View source for Talk:Biathlon World Championships

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==Unofficial Team awards 1958 thru 1965==

The following table, emanating from http://www.wintersport.as, lists the highest-ranking nations of the 1958 to 1965 BWCHs, which reportedly consisted of the men's Individual (20 km) contest only. The 1958--1965 Team results table should thus be withheld from the article until certified whether the results represents a [[Biathlon#Team|Team]] competition as such (albeit an unofficial one) or the accumulated Individual contest points of each participating nation's biathletes. --[[User:Wernher|Wernher]] 20:29, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)

<table>
<tr>
<td>1958</td>
<td>[[Sweden]]</td>
<td>[[Soviet Union|USSR]]</td>
<td>[[Norway]]</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>1959</td>
<td>[[Soviet Union|USSR]]</td>
<td>[[Sweden]]</td>
<td>[[Norway]]</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>1961</td>
<td>[[Finland]]</td>
<td>[[Soviet Union|USSR]]</td>
<td>[[Sweden]]</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>1962</td>
<td>[[Soviet Union|USSR]]</td>
<td>[[Finland]]</td>
<td>[[Norway]]</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>1963</td>
<td>[[Soviet Union|USSR]]</td>
<td>[[Finland]]</td>
<td>[[Norway]]</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>1965</td>
<td>[[Norway]]</td>
<td>[[Soviet Union|USSR]]</td>
<td>[[Poland]]</td>
</tr>
</table>

==Inclusion of flags in tables==

To the anonymous user whose edits were recently reverted by myself: contributions are generally appreciated, but should follow Wikipedia policies and/or conventions made in order to simplify and 'prettify' the articles (and also the editing process). As regards flags in sports results listings, there are established methods to do this; see for example [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Flag Template|WikiProject Flag Template]] and [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Sports Results|WikiProject Sports Results]]. If these guidelines/templates aren't followed, it's better to postpone one's editing until prepared to comply (lest risking reversion). --[[User:Wernher|Wernher]] 22:15, 3 October 2005 (UTC)

:Again, reverted. And again, not done in [[wikt:spite|spite]], but because we should really try to reach a [[wikt:consensus|consensus]] before doing these numerous edits.

:Heck, I'll make a suggestion now right away for us to discuss: how about the following format: ''flag first, name second, and IOC country code third''? (the IOC code might link to the country or not; see the deliberations below the table). I suggest this format in order to keep the tables of individual results at just one line for each result/year, making the vertical size of the article as small as possible (a [[Good Thing]]&trade; when browsing the tables):

:'''Example draft of new table format: Mass start (12.5 km)'''

:{| border="1" cellpadding="2" cellspacing="0"
!style="background:#efefef;" |Year
!style="background:#efefef;" |Gold
!style="background:#efefef;" |Silver
!style="background:#efefef;" |Bronze
|-
|1999
|{{biathlon flagresult|Olena Zubrilova|UKR}}
|{{biathlon flagresult|Olena Petrova|UKR}}
|{{biathlon flagresult|Magdalena Forsberg|SWE}}
|-
|2000
|{{biathlon flagrespip|Liv Grete Skjelbreid Poirée|Liv Grete Poirée|NOR}}
|{{biathlon flagresult|Galina Koukleva|RUS}}
|{{biathlon flagresult|Corinne Niogret|FRA}}
|-
|2001
|{{biathlon flagresult|Magdalena Forsberg|SWE}}
|{{biathlon flagresult|Martina Glagow|GER}}
|{{biathlon flagrespip|Liv Grete Skjelbreid Poirée|Liv Grete Poirée|NOR}}
|-
|2003
|{{biathlon flagresult|Albina Akhatova|RUS}}
|{{biathlon flagresult|Svetlana Ishmouratova|RUS}}
|{{biathlon flagresult|Sandrine Bailly|FRA}}
|-
|2004
|{{biathlon flagrespip|Liv Grete Skjelbreid Poirée|Liv Grete Poirée|NOR}}
|{{biathlon flagresult|Katrin Apel|GER}}
|{{biathlon flagresult|Sandrine Bailly|FRA}}
|-
|[[Biathlon World Championship 2005|2005]]
|{{biathlon flagrespip|Gro Marit Istad-Kristiansen|Gro M. Istad-Kristiansen|NOR}}
|{{biathlon flagresult|Anna Carin Olofsson|SWE}}
|{{biathlon flagresult|Olga Pyleva|RUS}}
|}

