (UTC)

Spanish "croquets" (croquetas) are a typical meal on its own, known from a long time ago, before any Dutch come to Spain. Filled with ham, tuna, minced meat.... --[[User:81.60.2.204|81.60.2.204]] 13:08, 8 December 2005 (UTC)
: I've correct the "Costa del sol" thing. Dutch tourist didn't export croquettes' recipe to Spain...

==Shaped like a sausage?==

Is it just me, or does sausage, like, come in a lot of shapes?  I get the impression we're talking about a sausage patty shape here, but I think links are a more typical sausage shape.  And what's with not explaining what it's made of until three-quarters of the way thru the article?  I'm hesitant to change the article myself, not knowing much about it...  [[User:NickelShoe|NickelShoe]] 22:41, 2 November 2005 (UTC)

:Nothing to do with a sausage. This is a vegetable based food. I guess you COULD cook up a sausage croquette (the bread/potato exterior with sausage inside), but it would still be a croquette, and not a sausage patty. [[User:Quase|Quase]] 04:18, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

== Dutch focus? ==

Perhaps this is a stupid question, but why is this article so focused on The Netherlands? Surely this is an international food item? In fact, having visited both Spain and The Netherlands, I say that croquettes are more popular in Spanish restaurants than in Dutch ones. <small>—The preceding [[Wikipedia:Sign your posts on talk pages|unsigned]] comment was added by [[Special:Contributions/198.54.202.246|198.54.202.246]] ([[User talk:198.54.202.246|talk]]) 22:01, 7 March 2007 (UTC).</small><!-- HagermanBot Auto-Unsigned -->


It - in the Netherlands - isn't sold a lot in restaurant but at snackbars (including McDonalds with the McKroket) and other fastfood places not the fancy restaurants, the proletarian food. [[User:212.64.58.115|212.64.58.115]] 19:12, 12 November 2007 (UTC)

bogus. The 'kroket' is also served in restaurants in the Netherlands, even top chefs prepare it,  books have been written about it. Additionally, the dutch kroket is usually containing a meat ragout filling. not a mashed potato filling. those would be 'potato croquettes (26 may 2015)

::I also think it's odd that the article says that croquettes are a Dutch invention, but then explains that a Dutch chef "came across" them in France and introduced them back at home. Inventing and "coming across" something are completely different actions. The next paragraph continues the same POV when it starts with "In the Netherlands..." and only later mentions "In other places..." though it's a common food all over the world.

::Wouldn't be surprised if the text was translated and transfered from the Dutch language version of wikipedia. That whole opening section needs to adjusted for POV by someone who knows more about this than I do, imo. [[User:Zeng8r|Zeng8r]] 00:36, 13 November 2007 (UTC)

::I deleted most of the Dutch centric content, moved bits of it to the country specific section and also massively corrected the new Dutch "entry". It should now be possible to improve the introduction and extend the country specific information. [[User:JeR|JeR]] ([[User talk:JeR|talk]]) 12:59, 7 January 2008 (UTC)

==English croquettes==

The article mentions potato croquettes with fillings. In England, croqettes will be purely mashed potato in breadcrumbs. If they include fish and are round, as the pictured round ones look, they're called "fish cakes". Maybe this should be included in the article?  <small>—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/82.32.148.114|82.32.148.114]] ([[User talk:82.32.148.114|talk]]) 00:45, 21 September 2007 (UTC)</small><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== Netherlands ==

mcdonalds netherlands also has a mckroket  <small>—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/91.0.227.85|91.0.227.85]] ([[User talk:91.0.227.85|talk]]) 16:29, 2 March 2008 (UTC)</small><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

:let it fly!!! [[Special:Contributions/128.6.147.104|128.6.147.104]] ([[User talk:128.6.147.104|talk]]) 16:34, 4 February 2025 (UTC)

== Merge proposal ==

There has been a merge tag on [[Korokke]] for awhile now. They sound very similar. —[[User:Tokek|Tokek]] ([[User talk:Tokek|talk]]) 09:20, 9 August 2008 (UTC)

The merger proposal tag has existed at [[Korokke]] since July 2007, so we might as well decide on whether to merge the articles or remove the proposal tag and keep them separated. Also noticed that I took a position favorable to keeping the articles split back in January 2006 at [[Talk:Korokke]], then forgot about it. —[[User:Tokek|Tokek]] ([[User talk:Tokek|talk]]) 16:50, 9 August 2008 (UTC)

