View source for Talk:Édith Piaf

{{GA nominee|23:05, 20 May 2025 (UTC)|nominator=[[User:Yadsalohcin|Yadsalohcin]] ([[User talk:Yadsalohcin|talk]])|page=2|subtopic=Music|status=onreview|note=|shortdesc=French singer (1915–1963)}}
{{FailedGA|00:30, 17 July 2023 (UTC)|topic=Music|page=1|oldid=1165607579}}
{{WikiProject banner shell|class=B|vital=yes|listas=Piaf, Edith|blp=no|1=
{{WikiProject Biography|musician-priority=High|musician-work-group=yes}}
{{WikiProject France|importance=High }}
{{WikiProject Women's History|importance=mid}}
{{WikiProject Pop music|importance=high}}
{{WikiProject Women }}
{{WikiProject Women in Green|8}}
{{WikiProject Women in Music|importance=high}}
}}
{{Backwards copy
| title            = Les 100 Chansons Éternelles D' Edith Piaf
| year             = 2020
| author           = 
| display-authors  = 
| url              = https://cdgo.com/en/detalhe/3596972537127/edith-piaf-les-100-chansons-ternelles-d-edith-piaf
| org              = 
| monthday         = <!-- 2020-01-01 -->
| id               = 932424262
| title2           = Édith PIAF – Deja Vu, Definitive Gold 2006
| year2            = 2010
| author2          = 
| display-authors2 = 
| url2             = https://whoisthemonk.wordpress.com/2010/11/30/edith-piaf-deja-vu-definitive-gold-2006/
| org2             = 
| monthday2        = <!-- 2010-11-30  id2= 457721366 -->
| title3           = Death in Hollywood: Edith Piaf, French Chanteuse, 1915-1963
| year3            = 2022
| author3          = 
| display-authors3 = 
| url3             = https://emanuellevy.com/profile/death-in-hollywood-edith-piaf-french-chanteuse-1915-1963/
| org3             = 
| monthday3        =<!-- 2022-10-26  id3=1112932088 -->
}}
{{Annual readership}}

==Accent==
Isn't it a bit precious to use "É" all the way through?  Accents are usually omitted from capital letters in French; one ''can'' use them, but why do it here? --[[User:Mel Etitis|Mel Etitis]]  ([[User talk:Mel Etitis|<span style="color:green;">Μελ Ετητης</span>)]] 21:36, 29 September 2005 (UTC)
:Here in the English Wikipedia, I think it makes sense to use the same spelling as in the [[:fr:Edith Piaf|French]]. Your question is still valid for the French article, though. (I wonder if my local library has a French paper encyclopedia?) [[User:Abu ari|Abu ari]] 08:52, 13 September 2006 (UTC)

The accent issue is a false problem. It is true that for quite a long time, it has been thought to be unnecessary to keep the accent on capital letters. But this comes a technical inability of the old printing machines. In handwriting, we still have to write the accents. Nowadays, with the apparition of the computer, this issue is irrelevent and we yet again have to put the accents on capital letters.


http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usage_des_majuscules_en_fran%C3%A7ais#Accentuation_des_majuscules_et_capitales

[[User:Sseb22|Sseb22]] 05:28, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

== Death ==
Where should technical errors like the date of Edith Piaf's death being reported as the 10th at the top of the page and the 11th further down in the text be reported? I have similar errors on many pages and would like to let someone know about them. [[User Alan S]]12:10, 10 October 2005 (UTC)

:They shouldn't be reported but corrected (that's the beauty of Wikipedia).  Where you notice a discrepancy but don't know which is the correct version, a note like the one above on the relevant Talk page will do. --[[User:Mel Etitis|Mel Etitis]]  ([[User talk:Mel Etitis|<span style="color:green;">Μελ Ετητης</span>)]] 20:21, 11 October 2005 (UTC)

The use of her "official" date of death troubles me greatly.  Where is the evidence that she actually died on the 10th?  Why is she "officially" said to have died on the 11th, if she actually died on the 10th?  Where else in Wikipedia do we provide a date of death that we ''know'' is not the correct date?  If there is indeed a discrepancy between her actual, proven, date of death and some "official" date, we should use the actual date in the article and give the official date in the footnote, not the other way around.  [[User:JackofOz|JackofOz]] 01:14, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

:Janet Flanner, in her column filed on Oct. 23, 1963 and reprinted in the book ''Paris Journal:  1944-1965'', p.568, reports that Piaf's death occurred at 7:00 AM on a "recent Friday," which, according to my perpetual calendar, would have been the 11th.  Flanner also reports that Jean Cocteau died at 1:00 PM on the same day from "a final heart attack, provoked by the news of her demise."  The Wikipedia page on Cocteau has his death occurring on Oct 11, 1963.  [[User:Terry J. Carter|Terry J. Carter]] ([[User talk:Terry J. Carter|talk]]) 01:50, 22 July 2013 (UTC):

== Song ==
[[List of Canadian musicians|Wendy McNeill]] does a fabulous song (http://zed.cbc.ca/go?c=contentPage&CONTENT_ID=121650) about Edith Piaf.  Kind of summarizes a lot of her life. [[User:Fireworks|FireWorks]] 20:31, 3 December 2005 (UTC)

==Dear Editors of Wikipedia==

I would appreciate your sending me information about where you obtained the biographical information for Edith Piaf on the Wikipedia website.

It is my understanding that Edith Piaf's real name is actually: Edith Annette Gisson Holliday.  I do not believe that the name Gassion as listed on your website and a fake website with her grave marker is accurate.  Also,I do not believe that Edith Piaf was Italian as some of the surnames you have listed would imply. Further, I do not believe that Edith Piaf is related to a circus performer or a madame of a bordello. 

:According to Janet Flanner, ''Paris Journal 1944-1965,'' p. 569, Piaf's name was Gassion, and her grandmother ran a brothel.  Flanner's statement dates to Oct 23, 1963.  I can't find a Warner bio of Piaf, fake or otherwise, in WorldCat.  As Piaf performed in public as a "featured
act" from 1935 until not long before her death, I don't see how anybody could credit the idea of her having been killed during WW II.  If Warner did write such a book and if he did connect her to a relative with a brothel, that statement was not original with him.  [[User:Terry J. Carter|Terry J. Carter]] ([[User talk:Terry J. Carter|talk]]) 02:08, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

I heard a rumor recently that Senator John Warner wrote a Fake biography about Edith Piaf since he is making money selling her recordings.  I am still investigating how Senator Warner is related to Edith Piaf and how he accessed Edith Piaf's recordings to sell after 1945 when there are people that have said Edith Piaf was actually killed during WWII by the Nazis because of her Jewish heritage the fact that she was related to French and Belgian royalty. One would wonder how Senator Warner left WWII in 1945 with Edith Piaf recordings in tow if Edith Piaf lived beyond WWII.