:The linking from IOC code to country, after the biathlete name, might be a point of discussion: is a link necessary/desirable in addition to the code? After all, we're not dealing with very many countries in this sport, and letting the mouse pointer hover over the flag will display the full country name anyway. If we end up linking from IOC code to country as shown in the example above, we should perhaps try to find/make a template to produce the country-linked IOC codes without having to code them explicitly (i.e., <nowiki>[[</nowiki>''<IOC country code>''|''<country link>''<nowiki>]]</nowiki>) as I have done here.

:I guess for team events like relays we could use a separate line with the flag and country name and then list the teams' participants in as compact a format as possible. Please feel free to comment.  --[[User:Wernher|Wernher]] 01:42, 15 November 2005 (UTC)

:We should probably get in line and [[meta:Help:Table|wikify the tables]] as well. I've done that to this example now. --[[User:Wernher|Wernher]] 18:38, 15 November 2005 (UTC)

::Hi Wernher, i am partially at fault here since i gave up reverting on the athletics world championship pages and directed (he followed my example) this user to edit in the style with a flag on the seperate line. In the case of athletics this makes sense since we need another three colomns available for the times and distances. We never did reach a proper consensus on the [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Sports Results|WikiProject Sports Results]] and I notice this same user is doing what you are recommending here on the athletics Olympic pages where, for some reason, he has a preference for no results. So consistency is not a strong point for him. 

::I have not really figured out this user, but he does seem to follow by example (as i noted above). It seems that we either have to revert all his edits or just suck it up and accept that flags have to be included and lead by example. I still have no idea why wikipedians have such a flag fetish (or is it just this one user?). Personally, I quite like the tables without the flag clutter. [[User:Daycd|David D.]] [[User talk:Daycd|(Talk)]] 18:26, 15 November 2005 (UTC) 

:::I too, preferred flagless tables originally; the tables generally look much tidier without flags. However, I appreciate the effect that flags have on the ability of the reader to immediately see which nations have been particularly active/successful in a given sport or sports event. --[[User:Wernher|Wernher]] 18:38, 15 November 2005 (UTC)

:Update: I have now created a couple of templates, [[Template:Biathlon flagresult|Biathlon flagresult]] and [[Template:Biathlon flagrespip|Biathlon flagrespip]], for use in biathlon results tables. They are used in the example above. This way, adding the iconic flags as well as the IOC/ISO codes with links is quite easy and gives very compact WP source code. Also, the flags have been scaled to a standard vertical size, to further improve readability. Strangely, the 'mouse hover popup text' over the flag icons have disappeared, but this shouldn't be of much concern if we use the linked-to IOC codes as shown. --[[User:Wernher|Wernher]] 23:39, 15 November 2005 (UTC)

----
:The following example is with the standard IOC/ISO templates; ease to implement: just change <nowiki>[[NOR]] into {{NOR}}</nowiki>. It's often justed on 'sports' result-pages now. [[User:Bart l|Bart l]] 21:38, 16 November 2005 (UTC)

:'''Example draft of with standard IOC/ISO table format: Mass start (12.5 km)'''

:{| border="1" cellpadding="2" cellspacing="0"
!style="background:#efefef;" |Year
!style="background:#efefef;" |Gold
!style="background:#efefef;" |Silver
!style="background:#efefef;" |Bronze
|-
|1999
|[[Olena Zubrilova]] {{UKR}}
|[[Olena Petrova]] {{UKR}}
|[[Magdalena Forsberg]] {{SWE}}
|-
|2000
|[[Liv Grete Skjelbreid Poirée|Liv Grete Poirée]] {{NOR}}
|[[Galina Koukleva]] {{RUS}}
|[[Corinne Niogret]] {{FRA}}
|-
|2001
|[[Magdalena Forsberg]] {{SWE}}
|[[Martina Glagow]] {{GER}}
|[[Liv Grete Skjelbreid Poirée|Liv Grete Poirée]] {{NOR}}
|-
|2003
||[[Albina Akhatova]] {{RUS}}
|[[Svetlana Ishmouratova]] {{RUS}}
|[[Sandrine Bailly]] {{FRA}}
|-
|2004
|[[Liv Grete Skjelbreid Poirée|Liv Grete Poirée]] {{NOR}}
|[[Katrin Apel]] {{GER}}
|[[Sandrine Bailly]] {{FRA}}
|-
|[[Biathlon World Championship 2005|2005]]
|[[Gro Marit Istad-Kristiansen|Gro M. Istad-Kristiansen]] {{NOR}}
|[[Anna Carin Olofsson]] {{SWE}}
|[[Olga Pyleva]] {{RUS}}
|}