:Sooo, when will you be debating yourself? :)

:I'm for keeping the articles separate if the dish has a local twist and a local history. Though the [[Korokke]] article is relatively short, it seems to fit that description. Just my two cents... [[User:Zeng8r|Zeng8r]] ([[User talk:Zeng8r|talk]]) 18:00, 9 August 2008 (UTC)

== Sources and such ==

Ok, wikieditors; while some people are being unreasonably overzealous in their page wipes, it is true that this article needs more sources. Let's go get 'em! [[User:Zeng8r|Zeng8r]] ([[User talk:Zeng8r|talk]]) 20:28, 29 September 2008 (UTC)

Of course, but than a tag is more appropriate, by user  RFerreira or some {{citation needed}} tags,   
, not constantly removing the entire ''Croquettes in various countries'' section, more than half of the article (80%). That is called vandalism.
[[User:Warrington|Warrington]] ([[User talk:Warrington|talk]]) 22:29, 29 September 2008 (UTC)

:Oh, I agree. It's hard to source material that's been removed completely. [[User:Zeng8r|Zeng8r]] ([[User talk:Zeng8r|talk]]) 22:35, 29 September 2008 (UTC)

: Disagree completely.  The responsibility is on the reverting editor to provide sources, too, by the way.  Please stop reinserting what appears to be misinformation.  [[User:JBsupreme|JBsupreme]] ([[User talk:JBsupreme|talk]]) 01:57, 30 September 2008 (UTC)

We know that you do, you have been showing it by now, constantly vandalising the text under different names.
The rules are = put on tags or citation needed marks, not remove the entire text. Removing text in this way is vandalism.
And do not call the article misinformation.
that would be deliberate lies, and the text is not that.
And it is true, you can not source something that is not there. Your behavior is completely wrong.
[[User:Warrington|Warrington]] ([[User talk:Warrington|talk]]) 09:30, 30 September 2008 (UTC)

It happened AGAIN....
This is really annoying . People try to contribute and you just wipp out their contribs. It would take a long time to gather all that information all over  again.
[[User:Warrington|Warrington]] ([[User talk:Warrington|talk]]) 19:05, 30 September 2008 (UTC)

*I still don't understand the impetus for wiping 90% of the article. There's no libelous material here that calls for such a drastic action. And what "appears to be misinformation"? It appears to me that users from around the world have contributed info about croquette varieties from their own locales. But what's common knowledge in one community may not be so commonly known anywhere else, so sources are lacking and perhaps hard to find online. Sprinkle liberally with {{fact}} tags, but please stop throwing it all away. [[User:Zeng8r|Zeng8r]] ([[User talk:Zeng8r|talk]]) 21:51, 30 September 2008 (UTC)
** '''[http://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikien-l/2006-May/046440.html http://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikien-l/2006-May/046440.html]''' thx [[User:JBsupreme|JBsupreme]] ([[User talk:JBsupreme|talk]]) 06:30, 1 October 2008 (UTC)

THIS IS NOT A VALID ARGUMENT, YOUR LINK LEADING TO 
''Zero information is preferred to misleading or false information''

THIS ARTICLE IS NOT MISLEADING OR FALSE INFORMATION

SEE 

Deutsch
 
Español 

Euskara
 
Bahasa Indonesia 

Nederlands
 
Polski 

Português 

Русский 

THEY ALL HAVE ARTICLES ON "Croquette"

i can speak German, Duch, (Duch meaning Duch from Netherland) and a little Portugese, and what they have in their "Croquette" article is about the same here. 
Or do you want to propose that it is an international culinary conspiration?

(cur) (last)  06:25, 1 October 2008 JBsupreme (Talk | contribs) (1,427 bytes) (find sources for this garbage or gtfo please 

iT IS NOT GARBAGE .
you are getting this all wrong, and you are vandalising this article, and you are not giving any valid motifs for your behavior. You are misbehaving. Try with a a demonstration of a proof, or using logical reasoning for persuasion. 