*Paline HollidayEarpCarroll Brown

: ''Note written 7 months later'': The above fascinatingly bizarre opinion was written in January 2006. Apparently, everybody was stunned into silence by its content, since it never got any response, at least not on this page. (''John Warner?!?!?'') - [[User:DavidWBrooks|DavidWBrooks]] 22:19, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

This does show why ''the article needs citations desperately''.--[[User:76.182.88.254|76.182.88.254]] 04:48, 19 July 2007 (UTC)

I post alleged 'original research' and it gets vaporized  in a nano second. [[rem486]]  <small>—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/207.255.86.240|207.255.86.240]] ([[User talk:207.255.86.240|talk]]) 21:27, 10 May 2008 (UTC)</small><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== La Vie en Rose ==

I recently created an article for [[La Vie en Rose]], so any contributions from people with knowledge about Edith's signature song would be appreciated - [[User:AKeen|AKeen]] 16:01, 3 February 2006 (UTC)

== Clean this article up! ==

It's pretty messy and unprofessional at the moment. Let's clean it up already.

[[User:Markcholden|Mark]] 23:40, 11 March 2006 (UTC)

==Deletion==
The entirety of this article was deleted, without comment, due to alleged copyright violation a few days ago.  It seems absurd to have nothing more than "a French singer" for possibly the most famous French chanteuse.  I have supplied a translation, more or less bad, of the Piaf article at the French Wikipedia.  But I think that some discussion would be warranted before yanking an entire article. [[User:RandomCritic|RandomCritic]] 21:03, 11 April 2006 (UTC)

:Hi. Well, the article was not "deleted", just marked as a possible copyvio (all the previous revisions are still there and could be restored). It's not excluded (though IMHO unlikely) that the issue is the other way round: the site that I spotted has actually copied from Wikipedia. In any case I guess we had to wait a few days before rewriting the whole content, just to be sure. Please, consider that the page is still listed here:

::[[Wikipedia:Copyright_problems/2006_April_9]]

:In any case I just followed the "canonical" procedure.

::[[Wikipedia:Copyright_FAQ#What_should_I_do_if_I_find_a_copyright_violation_on_Wikipedia.3F|What to do about copyright violations]]

:Believe me, I was really disappointed for my "discovery".

:--[[User:Gennaro Prota|Gennaro Prota]] 01:06, 12 April 2006 (UTC)

<div style="color: darkblue;">Well, somebody (name not given on the history page) did delete both the article and your copyvio notice.</div>
:Not my fault. That's someone who doesn't read what he has in front of his eyes.

<div style="color: darkblue;">In any case you seem to have been mistaken.</div>

:Here you still keep some courtesy. There must have been something which made you lose your temper between writing this and the next paragraphs. But it was not me.

<div style="color: darkblue;">If you had provided a link to your asserted site in this talk page the matter could have been investigated;</div>

:Don't be offended but you seem very unfamiliar with Wikipedia procedures. Yes, I forgot to add the link as an argument to the copyvio template (because I was in a hurry and because I'm quite new here &mdash;this is my first possible-copyvio tagging), but the link is anyway here:
::[[Wikipedia:Copyright_problems/2006_April_9]]
:''(if someone provides a link and wastes time for that, please be gentle enough to take it a look)''

<div style="color: darkblue;">better yet, you could have investigated it yourself before jumping to conclusions.</div>

:I didn't draw conclusions. Rather you jumped the gun. I was investigating yesterday (sorry for not being able to do that *immediately*, boss; I'll ask my company to give me more spare time) and found that the first version which comes close to the one at

::http://www.edithpiaf.com/biography.php

:is revision as of 04:56, 16 November 2003

:That comforted me as the site reports "©2004–present EdithPiaf.com" so it is very likely older.

<div style="color: darkblue;">As it turns out, the biography at EdithPiaf.com is an exact copy of the Wikipedia article as of August 9, 2004.  And if you look at the layers of history before that, you can see that the Wikipedia article on that date was not copied and pasted from somewhere else, but the product of months and months of accumulated changes.</div>

:Yes. As I said, sorry for not working 24 hours a day here.

<div style="color: darkblue;">It is clear that EdithPiaf.com borrowed the article from Wikipedia and not the other way around. I hope that in the future you will be much more careful about making assertions of copyright violation. Many, many places use Wikipedia as a source.</div>

:Your main misunderstanding is that I made an assertion of copyright violation. I just made a report of possible copyright violation. You seem also very unfamiliar with Wikipedia policies and with [[Wikipedia:Etiquette|Wikiquette]]. Please take a look at that. And remember we are all here for the same reason. No need to bite.
::The point is that you, by honest mistake, replaced a good article with a copyright violation notice.  The effect of your report was to make the article inaccessible by normal search.  Of course it was still in the history, but that is not where one would expect to look for it.  Furthermore, people are inclined to assume that copyright violation notices are not only made in good faith (which I don't question) but based on solid information.  I would only ask that you refrain from making your "reports" in the future before you have solid evidence that a violation has occurred (e.g., if you yourself are the copyright holder). [[User:RandomCritic|RandomCritic]] 13:31, 12 April 2006 (UTC)

<div style="color: darkblue;">[[User:RandomCritic|RandomCritic]] 05:13, 12 April 2006 (UTC)</div>

:Yeah, I understand your nick now :-(<br>--[[User:Gennaro Prota|Gennaro Prota]] 12:25, 12 April 2006 (UTC)

----


I don't mind if the article is reverted to the last pre-copyvio form, but I should note that there is a little information in the French article which could be incorporated; for instance, it clears up the October 10/October 11 death date question. [[User:RandomCritic|RandomCritic]] 05:13, 12 April 2006 (UTC)

== Films ==
There's a section with films without any explanation. Did she act in them or are they about her? [[User:AxelBoldt|AxelBoldt]] 07:24, 28 May 2006 (UTC)

:I wondered this myself. I would say they are about her but I didn't check the full list (I would not exclude that some of them just feature some of her famous songs in their soundtrack). I have worked on this article but then lost interest. I have seen you did a nice work with the section titles. If you continue on this track I guess that will incentive me to join again :) —[[User:Gennaro Prota|<span style="color: #000080; font-weight: bold">Gennaro Prota</span>]][[User talk:Gennaro Prota|<sup style="color: #006400">•Talk</sup>]] 14:20, 28 May 2006 (UTC)

Piaf appeared in all of them except "Edith et Marcel" which is about her.  It seems that "Al diavolo la celebritá" was included erroneously, so I've deleted it. [[User:RandomCritic|RandomCritic]] 20:05, 28 May 2006 (UTC)
:Probably because Marcel Cerdan appears in it. —[[User:Gennaro Prota|<span style="color: #000080; font-weight: bold">Gennaro Prota</span>]][[User talk:Gennaro Prota|<sup style="color: #006400">•Talk</sup>]] 20:32, 28 May 2006 (UTC)

== Vandals ==

someone obviously vandalized the article:
From the age of three to seven she was blind, and from eight to fourteen she was deaf and suffered from severe Androgenetic alopecia.