:Thanks for your suggestion. However, I was actually well aware of the existing <nowiki>{{</nowiki>''IOC code''<nowiki>}}</nowiki> templates---my aim with this 'custom' scheme is rather to get a tidy layout for these tables, with the flags and athletes' names being vertically aligned. I hope you agree that such a layout is more -eh- 'pleasing to the eye', and in general much more readable, than a layout with flags being positioned all across their 'cells' depending on the differing lengths of the athletes' names. --[[User:Wernher|Wernher]] 01:25, 17 November 2005 (UTC)

::I fully agree with your comment! What might work too, is to put the country between <nowiki><small> </small> tags</nowiki> like <small>[[France]]</small> or <small>([[FRA]])</small>. Personaly I think the countryname is more usefull than the countrycode TLC, since they often not link to the country page directly, but that just an opinion. [[User:Bart l|Bart l]] 18:40, 17 November 2005 (UTC)

:::You're right about the country code not often linking to the country page---which is why I have made the 'biathlon templates' do just that. :-) (As I have mentioned above, however, I think such links might not be absolutely necessary in the biathlon pages, due to the relatively low number of countries participating in the sport (as well as the several notes referring the readers to the IOC country code lists in case of doubt). Anyway, if the mood is for linking from each country code to the country page, so be it; I see no reason to contest that.)

:::As for the 'biathlon templates', I should also mention that I am looking into minimizing the server load effect of using those templates. I will experiment with the use of "subst:" within the templates, to try and alleviate the negative effects. My goal, anyway, is to ensure that the editing of the results tables should be as easy, quick, and effortless as possible, as well as being self-explaining to all current and future editors. I think we'll get a good result after cooperating on this. --[[User:Wernher|Wernher]] 21:00, 17 November 2005 (UTC)

== New 'flag template' to be used in tables ==

I have made a modified 'flag template' more general in use than the above. The new tpl is [[:Template:Flag athl iocc|<nowiki>{{flag athl iocc}}</nowiki>]] [[Template talk:Flag athl iocc|(usage)]]. Barring serious protests, I'll introduce the tpl into the pertinent tables in several articles shortly, to save storage capacity and speed up loading. --[[User:Wernher|Wernher]] 23:20, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

== Below-table footnotes ==

An anonymous user (which I will refrain from calling names, however tempting that is) some time ago removed the informational footnotes below each table; see
[http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Biathlon_World_Championships&oldid=111324998 this version] for the one ''with'' the notes. As soon as I can manage, I will reinstate the footnotes, possibly using the "bottom of page with return pointers" footnote format if that proves more fitting. --[[User:Wernher|Wernher]] 02:43, 5 October 2007 (UTC)

==Peter Angerer FRG==
In 1986 this source http://www.sports-reference.com/olympics/athletes/an/peter-angerer-1.html explains that Angerer was disqualified from his silver medal place and this ties up with German wikipedia, but it is not correct here so I've changed it, however I can't find many sources to back this up. [[User:Tonyr68uk|Tony]] ([[User talk:Tonyr68uk|talk]]) 23:46, 26 February 2009 (UTC)

== Added New Venues ==

From 2018 to 2022.  <small><span class="autosigned">—&nbsp;Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:FallandSpringOlympics|FallandSpringOlympics]] ([[User talk:FallandSpringOlympics|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/FallandSpringOlympics|contribs]]) 02:43, 17 November 2013 (UTC)</span></small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

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