[[User:Warrington|Warrington]] ([[User talk:Warrington|talk]]) 09:21, 1 October 2008 (UTC)

: Wikipedia has a fairly strict policy regarding original research.  In fact, it is officially documented at '''[[Wikipedia:No original research]]'''.  I don't agree with the strong words being used by JB but in effect he is correct.  If you have proof of these variations, please provide citations for them.  It also concerns me that some of these variations are borderline trivial and aren't actually citing ''reliable sources'' but at this point I'm willing to compromise with ''some'' sources rather than none at all. [[User:RFerreira|RFerreira]] ([[User talk:RFerreira|talk]]) 21:24, 1 October 2008 (UTC)

Why don't you try to find some yourself?

[[User:Warrington|Warrington]] ([[User talk:Warrington|talk]]) 23:27, 1 October 2008 (UTC)

:'tis easier to wipe an article than to try to make it better. It's also counterproductive on a site that's supposed to allow many users to combine good information into a more useful whole. Be part of fixing the problem; don't be the problem. [[User:Zeng8r|Zeng8r]] ([[User talk:Zeng8r|talk]]) 23:53, 1 October 2008 (UTC)

It is easier to wipe an article than to find sources that's a fact in itself. I myself have come across editors that will not help at all, but are just interesting in deleting information even if it's true and well known. Sources must be provided so people can't destroy your work and the effort you have put into an article. That's like me saying whales are mammals not fish which is well known, however you could have someone who is ignorant come up and say no whales are a type of fish which puts your work into question. The same can be said for the singer [[Aaliyah]] she's part African American and Native American that information is blow up everywhere, but because that information has not been published we can't use it. Try finding an online site that deals with food, and recipes. There should at least be a few on the web for people who love to cook. I hope this helps[[User:Mcelite|Mcelite]] ([[User talk:Mcelite|talk]]) 05:26, 2 October 2008 (UTC)

: What a strawman argument if I've ever heard one.  I could cite a million (YES A MILLION) difference sources that demonstrate that whales are mammals, not fish.  Stop making excuses and follow editorial policy.  [[User:JBsupreme|JBsupreme]] ([[User talk:JBsupreme|talk]]) 07:08, 2 October 2008 (UTC)

It is allways nice to have a million referrences, yes, but:

About editorial policy:
I have asked for third opinion, just to be '''sure about this'''. The answer was: “The verifiability policy only actually requires references for facts which are controversial, or facts which are challenged. I don't think that a recipe is very controversial, so I don't think that references are '''needed'''. "

[[User:Warrington|Warrington]] ([[User talk:Warrington|talk]]) 08:19, 2 October 2008 (UTC)

User:RFerreira&JBsupreme, please help improving the edit instead of removing entirely the section '''Croquettes in various countries.''' This is is an unproductive, repeated, combative reversion of others' edits. 

[[User:Warrington|Warrington]] ([[User talk:Warrington|talk]]) 09:19, 2 October 2008 (UTC)

I wasn't making an excuse JB. I was just saying that the information must be sourced even if it is true. That's why I used the whales for an example.[[User:Mcelite|Mcelite]] ([[User talk:Mcelite|talk]]) 20:12, 2 October 2008 (UTC)

And one more thing, User:RFerreira&JBsupreme. This is the current version, or what you keept of the list - Croquettes in various countries. I have to say that this sounds weird.''' Krokett''' is '''Hungarian''' for croquette. In this current new edit it disapeared somewhere. And where is the Czech variety?

''[edit] Variations

"Krokett" ''is a small cylindrical croquette made similar the Czech variety: potatoes, eggs, flour, butter and touch of nutmeg and salt that are deep fried in oil. This variety can be ordered in most restaurants as a side dish as well as bought frozen. Croquette can be made with cheese too, called turokrokett[1].
''In Tampa, Florida, there is a type of croquette made with seasoned crab meat that is traditionally breaded with stale Cuban bread. Locally, this is known as a deviled crab (croqueta de jaiba)''.[2]

THIS STUFF WAS IN THE ARTICLE NOW FOR A WHILE.

''“This variety can be ordered in most restaurants as a side dish as well as bought frozen”'' 

It sounds like you can buy those Hungarian Krokett in Orange County or somewhere in New Brunswick. I mean making so much fuss about correctness, and than not beeing correct yourself. 