[[User:Wathiik|Wathiik]] 07:38, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

== Early life ==

The blindness / deafness issue seemed to me highly unlikely, so I took a look at the versions in other Wikipedias. Her blindness seems to be well-acknowledged, although w:de reports it as having occurred from the ago of 4 through 6 only. But deafness is mentioned only in the English version, with articles in other languages specifically mentioning that she is believed to have begun singing at age of ten. I think someone with access to a reputable biographical work should further investigate the issue. [[User:62.57.0.221|62.57.0.221]] 10:34, 23 December 2006 (UTC)

: In fact what is true is that she suffered from a "keratinite" that caused her to be almost blind when she was young; part of the problem was cured, but anyway she remained half-blind (on one eye).
: This was publicly testified on French TV today, with several people that had lived with her (notably her hair-dresser) invited to a long live TV show, showing and explaining her life, along with other guested actors and the director of the next cinema film that will come to our screens in the next few days: "'''La Mome'''", featuring lots of songs from our famous singer (and her love with the French boxer Marcel Cerdant, her two weddings after that, her loves with several French actors or singers). Although the film is oriented, it has been announced as providing only true and verified facts about her life (and those that have lived with Edith Piaf have approved the content). All those persons can testify that she was partly blind during all her life.
: However she was definitely not deaf (may be she had some earing problem, or suffered from some otites). This is pure speculation and the way she could master her voice is extremely clear. What is true is the she suffered from alcoolism and drugs, and her appearance was much older than she was really in the few years before her death. And it is true that she remains as a myth that can excite lots of imagination and creativity; that's the destinate of the most famous stars: she was and remains as the French Marilyn, and her songs are still loved so much today with her original voice.
: I want comment the very strange comment above, about the invention that Piaf would have died during WW2 (this is pure invention); most successes from Piaf were created after WW2; this is extremely irritating to find such stupidity here when there are much enough proofs (and millions of people that have seen her in public live shows after WW2!) that she recorded and sang most of her successes after WW2, including the greatest success "La Vie en rose" or "Mon Légionnaire". Her voice was really unique and unequalled since then (such voice can't be reproduced today, because the common French accent has evolved a lot since then, as well as the language). [[User:86.221.35.173|86.221.35.173]] 16:05, 4 February 2007 (UTC)


2.9.07
I added the premiere of the film, "la mome", at the Berlin Film Festival February, 2007 in the legacy section.

== Pure Idiocy ==

"Today she is still remembered and revered as one of the greatest singers France has ever produced. [citation needed]"

Citation needed??? <small>—The preceding [[Wikipedia:Sign your posts on talk pages|unsigned]] comment was added by [[Special:Contributions/87.6.130.121|87.6.130.121]] ([[User talk:87.6.130.121|talk]]) 23:29, 28 April 2007 (UTC).</small><!-- HagermanBot Auto-Unsigned -->
:Agreed. The citation is absolutely unnecessary.

"Elvis Presley is still remembered and revered as one of the greatest rock'n'roll singer" [citation needed] [[user:pole25|pole25]] 20:25, 24 january 2008  <small>—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/90.32.75.131|90.32.75.131]] ([[User talk:90.32.75.131|talk]]) {{{2|}}}</small><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

===Fact or opinion?===

I could say that I thought she was a singer whose reputation was enhanced by her premature death. That might not be true, but it is no more true to say that she is one of the greatest singers ever in France. However, a comment by a respected music critic saying that she was one of the greatest singers would make the statement more encyclopedic and not violate NPOV, which it seems to do now. [[Special:Contributions/66.234.220.195|66.234.220.195]] ([[User talk:66.234.220.195|talk]]) 06:47, 2 March 2008 (UTC)

== one of france's greatest singers: citation needed? ==

In the section "Death and Legacy", it's written "Today she is still remembered and revered as one of the greatest singers France has ever produced.[citation needed]".

Do we really need citation for that statement? It's like saying we need citation for Shakespeare being one of the greatest playwrights. I don't think to say she is "one of the greatest" is an exaggeration (much less a statement requiring citation), though saying she is the "greatest" would certainly be. Mmm...perhaps a better concession would be to rephrase the statement? Something enough to convey that she was recognised a being ''big'' in France in her day (almost equivalent so say Madonna or Celine Dion) and is certainly a cultural icon?[[User:Jaimebienlesfruits|Pristine]] 12:55, 23 June 2007 (UTC)


Whoops, I just noticed someone discussed this above. Anyhow, thoughts are still welcome.[[User:Jaimebienlesfruits|Pristine]] 12:55, 23 June 2007 (UTC)

If it's so obvious, it shouldn't be hard to find a citation for the sentence.  Citations are needed on Wikipedia no matter how obvious a statement may seem.  That's how it works :)  Just find a quick citation and add it. That is the least of this article's problems because most of the article lacks citation of any form.--[[User:76.182.88.254|76.182.88.254]] 04:44, 19 July 2007 (UTC)

:Wikipedia is not for publishing your own opinion, irregardless of how widely held it is. If you wish to make this claim, it needs to be from a  reputable and authoritative source in granting such an opinion [[User:Rotovia|Rotovia]] ([[User talk:Rotovia|talk]]) 16:46, 22 March 2008 (UTC)

::"irregardless" is not a word.[[Special:Contributions/69.47.221.232|69.47.221.232]] ([[User talk:69.47.221.232|talk]]) 06:09, 9 December 2008 (UTC)

:::Citation needed! Citation needed!

:There is no argument about Piaf being one of the greatest WORLD singers (not just for France) in Wikipedia articles in languages other than English. Including Russian page, for instance. Remarkably, it is only US/UK who do not want to admit it. One more proof that people in US/UK are very ignorant towards everything which is not in English.  <small>—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/99.237.244.226|99.237.244.226]] ([[User talk:99.237.244.226|talk]]) 23:16, 25 May 2008 (UTC)</small><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
:There is no argument that it's not true, just that it needs to be cited. It needs to be cited in other languages' Wikipedia articles as well. People all over the world use the English Wikipedia, not just those from the US and UK.--[[User:Gloriamarie|Gloriamarie]] ([[User talk:Gloriamarie|talk]]) 21:25, 27 December 2008 (UTC)

