View source for Talk:∑

…or the Greek letter [[Sigma]]. [[User:Archola|Archola]]

== ∑ = series ==

The reason I reverted it to point to [[Series (mathematics)|Series]] is because the ∑ symbol used in the title is represented by 2211 in Unicode, which points to the series symbol.  The Unicode character for ''sigma'' is at 03A3 and looks like Σ, which is slightly different.--<strong><code>[[User:Schwarzm|<span style="color: maroon;">Max</span>]]</code></strong>  <small class="plainlinks">[[User Talk:Schwarzm|Talk ]][{{SERVER}}{{localurl:User_talk:Schwarzm|action=edit&section=new}} (add)]</small> 18:31, 18 April 2006 (UTC)

: True enough, but for most people what matters is visual appearance. I belive that even if the Unicode Sigma is used for sum, it is still Sigma in a different font, and as such, it should redirect to [[Sigma]] and not to [[Series (mathematics)]]. Now the latter article has a note that ∑ redirects there, and that's just plain confusing. [[User:Oleg Alexandrov|Oleg Alexandrov]] ([[User talk:Oleg Alexandrov|talk]]) 03:24, 19 April 2006 (UTC)

::How is it anymore confusing than the note of the top of ß saying: ''This article is about the letter ß found in the German alphabet; for the Greek letter β, see Beta (letter)''?
::: That's different.  ß and β look very different and they are indeed different letters. The math one, ∑, is just the Greek sigma with a different font. As such, it should redirect to [[Sigma]] not to the series article. [[User:Oleg Alexandrov|Oleg Alexandrov]] ([[User talk:Oleg Alexandrov|talk]]) 20:19, 19 April 2006 (UTC)
{|class="wikitable" align="right"
|- style="font-family:sans-serif;"
!Sans-serif
|I
|l
|1
|- style="font-family:serif;"
!Serif
|I
|l
|1
|- style="font-family:monospace;"
!monospace
|I
|l
|1
|}
::What about I, l, and 1?  In certain fonts, they look nearly identical, but they are very different characters:--<strong><code>[[User:Schwarzm|<span style="color: maroon;">Max</span>]]</code></strong>  <small class="plainlinks">[[User Talk:Schwarzm|Talk ]][{{SERVER}}{{localurl:User_talk:Schwarzm|action=edit&section=new}} (add)]</small> 23:22, 21 April 2006 (UTC)

That's beside the point. ∑ and &Sigma; are the same character. They should redirect to the same article, that being the letter. The article [[Sigma]] does mention that it is used to denote series and other sums. [[User:Oleg Alexandrov|Oleg Alexandrov]] ([[User talk:Oleg Alexandrov|talk]]) 00:08, 22 April 2006 (UTC)
:In a serif font, the two look quite a bit different.  However, I believe one keep them seperate for semantic reasons, even though they look similar.  An example is the <nowiki><code> and <tt></nowiki> tags.  Even though they appear nearly the same, for semantic reasons they are kept separate.  Also note that the [[∏]] and [[∆]] symbols redirect to [[n-ary code]] and [[triangle]] respectively, even though they look like the Greek letters Π and Δ, respectively.--<strong><code>[[User:Schwarzm|<span style="color: maroon;">Max</span>]]</code></strong>  <small class="plainlinks">[[User Talk:Schwarzm|Talk ]][{{SERVER}}{{localurl:User_talk:Schwarzm|action=edit&section=new}} (add)]</small> 16:45, 22 April 2006 (UTC)

Those redirects are just as unhelpful and confusing. But that's not what matters much, ultimately we are talking about very obscure redirects, which nobody ever would type by hand. What I am really unhappy with, however, is the note

:∆ ''redirects here. For the Greek letter [[Δ]], see [[Delta (letter)]]''

at [[triangle]]. That is distracting. If you really think people will look for [[Δ]] at the redirect [[∆]], then one must redirect to [[Δ]] to start with. It is highly highly improbable somebody will look for the triangle by typing in [[∆]].

All in all, I see your point about semantics. But please keep in mind that this is all Unicode tricks and stuff. Most people are not aware of this stuff, and it is not a good idea to expose these intricate technicalities more than necessary. [[User:Oleg Alexandrov|Oleg Alexandrov]] ([[User talk:Oleg Alexandrov|talk]]) 17:01, 22 April 2006 (UTC)

: I would challenge you to write two short articles on [[∆]] and [[∑]], explaining what you said above, that they are unicode characters, that their code in the table is such and such, that they are used to denote such and such math operation, and that they are similar/related to such and such charaters. That may solve the problem. [[User:Oleg Alexandrov|Oleg Alexandrov]] ([[User talk:Oleg Alexandrov|talk]]) 18:22, 22 April 2006 (UTC)

::Your wearing me down.  I don't actually care that strongly where it points to, and I am starting to see the logic behind your point.  You can change it to [[sigma]] if you want.--<strong><code>[[User:Schwarzm|<span style="color: maroon;">Max</span>]]</code></strong>  <small class="plainlinks">[[User Talk:Schwarzm|Talk ]][{{SERVER}}{{localurl:User_talk:Schwarzm|action=edit&section=new}} (add)]</small> 18:19, 26 April 2006 (UTC)

Heh. :) Formally you are right, but insisting on the distinction between &Sigma; and ∑ is just confusing. I don't mind if the redirect stays, I don't care much about it. But I removed the disambiguation at [[series (mathematics)]] which says that [[∑]] redirects to it. 

If somebdy puts that note back at [[series (mathematics)]], I will redirect [[∑]]  to [[Sigma]]. [[User:Oleg Alexandrov|Oleg Alexandrov]] ([[User talk:Oleg Alexandrov|talk]]) 00:41, 27 April 2006 (UTC)