And your new edit makes it sound like all croquette with cheese is called “turokrokett” (that would be Hungarian for cheesecroquette).  This IS misleding and incorrect information, much more than the list, - if somebody reads the article in this present state gets really a wrong idea about a lot of things.

[[User:Warrington|Warrington]] ([[User talk:Warrington|talk]]) 10:39, 3 October 2008 (UTC)

== Confused about intro vs. rest  ==

Hi everyone. I'm a bit confused here. This article starts out by saying "A croquette is a small fried roll containing mashed potatoes," then launches into a long list of foods that may or may not have mashed potatoes in them. For most of these, like Dutch ''kroketten'' and Portuguese ''croquetes'', the name makes it clear that they are somehow related. But the Russian котлета, it's not actually clear at all why they are in this list. And going down the list, it becomes unclear which ones have potatoes and which don't. If potatoes are not mentioned specifically for some country's version of croquettes, should we assume they are present (because the intro says so) or not? So... could somebody in the know please expand the intro to explain that some countries' "croquettes" aren't actually potato-based? And be more clear about why котлета are in this article? Thanks! [[User_talk:FreplySpang|FreplySpang]] 00:15, 25 December 2008 (UTC)

croquette is a small fried roll usually containing mashed potatoes, and/orminced meat, shellfish or vegetables, or any of the combination thereof, often encased in breadcrumbs.

[[User:Warrington|Warrington]] ([[User talk:Warrington|talk]]) 10:40, 25 December 2008 (UTC)

== A French invention? ==

Is there any citation to support that? It certainly isn't in the text or citations within the article. - [[User:Jack Sebastian|Jack Sebastian]] ([[User talk:Jack Sebastian|talk]]) 18:47, 9 May 2010 (UTC)

== External links modified ==

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I have just modified 5 external links on [[Croquette]]. Please take a moment to review [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?diff=prev&oldid=795526448 my edit]. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit [[User:Cyberpower678/FaQs#InternetArchiveBot|this simple FaQ]] for additional information. I made the following changes:
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*Added archive https://archive.is/20120722074331/http://www.cigarcitymagazine.com/food/item/bitter-strikes-brought-deviled-crabs to http://www.cigarcitymagazine.com/food/item/bitter-strikes-brought-deviled-crabs
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20080512020352/http://www.foodmuseum.com/xLiliDeviledCrab.html to http://www.foodmuseum.com/xLiliDeviledCrab.html
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== Belgium ==

I was reading this article once when I saw the Belgium part. <br>
“the quality comes down to the filling” <br>
What is this, are they promoting Belgian croquettes? I put a tone template above this grarmpitutty. <span style="color:blue;"><sup>いくら</sup></span><span style="background-color:Cyan; color:black;">[[User:Braden1127|Braden1127]]</span> <span style="color:blue;"><sub>イクラ</sub></span><span style="color:blue;">[[User talk:Braden1127|ꅇ]]</span> 06:42, 28 December 2018 (UTC)
==Merge proposal==
I propose to merge the article [[Crocchè]] here. Actually ''crocchè'' are ''crocchette'' in Naples, and ''crocchette'' are croquettes. [[User:Alessandro57|Alex2006]] ([[User talk:Alessandro57|talk]]) 20:11, 9 July 2023 (UTC)

:@[[User:Alessandro57|Alessandro57]] I agree it makes sense to merge (and redirect) crocch''è/''crocchette (Italy). Croquetas (Spain/Latin America) and Krokets (Netherlands), and so on, essentially refer to regional variations of a dish with the same simple core ingredients, prepared in the same basic method - this is even plain to see linguistically across languages.
:I'm not sure about the etymology of crocch''è/''crocchette but croquetas (spanish) is derived from the French name - croquer (to crunch) + ette (feminine diminutive suffix). It may be the same in Italian.
:I note 'Croquetas' redirects to 'Croquettes' in the English language Wikipedia, and the regional variations in Wikipedia are well described in this article.
:From a UK or Australian perspective, the various variations described here would usually be explained as 'a type of croquette'. [[User:Montezuma69|Montezuma69]] ([[User talk:Montezuma69|talk]]) 23:17, 6 December 2023 (UTC)
::{{merge done}} [[User:Klbrain|Klbrain]] ([[User talk:Klbrain|talk]]) 18:55, 27 December 2023 (UTC)