:Here's an example of the murky waters of perceived fact and opinion...the above contributor compares Piaf to a Madonna or Celine Dion!  Wow!  Neither of these pop stars have been particularly good (especially Madonna, if we're talking about singers), although have had huge commercial success.  One could find them "great" if one wishes, but uninformed opinion, or undeveloped taste don't count for much, and blanket statements made on their behalf wouldn't be too mature.  One may also not like Piaf, and find reasons for why she is overrated, or even good; it's an opinion, but not a well informed one.  Comparisons to Judy Garland, or Billie Holiday (or many another wondderful, or influential singer) would carry much more qualitative and critical weight.  But alas, it all comes down to opinion, and taste.  I find it hard to disagree with the statement in question however , in regards to Edith Piaf, even while I happen NOT to be a Piaf fan, and in this case, it would be foolhardy to have to proove the statement with a quote or reference.  My opinion may be that I don't like her, that doesn't alter the cultural fact that she was one of the greatest French singers, and even one of the key world singers of the century. One needn't have a citation that Elvis was one of the greatest rock singers, although conversely one would be hardpressed to state as fact that he was a great singer, or even one of the greatest pop entertainers, regardless of his overwhelming long-term popularity and cultural impact.  Simple comparisons, or exposure to tons of other 20th century pop entertainers proves the point fast enough.  Same goes for Michael Jackson, and Madonna.  That might not change a person's opinion that Elvis was the best, or the FACT that he was a great star of the ROCK era.  <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/71.125.236.139|71.125.236.139]] ([[User talk:71.125.236.139|talk]]) 02:32, 5 April 2010 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== Irrelevant factoid deleted from intro ==

"Edith Bunker, the mother on the TV series [[All in the Family]], was named after her." - when I read this in the article's intro paragraph it was a true WTF moment! --[[User:Salimfadhley|Salimfadhley]] 08:16, 2 July 2007 (UTC)
==Fair use rationale for Image:Edith piaf.jpg==
[[Image:Nuvola apps important.svg|70px|left]]
'''[[:Image:Edith piaf.jpg]]''' is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under [[Wikipedia:Fair use|fair use]] but there is no [[Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline|explanation or rationale]] as to why its use in '''this''' Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the [[Wikipedia:Image copyright tags/Fair use|boilerplate fair use template]], you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with [[WP:FU|fair use]].

Please go to [[:Image:Edith piaf.jpg|the image description page]] and edit it to include a [[Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline |fair use rationale]]. Using one of the templates at [[Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline]] is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is  other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page.  Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on [[Wikipedia:Criteria for speedy deletion#Images.2FMedia|criteria for speedy deletion]]. If you have any questions please ask them at the [[Wikipedia:Media copyright questions|Media copyright questions page]]. Thank you.<!-- Template:Missing rationale2 -->

[[User:BetacommandBot|BetacommandBot]] 01:59, 2 August 2007 (UTC)

An Image is needed for this article!!!--[[User:Burgas00|Burgas00]] 16:56, 2 October 2007 (UTC)

== Put back the ckuik.com videos ==

Dear editors
I just got a message that my addition of ckuik.com link to videos inspired by Edith Piaf is not allowed. Since I did not do it as to promote my website - it is a service since so many video clips there are great examples of her masterpieces - please put it back and let the visitors get the full picture.

Dr. Dafni  <small>—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:Nadav.dafni|Nadav.dafni]] ([[User talk:Nadav.dafni|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Nadav.dafni|contribs]]) 23:37, 4 October 2007 (UTC)</small><!-- Template:Unsigned --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

:Please do not add this website to Wikipedia articles. [[WP:NOT#MIRROR|Wikipedia is not a mirror of links or media files]]. Many of the videos [[Special:Contributions/Nadav.dafni|you are linking]] to various artist articles are in [[WP:COPYVIO|copyright violation]]. Per Wikipedia's [[WP:EL|external links policy]], links to music videos on ckuik.com are neither unique nor informative, and should not be added to Wikipedia articles./ [[User:Edgarde|edg]]<small> [[User_talk:Edgarde|☺]] [[Special:Contributions/Edgarde|★]]</small> 23:46, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

== Place of Death ==

The place of death in this article is not the same as the French Wikipedia of Edith Piaf.

Is it normal ?

And in the movie (La Môme, 2007, Olivier Dahan), it is also showed that she died in Grasse.
[[User:Sseb22|Sseb22]] 05:35, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

== No image? ==

Is there any particular reason why we have no image of Piaf? I thought we were permitted to use fair use ones for people, if the person is dead. - [[User:Estoy Aquí|<span style="color:#cadbff;"><sup>Estoy</sup></span><span style="color:#cadbff;"><sub>Aquí</sub></span>]]<sup>([[User talk:Estoy Aquí|t]] • [[Special:Contributions/Estoy Aquí|c]] • [[Special:Emailuser/Estoy Aquí|e]])</sup> 14:27, 14 November 2007 (UTC)


i don't know how to edit picture boxes etc... but the picture of edith's bust needs to be altered or shrunk or something because currently it is obscuring information about her songs  <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/77.101.56.216|77.101.56.216]] ([[User talk:77.101.56.216|talk]]) 14:09, 26 April 2009 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== Marcel Cerdan ==

"The great love of Piaf's life,[3] the married boxer Marcel Cerdan, died in a plane crash in October 1949, while flying from New York City to Paris to meet her" 

According to the PlaneCrashInfo database (http://planecrashinfo.com/1949/1949-46.htm), the plane carrying Cerdan was en route *from Paris* *to NY*. There must be a factual error somewhere: either Piaf was in NY at the time, or Cerdan was not flying *to* her (but perhaps from her?), or the plane was indeed flying to Paris. Does anyone know, which is the case? [[User:Kostikrus|Kostikrus]] ([[User talk:Kostikrus|talk]]) 23:16, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

::No, it's correct. She was performing in New York at the time. [[User:Indisciplined|Indisciplined]] ([[User talk:Indisciplined|talk]]) 12:37, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

== WWII Activities ==

This article: http://ngm.typepad.com/pop_omnivore/2008/02/and-the-omnie-1.html seems to corroborate the idea that Piaf did work for (even if indirectly) the French resistance during the war. The information comes from her sister-in-law, Christie Laume, who I would accept as an authoritative (if perhaps biased) source.  <small>—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/76.91.171.198|76.91.171.198]] ([[User talk:76.91.171.198|talk]]) 07:47, 21 February 2008 (UTC)</small><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== Reference to work in films ==

Edith's song L'accordéoniste is referenced and used in the interpretation of Alan Bennetts History .  <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">—Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/92.6.32.115|92.6.32.115]] ([[User talk:92.6.32.115|talk]]) 20:40, 21 October 2008 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:UnsignedIP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== Simone Berteaut ==

Has anyone any evidence that ''Piaf'' by Simone Berteaut, (Penguin 1973, {{ISBN|0 14 00 3669 5}}) is merely a fabrication? That Piaf and the author were NOT half sisters, and that Berteaut was merely one of Piaf's many hangers-on? If so, Berteaut still seems to know an awful lot of the 'legend' from the inside. <strong>[[User:Bluedawe|<span style="color:MidnightBlue;">Bluedawe</span>]]</strong> 23:19, 2 June 2012 (UTC)

==Vandalism?==
Some of the edits in this [http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=%C3%89dith_Piaf&diff=500050992&oldid=499282460 diff] do not seem to be true.  The statements are not necessarily found in the sources.  Would someone please look into this?  Thanks [[User:Jim1138|Jim1138]] ([[User talk:Jim1138|talk]]) 09:21, 7 July 2012 (UTC)

== Discography ==

Why does the discography consist only of "compilations of Édith Piaf's songs, and not reissues of the titles released while Édith Piaf was active"? Is it not possible for someone to list the titles of the albums she actually made?  [[Special:Contributions/86.42.33.161|86.42.33.161]] ([[User talk:86.42.33.161|talk]]) 17:30, 29 October 2012 (UTC)

== Named after Edith Cavell? ==

I am just a bit confused. The article says this:
{{quote|She was named Édith after the World War I British nurse Edith Cavell, who was executed for helping French soldiers escape from German captivity.}}
The reference it provides is a dead link, so I can't verify. But since Piaf was born in 1908, ''before'' Cavell was executed for helping the French soldiers, I highly doubt this fact is true. From the [[Edith Cavell]] article, it seems that starting in 1907 and before 1910, Cavell was matron of a nursing school "''L'École Belge d’Infirmières Diplômées'' on the ''Rue de la Culture'' in Brussels." Cavell only began assisting Allied soldiers in 1914.

The facts of the matter are this:
* Edith Piaf was born in 1908 in Paris.
* In 1908, Edith Cavell was the new matron of a newly established nursing school in Belgium.
* Prior to that, Cavell was either training as a nurse in London (1900-1905) or working as a governess in Belgium (< 1900)

Given the above, I find it highly doubtful that Piaf would have been named after Cavell, since Cavell's wartime heroism had not yet occurred at that time.

I have tagged the reference in the article as a dead link, so that someone might try to dig up an archived version or another reference. [[User:Mukkakukaku|<span style="color:#006600;">'''M'''û'''ĸĸ'''â'''ĸ'''û'''ĸ'''â'''ĸ'''û</span>]] <sub><small>([[User talk: Mukkakukaku|blah?]])</small></sub> 03:49, 19 November 2012 (UTC)

:The current article gives 1915 as her birth-year. I don't know where 1908 came from. [[User:Valetude|Valetude]] ([[User talk:Valetude|talk]]) 12:23, 13 July 2014 (UTC)
::According to the Crosland bio, she was named after Edith Cavell, but I haven't cross-checked this. [[Special:Contributions/94.197.12.104|94.197.12.104]] ([[User talk:94.197.12.104|talk]]) 17:03, 18 June 2022 (UTC)

== Married two or three times? ==

At one point the article refers to [Theo Sarapo] as Edith's third husband, but only two marriages are ever mentioned. His wikipedia article makes the same assumption.
[[User:Aebcoreno|Aebcoreno]] ([[User talk:Aebcoreno|talk]]) 21:47, 13 March 2013 (UTC)

== Place of Birth--Sidewalk or Hospital ==

Janet Flanner, in the source I have cited two/three times already and am too rushed for time to repeat, but see above, says that Edith Piaf was born on a sidewalk and that two policemen assisted in the birth.  Could it not have been possible that her mother and she were then taken to a hospital for further attention, and that a birth certificate was filled out there?  That's beyond original no-no research, it's original speculation !!!  but the answer to the birth dilemma might be "all of the above."  [[User:Terry J. Carter|Terry J. Carter]] ([[User talk:Terry J. Carter|talk]]) 02:18, 22 July 2013 (UTC)

:Margaret Crosland says the sidewalk story is untrue and that she was born in a hospital- I haven't cross-checked this. [[Special:Contributions/94.197.12.104|94.197.12.104]] ([[User talk:94.197.12.104|talk]]) 17:03, 18 June 2022 (UTC)

== Death and funeral: the mystery continues ==

German wikipedia explains the circumstances of her death rather well. Like other wikipedias, I think we should go for the 10th as her real date of death. Today it is 50 years ago.

Both French and English wikipedia mention the claim that she did not get a Roman Catholic funeral, because the Archbishop of Paris forbade it. However, I am old enough to remember the TV news item about her funeral and the general standstill in Paris as her body was taken to Pere Lachaise. I distinctly remember the broadcaster saying a funeral service had taken place at an Orthodox church. As I could not find that on any wikipedia, I thought my memory was faulty. A bit of googling, however, proved it was not. [http://www.ebay.com/itm/Press-Photo-Orthodox-Priest-Performing-Funeral-Rites-Edith-Piaf-/350672615960?_trksid=p3284.m263&_trkparms=algo%3DSIC%26its%3DI%26itu%3DUCI%252BIA%252BUA%252BFICS%252BUFI%26otn%3D21%26pmod%3D251089239159%26ps%3D54 Photo of an Orthodox Priest Performing the Funeral Rites of Edith Piaf]

Since Theo Sarapo was of Greek origin, one may wonder whether he ever envisaged an RC funeral. After all, the couple married at an Orthodox church as well. Can we be sure there really was a veto by the Archbishop? Of course, Edith may have asked for an RC funeral, and after the veto, Theo may have opted for the next best thing. Or Edith may have checked with RC priests before her death (she may have known that she would not live much longer), and have got the answer that there was a veto from the Archbishop. In any case, the fact that she did get a Christian burial anyway should be mentioned if we keep the story about the veto. --[[User:Paul Pieniezny|Paul Pieniezny]] ([[User talk:Paul Pieniezny|talk]]) 21:56, 10 October 2013 (UTC)

: I agree that this is probably worth going into a little more. From what I can see, there appears to have been some question of a Catholic funeral and clear evidence of a veto. David Bret goes into this in his book. "The Piaf Legend" and quotes a statement from [[Maurice Feltin]], the Archbishop at the time. I can only access the book in snippet form on google books, but Feltin's statement seems to have run: "The honours that the Church reserves for its dead cannot be rendered towards Edith Piaf because of an irregular situation. Those who have appreciated the talents of Madame Piaf are deeply moved by her sudden death. Christians aware of her faith and charity will not fail to beseech divine mercy for her soul at the sacrifice of the Mass". Bret goes on to say prayers were said at the cemetery by two priests: Fr Thouvenin de Villaret, and a Jesuit, Msgr Martin. Bret's implication is both were Catholic, but given Sarapo's background it would be unsurprising if there was an Orthodox priest present too. If someone knows where to look in contemporary newspaper reports (French ones would be best) then it shouldn't be too difficult to get some further clarification on this. [[User:ANB|ANB]] ([[User talk:ANB|talk]]) 00:35, 16 October 2013 (UTC)

I'm making an edit to the section about the funeral being denied today, having seen this article quoted on a Reddit thread.  The article before the edit states that she was denied a funeral Mass "because of her lifestyle", relying on a Guardian article from 2003.  However the Guardian's own archives give a more complete reason, quoted at https://www.theguardian.com/theguardian/2008/oct/14/2 : that she had remarried after a divorce in a Greek Orthodox Church.  "Remarriage" is impossible in Catholic theology while a valid marriage still  exists, and resorting to a  Orthodox Church to 'remarry' implies a choice to move from Catholic to Orthodox theology and jurisdiction - and a Catholic funeral Mass is not appropriate for someone who has made the choice to become Orthodox instead.  <!-- Template:Unsigned --><span class="autosigned" style="font-size:85%;">—&nbsp;Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[User:Daldred|Daldred]] ([[User talk:Daldred#top|talk]] • [[Special:Contributions/Daldred|contribs]]) 13:33, 4 February 2021 (UTC)</span> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

==birth date==
If the listed source claims her birth date is December 15, why is December 19 listed in introduction and the side bar box?   <span style="font-size: smaller;" class="autosigned">— Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/65.35.161.105|65.35.161.105]] ([[User talk:65.35.161.105|talk]]) 03:35, 5 January 2014 (UTC)</span><!-- Template:Unsigned IP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
:

== Inception ==

Hi All, Just wanted to mention that I reworded the sentence "Probably the most famous use of one of her songs was in the film "Inception"." Édith Piaf was a superstar for decades, and according to this article some of her live recordings have "never been out of print." It doesn't seem fair to say that the most famous use of one of her songs is a novelty appearence in an American movie. [[Special:Contributions/71.11.110.90|71.11.110.90]] ([[User talk:71.11.110.90|talk]]) 00:46, 20 March 2015 (UTC)

: I totally agree with you re. "It doesn't seem fair to say ... " etc.  
:I'd like to suggest that replacing the sentence with the following would be more than adequate:  ''Non, Je Ne Regrette Rien was also used as a prominent motif in the narrative element of the film "Inception".''  The song is already famous and she will be remembered as a super-star long after this movie is forgotten.  (I added "also" to the sentence since Non, Je Ne Regrette Rien is referred to in preceding paragraphs.) - [[User:Xenxax|Xenxax]] ([[User talk:Xenxax|talk]]) 11:27, 20 March 2015 (UTC)

== Jean Cocteau's Friends ==

Were all Nazi collaborators it seems ...  <small class="autosigned">—&nbsp;Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/108.18.230.179|108.18.230.179]] ([[User talk:108.18.230.179|talk]]) 05:57, 26 June 2015 (UTC)</small><!-- Template:Unsigned IP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== External links modified ==

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just added archive links to {{plural:1|one external link|1 external links}} on [[Édith Piaf]]. Please take a moment to review [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?diff=prev&oldid=678336598 my edit]. If necessary, add {{tlx|cbignore}} after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add {{tlx|nobots|deny{{=}}InternetArchiveBot}} to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/20070714183814/http://www.paris.org/Kiosque/feb98/love.html to http://www.paris.org/Kiosque/feb98/love.html

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the ''checked'' parameter below to '''true''' to let others know.

{{sourcecheck|checked=false}}

Cheers. —[[User:Cyberbot II|<sup style="color:green;font-family:Courier">cyberbot II</sup>]]<small><sub style="margin-left:-14.9ex;color:green;font-family:Comic Sans MS">[[User talk:Cyberbot II|<span style="color:green">Talk to my owner</span>]]:Online</sub></small> 19:14, 28 August 2015 (UTC)

==Shame==
Comment: this article is a shame for english Wikipedia. How it is possible that an article about Edith Piaf has in the first line that she was a "Cabaret Singer" ? It's enough to say that 70% of French artists (and of other nationalities on Paris) started singing on Cabarets, so why there's not a "Cabaret Singer" as the definition of Jacques Brel work, to use only one example? Ridiculous.
Besides that, mentioning abhorred "rumors" about her life. It's sourced, but what really does matter a "rumor" having a source? So, there's a rumor about Edith Piaf's life, a very offensive rumor, but there's a source for the rumor, so it's ok.
Ridiculous... Edith Piaf is too way important artist for having a biography of that level. Shame on Wikipedia.  <!-- Template:Unsigned IP --><small class="autosigned">—&nbsp;Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/201.6.227.188|201.6.227.188]] ([[User talk:201.6.227.188#top|talk]]) 06:20, 25 March 2017 (UTC)</small> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->

== External links modified ==

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 3 external links on [[Édith Piaf]]. Please take a moment to review [[special:diff/813977169|my edit]]. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit [[User:Cyberpower678/FaQs#InternetArchiveBot|this simple FaQ]] for additional information. I made the following changes:
*Corrected formatting/usage for http://www.rfimusique.com/siteen/biographie/biographie_6057.asp
*Added archive https://archive.is/20121211060308/http://joearay2.tripod.com/vancouversun/brel_et_piaf.html to http://joearay2.tripod.com/vancouversun/brel_et_piaf.html
*Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20080509060641/http://www.paris.org/Musees/Piaf/info.html to http://www.paris.org/Musees/Piaf/info.html

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

{{sourcecheck|checked=false|needhelp=}}

Cheers.—[[User:InternetArchiveBot|'''<span style="color:darkgrey;font-family:monospace">InternetArchiveBot</span>''']] <span style="color:green;font-family:Rockwell">([[User talk:InternetArchiveBot|Report bug]])</span> 06:38, 6 December 2017 (UTC)

== A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion ==
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion:
* [[commons:File:New-Map-Francophone World.PNG|New-Map-Francophone World.PNG]]<!-- COMMONSBOT: discussion | 2019-01-20T09:39:54.855435 | New-Map-Francophone World.PNG -->
Participate in the deletion discussion at the [[commons:Commons:Deletion requests/File:New-Map-Francophone World.PNG|nomination page]]. —[[User:Community Tech bot|Community Tech bot]] ([[User talk:Community Tech bot|talk]]) 09:40, 20 January 2019 (UTC)

== Pronunciation ==

{{ping|NKM1974}} let me explain. {{IPA|/i/}} already includes the pronunciation {{IPA|[piːˈɑːf]}}, in free variation with {{IPA|[pɪˈɑːf]}}, so it is absolutely redundant to transcribe the former pronunciation separately. That’s how we should deal with these cases in Wikipedia transcriptions. American sources normally just use the same symbol that is used for phonemic {{IPA|/iː/}}, whence probably your confusion originates. 〜[[User:IvanScrooge98|<span style="color:#009246;" lang="ja">イヴァン'''スクルージ'''九十八</span><span style="font-size:85%;">［Ivan'''Scrooge'''98］</span>]]<span style="font-size:85%;">（[[user talk:IvanScrooge98|<span style="color:#CE2B37;" lang="ja">会話</span>]]）</span> 07:59, 16 September 2019 (UTC)
:{{ping|IvanScrooge98}} This is the information on LPD 3rd edition by John Wells:  BrE {{IPA|[ˈpiːæf]}} & AmE {{IPA|[piːˈɑːf]}}.  This is the information on CEPD 18th edition by Peter Roach:  BrE {{IPA|[ˈpiːæf]}} & {{IPA|[piːˈæf]}} AmE {{IPA|[ˈpiːɑːf]}} & {{IPA|[piːˈɑːf]}}.  These two phonetics:  ({{IPA|[piˈɑːf]}} is the same as {{IPA|[piːˈɑːf]}}) and ({{IPA|[piˈæf]}} is the same as {{IPA|[piːˈæf]}}).  Am I correct?  In that case, you should be adding 2 colons next to the i, as in {{IPA|/iː/}}.  It's very confusing & Wikipedia uses the BrE IPA & not AmE IPA.  [[User:NKM1974|NKM1974]] ([[User talk:NKM1974|talk]]) 13:00, 16 September 2019 (UTC)
::{{re|NKM1974}} I’d have to know how those sources normally transcribe {{IPA|/i/}} before vowels to know whether is can only be tense as you say. Can you provide me any similar examples from them? 〜[[User:IvanScrooge98|<span style="color:#009246;" lang="ja">イヴァン'''スクルージ'''九十八</span><span style="font-size:85%;">［Ivan'''Scrooge'''98］</span>]]<span style="font-size:85%;">（[[user talk:IvanScrooge98|<span style="color:#CE2B37;" lang="ja">会話</span>]]）</span> 13:42, 16 September 2019 (UTC)
:::{{re|IvanScrooge98}} Here's a Wikipedia link [[Close front unrounded vowel]], happy /i/ in AmE & fleece /iː/ BrE.  Since I based everything on listening/speaking & not an expert on phonetic rules, [[User:Nardog]] might be able to resolve this issue.  [[User:NKM1974|NKM1974]] ([[User talk:NKM1974|talk]]) 05:17, 17 September 2019 (UTC)
::::{{re|NKM1974}} what I meant is some examples that may have {{IPA|/i/}} followed by a vowel, to see how the sources would transcribe it. But probably Nardog knows what system they use. 〜[[User:IvanScrooge98|<span style="color:#009246;" lang="ja">イヴァン'''スクルージ'''九十八</span><span style="font-size:85%;">［Ivan'''Scrooge'''98］</span>]]<span style="font-size:85%;">（[[user talk:IvanScrooge98|<span style="color:#CE2B37;" lang="ja">会話</span>]]）</span> 05:31, 17 September 2019 (UTC)

/ˈiːdɪθ/ does seem the most common way English speakers pronounce her first name at least based on [https://youglish.com/search/%C3%89dith+Piaf Youglish], but ''Edith'' is also an English given name so we can't use a dictionary as a source for it unless it specifically gives /ˈiːdɪθ/ for ''Édith'', with the acute; it also means /eɪˈdiːt/ given in M-W is most likely prescriptive (see [[Help talk:IPA/English#General American pronunciations of loanwords|this discussion]] &#91;[[Special:PermaLink/915615697#General American pronunciations of loanwords|perma]]&#93;). /ˈpiːæf/, /pi(ː)ˈæf/, /ˈpiːɑːf/, and /pi(ː)ˈɑːf/ all do seem plausible and attested variants, but if we included them and cluttered the lead, it would be giving too much information to the point of giving no information. As for /iː/ vs. /i/, {{em|taken at face value}}, LPD is saying that the first syllable is not reduced—which is not readily discernible because all varieties of modern GA have the same quality in FLEECE and happY, but which could nonetheless be substantiated if a stress shift occurred in e.g. "a ˌPiaf ˈsong"—again, if taken at face value; it could be just a typo. [[User:Nardog|Nardog]] ([[User talk:Nardog|talk]]) 19:02, 17 September 2019 (UTC)
:{{re|IvanScrooge98}}, it's the fleece /iː/ vowel that's missing & the happy /i/ vowel should be removed.  {{re|Kbb2}} & {{re|Nardog}}, thank you for resolving this matter.  [[User:NKM1974|NKM1974]] ([[User talk:NKM1974|talk]]) 01:03, 18 September 2019 (UTC)
:{{re|Nardog}} So we're mostly speaking of an artificial distinction. Weak {{IPA|/i, u/}} and most likely {{IPA|/ər/}} (though the strong variants of these should still be written with {{angbr IPA|i}}, {{angbr IPA|u}} and {{angbr IPA|ər}}) don't exist in AmE except on some abstract level that's inaccessible to an ordinary speaker (in RP, the final vowels of "happy" and "pedigree" can be distinct even for happy-tensers, also compare "forward" vs. "foreword"). I really wish the editors of LPD and CEPD would get their facts straight and removed the length marks from AmE transcriptions (as well as the artificial distinction between {{sc2|NURSE}} and {{sc2|LETTER}} - GA features only the former). [[User:Kbb2|Kbb2]] <small>(ex. Mr KEBAB)</small> ([[User talk:Kbb2#top|talk]]) 08:05, 18 September 2019 (UTC)

== bisexuality and affair with Marlene Dietrich ==

According to Stephen Bach in his Dietrich bio, and Dietrich's daughter Maria Riva in her book Marlene Dietrich, Piaf and Dietrich were lovers. Margaret Crosland mentions that Ginette and Simone Berteaut lived with her, but says there was 'no lesbian relationship' with them. I have not yet checked this with other sources. Piaf is listed in the Wikipedia list of bisexual people, so shouldn't she have bisexual women, bisexual musicians/entertainers, bisexual actresses categories?  <!-- Template:Unsigned IP --><small class="autosigned">—&nbsp;Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/94.197.12.104|94.197.12.104]] ([[User talk:94.197.12.104#top|talk]]) 16:56, 18 June 2022 (UTC)</small> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
{{Talk:Édith Piaf/GA1}}

== Why is there no mention of her daughter Marcelle? ==

Many other biographies on the Internet mention the birth of a daughter.
https://uofa.ru/en/biografiya-golosa-parizha-edit-piaf-sudba-malyshki-s-golosom/
[[User:Grandma Roses|Grandma Roses]] ([[User talk:Grandma Roses|talk]]) 12:12, 10 October 2023 (UTC)

== Grandmother or mother? ==

"Annetta's father was Auguste Eugène Maillard (1866–1912) of French descent and her grandmother was [[Emma Saïd Ben Mohamed|Emma (Aïcha) Saïd Ben Mohammed]] (1876–1930), an acrobat of [[Kabyle people|Kabyle]] and Italian descent."

As Emma (Aïcha) is declared to have been the grandmother of Piaf she cannot have been the grandmother but only the mother of her mother Anetta. [[Special:Contributions/2001:9E8:24A:F000:75B3:ADBE:B7C9:EC8C|2001:9E8:24A:F000:75B3:ADBE:B7C9:EC8C]] ([[User talk:2001:9E8:24A:F000:75B3:ADBE:B7C9:EC8C|talk]]) 17:29, 18 November 2024 (UTC)

==GA Review 2025==
Having worked through the comments in [[#GA Review|the above GA Review]] I'm inclined to submit the article for GA Review anew. Any and all further tidying etc welcome. -[[User:Yadsalohcin|Yadsalohcin]] ([[User talk:Yadsalohcin|talk]]) 17:39, 16 May 2025 (UTC)

== Women in Green 20-minute assessment ==

Hello {{u|Yadsalohcin}}! As requested at the [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Women in Green/Meetup/8|May 2025 Women in Green GA edit-a-thon]], here is a short mini-review to help identify any major improvements needed by this article before a formal Good Article nomination is submitted. You've made an excellent start of preparing this article for a GA review (I see you've been tackling much-needed reference and prose improvements, including suggestions from the last GA review), but I think it still needs some work before it's formally submitted for another full review. Here are some things to address now: 
* The opening line of the "Early life" section seems unneeded: "Despite numerous biographies, some details of Piaf's life are unknown." What details are unknown? Why does this need to be mentioned here, instead of focusing on the details that ''are'' known? All biographies will inevitably have some blind spots, so I don't think this line is necessary unless you need to explain why a specific piece of information is missing. 
* The Discography section has a "needs additional citations" tag. Maintenance tags should be addressed and removed before the article undergoes a GA review.
* Earwig's copy-vio tool has flagged some [https://copyvios.toolforge.org/?lang=en&project=wikipedia&title=%C3%89dith+Piaf&oldid=&action=search&use_engine=1&use_links=1&turnitin=0 possible copyright violations]. I think these other websites are likely "backwards copies" (they took the text from Wikipedia), but you should check the dates of publication and compare with earlier versions of the Wikipedia article (via the article history) to make sure. You can use [[Template:Backwards copy|this talk page template]] to flag any backwards copies.
* I had a look through the article's images and their copyright status tags. The four photos of Piaf from 1950 and earlier all have tags explaining why they are public domain in France, but no confirmation about their copyright status in the U.S. Because Wikipedia hosts servers (and digital content) in the United States, public domain images from other countries must meet public domain requirements from the U.S. ''as well as'' from their country of origin in order to be considered freely usable on Wikipedia. If you're not certain whether these French photos also meet American public domain requirements, I recommend checking in at the [https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:Village_pump/Copyright Commons Copyright Village Pump page], which is a great place to ask questions about photo copyright.
* From a quick glance through the list of currently cited sources in this article, I'm noticing a few sources that may be considered unreliable (or not reliable enough to meet GA criteria): BroadwayWorld, Goodreads, and YouTube all lack editorial oversight, and are flagged in this [[Wikipedia:Reliable sources/Perennial sources#Sources|list of "perennial" often-discussed sources]]. I recommend taking a closer look at the article's full list of sources -- consider removing content or replacing sources with more reliable citations when necessary.
* While not strictly required to meet GA criteria, it's good practice to include alt text for all images (I suggest 1-2 concise lines of clear visual description for each photo).
This is a fascinating biography, and I hope you continue to work on improvements for it. Good luck! Let me know if you have any questions about my comments. [[User:Alanna the Brave|Alanna the Brave]] ([[User talk:Alanna the Brave|talk]]) 22:28, 17 May 2025 (UTC)

:@[[User:Alanna the Brave|Alanna the Brave]] many thanks for the suggestions wrt Edith Piaf - I hope to get on with responding to these asap. [[User:Yadsalohcin|Yadsalohcin]] ([[User talk:Yadsalohcin|talk]]) 10:38, 18 May 2025 (UTC)
::@[[User:Alanna the Brave|Alanna the Brave]] I think I have an idea of what the originator of the opening line of the "Early life" section may have been trying to get at, but I haven't tested the theory and I agree that there's enough in the article not to need to shout about any yawning chasm... Re the discography section, I added the general references at the head and left 'refimprove' as a reminder - the first few have reference numbers and dates - as per '(Capitol ST 10295) 1962' - would these be sufficient if added throughout? Thanks again, [[User:Yadsalohcin|Yadsalohcin]] ([[User talk:Yadsalohcin|talk]]) 11:25, 18 May 2025 (UTC)
:Re the picture files
:* [[:File:Piaf Harcourt 1946 2.jpg]]
:* [[:File:Edith Piaf Harcourt 1950 1.jpg]]
:* [[:File:Edith Piaf et les Compagnons de la Chanson.jpg]]
:* [[:File:1951 La P'tite Lili - Théatre ABC retouched.jpg]]
:* [[:File:Edith Piaf enfant.jpg]]
:It seems unlikely that these qualify as being in the public domain at present, and accordingly, on a precautionary basis, they have been deleted from the article. See discussion at https://commons.m.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:Village_pump/Copyright#Photos_in_%C3%89dith_Piaf_article [[User:Yadsalohcin|Yadsalohcin]] ([[User talk:Yadsalohcin|talk]]) 21:48, 19 May 2025 (UTC)
:I have had a look at the potential copyright issues flagged up by Earwig's Copyvio, and from looking at a few key phrases that it picked up on in each case concluded that the top 3 cases (''cdgo.com'', ''whoisthemonk'', and ''emanuellevy'') look to be reverse copies and I have listed these into a template added at the head of this page. The fourth case is that of ''marefa.org'', for which the original is in Arabic, making comparison rather harder, but from what I can see it looks as if mostly here copyvio is picking up on song, book and film titles. I suspect that these are inevitable in such a biographical piece and I would contend that no infringement exists here. That covers the 4 cases >70%; a fifth, ~30% is described as 'Violation unlikely' and subsequent ones score <20%. [[User:Yadsalohcin|Yadsalohcin]] ([[User talk:Yadsalohcin|talk]]) 10:43, 20 May 2025 (UTC)
{{Talk:Édith Piaf/GA2}}

== May 2025 (grandmother's ancestry) ==

{{re|Factchecker hero}}} where he was born is irrelevant to the fact that he was Kabyle (Plenty of Algerians moved to Morocco during the French colonisation). Anyway, this fact is sourced to primary, secondary and tertiary sources, and therefore, not something that you can challenge or change at will. [[User:M.Bitton|M.Bitton]] ([[User talk:M.Bitton|talk]]) 12:23, 28 May 2025 (UTC)
:Let's not edit war on this or I may be required to quickfail the GA review. Conflicts over nationality and ancestry are a frequent source of edit warring (see [[WP:LAME]]). I haven't gone through many of the sources yet, but my tendency would be to footnote it with any disagreement between major sources – or possibly to trim it altogether as it's a bit tangential to the subject of this article and better belongs in the biography article for the grandmother. – [[User:Reidgreg|Reidgreg]] ([[User talk:Reidgreg|talk]]) 13:19, 28 May 2025 (UTC)
::No objection to trimming the stuff about her grandmother, as most RS don't mention her, but the fact that her mother, Line Marsa, is described as being of Italian-Kabyle origin (d'origine italo-kabyle) is repeated in multiple RS, including tertiary ones (which usually establish DUE). [[User:M.Bitton|M.Bitton]] ([[User talk:M.Bitton|talk]]) 13:26, 28 May 2025 (UTC)